Elliott Whitehead

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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by myanonymoususername »

Billy Walker wrote: July 30, 2022, 8:32 pm
Neeeegz wrote: July 30, 2022, 7:54 pm He was solid while in the field, I did notice a lazy effort in defence for one of their trys, but still need him at the moment, limit his minutes, and needs to come on after 20 minutes to prolong his career
Why do we want to prolong the careers of underperforming players in obvious decline?
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Matt »

Green Machine 2011 wrote: July 30, 2022, 8:44 pm
Canberra Milk wrote: July 30, 2022, 5:58 pm At least he's not getting 80 anymore. I can live with it
That’s it. At least there’s an acknowledgment he’s a 40-45min player.

CHN has his issues but massive upside too.

Like mini Germ taking out the early ‘sting’, let Whitehead do the same, and then bring CHN to cause havoc
Botman wrote: July 30, 2022, 8:56 pm It's always baby steps with veteran players for Stuart.
Agreed with CM, that we're at a point where Stuart understands he's not got 80 minuntes is the first small step, ill take it
CHN has his defensive issues (statistically this yr, he and Whitey aren't too different), but his is usually over enthusiasm. As in, over pursue, or rush up. Not good, but at least its proactive. He can lay the wood too, as his did on the weekend. However, his attacking upside, and the obvious change to our attack once he is on, is more than noticeable.

Whitehead is being burnt laterally, and its every week. Teams go at the gap either side of you half naturally, but they are attacking Whiteheads outside shoulder and winning too often. I noticed Elliott defending outside him a few times on the weekend, and I think that was for lateral speed vs Fifita on the open sides.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Raider of d Lost Ark »

Does Whitehead make the England World Cup Team at the end of the year?
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Billy Walker »

Raider of d Lost Ark wrote: August 6, 2022, 7:38 pm Does Whitehead make the England World Cup Team at the end of the year?
Is England serious about winning it?
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Botman »

Raider of d Lost Ark wrote: August 6, 2022, 7:38 pm Does Whitehead make the England World Cup Team at the end of the year?
I doubt it. But then i dont have much feel for the english team
Id say if he does, it's a problem for them
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

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Raider of d Lost Ark wrote: August 6, 2022, 7:38 pm Does Whitehead make the England World Cup Team at the end of the year?
I doubt it. But then i dont have much feel for the english team
Id say if he does, it's a problem for them
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by -PJ- »

He’s a walk up start.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Greengoblin »

Elliot’s used by has come and gone. He has no influence over the game as captain and has had a poor influence over the team as a starting 2nd rower. It’s time to insert some intelligence into the captains roll. Tapine? Jack? Jamal? Not sure there is much between the 3 and that might be the problem.
Can’t confess to know the solution. But we need to be looking for someone with genuine and positive influence over the playing group to join the squad next year
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Greengoblin »

Elliot’s used by has come and gone. He has no influence over the game as captain and has had a poor influence over the team as a starting 2nd rower. It’s time to insert some intelligence into the captains roll. Tapine? Jack? Jamal? Not sure there is much between the 3 and that might be the problem.
Can’t confess to know the solution. But we need to be looking for someone with genuine and positive influence over the playing group to join the squad next year
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Hong Kong Raider »

Whitehead was trying to get more involved today. His defence was better (there was no try cause pinned on him). But he's well past it. He's very slow to come back onside after kicks.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by sprintman »

Shouldn’t be anywhere near first grade
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by reptar »

-PJ- wrote:He’s a walk up start.
Too slow to run?
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

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Hong Kong Raider wrote: August 6, 2022, 8:18 pm Whitehead was trying to get more involved today. His defence was better (there was no try cause pinned on him). But he's well past it. He's very slow to come back onside after kicks.
Stats can say what stats say but the first Panthers try isn’t caused it Elliot Dundeehead does turn over the kick off in the 20.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by rayden83 »

What does Stuart hope to achieve continually picking Whitehead? Is he trying to prove his loyalty? Any other team and Whitehead would be playing second division in England by now. I get the feeling they are great mates off the park and Stuart simply doesnt have the heart to drop his mate. Beers between them would never be the same again. :cry: It was the same situation with Croker last year, it had to get really really bad before Stuart finally apparently woke up. But even then I think Croker succumbed to injury before Stuart’s wrath, so who really knows. Whitehead is at the point too, that he is not just useless and ineffective but a total liability.

Loyalty is great and all but why cant Stuart recognise that its not his job to be loyal and kind but to try to win a premiership. You cant win premierships with plodders who offer nothing on the park, especially when they are Captain. Rickys loyalty is his strength but its also his greatest weakness and the main reason he will never win a premiership (with the Raiders), he gets too emotionally invested in his relationships and it interferes with his ability to make good decisions in the best interests of the club. A clear minded coach with ambition to win a Premership would have dropped Whithead a long time ago.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by greeneyed »

Needs to be "rested".
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Billy Walker »

There were a few kids having a decent crack in the reserve game v souths today. Time to give them a go.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by BadnMean »

rayden83 wrote: August 6, 2022, 9:32 pm What does Stuart hope to achieve continually picking Whitehead? Is he trying to prove his loyalty? Any other team and Whitehead would be playing second division in England by now. I get the feeling they are great mates off the park and Stuart simply doesnt have the heart to drop his mate. Beers between them would never be the same again. :cry: It was the same situation with Croker last year, it had to get really really bad before Stuart finally apparently woke up. But even then I think Croker succumbed to injury before Stuart’s wrath, so who really knows. Whitehead is at the point too, that he is not just useless and ineffective but a total liability.

Loyalty is great and all but why cant Stuart recognise that its not his job to be loyal and kind but to try to win a premiership. You cant win premierships with plodders who offer nothing on the park, especially when they are Captain. Rickys loyalty is his strength but its also his greatest weakness and the main reason he will never win a premiership (with the Raiders), he gets too emotionally invested in his relationships and it interferes with his ability to make good decisions in the best interests of the club. A clear minded coach with ambition to win a Premership would have dropped Whithead a long time ago.
You're right in that it's the pattern. It also stops us recruiting in those areas.

We'll likely watch it again next year when Rapana goes a season too long. And whoever else is next on his "great at team bbqs" list.

If Whitehead is playing injured- then it's time to give him a rest. If not, the we'll be paying $550k to a reserve grade backrower for 2 seasons after this.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Billy Walker »

Take all the $$ we are currently giving to Croker, Hodgo and Whitehead and surely there isn’t player in the game we can’t buy??
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by thedevilingreen »

Yes but who would want too come here when Ricky is our coach.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by yurithe1 »

IMO, the game changed when Whitehead dropped the ball, which led to Penrith's try. It felt as though the team sagged when that happened.

Losing Tapine and Sutton didn't help later on, but the rot started there. I kept yelling for Stuart to replace Whitehead with CHN, but to now avail.

Time to make either Wighton or Tapine the co-captain and then replace Whitehead in that role at the end of the season.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Billy Walker »

yurithe1 wrote: August 7, 2022, 1:37 pm IMO, the game changed when Whitehead dropped the ball, which led to Penrith's try. It felt as though the team sagged when that happened.

Losing Tapine and Sutton didn't help later on, but the rot started there. I kept yelling for Stuart to replace Whitehead with CHN, but to now avail.

Time to make either Wighton or Tapine the co-captain and then replace Whitehead in that role at the end of the season.
Yep it was a great start that got totally derailed by that dropped ball.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by RTW »

Billy Walker wrote:Take all the $$ we are currently giving to Croker, Hodgo and Whitehead and surely there isn’t player in the game we can’t buy??
With Dolphins throwing their hat in the ring for any quality player that is available it isn’t that somple.


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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Billy Walker »

RTW wrote: August 7, 2022, 10:54 pm
Billy Walker wrote:Take all the $$ we are currently giving to Croker, Hodgo and Whitehead and surely there isn’t player in the game we can’t buy??
With Dolphins throwing their hat in the ring for any quality player that is available it isn’t that somple.


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If you tally up what we are paying those 3 you get a very big number that exceeds anything the very elite of the game are anywhere near.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by GreenMachine »

We’ve been playing with 12 men on the field all season…
Remarkable we’ve been even close to the top 8.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Mickey_Raider »

Imagine being this washed up and still being able to sit back and smile knowing you have another 1.25 + million to fetch off the Raiders over the next 2.5 years.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Green Blogger »

There is a looming opportunity - Whitehead has been open in his aspirations to coach long term. Now might be a good time to make him the latest member of the old boys club on the coaching staff with McFadden leaving.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by BadnMean »

Green Blogger wrote: August 8, 2022, 11:28 am There is a looming opportunity - Whitehead has been open in his aspirations to coach long term. Now might be a good time to make him the latest member of the old boys club on the coaching staff with McFadden leaving.
You can't actually do that under salary cap rules without still being on the hook for Elliot's $550k until end 2024.

The rules are there specifically to stop clubs giving bogus length contracts as a golden handshake to senior players and then pensioning them off into assistant coaches/promo reps etc.

Only way not to is a medical retirement and we don't actually see many of those across the league. Many one a year across the NRL? Best bet these days might be concussions where he's concerned. He's copped a few.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Botman »

Yeah that's not going to work out for us :lol:
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Hong Kong Raider »

I read in SMH that Andrew McCullough of the Dragons is going to retire at the end of the year, even though he has a contract with the Dragons for next year. Doesn't want to hinder the Dragons sourcing a replacement and knows it's time. Maybe Whitehead should do the same.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Billy Walker »

Hong Kong Raider wrote: August 8, 2022, 6:00 pm I read in SMH that Andrew McCullough of the Dragons is going to retire at the end of the year, even though he has a contract with the Dragons for next year. Doesn't want to hinder the Dragons sourcing a replacement and knows it's time. Maybe Whitehead should do the same.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by kona_dream »

BadnMean wrote: August 8, 2022, 12:58 pm
Green Blogger wrote: August 8, 2022, 11:28 am There is a looming opportunity - Whitehead has been open in his aspirations to coach long term. Now might be a good time to make him the latest member of the old boys club on the coaching staff with McFadden leaving.
You can't actually do that under salary cap rules without still being on the hook for Elliot's $550k until end 2024.

The rules are there specifically to stop clubs giving bogus length contracts as a golden handshake to senior players and then pensioning them off into assistant coaches/promo reps etc.

Only way not to is a medical retirement and we don't actually see many of those across the league. Many one a year across the NRL? Best bet these days might be concussions where he's concerned. He's copped a few.
Can’t we just claim an injury, create an ambassador role on massive money for a couple of years and then he can return to the super league. It worked for GI and the bunnies.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by BadnMean »

kona_dream wrote: August 8, 2022, 10:13 pm
BadnMean wrote: August 8, 2022, 12:58 pm
Green Blogger wrote: August 8, 2022, 11:28 am There is a looming opportunity - Whitehead has been open in his aspirations to coach long term. Now might be a good time to make him the latest member of the old boys club on the coaching staff with McFadden leaving.
You can't actually do that under salary cap rules without still being on the hook for Elliot's $550k until end 2024.

The rules are there specifically to stop clubs giving bogus length contracts as a golden handshake to senior players and then pensioning them off into assistant coaches/promo reps etc.

Only way not to is a medical retirement and we don't actually see many of those across the league. Many one a year across the NRL? Best bet these days might be concussions where he's concerned. He's copped a few.
Can’t we just claim an injury, create an ambassador role on massive money for a couple of years and then he can return to the super league. It worked for GI and the bunnies.
Like I said, you don't see many clubs get away with it. GI was a few years ago. And big enough to have the rules bent. With a top tier CEO pulling the strings. The fact we don't then see a rash of such obvious lurks makes me think NRL made it known it wouldn't be happening easily.

You don't see many sketchy ones- Souffs got 2 (GI and Surgess). Maybe Parra got one with Whatmough 5 years ago.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

Matt wrote: August 1, 2022, 3:37 pm
Green Machine 2011 wrote: July 30, 2022, 8:44 pm
Canberra Milk wrote: July 30, 2022, 5:58 pm At least he's not getting 80 anymore. I can live with it
That’s it. At least there’s an acknowledgment he’s a 40-45min player.

CHN has his issues but massive upside too.

Like mini Germ taking out the early ‘sting’, let Whitehead do the same, and then bring CHN to cause havoc
Botman wrote: July 30, 2022, 8:56 pm It's always baby steps with veteran players for Stuart.
Agreed with CM, that we're at a point where Stuart understands he's not got 80 minuntes is the first small step, ill take it
CHN has his defensive issues (statistically this yr, he and Whitey aren't too different), but his is usually over enthusiasm. As in, over pursue, or rush up. Not good, but at least its proactive. He can lay the wood too, as his did on the weekend. However, his attacking upside, and the obvious change to our attack once he is on, is more than noticeable.

Whitehead is being burnt laterally, and its every week. Teams go at the gap either side of you half naturally, but they are attacking Whiteheads outside shoulder and winning too often. I noticed Elliott defending outside him a few times on the weekend, and I think that was for lateral speed vs Fifita on the open sides.
Ah yes proactive missed tackles. Good to see we're now inventing stats to put a positive spin on CHN's shortcomings. Can we also add in linebreaks vs the bottom 6? He'd be a gun there too, which is more on the halves than him.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by Finchy »

To be fair, I’d rather a player miss a tackle by over-enthusiasticly chasing the ball runner or shooting out of the line to put a shot on than being lazy, arm grabbing, or too old/slow/tired, or outright avoiding contact like Reece Robinson, Sam Williams, or Darius Boyd.

By being eager to make the tackle, the player has the potential to be coached to adjust their techniques. The latter can’t be fixed.
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Re: Elliott Whitehead

Post by gangrenous »

Sure it can. It’s called - “contract year”
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