The Politics Thread 2022

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Dr Zaius
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Dr Zaius »

Has the reason for their slow action been explained? Maybe the men on the ground were more than willing, but the order from above was to hold back. I honestly don't know, but it seems unless an explanation has been given recent discussion is somewhat irrelevant.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Riaan »

Dr Zaius wrote: May 28, 2022, 10:00 pm Has the reason for their slow action been explained? Maybe the men on the ground were more than willing, but the order from above was to hold back. I honestly don't know, but it seems unless an explanation has been given recent discussion is somewhat irrelevant.
Seems like there was confusion with the multiple agencies attending the scene. I wouldn't want to be charging blindly into a school anyway so can see the hesitation on the police forces part.
People need to ask themselves why the media are going after the police in the this instance, seems very suspicious.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Botman »

https://www.forbes.com/sites/annakaplan ... e3559c34cf

This seems to be a good breakdown of the incident in a timeline perspective. But i've seen wildly conflicting reports on this too. It's hard to know what really happened. But i stand by my view that this isnt a police action/inaction issue.

Edit: and I know that’s not what you guys are saying the major issue is. I think we’re all mostly on the same page here.
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The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gangrenous »

Riaan wrote:Seems like there was confusion with the multiple agencies attending the scene. I wouldn't want to be charging blindly into a school anyway so can see the hesitation on the police forces part.
People need to ask themselves why the media are going after the police in the this instance, seems very suspicious.
I agree with your insinuation - there are very powerful politicians and lobby groups who have a vested interested in the media and public focussing on the police as the issue here and directing their anger at police…
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by T_R »

It has been confirmed in the last hour that police went in and got THEIR OWN kids out of the school.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gangrenous »

Sounds horrible. But are there details on this?

The issue as I understood it was police not attempting to breach the classroom with the shooter in it, which he was contained to relatively quickly? The police obviously didn’t breach that room get their kids out and then lock it on their way out. So is this not the worst possible way of framing the evacuation of the rest of the school?
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by T_R »

I can only see the same reports as everyone else but apparently police set up a cordon. Individual police then breached that cordon to find their own kids. Other police prevented other parents from doing the same, including by tasering them.

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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gergreg »

Wow that's bad. Maybe the reports don't go into the detail but did police go into rooms and clear/evacuate 'only' their own children and then leave any other children there? Or did they clear/evacuate the entire rooms that their own children happened to be in?
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gergreg »

Just reading a few articles and I can't see that - have you got a link TR?

I think it's worth circling back to the point Bot was making, which is a good one and like he said we all agree on it. All this blame being placed on the police isn't how people should be reacting to this situation. Fix your gun laws you idiots. There is no good reason, no reason whatsoever that members of the public need to own weapons - let alone automatic, semi-automatic and/or high powered weapons. But they're not going to do anything about it. Steve Kerr was right. Who cares about the 'thoughts and prayers' and 'moments of silence'. They don't mean anything really. Doesn't change or fix anything.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Coastalraider »

The fundamental difference is access.

In every country the causes for these major issues are common… disillusioned youth, depression, mental health, domestic violence, radical religious beliefs, criminals etc. common. Everyone has these issues to varying degrees.

The difference being that when a kid is I’ll and want to take out a tonne of kids in Australia, they might take a knife to school. Might cause an issue, unlikely to cause fatality. In the US he buys over 1000 rounds of ammo for a semi automatic military weapon, and let’s loose over 100 rounds in the first 3 minutes.

In aus, a fanatic like in the Lindt siege has a pump action, get off a round and is taken out. In the US, a wack job rents a hotel room with multiple so per rifles and starts taking potshots at a concert crowd.

Common causes, radically different outcomes - the difference? Access.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by T_R »


gergreg wrote:Just reading a few articles and I can't see that - have you got a link TR?

.
I'm in bed with COVID, so have too much time on my hands - have been watching reports on US TV. I've only quoted what has been confirmed by police.

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You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.
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The Politics Thread 2022

Post by The Nickman »

Haha TR just wildly making up rubbish and then pulling the COVID card when he gets called on it?

Typical. What a ****

I’ll bet he doesn’t even HAVE a Tv
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by T_R »

The Nickman wrote:Haha TR just wildly making up rubbish and then pulling the COVID card when he gets called on it?

Typical. What a ****

I’ll bet he doesn’t even HAVE a Tv
I honestly wish I could come to Rocky to cough on you. But then I'd be in Rocky.



Gergreg, watch from 1.34min on this. There are other similar interviews.

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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Botman »

I had seen a report yesterday saying police had restrained parents including by use of taser to stop them entering the school to get their kids.
Apparently according to the report I read one mother managed to break out of the handcuffs and get into the build and get her child.

I hadn’t seen the reports of cops breaking their own cordon, though I don’t doubt that for one second. We can ask and think we should expect more from police, but at the end of the day they’re human too, and parents first before they’re cops
I think that sort of thing, whilst being probably a dereliction if their duty, is entirely understandable and predictable. That’s human nature really
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SELECT * FROM Previous_Post
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gergreg »

T_R wrote:
The Nickman wrote:Haha TR just wildly making up rubbish and then pulling the COVID card when he gets called on it?

Typical. What a ****

I’ll bet he doesn’t even HAVE a Tv
I honestly wish I could come to Rocky to cough on you. But then I'd be in Rocky.



Gergreg, watch from 1.34min on this. There are other similar interviews.

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Thanks for sharing. I'm sure with time there will be much much more digging into this. If you're a parent, standing outside watching police come out with their own children and then you being prevented from doing the same. I can't even begin to imagine how infuriating that would be.
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The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gangrenous »

T_R wrote:
The Nickman wrote:Haha TR just wildly making up rubbish and then pulling the COVID card when he gets called on it?

Typical. What a ****

I’ll bet he doesn’t even HAVE a Tv
I honestly wish I could come to Rocky to cough on you. But then I'd be in Rocky.



Gergreg, watch from 1.34min on this. There are other similar interviews.

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Not a lot of detail in that interview on the police going in. That answer could easily be misconstrued and surprised there isn’t more detail available on that side of things if that happened…

For example have seen a few places reporting this guy saving his daughter while clearing classrooms - https://nypost.com/2022/05/27/cbp-offic ... ghter/amp/ if that’s what the officer is referring to, while the other officers were working out what to do with the barricaded gunman, then can’t see that there’s too much of an issue there.

Obviously there’s still a lot to be answered in time yet. I don’t think there’s enough clear info to say one way or another at this stage.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Begbie »

If true, sounds like this bloke is pretty inspiring. Like you say - need to get all the evidence first.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by The Nickman »

T_R wrote:
The Nickman wrote:Haha TR just wildly making up rubbish and then pulling the COVID card when he gets called on it?

Typical. What a ****

I’ll bet he doesn’t even HAVE a Tv
I honestly wish I could come to Rocky to cough on you. But then I'd be in Rocky.
I… I think I’d like that
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Dr Zaius »

UAP in the running for the 6th Victorian senate spot courtesy of LNP preferences. Thanks **** heads.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Mickey_Raider »

The Coalition is going to need to win back 17-19 seats to return to government in 2025. Many of these seats are now held by progressives who flatly rejected the Coalition's lurch to the right on certain issues such as climate change.

The balance were lost in metro seats with high concentrations of Chinese-Australians; a clear repudiation of some of the LNP rhetoric about China in recent times.

They have now installed right faction hard-man Dutton — one of the main exponents of said rhetoric — as the guy to wrest these seats back.

Progressives across the country will be sleeping easy tonight.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Botman »

I dont think the LNP will stick with Dutton all the way to an election when his polling numbers continue to show how deeply unlikable and unpopuar he is.
And if they do, they'll get what they deserve for that.

The coalition winning back back many seats is going to be a very tall order regardless, unless Albo has a ScoMo level disasterous term
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by zim »

After the election is doing a Scomo now considered letting an entire country down or is it still **** my pants?
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by T_R »

A very rare outbreak of good sense at the Nats!

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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by -PJ- »

What’s up with Duttons head ?
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by zim »

Head like an orange.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by zim »

I'd like to think this happened after Joyce had already lost.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gangrenous »

T_R wrote:A very rare outbreak of good sense at the Nats!

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In dethroning Joyce or electing Littleproud?
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Botman »

I have to say i know very little about the new nats guy... is he... not a complete **** red neck?!
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gangrenous »

I am pretty sure I remember thinking he was a goose when listening to him before.

From Wikipedia he represents an electorate that voted against marriage equality and apparently has a lot of resources shares.

So I wouldn’t be getting your hopes up.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad »

I first heard of Shoebridge as part of a working group on Silicosis claims I was involved in a few years back. He was pushing hard to ban artificial stone manufacturing.

Apart from that, don’t know much about him.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by gangrenous »

https://amp.theguardian.com/australia-n ... als-leader

Cliffs notes:
+ arguing for targeting sensible centre
- said in 2019 wasn’t convinced climate change was man made
+ condemned Christensen’s vaccine nonsense
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Begbie »

Hey Ni
Botman wrote: May 30, 2022, 8:29 pm I have to say i know very little about the new nats guy... is he... not a complete **** red neck?!
Just a thought, did you confuse him with David Leyonhjelm?
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by Botman »

Begbie wrote: May 30, 2022, 9:20 pm Hey Ni
Botman wrote: May 30, 2022, 8:29 pm I have to say i know very little about the new nats guy... is he... not a complete **** red neck?!
Just a thought, did you confuse him with David Leyonhjelm?
No. Certianly not. Im well versed in Leyonhjelm's brand of ****.
Googling seems to suggest he's more reasonable than Joyce... which is not a high bar to clear at all.
CREATE PROCEDURE BotMan_Post AS
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Re: The Politics Thread 2022

Post by T_R »

gangrenous wrote:I am pretty sure I remember thinking he was a goose when listening to him before.

From Wikipedia he represents an electorate that voted against marriage equality and apparently has a lot of resources shares.

So I wouldn’t be getting your hopes up.
He's leading the Nationals, not the Greens. I really don't think it's your approval he's seeking.



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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.
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