2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

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Who will win?

Raiders 13+
3
25%
Raiders 1-12
6
50%
Draw
0
No votes
Broncos 1-12
2
17%
Broncos 13+
1
8%
 
Total votes: 12

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Rick
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Rick »

Northern Raider wrote:At risk of scapegoating individuals I think a lot of our problems in the last 20 mins came from Starling. He kept holding the ball and running around at dummy half. It was disrupting any structure we may have had. What we needed at the back end of the game and Starling was completely lacking it. We needed Woolford back out there.
I’ve been banging this drum for a long time. Starling absolutely stifles our attack and does not improve our defence. The experiment needs to end.

We are lucky to be able to lose Hodgo and still be able to run Woolford/ Elliot or Woolford/ Trevalyn.

Shop starling for the remainder of the year or we should be seriously looking to see if Dolphins want a package deal of; Croker. Whitehead, CHN and Starling.


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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Billy Walker »

Rick wrote: June 11, 2022, 11:41 pm
Northern Raider wrote:At risk of scapegoating individuals I think a lot of our problems in the last 20 mins came from Starling. He kept holding the ball and running around at dummy half. It was disrupting any structure we may have had. What we needed at the back end of the game and Starling was completely lacking it. We needed Woolford back out there.
I’ve been banging this drum for a long time. Starling absolutely stifles our attack and does not improve our defence. The experiment needs to end.

We are lucky to be able to lose Hodgo and still be able to run Woolford/ Elliot or Woolford/ Trevalyn.

Shop starling for the remainder of the year or we should be seriously looking to see if Dolphins want a package deal of; Croker. Whitehead, CHN and Starling.


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What did the Dolphins ever do to us???
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Rick »

Looks like they are desperate to form a squad of 30.


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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by greeneyed »

I was disappointed with the performance, furious about the press conference, and absolutely downright fuming about Fox League cutting the post match coverage on Fox League to go to greyhound racing. It’s a rugby league channel. It is not a boxing or greyhound channel. Foxtel, of course, make it just about impossible to complain.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Green Taipan »

benda wrote: June 11, 2022, 9:45 pm
Question wrote: June 11, 2022, 9:41 pm
Rickmando wrote:Why do people keep crapping on about our top 8 chances???

Have you seen the style of football we’ve been playing this season? Who are we beating?! Even the rare occasions when we put a few plays together - we are dumb as dog ****. The players look clueless about their roles and/or the game plan, and there’s no leaders with football smarts to drag them along.

We don’t know how to win.
It's just rubbish talk trying to make a dead rubber interesting.

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We got decent players IMO. Sure areas we have weaknesses.. but we can and should be better.

Im starting to this our lack of attack is purely down to coaching. Unless something changes... and im not sure its necessarily Stuart needs to go... we will lean on grinding footy which doesnt work anymore. The game has speed up way too much for that.

We didnt use our backline in any decent way in attack in their half. Question needs to be why is that the case?
The answer is obvious; Ricky Stuart!
It's a simple game; tackle, back-up, pass, hold the ball! What did I say? "Hold the bloody ball!!"
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Billy Walker »

greeneyed wrote: June 11, 2022, 11:49 pm I was disappointed with the performance, furious about the press conference, and absolutely downright fuming about Fox League cutting the post match coverage on Fox League to go to greyhound racing. It’s a rugby league channel. It is not a boxing or greyhound channel. Foxtel, of course, make it just about impossible to complain.
I just went with it, picked a number, placed a bet and made a few bob. Don’t think it will convert me to the dish lickers but nice to have a win for the night. I take your point though.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Green Taipan »

Green Machine 2011 wrote: June 11, 2022, 9:37 pm We didn’t lose because of Savage.

Wighton and Fogarty suck major balls. As does schnieder. We have ZERO halves that can take effect of our outside backs.

CNK, Hodgo, Croker and Whitehead - punt them to the sun and use their cash to get Munster. Won’t happen, but move Jack out of the halves and to 13, and we will become a top 4 team again

We are a rabble
I think we did lose because of Savage; he cost us a try in defence and one in attack. He has talent and we probably have to preserve with him but he desperately needs a lot more coaching about playing in the NRL and it's not going to come from a myopic Ricky!
It's a simple game; tackle, back-up, pass, hold the ball! What did I say? "Hold the bloody ball!!"
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by BadnMean »

RedRaider wrote: June 11, 2022, 11:31 pm Our defence let us down tonight. Badly.
Try 1 - Mann steps past EW easily for a simple running 5/8s try
Try 2 - Lee pushes off Kris, 1 on 1 and gives his winger an easy try
Try 3 - Raiders D too compressed. Winger Schiller has to come in to take 5/8 Mann and misses the 1 on 1 but Mann has center Farnsworth outside him for a run to the line.
Try 4 - Play towards our right side and Fog goes for the decoy runner which creates a 3 on 2 for the Bronco's

Three of their 4 tries coming down our right side defensive line up. There does not seem to be much communication and/or discipline between the players on that side. They seem to react as individuals rather than a defensive unit working together.
Schiller and Fog the new faces there + a rookie centre. Not the strongest defensive set up. Two rookies and a guy 3 games into a comeback.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Green Taipan »

Rickmando wrote: June 11, 2022, 9:39 pm Why do people keep crapping on about our top 8 chances???

Have you seen the style of football we’ve been playing this season? Who are we beating?! Even the rare occasions when we put a few plays together - we are dumb as dog ****. The players look clueless about their roles and/or the game plan, and there’s no leaders with football smarts to drag them along.

We don’t know how to win.
The truth hurts; we were leaderless again tonight. Whitehead, Fog and Jack are not leadership material. We played better when Frawley (as limited as he is) was at 6. Ricky being the obstinate person he is, only sees what he wants to see.
It's a simple game; tackle, back-up, pass, hold the ball! What did I say? "Hold the bloody ball!!"
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Green Taipan »

Rickmando wrote: June 11, 2022, 10:11 pm
Greenev wrote: June 11, 2022, 10:05 pm Whitehead looks like a con artist talking about effort in the presser

These guys realise who they had out yeah? This wasn’t bad luck

It was PISS poor excecution

We would be better off with T Barrett or McGuire and that’s not a lie
He’s sitting next to the greatest con artist of all. That man has convinced 4 clubs over 2 decades to pay him a lot of money, despite very little evidence that he actually understands the game from a coaching perspective
Spot on!!!!!!
It's a simple game; tackle, back-up, pass, hold the ball! What did I say? "Hold the bloody ball!!"
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Green Taipan »

Raider47 wrote: June 11, 2022, 10:11 pm What is Ricky trying to achieve with his hooker rotation?

Starling's upside is that he can cause havoc against a tiring defence however it's 3 weeks in a row now where he has been brought on just after the break against what are no doubt rested opposition legs... surprise surprise he has phoned in those three weeks.

Concerns around Wighton too. Only 3 wins with him this season and there have been a number of games now where the chance has been there for a half to seize the moment and he fails to do so.
Wighton is an overpaid joke at 5/8!
It's a simple game; tackle, back-up, pass, hold the ball! What did I say? "Hold the bloody ball!!"
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

Billy Walker wrote: June 11, 2022, 11:45 pm
Rick wrote: June 11, 2022, 11:41 pm
Northern Raider wrote:At risk of scapegoating individuals I think a lot of our problems in the last 20 mins came from Starling. He kept holding the ball and running around at dummy half. It was disrupting any structure we may have had. What we needed at the back end of the game and Starling was completely lacking it. We needed Woolford back out there.
I’ve been banging this drum for a long time. Starling absolutely stifles our attack and does not improve our defence. The experiment needs to end.

We are lucky to be able to lose Hodgo and still be able to run Woolford/ Elliot or Woolford/ Trevalyn.

Shop starling for the remainder of the year or we should be seriously looking to see if Dolphins want a package deal of; Croker. Whitehead, CHN and Starling.


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What did the Dolphins ever do to us???
Lol.

I've got a shipping container of Milli Vanilli merch, hopefully the Dolphins are keen on that too.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by twistedbydesign »

Super frustrating loss. For any improvement we've made over the last month or two, we still lack any structure in our attack and get found out when the game is on the line as a result.

Starling's regression has been brutal. He'll have flashes due to his speed but it's not an accident we aren't scoring points when he's out there, he's completely starving the rest of the team for air. Fogarty and Wighton have to take their fair share of responsibility here as well, it's early days for their combo but just based on NRL experience alone they should have been able to get us over the line tonight.

Whitehead is a liability. He's never been a high workrate player but his output is embarrassing right now, particularly when compared with Hudson on the other side of the field. That defensive edge that he shares with Fogarty and Timoko will have a target on it every week, it needs fixing - and fast.

Savage had some good moments, every week he has a couple of touches which leave you in awe. But his ball control in contact isn't good enough as others have said. Seems an attitude/concentration thing as much as anything, so hopefully we see improvement in this area sooner rather than later.

I thought Cotric was excellent and Schiller strong also. Tapine immense and Hors and Elliot very good as well. Timoko had some nice moments with the ball in hand, less so without it. We have some pieces, but lack the structure - and, if we're honest, the playmaking ability - to really get the most of them.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by nachopants »

Disappointing game, perhaps I'm so defeated that this one didn't really bother me all that much.

The press conference looked a lot to me like "Xavier **** the bed and cost us the game, no need for me to say it, you all saw it" so Ricky just deflected instead of a public execution.

Ricky said it a few weeks ago, the Xavier hype is premature, he's 2 years and 10kg premature for first grade (posted this on Twitter as well).

Today Rick was proven right, with Savage a 'forced selection' with no alternatives. That's why he sat there the way he did imo.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by benda »

nachopants wrote: June 12, 2022, 1:08 am Disappointing game, perhaps I'm so defeated that this one didn't really bother me all that much.

The press conference looked a lot to me like "Xavier **** the bed and cost us the game, no need for me to say it, you all saw it" so Ricky just deflected instead of a public execution.

Ricky said it a few weeks ago, the Xavier hype is premature, he's 2 years and 10kg premature for first grade (posted this on Twitter as well).

Today Rick was proven right, with Savage a 'forced selection' with no alternatives. That's why he sat there the way he did imo.
Its hard to read into the press conference too much. All have media training these days plus lots of diversion or lack of depth into the real core challenges that exist. In most cases comments are very measured with emotion and true opinions kept to themselves for good reason.

Stuart surely doesnt believe it was just unlucky. We did not show one nice play with our backline. Anyone that follows footy can see that.

Im prepared to aay our forwards are up amongst the top 4 forwards in the comp. Tapine is maybe the best prop in the game.

Challenge really is we dont know what to do in attack. Our game play is purely based on our forward power play and then (big) maybe some ball playing around that. And the problem is its purely around our forwards. We cant seem to score tries with our backs beating their opposition 1 on 1 or a clean line break.

Savage.. to bag him is a great shame. The kid is confident.. i do think ball security is an area of improvement... but he has just a handful of games starting. This kid needs good mentoring and to be left in that position. He can be our next belcher or mullins. That kick he out into the in goal was great skill and awareness.

What Stuart is correct in and he did say is our culture is up there. Our players put it. I agree with this 100%. Challenge for Stuart is that now he had culture ticked.. assuming my assumption is correct... how do we score tries is thr next problem he needs to solve.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by benda »

nachopants wrote: June 12, 2022, 1:08 am Disappointing game, perhaps I'm so defeated that this one didn't really bother me all that much.

The press conference looked a lot to me like "Xavier **** the bed and cost us the game, no need for me to say it, you all saw it" so Ricky just deflected instead of a public execution.

Ricky said it a few weeks ago, the Xavier hype is premature, he's 2 years and 10kg premature for first grade (posted this on Twitter as well).

Today Rick was proven right, with Savage a 'forced selection' with no alternatives. That's why he sat there the way he did imo.
Its hard to read into the press conference too much. All have media training these days plus lots of diversion or lack of depth into the real core challenges that exist. In most cases comments are very measured with emotion and true opinions kept to themselves for good reason.

Stuart surely doesnt believe it was just unlucky. We did not show one nice play with our backline. Anyone that follows footy can see that.

Im prepared to aay our forwards are up amongst the top 4 forwards in the comp. Tapine is maybe the best prop in the game.

Challenge really is we dont know what to do in attack. Our game play is purely based on our forward power play and then (big) maybe some ball playing around that. And the problem is its purely around our forwards. We cant seem to score tries with our backs beating their opposition 1 on 1 or a clean line break.

Savage.. to bag him is a great shame. The kid is confident.. i do think ball security is an area of improvement... but he has just a handful of games starting. This kid needs good mentoring and to be left in that position. He can be our next belcher or mullins. That kick he out into the in goal was great skill and awareness.

What Stuart is correct in and he did say is our culture is up there. Our players put it. I agree with this 100%. Challenge for Stuart is that now he had culture ticked.. assuming my assumption is correct... how do we score tries is thr next problem he needs to solve.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by lightning »

BadnMean wrote: June 12, 2022, 12:02 am
RedRaider wrote: June 11, 2022, 11:31 pm Our defence let us down tonight. Badly.
Try 1 - Mann steps past EW easily for a simple running 5/8s try
Try 2 - Lee pushes off Kris, 1 on 1 and gives his winger an easy try
Try 3 - Raiders D too compressed. Winger Schiller has to come in to take 5/8 Mann and misses the 1 on 1 but Mann has center Farnsworth outside him for a run to the line.
Try 4 - Play towards our right side and Fog goes for the decoy runner which creates a 3 on 2 for the Bronco's

Three of their 4 tries coming down our right side defensive line up. There does not seem to be much communication and/or discipline between the players on that side. They seem to react as individuals rather than a defensive unit working together.
Schiller and Fog the new faces there + a rookie centre. Not the strongest defensive set up. Two rookies and a guy 3 games into a comeback.
Broncos weren’t much better than us on attack. Some bad D cost us. Structure on the right. and Kris miss one if the worst one on one centre attempts I’ve seen in ages head down grab at nothing.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by RedRaider »

BadnMean wrote: June 12, 2022, 12:02 am
RedRaider wrote: June 11, 2022, 11:31 pm Our defence let us down tonight. Badly.
Try 1 - Mann steps past EW easily for a simple running 5/8s try
Try 2 - Lee pushes off Kris, 1 on 1 and gives his winger an easy try
Try 3 - Raiders D too compressed. Winger Schiller has to come in to take 5/8 Mann and misses the 1 on 1 but Mann has center Farnsworth outside him for a run to the line.
Try 4 - Play towards our right side and Fog goes for the decoy runner which creates a 3 on 2 for the Bronco's

Three of their 4 tries coming down our right side defensive line up. There does not seem to be much communication and/or discipline between the players on that side. They seem to react as individuals rather than a defensive unit working together.
Schiller and Fog the new faces there + a rookie centre. Not the strongest defensive set up. Two rookies and a guy 3 games into a comeback.
Agree it was a 'thrown together' set up on our right, BnM. The well coached sides (Storm, Panthers, Chooks last year with all their injuries) seem to be able to adjust and players communicate with each other. The current Raider coaches would have plenty of video of Bronco attacking play. I imagine the players would have had some time to run opposed training sessions with the objective of closing down their tactics and becoming familiar with each other. The Bronco's tries looked like unopposed training runs.

One thing on the use of 'Jesus Wept'. My Dad used that lingo as we were growing up in the 50's and 60's and beyond. For Nickman that's 1950's/1960's not 1850's/1860's. :D
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by HoraceBigCigar »

Azza wrote: June 11, 2022, 8:53 pm
yeh raiders wrote:
Azza wrote: June 11, 2022, 8:50 pm
Greenev wrote:Here I am watching another failed halfback experiment, Fogarty is trash and we have wasted our money
A poor man's Sezer

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Still haven’t worked out what the fuss was all about… was he ever any good at the Titans?
No.

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It’s not like there’s a queue of gun halfbacks waiting for their chance to play in our lovely nation’s capital. Would you rather have Sammy every week? Frawley? When we were playing Schneider the general comments were “he’s not FG material”. Agree Fog ain’t gonna be playing origin any time soon but tell me please (considering who’s available on the market, we aren’t a ‘glamour’ club etc) who should be playing halfback for us?
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by pickles »

Disappointing to put ourselves in a position to win and not be able to generate the points required to get across the line.

We lacked composure in attack and were trying to win with every play rather than building pressure.

What it looks like to me is that our forwards are good enough to get us into the top 4 but our spine isn’t too 8 material. It is t that surprising given we’ve only managed to run the same spine out twice in half a season.

The big question is can they click quickly enough to save this season. 4 of our next 5 games are very winnable, the other is the storm. We need to win the 4 winnable ones at a minimum to stay in touch.

Fogarty and savage are improving week on week individually but it’s the combinations that we need to work. I hope they can sort it out, there’s definitely talent there, but they need to take control and ice games like that one consistently.
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by daley6 »

I love all this , this guy that guy crap, we cant do anything in the 2nd half of games this year , with the exception of the titans game in 14 rounds of footy,
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by HoraceBigCigar »

Azza wrote: June 11, 2022, 9:11 pm Very frustrating if we were a smarter team we could easily win this

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Canberra Raiders smart football team. LoL 😂 That’s a good one
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by HoraceBigCigar »

Green Machine 2011 wrote: June 11, 2022, 9:37 pm We didn’t lose because of Savage.

Wighton and Fogarty suck major balls. As does schnieder. We have ZERO halves that can take effect of our outside backs.

CNK, Hodgo, Croker and Whitehead - punt them to the sun and use their cash to get Munster. Won’t happen, but move Jack out of the halves and to 13, and we will become a top 4 team again

We are a rabble
I’m all for Jack @ 13, but who plays 6?
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by radicalraider »

Sorry for last night guys it really hurt to lose like that and I had a few too many
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Boomercm »

Hillsraider wrote: June 11, 2022, 11:24 pm
Northern Raider wrote: June 11, 2022, 10:05 pm At risk of scapegoating individuals I think a lot of our problems in the last 20 mins came from Starling. He kept holding the ball and running around at dummy half. It was disrupting any structure we may have had. What we needed at the back end of the game and Starling was completely lacking it. We needed Woolford back out there.
It seems like only a moment ago Starlo was the antidote to Hodgo 'overplaying it' in attack and now Germ Jr is the one that seems to get the best out of the team when he's on the field.

With Trev in the wings I honestly have no idea who our main hooker will be this time next year.
Trev is the messiah
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Green Machine 2011 »

radicalraider wrote: June 12, 2022, 8:11 am Sorry for last night guys it really hurt to lose like that and I had a few too many
No need to apologize mate, last night did hurt for a number of reasons.

We should have won with their outs and injuries, but we are directionless in attack and still can’t play a second half for the life of us.

Add to the fact that the glimpse of hope the last 6 weeks gave us is now over, as we’re not making the 8 (bar a miracle run, which I just can’t see).

TimiGO got me chuckling this morning 😂

The spine in the second half (and in general) are just not up to scratch. Starling has got to go, Wighton is not a half, Forgarty is run of the mill, Savage had a shocker but can give him a pass
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by GreenMachine »

Took the Mrs out to dinner last night and missed the game….looks like a great decision after reading the comments this morning..
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Green Machine 2011 »

HoraceBigCigar wrote: June 12, 2022, 7:41 am
Green Machine 2011 wrote: June 11, 2022, 9:37 pm We didn’t lose because of Savage.

Wighton and Fogarty suck major balls. As does schnieder. We have ZERO halves that can take effect of our outside backs.

CNK, Hodgo, Croker and Whitehead - punt them to the sun and use their cash to get Munster. Won’t happen, but move Jack out of the halves and to 13, and we will become a top 4 team again

We are a rabble
I’m all for Jack @ 13, but who plays 6?
Despite that comment by me being in the heat of the moment and a few drinks deep, I do actually think we should be looking to move Jack from 6. He’s still an origin level player and elite, but let’s use him at what he does best - run hard and tackle hard. Be it centre or 13.

We don’t have a ready made replacement, Fogarty and Frawley is a halves pairing that would be battling for the spoon. So he stays for now, and Ricky is super emotional about Jack in general, that he realistically stays there for so long as he’s a raider.

I get the Munster thing won’t happen, but we need to constantly be looking at halves. We should at least make Munster a massive offer for 2024, even if he would never come here
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Boomercm »

benda wrote: June 12, 2022, 2:06 am
nachopants wrote: June 12, 2022, 1:08 am Disappointing game, perhaps I'm so defeated that this one didn't really bother me all that much.

The press conference looked a lot to me like "Xavier **** the bed and cost us the game, no need for me to say it, you all saw it" so Ricky just deflected instead of a public execution.

Ricky said it a few weeks ago, the Xavier hype is premature, he's 2 years and 10kg premature for first grade (posted this on Twitter as well).

Today Rick was proven right, with Savage a 'forced selection' with no alternatives. That's why he sat there the way he did imo.
Its hard to read into the press conference too much. All have media training these days plus lots of diversion or lack of depth into the real core challenges that exist. In most cases comments are very measured with emotion and true opinions kept to themselves for good reason.

Stuart surely doesnt believe it was just unlucky. We did not show one nice play with our backline. Anyone that follows footy can see that.

Im prepared to aay our forwards are up amongst the top 4 forwards in the comp. Tapine is maybe the best prop in the game.

Challenge really is we dont know what to do in attack. Our game play is purely based on our forward power play and then (big) maybe some ball playing around that. And the problem is its purely around our forwards. We cant seem to score tries with our backs beating their opposition 1 on 1 or a clean line break.

Savage.. to bag him is a great shame. The kid is confident.. i do think ball security is an area of improvement... but he has just a handful of games starting. This kid needs good mentoring and to be left in that position. He can be our next belcher or mullins. That kick he out into the in goal was great skill and awareness.

What Stuart is correct in and he did say is our culture is up there. Our players put it. I agree with this 100%. Challenge for Stuart is that now he had culture ticked.. assuming my assumption is correct... how do we score tries is thr next problem he needs to solve.
Timoko scored 1-1 last week. We just don't get our backs into those positions very often. I really am unsure what our backs might be able to do. I suspect most of them would be better in other systems.

There are so many game awareness issues in our side. It is like we are just playing the next play each time, frantically trying to make a decision about what comes next at the play the ball. Other teams are playing 2 or 3 plays ahead (or 2 or 3 sets ahead if you are Penrith/Storm) and everyone seems to know where they need to be.

This is definitely improved when we have a calm organising hooker. Starling does not seem to be a good fit. He might star at a club with more organised halves and structure, but he adds more confusion to us and that is the last thing we need.

I have my fingers crossed that Trev/Schnieder can fix this together over the next year or two. They have played lots of footy together, and Trev is supposed to be a game manager with a good range of skills. It doesn't seem like our coaching staff are able to imprint these skills on players, so I am hoping we get lucky and it will come naturally with these guys playing together.
TongueFTW
Dean Lance
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by TongueFTW »

Thought I would feel better this morning about the game, but after watching the Stuart press conference, feel worse:

* I mentioned it in the other thread, but the lack of football IQ beggars belief. We just needed two full back to back sets, and we would have scored, yet we spent the whole time going for miracle plays in a panic, making some stupid mistakes. We did not give Timoko a single one on one chance, which beggars belief.
* As others have said, with Starling we lost any semblance of calm and control - in saying that, he made a couple of half breaks and there was no push support through the middle. This is something Savage needs to work on. Savage is a work in progress, the main issue is his handling out of trouble. Our attack definitely looks better with him there. He did drop a Reynolds kick last night, but overall I have been impressed with him under the high ball, particularly compared to CNK.
* Wighton shouldn’t have played. I saw some footage of him on Thursday morning, he was struggling to walk. He didn’t take a single run last night, or help at all coming out of trouble - understandable too, given his massive effort on Wednesday. This whole “Origin players back up” is not a general rule across all games and all performances. After the speed of the game and Jack’s performance on Wednesday, he needed a break. A couple of times I felt he could have went for a run when we were camped in the Broncos 20, but he didn’t want the contact.
* Our right side defence is a major, major concern, and next week we will be coming up against Ponga, who will tear us to pieces. Whitehead has lost his motor, and Fog, as I mentioned at the time of his signing, is good in physical contact but makes poor decisions. There was nothing unlucky in that performance. Actually, we had all of the luck go our way. Structural issues in attack and defence cost us.
* Tapine is the best forward in the game, and I thought Elliot, Young, and Horsburgh were great in support. What I love about out pack is the balance - different body shapes, all with distinct running styles. Very hard to defend. Right side second row is an issue.
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Canberra Milk
Laurie Daley
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Canberra Milk »

benda wrote: June 12, 2022, 2:06 am
nachopants wrote: June 12, 2022, 1:08 am Disappointing game, perhaps I'm so defeated that this one didn't really bother me all that much.

The press conference looked a lot to me like "Xavier **** the bed and cost us the game, no need for me to say it, you all saw it" so Ricky just deflected instead of a public execution.

Ricky said it a few weeks ago, the Xavier hype is premature, he's 2 years and 10kg premature for first grade (posted this on Twitter as well).

Today Rick was proven right, with Savage a 'forced selection' with no alternatives. That's why he sat there the way he did imo.
Its hard to read into the press conference too much. All have media training these days plus lots of diversion or lack of depth into the real core challenges that exist. In most cases comments are very measured with emotion and true opinions kept to themselves for good reason.

Stuart surely doesnt believe it was just unlucky. We did not show one nice play with our backline. Anyone that follows footy can see that.
But we play exactly like Ricky talks. Like a team who is so obsessed with effort, that they've neglected the skill and structure component. I think Ricky does believe what he's saying

Nacho above blaming Savage for the loss, well, in a big enough sample size as you get on internet message boards, there's always going to be a few moronic comments
Green Machine 2011
Simon Woolford
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Green Machine 2011 »

TongueFTW wrote: June 12, 2022, 8:37 am Thought I would feel better this morning about the game, but after watching the Stuart press conference, feel worse:

* I mentioned it in the other thread, but the lack of football IQ beggars belief. We just needed two full back to back sets, and we would have scored, yet we spent the whole time going for miracle plays in a panic, making some stupid mistakes. We did not give Timoko a single one on one chance, which beggars belief.
* As others have said, with Starling we lost any semblance of calm and control - in saying that, he made a couple of half breaks and there was no push support through the middle. This is something Savage needs to work on. Savage is a work in progress, the main issue is his handling out of trouble. Our attack definitely looks better with him there. He did drop a Reynolds kick last night, but overall I have been impressed with him under the high ball, particularly compared to CNK.
* Wighton shouldn’t have played. I saw some footage of him on Thursday morning, he was struggling to walk. He didn’t take a single run last night, or help at all coming out of trouble - understandable too, given his massive effort on Wednesday. This whole “Origin players back up” is not a general rule across all games and all performances. After the speed of the game and Jack’s performance on Wednesday, he needed a break. A couple of times I felt he could have went for a run when we were camped in the Broncos 20, but he didn’t want the contact.
* Our right side defence is a major, major concern, and next week we will be coming up against Ponga, who will tear us to pieces. Whitehead has lost his motor, and Fog, as I mentioned at the time of his signing, is good in physical contact but makes poor decisions. There was nothing unlucky in that performance. Actually, we had all of the luck go our way. Structural issues in attack and defence cost us.
* Tapine is the best forward in the game, and I thought Elliot, Young, and Horsburgh were great in support. What I love about out pack is the balance - different body shapes, all with distinct running styles. Very hard to defend. Right side second row is an issue.
Good post. Wish I had more to add but well said
Boomercm
Brett Mullins
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by Boomercm »

Green Machine 2011 wrote: June 12, 2022, 8:29 am
HoraceBigCigar wrote: June 12, 2022, 7:41 am
Green Machine 2011 wrote: June 11, 2022, 9:37 pm We didn’t lose because of Savage.

Wighton and Fogarty suck major balls. As does schnieder. We have ZERO halves that can take effect of our outside backs.

CNK, Hodgo, Croker and Whitehead - punt them to the sun and use their cash to get Munster. Won’t happen, but move Jack out of the halves and to 13, and we will become a top 4 team again

We are a rabble
I’m all for Jack @ 13, but who plays 6?
Despite that comment by me being in the heat of the moment and a few drinks deep, I do actually think we should be looking to move Jack from 6. He’s still an origin level player and elite, but let’s use him at what he does best - run hard and tackle hard. Be it centre or 13.

We don’t have a ready made replacement, Fogarty and Frawley is a halves pairing that would be battling for the spoon. So he stays for now, and Ricky is super emotional about Jack in general, that he realistically stays there for so long as he’s a raider.

I get the Munster thing won’t happen, but we need to constantly be looking at halves. We should at least make Munster a massive offer for 2024, even if he would never come here
I reckon Mitchell Moses would be a better option for us than Munster - he would compliment Jack better. He seems like he likes the $ too. If they don't think Trev/Woolford and Schneider are the long term pairings to control the side and manage games, then perhaps throw big $ at Moses.

I think center is Jack's natural position, but he's a very high quality 5/8 nowadays. His mid and long range kicking has improved enormously. He's not a general though (and nor is Munster, I don't think). And because Jack is not a general he probably should have been given a rest last night. Him being out there exhausted didn't add much for us.
radicalraider
John Ferguson
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Re: 2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by radicalraider »

You all laughed at me when I said jack not a 6 a few years ago... whos laughing now
LastRaider
John Ferguson
Posts: 2383
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2022 Rd 14 V Broncos: Game Day

Post by LastRaider »

pickles wrote:Disappointing to put ourselves in a position to win and not be able to generate the points required to get across the line.

We lacked composure in attack and were trying to win with every play rather than building pressure.

What it looks like to me is that our forwards are good enough to get us into the top 4 but our spine isn’t too 8 material. It is t that surprising given we’ve only managed to run the same spine out twice in half a season.

The big question is can they click quickly enough to save this season. 4 of our next 5 games are very winnable, the other is the storm. We need to win the 4 winnable ones at a minimum to stay in touch.

Fogarty and savage are improving week on week individually but it’s the combinations that we need to work. I hope they can sort it out, there’s definitely talent there, but they need to take control and ice games like that one consistently.
I agree with this and unfortunately I think the answer is moving Wighton out of 6 to centre. Time and time again, Wighton proves to be too erratic and lacks the composure to guide us home to win these tight games which we have become the best in the league at losing by less than 6 points


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