Bluesbrother wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 10:55 am
Levi has only featured in 4 NRL games for us. I am not sure how he has been written off so emphatically.
Early in his career, I remember him impressing. To the point where he made the kiwi side.
Whilst I don't think he is the long term solution I do think his ceiling is clearly higher than Zac Woolford's and he should be given an opportunity to show that in our forward pack. Servicing Joe Tapine, Papalii and Hors could make any hooker look better than they are and I am happy with the selection as Woolford showed nothing in 2023 compared to 22 form and looks slower again this season.
If it's not Levi, and he does in fact go as the experts on here suggest, we need to be looking at someone asap for the 2025 season in that role.
Spot on BluesBrother. He still a young guy with over 100 first grade games behind him and an international representative. He is the best 9 at this club. If he isn’t the long term answer at 9 then we need to be recruiting hard but Woolford and Starling aren’t the answer. At the end of the day, you know this, I know this, Ricky knows this so the “experts” will just have to suck it up and keep attributing poor passes from other players to him
Botman wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 11:01 am
So here it is fellas... the wing combinations named for each team this weekend... there might be some cases where injury has played a role but for the most part these are the wingers teams are going into their season with the idea that these guys are the best:
Manly: Saab and Paulo
Souths: Johnston and Gagai
Easts: Tupou and Suaalii
Broncos: Arthur and Mariner
Knights: Tuala and Marzhew
Warriors: DWZ and Montoya
Storm: Warbrick and Coates
Sharks: Katoa and Mulitalo
Panthers: Turuva and To'o
Eels: Simonsson and Russell
Bulldogs: Wilson and JAC
Titans: Khan-Pereira and Sami
Dragons: Lomax and Ravalawa
Dolphins: Isaako and Bostock
Cowboys: Feldt and Taulagi
There are 10 clubs there where i don't even think its up for debate that Jordan Rapana is better than one of the guys named. Add in the Tigers and you have 11. And not was better, actually is better right now
The only sides i go the other way on and say he's definitely not getting into is Easts and Penrith.
So only the fellas get to play this game? Seems quite exclusionary to the many female contributors on the greenhouse?
That’s just not really true. The only team he wouldn’t walk into is Easts imo.
They haven't been called Easts since before you were watching rugby league, give it up, m8... please.
I guess you don't hear the "East's " chant at their home games
They will always be easts, just like Balmain
It's not Balmain though, is it?
Of course it's not.
You've got two posters here who have literally never seen Easts play and were both max 5 years old when Balmain last existed that are calling them by ridiculously outdated names.
MrPosh wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 8:09 am
I know Rapana is a legend at this club - and rightly so - but right now he only gets into a handful of NRL sides on the wing
That’s just not really true. The only team he wouldn’t walk into is Easts imo.
I’m with Posh on this one. I get people find it hard to separate sentiment from logic and I appreciate that Rapa is apparently fitter than he has been in previous years, but it is a big problem that he is fill in fullback and first pick wing. It says as much about our other options as it does about him. We need Stewart, Asomua, Schiller, Weekes, Savage and every other young talent to be pushing past. Rapa has been great, but unfortunately ‘has been’ are the key words there.
Couldn’t disagree more. Rapana would walk into almost any club out there. He’s work rate and tackle breaks are a reason we get a lot of go forward from the back. He has an element of rocks and diamonds about him but later on his career, he’s been more diamonds. Can finish. Can catch. And puts his body on the line every time.
He won’t be finishing the season at Fullback. That’s a certainty. If Stewart does what he needs to do this year cause from his trials, he isn’t ready, he will be our fullback. If not, Savage will be there.
MrPosh wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 8:09 am
I know Rapana is a legend at this club - and rightly so - but right now he only gets into a handful of NRL sides on the wing
That’s just not really true. The only team he wouldn’t walk into is Easts imo.
I’m with Posh on this one. I get people find it hard to separate sentiment from logic and I appreciate that Rapa is apparently fitter than he has been in previous years, but it is a big problem that he is fill in fullback and first pick wing. It says as much about our other options as it does about him. We need Stewart, Asomua, Schiller, Weekes, Savage and every other young talent to be pushing past. Rapa has been great, but unfortunately ‘has been’ are the key words there.
Couldn’t disagree more. Rapana would walk into almost any club out there. He’s work rate and tackle breaks are a reason we get a lot of go forward from the back. He has an element of rocks and diamonds about him but later on his career, he’s been more diamonds. Can finish. Can catch. And puts his body on the line every time.
He won’t be finishing the season at Fullback. That’s a certainty. If Stewart does what he needs to do this year cause from his trials, he isn’t ready, he will be our fullback. If not, Savage will be there.
Yeah, sorry Posh, if there's not a greater indication you're wrong on a topic, it's when a deliberately contrarian troll agrees with you.
Billy Walker wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 11:22 am
So only the fellas get to play this game? Seems quite exclusionary to the many female contributors on the greenhouse?
I meant to quote the discussion that involved you, Julian and Mr Posh.
But the exercise is there for anyone to do, i'd welcome anyone who thinks Rapana wouldnt make most teams to do the exercise and correct themselves.
Or better yet, you tell me which teams on that list have two players better than Rapana?
Last edited by Botman on March 6, 2024, 11:34 am, edited 1 time in total.
MrPosh wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 8:09 am
I know Rapana is a legend at this club - and rightly so - but right now he only gets into a handful of NRL sides on the wing
That’s just not really true. The only team he wouldn’t walk into is Easts imo.
I’m with Posh on this one. I get people find it hard to separate sentiment from logic and I appreciate that Rapa is apparently fitter than he has been in previous years, but it is a big problem that he is fill in fullback and first pick wing. It says as much about our other options as it does about him. We need Stewart, Asomua, Schiller, Weekes, Savage and every other young talent to be pushing past. Rapa has been great, but unfortunately ‘has been’ are the key words there.
Couldn’t disagree more. Rapana would walk into almost any club out there. He’s work rate and tackle breaks are a reason we get a lot of go forward from the back. He has an element of rocks and diamonds about him but later on his career, he’s been more diamonds. Can finish. Can catch. And puts his body on the line every time.
He won’t be finishing the season at Fullback. That’s a certainty. If Stewart does what he needs to do this year cause from his trials, he isn’t ready, he will be our fullback. If not, Savage will be there.
Botman wrote: ↑March 5, 2024, 9:36 pm
Apparently we can’t all figure it… let me walk you through this.. we’ll go slow, I know you need that…
That 2018 was a time in which those footballers were representative players.
None of those names matter anymore.
6 years is a long time in sports. Who gives a **** how good you were in 2018 in 2024?
We were an amazing attacking team in 1994 too. It doesn’t count for **** all in 2024
Doesn’t the rude, childish righteous act ever get boring? Seiff acknowledged he wasn’t fussed if you didn’t agree with him. Is he not allowed to have a different view to you or make a point you don’t agree without you being a tool about it?
It doesn't sound like botman has changed a bit since the early days
Botman wrote: ↑March 5, 2024, 9:36 pm
Apparently we can’t all figure it… let me walk you through this.. we’ll go slow, I know you need that…
That 2018 was a time in which those footballers were representative players.
None of those names matter anymore.
6 years is a long time in sports. Who gives a **** how good you were in 2018 in 2024?
We were an amazing attacking team in 1994 too. It doesn’t count for **** all in 2024
Doesn’t the rude, childish righteous act ever get boring? Seiff acknowledged he wasn’t fussed if you didn’t agree with him. Is he not allowed to have a different view to you or make a point you don’t agree without you being a tool about it?
It doesn't sound like botman has changed a bit since the early days
Sent from my SM-G998B using Tapatalk
It’s a shame because his analysis is often quite good. If he could learn to respect others he would be a good contributor.
I wouldnt wait by the mailbox waiting on news of me changing
I am perfectly happy and content with how i go about contributing. And certainly wont be taking advice on how to be a good contributor from the dude who's blocked by more people than any other poster due to their contributions being considered worthless.
In any event it's good to see VTV back for another season.
Botman wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 11:58 am
I wouldnt wait by the mailbox waiting on news of me changing
I am perfectly happy and content with how i go about contributing. And certainly wont be taking advice on how to be a good contributor from the dude who's blocked by more people than any other poster due to their contributions being considered worthless.
In any event it's good to see VTV back for another season.
Hahaha indeed, it's a good pro-tip for anyone using this forum: if you ever find yourself on the same side of an argument as old Billy Boy here... might be time to reconsider your viewpoint.
The guy literally just throws out whatever contrarian view he thinks will cause the biggest reaction, it's genuine garbage 99% of the time, and the other 1% is a mistake.
Botman wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 11:58 am
I wouldnt wait by the mailbox waiting on news of me changing
I am perfectly happy and content with how i go about contributing. And certainly wont be taking advice on how to be a good contributor from the dude who's blocked by more people than any other poster due to their contributions being considered worthless.
In any event it's good to see VTV back for another season.
Hahaha indeed, it's a good pro-tip for anyone using this forum: if you ever find yourself on the same side of an argument as old Billy Boy here... might be time to reconsider your viewpoint.
The guy literally just throws out whatever contrarian view he thinks will cause the biggest reaction, it's genuine garbage 99% of the time, and the other 1% is a mistake.
Another pro-tip, if you find yourself being shouted over and called names by a Nicko trying to be a bully, just call him out on his nonsense and stand up to him. You’ll find like all bullies, he is actually a coward and he will block you and hide away in the shadows but possibly still obsess over you
MrPosh wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 8:09 am
I know Rapana is a legend at this club - and rightly so - but right now he only gets into a handful of NRL sides on the wing
That’s just not really true. The only team he wouldn’t walk into is Easts imo.
I’m with Posh on this one. I get people find it hard to separate sentiment from logic and I appreciate that Rapa is apparently fitter than he has been in previous years, but it is a big problem that he is fill in fullback and first pick wing. It says as much about our other options as it does about him. We need Stewart, Asomua, Schiller, Weekes, Savage and every other young talent to be pushing past. Rapa has been great, but unfortunately ‘has been’ are the key words there.
Couldn’t disagree more. Rapana would walk into almost any club out there. He’s work rate and tackle breaks are a reason we get a lot of go forward from the back. He has an element of rocks and diamonds about him but later on his career, he’s been more diamonds. Can finish. Can catch. And puts his body on the line every time.
He won’t be finishing the season at Fullback. That’s a certainty. If Stewart does what he needs to do this year cause from his trials, he isn’t ready, he will be our fullback. If not, Savage will be there.
Haha thanks mate, for sending me a subjective article where Dom Young is ranked 15th and Corey Oats is ranked 2nd in the league for wingers. Arguments out the window right there
Rob Sutherland from DT on a SuperCoach podcast said there are whispers of Weekes coming in at 14 but I don’t believe that.
Also, give Levi a chance. He only played a few games of first grade for us last year (a whopping 125 minutes over 4 games) and before that, very few on this forum consistently watched him since 2020 given he only played 9 games in 2021 (came in partway through the year for broncos).
It’s clear he was the best hooker in the trials and Zac Woolford certainly didn’t have a mortgage on the position - there is nothing to complain about imo, they will both get chances throughout the year whilst the club continues looking for a solution in the meantime.
Would have loved for Mooney to get picked but Saulo did out perform him in the trials. I’ve never been big on Guler but I appreciate it’s a big call to drop him for a rookie in round 1. I don’t expect we will have these headaches for too long with suspensions, injuries and concussions anyway.
I will be fuming if it’s not a straight swap for Kirs and Hopa round two however regardless how Cotric or Savage perform - if this is the first choice, give them all another go.
Last edited by Dylan’s Raiders on March 6, 2024, 12:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Dylan’s Raiders wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 12:18 pm
Rob Sutherland from DT on a SuperCoach podcast said there are whispers of Weekes coming in at 14 but I don’t believe that.
Also, give Levi a chance. He only played a few games of first grade for us last year (a whopping 125 minutes over 4 games) and before that, very few on this forum consistently watched him since 2020 given he only played 9 games in 2021 (came in partway through the year for broncos).
It’s clear he was the best hooker in the trials and Zac Woolford certainly didn’t have a mortgage on the position - there is nothing to complain about imo, they will both get chances throughout the year whilst the club continues looking for a solution in the meantime.
Would have loved for Mooney to get picked by Saulo did out perform in the trials. I’ve never been big on Guler but I appreciate it’s a big call to drop him for a rookie in round 1. I don’t expect we will have these headaches for too long with suspensions, injuries and concussions anyway.
I will be fuming if it’s not a straight swap for Kirs and Hopa round two however regardless how Cotric or Savage perform - if this is the first choice, give them all another go.
Bluesbrother wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 10:55 am
Levi has only featured in 4 NRL games for us. I am not sure how he has been written off so emphatically.
Early in his career, I remember him impressing. To the point where he made the kiwi side.
Whilst I don't think he is the long term solution I do think his ceiling is clearly higher than Zac Woolford's and he should be given an opportunity to show that in our forward pack. Servicing Joe Tapine, Papalii and Hors could make any hooker look better than they are and I am happy with the selection as Woolford showed nothing in 2023 compared to 22 form and looks slower again this season.
If it's not Levi, and he does in fact go as the experts on here suggest, we need to be looking at someone asap for the 2025 season in that role.
Spot on BluesBrother. He still a young guy with over 100 first grade games behind him and an international representative. He is the best 9 at this club. If he isn’t the long term answer at 9 then we need to be recruiting hard but Woolford and Starling aren’t the answer. At the end of the day, you know this, I know this, Ricky knows this so the “experts” will just have to suck it up and keep attributing poor passes from other players to him
Don't think Levi is as bad as a lot of people make out. I think he's quite a decent backup. My biggest concern is if he's our best no9 then we have serious issues at a very important role. Him, Woolford and Starling have been around for quite a few years now and their ceiling looks to be well established. Whoever we pick to start we're in the bottom 20% for that position.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.
That’s just not really true. The only team he wouldn’t walk into is Easts imo.
I’m with Posh on this one. I get people find it hard to separate sentiment from logic and I appreciate that Rapa is apparently fitter than he has been in previous years, but it is a big problem that he is fill in fullback and first pick wing. It says as much about our other options as it does about him. We need Stewart, Asomua, Schiller, Weekes, Savage and every other young talent to be pushing past. Rapa has been great, but unfortunately ‘has been’ are the key words there.
Couldn’t disagree more. Rapana would walk into almost any club out there. He’s work rate and tackle breaks are a reason we get a lot of go forward from the back. He has an element of rocks and diamonds about him but later on his career, he’s been more diamonds. Can finish. Can catch. And puts his body on the line every time.
He won’t be finishing the season at Fullback. That’s a certainty. If Stewart does what he needs to do this year cause from his trials, he isn’t ready, he will be our fullback. If not, Savage will be there.
Haha thanks mate, for sending me a subjective article where Dom Young is ranked 15th and Corey Oats is ranked 2nd in the league for wingers. Arguments out the window right there
Reg the key word in your post is subjective. That is the entire point. The muppets that put together the YouTube rankings have a subjective view, you have a subjective view, as did Posh. I agree with Posh’s subjective view that Rapa wouldn’t be getting a start at most other NRL clubs. Many won’t agree with that view. I respect your alternative view. We are not trying to reach a consensus on things here, we are sharing views and opinions. Agree/disagree it doesn’t bother me.
Bluesbrother wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 10:55 am
Levi has only featured in 4 NRL games for us. I am not sure how he has been written off so emphatically.
Early in his career, I remember him impressing. To the point where he made the kiwi side.
Whilst I don't think he is the long term solution I do think his ceiling is clearly higher than Zac Woolford's and he should be given an opportunity to show that in our forward pack. Servicing Joe Tapine, Papalii and Hors could make any hooker look better than they are and I am happy with the selection as Woolford showed nothing in 2023 compared to 22 form and looks slower again this season.
If it's not Levi, and he does in fact go as the experts on here suggest, we need to be looking at someone asap for the 2025 season in that role.
Spot on BluesBrother. He still a young guy with over 100 first grade games behind him and an international representative. He is the best 9 at this club. If he isn’t the long term answer at 9 then we need to be recruiting hard but Woolford and Starling aren’t the answer. At the end of the day, you know this, I know this, Ricky knows this so the “experts” will just have to suck it up and keep attributing poor passes from other players to him
Don't think Levi is as bad as a lot of people make out. I think he's quite a decent backup. My biggest concern is if he's our best no9 then we have serious issues at a very important role. Him, Woolford and Starling have been around for quite a few years now and their ceiling looks to be well established. Whoever we pick to start we're in the bottom 20% for that position.
The dream would be for Trev to sweep the field and emerge as such a quality 9 that the debate moves to who is backup might be. It was a mistake to extend Starling, Levi and Woolford. 2 yes, but we need a second emerging talent with a clear pathway through.
You sent me the article proving he’s not. I’m confused. Anyway, I think you’re wrong. He would start in pretty much any team. That’s not subjective, that’s fact.
This is all in mind that he’s older than Father Time.
I am no fan of Levi, in his appearances for us last year, he looked poor. Very poor. But he did play well in the trials this year. IMO, he was our best of the nines. However, it will be a long season, and may the best 9 win.
Big Red will return, and I expect Guler to be the player to be stood down. Saulo was actually pretty good in the trials, and I am not surprised he is back in the 17.
This will be a good game.
Ponga must be contained; on his day, he tears teams apart. Our edges need to be sharp, and with Hosking in the team ahead of EW I actually feel fairly comfortable that he will tighten up that edge.
A key matchup for me is Best vs. Hoppa. Best, while inconsistent, is developing into the player he was expected to be. Both he and Hoppa were absolute beasts at junior level; sadly, injury has thwarted young Hoppa.
I am looking forward to seeing how Smithies goes. He was defensively impressive vs. NQ. I hope Savage has a blinder.
The spiral of silence refers to the idea that when people fail to speak, the price of speaking rises. As the price to speak rises, still fewer speak out, which further causes the price to rise, so that fewer people yet will speak out, until a whole culture or nation is silenced. This is what happened in Germany.
If you do not speak, you are not being neutral, but are contributing to the success of the thing you refuse to name and condemn.
I’m with Posh on this one. I get people find it hard to separate sentiment from logic and I appreciate that Rapa is apparently fitter than he has been in previous years, but it is a big problem that he is fill in fullback and first pick wing. It says as much about our other options as it does about him. We need Stewart, Asomua, Schiller, Weekes, Savage and every other young talent to be pushing past. Rapa has been great, but unfortunately ‘has been’ are the key words there.
Couldn’t disagree more. Rapana would walk into almost any club out there. He’s work rate and tackle breaks are a reason we get a lot of go forward from the back. He has an element of rocks and diamonds about him but later on his career, he’s been more diamonds. Can finish. Can catch. And puts his body on the line every time.
He won’t be finishing the season at Fullback. That’s a certainty. If Stewart does what he needs to do this year cause from his trials, he isn’t ready, he will be our fullback. If not, Savage will be there.
Haha thanks mate, for sending me a subjective article where Dom Young is ranked 15th and Corey Oats is ranked 2nd in the league for wingers. Arguments out the window right there
Reg the key word in your post is subjective. That is the entire point. The muppets that put together the YouTube rankings have a subjective view, you have a subjective view, as did Posh. I agree with Posh’s subjective view that Rapa wouldn’t be getting a start at most other NRL clubs. Many won’t agree with that view. I respect your alternative view. We are not trying to reach a consensus on things here, we are sharing views and opinions. Agree/disagree it doesn’t bother me.
On this point - this is why ranking individual players is so controversial/difficult. I watch every game which is 272 players every week but even then, I watch raiders game much closer than other games (eyes glued to the screen noticing if the kick off isn’t deep enough compared to paying attention to my animals during the tigers game you know).
Anyways, if you watch a certain team a bit more carefully than others you will notice the one percenters of certain players and you rank them more highly.
In respect of Jordan Rapana, I disagree with Posh and Billy but I think the majority of neutral NRL fans would agree with Posh and Billy. But to be fair, I don’t watch Junior Topou from the tigers as closely as I do Rapana and no one watches the raiders as closely as raiders fans.
Totally pointless post but I’ve thought about this before haha.
dubby wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 12:35 pm
Well said, Dylan.
I am no fan of Levi, in his appearances for us last year, he looked poor. Very poor. But he did play well in the trials this year. IMO, he was our best of the nines. However, it will be a long season, and may the best 9 win.
Big Red will return, and I expect Guler to be the player to be stood down. Saulo was actually pretty good in the trials, and I am not surprised he is back in the 17.
This will be a good game.
Ponga must be contained; on his day, he tears teams apart. Our edges need to be sharp, and with Hosking in the team ahead of EW I actually feel fairly comfortable that he will tighten up that edge.
A key matchup for me is Best vs. Hoppa. Best, while inconsistent, is developing into the player he was expected to be. Both he and Hoppa were absolute beasts at junior level; sadly, injury has thwarted young Hoppa.
I am looking forward to seeing how Smithies goes. He was defensively impressive vs. NQ. I hope Savage has a blinder.
Best worries me - he is unstoppable when he is having a good day. I think we have the knights covered in the forwards but their backline could hurt us. I wish we could play them on the smaller dimension Vegas ground to limit the space.
Couldn’t disagree more. Rapana would walk into almost any club out there. He’s work rate and tackle breaks are a reason we get a lot of go forward from the back. He has an element of rocks and diamonds about him but later on his career, he’s been more diamonds. Can finish. Can catch. And puts his body on the line every time.
He won’t be finishing the season at Fullback. That’s a certainty. If Stewart does what he needs to do this year cause from his trials, he isn’t ready, he will be our fullback. If not, Savage will be there.
Haha thanks mate, for sending me a subjective article where Dom Young is ranked 15th and Corey Oats is ranked 2nd in the league for wingers. Arguments out the window right there
Reg the key word in your post is subjective. That is the entire point. The muppets that put together the YouTube rankings have a subjective view, you have a subjective view, as did Posh. I agree with Posh’s subjective view that Rapa wouldn’t be getting a start at most other NRL clubs. Many won’t agree with that view. I respect your alternative view. We are not trying to reach a consensus on things here, we are sharing views and opinions. Agree/disagree it doesn’t bother me.
On this point - this is why ranking individual players is so controversial/difficult. I watch every game which is 272 players every week but even then, I watch raiders game much closer than other games (eyes glued to the screen noticing if the kick off isn’t deep enough compared to paying attention to my animals during the tigers game you know).
Anyways, if you watch a certain team a bit more carefully than others you will notice the one percenters of certain players and you rank them more highly.
In respect of Jordan Rapana, I disagree with Posh and Billy but I think the majority of neutral NRL fans would agree with Posh and Billy. But to be fair, I don’t watch Junior Topou from the tigers as closely as I do Rapana and no one watches the raiders as closely as raiders fans.
Totally pointless post but I’ve thought about this before haha.
I don’t think it is pointless Dylan, it’s a really good post and I respect your view on Rapa. For me, I try to be a bit more objective. The bookies currently have us third shortest to win the least games. I don’t agree with that but it does make you pause and think about what the experts, who’s livelihood and money is on the line are seeing that we might not be. We might like to think all our problems stop with Levi, Hoppa and Saulo but that’s not the case. We need to be finding upgrades for quite a few positions including a wing spot that has been held for a long time by a great player.
Haha thanks mate, for sending me a subjective article where Dom Young is ranked 15th and Corey Oats is ranked 2nd in the league for wingers. Arguments out the window right there
Reg the key word in your post is subjective. That is the entire point. The muppets that put together the YouTube rankings have a subjective view, you have a subjective view, as did Posh. I agree with Posh’s subjective view that Rapa wouldn’t be getting a start at most other NRL clubs. Many won’t agree with that view. I respect your alternative view. We are not trying to reach a consensus on things here, we are sharing views and opinions. Agree/disagree it doesn’t bother me.
On this point - this is why ranking individual players is so controversial/difficult. I watch every game which is 272 players every week but even then, I watch raiders game much closer than other games (eyes glued to the screen noticing if the kick off isn’t deep enough compared to paying attention to my animals during the tigers game you know).
Anyways, if you watch a certain team a bit more carefully than others you will notice the one percenters of certain players and you rank them more highly.
In respect of Jordan Rapana, I disagree with Posh and Billy but I think the majority of neutral NRL fans would agree with Posh and Billy. But to be fair, I don’t watch Junior Topou from the tigers as closely as I do Rapana and no one watches the raiders as closely as raiders fans.
Totally pointless post but I’ve thought about this before haha.
I don’t think it is pointless Dylan, it’s a really good post and I respect your view on Rapa. For me, I try to be a bit more objective. The bookies currently have us third shortest to win the least games. I don’t agree with that but it does make you pause and think about what the experts, who’s livelihood and money is on the line are seeing that we might not be. We might like to think all our problems stop with Levi, Hoppa and Saulo but that’s not the case. We need to be finding upgrades for quite a few positions including a wing spot that has been held for a long time by a great player.
100% if you look at the teams on paper, I have raiders at 13th (ahead of Dolphins, Tigers, Bulldogs and Dragons). We need to punch well above our weight and have a lot of our players playing career best footy to scrape into the 8.
Compare that to Melbourne who had a relatively poor year by their standard and finished in the top 4.
I am optimistic about our future however because it’s untested youth and not just any youth either.
The likes of Ethan Strange, Trey Mooney, Hohepa Puru and even Ata Mariota to a lesser extent are untested in first grade with all the promise in the world while players like Chevy Stewart, Ethan Sanders and Michael Asomua are yet to play first grade but on probabilities all look likely to have successful first grade careers ahead of them.
If the youth doesn’t pay off that’s when I will be very worried.
Haha thanks mate, for sending me a subjective article where Dom Young is ranked 15th and Corey Oats is ranked 2nd in the league for wingers. Arguments out the window right there
Reg the key word in your post is subjective. That is the entire point. The muppets that put together the YouTube rankings have a subjective view, you have a subjective view, as did Posh. I agree with Posh’s subjective view that Rapa wouldn’t be getting a start at most other NRL clubs. Many won’t agree with that view. I respect your alternative view. We are not trying to reach a consensus on things here, we are sharing views and opinions. Agree/disagree it doesn’t bother me.
On this point - this is why ranking individual players is so controversial/difficult. I watch every game which is 272 players every week but even then, I watch raiders game much closer than other games (eyes glued to the screen noticing if the kick off isn’t deep enough compared to paying attention to my animals during the tigers game you know).
Anyways, if you watch a certain team a bit more carefully than others you will notice the one percenters of certain players and you rank them more highly.
In respect of Jordan Rapana, I disagree with Posh and Billy but I think the majority of neutral NRL fans would agree with Posh and Billy. But to be fair, I don’t watch Junior Topou from the tigers as closely as I do Rapana and no one watches the raiders as closely as raiders fans.
Totally pointless post but I’ve thought about this before haha.
I don’t think it is pointless Dylan, it’s a really good post and I respect your view on Rapa. For me, I try to be a bit more objective. The bookies currently have us third shortest to win the least games. I don’t agree with that but it does make you pause and think about what the experts, who’s livelihood and money is on the line are seeing that we might not be. We might like to think all our problems stop with Levi, Hoppa and Saulo but that’s not the case. We need to be finding upgrades for quite a few positions including a wing spot that has been held for a long time by a great player.
100% if you look at the teams on paper, I have raiders at 13th (ahead of Dolphins, Tigers, Bulldogs and Dragons). We need to punch well above our weight and have a lot of our players playing career best footy to scrape into the 8.
Compare that to Melbourne who had a relatively poor year by their standard and finished in the top 4.
I am optimistic about our future however because it’s untested youth and not just any youth either.
The likes of Ethan Strange, Trey Mooney, Hohepa Puru and even Ata Mariota to a lesser extent are untested in first grade with all the promise in the world while players like Chevy Stewart, Ethan Sanders and Michael Asomua are yet to play first grade but on probabilities all look likely to have successful first grade careers ahead of them.
If the youth doesn’t pay off that’s when I will be very worried.
It won’t all pay off but that is where I’d like to see us become a little more ruthless in turning players over. Some positions we need to be patient and give players time to develop but I worry we sometimes hold on to some guys far too long only to see them reach modest heights.
I don't have a huge issue with the team selections overall. I think the thing that gets me more concerned is the coach has no innovation in him so before a ball is kicked you can see that he'll always revert back to plugging holes in the most conservative fashion hoping to grind out a result. I get it Round 1 in Newcastle isn't easy and you don't want to throw young players to the wolves but if we are going to have to go backwards to go forwards i'd prefer we just begin how we mean to go on.
We continue to **** about with blokes that are part of some fraternity. It's infuriating.
Woodgers wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 1:53 pm
I don't have a huge issue with the team selections overall. I think the thing that gets me more concerned is the coach has no innovation in him so before a ball is kicked you can see that he'll always revert back to plugging holes in the most conservative fashion hoping to grind out a result. I get it Round 1 in Newcastle isn't easy and you don't want to throw young players to the wolves but if we are going to have to go backwards to go forwards i'd prefer we just begin how we mean to go on.
Strange at 6 is a good brave move, getting Hoskings and Smithies in there is great and good to see Savage back. I wouldn’t say he has been totally conservative. Yes he could have gone for Stewart and Asomua, but it’s a long season and maybe best to ease players in till they find their feet rather than too big too early and have it go bad. Who would you have liked to have seen be given a run?
Schiller at Centre would have been better for me as Hoppa isn't playing there in the future, might as well give him time there (pretty sure it would have been opposite Gagai not Best which is a consideration). Strange was a good move but he had to pick either him or Weekes regardless. I think he was forced into Hoskings with the Whitehead injury otherwise we all know Whitehead plays. I wouldn't be entertaining Levi at all, Ricky has to be the only one still stubborn enough to persist there and I think Woolford is miles better albeit not the future but clearly works better with the pack rolling forward than Levi. In terms of Guler and Saulo, I just think they're average NRL players, you probably have to take one with horse out but I think we all agree Mooney has a higher ceiling and we're better off just getting him in there than playing the same cards.
We continue to **** about with blokes that are part of some fraternity. It's infuriating.
Woodgers wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 2:12 pm
Schiller at Centre would have been better for me as Hoppa isn't playing there in the future, might as well give him time there (pretty sure it would have been opposite Gagai not Best which is a consideration). Strange was a good move but he had to pick either him or Weekes regardless. I think he was forced into Hoskings with the Whitehead injury otherwise we all know Whitehead plays. I wouldn't be entertaining Levi at all, Ricky has to be the only one still stubborn enough to persist there and I think Woolford is miles better albeit not the future but clearly works better with the pack rolling forward than Levi. In terms of Guler and Saulo, I just think they're average NRL players, you probably have to take one with horse out but I think we all agree Mooney has a higher ceiling and we're better off just getting him in there than playing the same cards.
Schiller would have to feel a bit unlucky after his first trial. I’m happy to see how Hoppa goes but equally wouldn’t have minded seeing Schiller get a crack. Don’t agree with you about Woolfold being a better option than Levi. I do think Guler has had a lot of opportunity and hasn’t taken the next step. Saulo I want to see more from as well. Agree it would be good to see Mooney and others prioritised.
Woodgers wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 2:12 pm
Schiller at Centre would have been better for me as Hoppa isn't playing there in the future, might as well give him time there (pretty sure it would have been opposite Gagai not Best which is a consideration). Strange was a good move but he had to pick either him or Weekes regardless. I think he was forced into Hoskings with the Whitehead injury otherwise we all know Whitehead plays. I wouldn't be entertaining Levi at all, Ricky has to be the only one still stubborn enough to persist there and I think Woolford is miles better albeit not the future but clearly works better with the pack rolling forward than Levi. In terms of Guler and Saulo, I just think they're average NRL players, you probably have to take one with horse out but I think we all agree Mooney has a higher ceiling and we're better off just getting him in there than playing the same cards.
How can you be so sure on Levi after 4 games at NRL level?
Also, let's see how our attack goes this year before saying we have no innovation. We've been in 4 of the last 5 finals series with a star-less roster. Something must be going ok?
I'm certainly not sold on Mooney. You sound like a typical sports fan who gets over excited when someone shows some potential. Guler and Saulo are toilers that do a job at NRL level who are coming into prime middle forward years. Just because Mooney is big, looks scary and his name is Trey doesn't mean he is bound for future stardom. There's been countless players with potential who never realised it. Trey isn't a better player than Saulo right now. He is in line with Guler IMO but he is well behind Mariota at this stage.
Woodgers wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 1:53 pm
I don't have a huge issue with the team selections overall. I think the thing that gets me more concerned is the coach has no innovation in him so before a ball is kicked you can see that he'll always revert back to plugging holes in the most conservative fashion hoping to grind out a result. I get it Round 1 in Newcastle isn't easy and you don't want to throw young players to the wolves but if we are going to have to go backwards to go forwards i'd prefer we just begin how we mean to go on.
Strange at 6 is a good brave move, getting Hoskings and Smithies in there is great and good to see Savage back. I wouldn’t say he has been totally conservative. Yes he could have gone for Stewart and Asomua, but it’s a long season and maybe best to ease players in till they find their feet rather than too big too early and have it go bad. Who would you have liked to have seen be given a run?
I don't mind Asomua and Stewart being omitted from the 17 and agree they could do with some more development before first grade. Although I'd back Asomua to be able to play at an NRL standard once he's given a chance.
However, I disagree strongly with the three prop bench, and more so having both Saulo and Guler on the bench. We saw last year how much we suffered in the middle once Tapine and Papalii were off, we have plenty of evidence at this point to suggest it's a problem. Plus there's the fact that the last benchie usually only gets 15-20 mins - with this in mind, what point is there in having Saulo or Guler as a third prop on the bench when we could be using this spot to rotate some of the younger forwards such as Mooney or Puru? Saulo and Guler are both fine to have in your 17 as the fourth prop, or the guy you bring into your 17 when a prop gets injured. But having the two of them in the 17 providing their ordinary output is an issue to me.
Woodgers wrote: ↑March 6, 2024, 1:53 pm
I don't have a huge issue with the team selections overall. I think the thing that gets me more concerned is the coach has no innovation in him so before a ball is kicked you can see that he'll always revert back to plugging holes in the most conservative fashion hoping to grind out a result. I get it Round 1 in Newcastle isn't easy and you don't want to throw young players to the wolves but if we are going to have to go backwards to go forwards i'd prefer we just begin how we mean to go on.
Strange at 6 is a good brave move, getting Hoskings and Smithies in there is great and good to see Savage back. I wouldn’t say he has been totally conservative. Yes he could have gone for Stewart and Asomua, but it’s a long season and maybe best to ease players in till they find their feet rather than too big too early and have it go bad. Who would you have liked to have seen be given a run?
I don't mind Asomua and Stewart being omitted from the 17 and agree they could do with some more development before first grade. Although I'd back Asomua to be able to play at an NRL standard once he's given a chance.
However, I disagree strongly with the three prop bench, and more so having both Saulo and Guler on the bench. We saw last year how much we suffered in the middle once Tapine and Papalii were off, we have plenty of evidence at this point to suggest it's a problem. Plus there's the fact that the last benchie usually only gets 15-20 mins - with this in mind, what point is there in having Saulo or Guler as a third prop on the bench when we could be using this spot to rotate some of the younger forwards such as Mooney or Puru? Saulo and Guler are both fine to have in your 17 as the fourth prop, or the guy you bring into your 17 when a prop gets injured. But having the two of them in the 17 providing their ordinary output is an issue to me.
Will be interesting to see what the bench looks like when Hors comes back and whether he goes straight to 13 with Smithies to the bench. Agree we don’t need 3 props on the bench.
