Raiders player signing speculation 2022

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Begbie
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Begbie »

Gus has given the nod of approval.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by President Clinton »

I’m curious as to why we chased and signed Chevy Stewart, with their being reports of him being viewed as our long term fullback.

I’d hope XS is viewed as our long term FB
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by BadnMean »

President Clinton wrote: May 22, 2022, 9:41 pm I’m curious as to why we chased and signed Chevy Stewart, with their being reports of him being viewed as our long term fullback.

I’d hope XS is viewed as our long term FB
They are about 4-5 years apart in age. I'm glad we didn't sign one bloke and then sit on our laurels just assuming it will all turn out ok.

No way, you sign the next best kid you can after that, in case Savage busts a knee or doesn't kick on or signs for the Roosters.

If we get really lucky and Savage does fulfil all his potential and is outstanding then great, we keep him and we've still got a promising back up who we might end up having to let go in 5 years as he looks for an opportunity. But we'd be silly not to try and have that talented option coming through just in case.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Botman »

President Clinton wrote: May 22, 2022, 9:41 pm I’m curious as to why we chased and signed Chevy Stewart, with their being reports of him being viewed as our long term fullback.

I’d hope XS is viewed as our long term FB
If he is, he is. What harm is it that we have a plan b, or c or d, or e?
Savage has a wide range of outcomes, on a 0 to 10 ratio he could be

0 - Bevan French: All speed, no physicality, too many errors. A true one trick pony. Not an NRL player
5 - Jason Saab: Lot of speed, pretty ordinary defender but does enough to have a good NRL career as a winger without a risk of being a true star
8 - Josh Addo-Carr: Excellent winger, speed to burn, competitive enough, phyical enough but a superstar winger with speed and finishing that lights up the screen. No ball playing to make him a fullback though
10 - Ryan Papenhuyzen: NOT **** likley imo. But if Savage has a play makers game at fullback, this is his very unlikely ceiling.


He could be anything in that range. Literally, he could be Bevan French and years from now we chuckle about the hype he had. He's got that very real boom or bust potential.

The club would be foolish not to aggressive bring in a talent like Stewart because of some hopes and prayers on Savage. And i say that one of the most aggressive "play Savage" fans on this site.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Canberra Milk »

Savage has superstar ceiling. He might not get there. But the fact that he has the potential, is a massive thing in itself

I agree though, have to beef up all parts of the squad at all times. Even if we had a Pap, there'd be nothing wrong with buying Chevy chase
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by simo »

Ricky is doing his absolute best to keep a lid on the savage bottle. He knows his good and the sometime the worst thing that can happen to a young talent is for them to believe their own hype (see kalyn ponga).
Rick clearly wants savage to get in a habit of adding more to his game before he realises he can just coast and just make a career being fast.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by BJ »

simo wrote:Ricky is doing his absolute best to keep a lid on the savage bottle. He knows his good and the sometime the worst thing that can happen to a young talent is for them to believe their own hype (see kalyn ponga).
Rick clearly wants savage to get in a habit of adding more to his game before he realises he can just coast and just make a career being fast.
Good call Simo.

It’s the super talented players who also take their training levels and professionalism to the highest levels who excel.

Anyone involved with Tedesco, Turbo and Pappenhausen will tell you they do all the training extras and don’t get overly distracted by external factors.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by BadnMean »

BJ wrote: May 23, 2022, 9:59 am
simo wrote:Ricky is doing his absolute best to keep a lid on the savage bottle. He knows his good and the sometime the worst thing that can happen to a young talent is for them to believe their own hype (see kalyn ponga).
Rick clearly wants savage to get in a habit of adding more to his game before he realises he can just coast and just make a career being fast.
Good call Simo.

It’s the super talented players who also take their training levels and professionalism to the highest levels who excel.

Anyone involved with Tedesco, Turbo and Pappenhausen will tell you they do all the training extras and don’t get overly distracted by external factors.
Trbo is always up for an extra sprint session down the Manly corso.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by BJ »

BadnMean wrote:
BJ wrote: May 23, 2022, 9:59 am
simo wrote:Ricky is doing his absolute best to keep a lid on the savage bottle. He knows his good and the sometime the worst thing that can happen to a young talent is for them to believe their own hype (see kalyn ponga).
Rick clearly wants savage to get in a habit of adding more to his game before he realises he can just coast and just make a career being fast.
Good call Simo.

It’s the super talented players who also take their training levels and professionalism to the highest levels who excel.

Anyone involved with Tedesco, Turbo and Pappenhausen will tell you they do all the training extras and don’t get overly distracted by external factors.
Trbo is always up for an extra sprint session down the Manly corso.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by simo »

BadnMean wrote: May 23, 2022, 10:09 am
BJ wrote: May 23, 2022, 9:59 am
simo wrote:Ricky is doing his absolute best to keep a lid on the savage bottle. He knows his good and the sometime the worst thing that can happen to a young talent is for them to believe their own hype (see kalyn ponga).
Rick clearly wants savage to get in a habit of adding more to his game before he realises he can just coast and just make a career being fast.
Good call Simo.

It’s the super talented players who also take their training levels and professionalism to the highest levels who excel.

Anyone involved with Tedesco, Turbo and Pappenhausen will tell you they do all the training extras and don’t get overly distracted by external factors.
Trbo is always up for an extra sprint session down the Manly corso.
Havent seen xaviour accepting one challenge from a punter and honestly, its telling.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by badsall1 »

Just seen a report on a bulldogs Facebook page welcoming xavier savage to the club. I hope this is Bull
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by gangrenous »

Sauce?
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Coastalraider »

Bbq.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Botman »

Botman wrote: May 22, 2022, 7:05 pm
Brew wrote: May 22, 2022, 6:46 pm

Phil Gould posted this tweet

Not sure if he was referring to the try he scored


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This was covered yesterday.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by greeneyed »

Every NRL club’s free agency state of play

RAIDERS

Off-contract 2022: Adam Elliott, Matt Frawley, Ryan Sutton, Jack Wighton (PO 2023, 2024), Sam Williams, Elijah Anderson, Ata Mariota

Off-contract 2023: Jarrod Croker (PO 2024), Emre Guler, Albert Hopoate, Peter Hola (MO 2024), Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad, Jordan Rapana, Harry Rushton, Xavier Savage, Brad Schneider, Harley Smith-Shields, Joseph Tapine, Clay Webb

Key re-signings: Corey Horsburgh (2024, PO 2025), Corey Harawira-Naera (2025), Hudson Young (2024)

Departing: Josh Hodgson (Eels, 2023)

Analysis: Star five-eighth Jack Wighton is likely to take up the option in his favour for at least 2023. Adam Elliott joined the club on a one-year lifeline and the Raiders are hoping to retain him on a new deal, but they face a challenge withNews Corp reporting the Knights are interested in his services . Newcastle’s chances in landing Elliott got a handy boost recently when his partner, Millie Boyle inked a marquee NRLW contract. A deal hasn’t been announced, but by all reports Ryan Sutton will join the Bulldogs next season. Beyond this season, Joe Tapine, Xavier Savage and Tom Starling are the most pressing. Coach Ricky Stuart is taking it slow with Savage’s development but there’s no denying he has the potential to be a star of the future and with a little more time he’ll be pushing for the No.1 jersey. That leaves question marks over where Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad stands beyond 2023. Tapine’s manager revealed in February that his star client wants to remain at the club, while Starling confirmed tofoxsports.com.auin March that he had taken up the option in his contract for 2024. The power is in Jarrod Croker’s hands for 2024 but given the veteran’s long battle with injuries we may not get a definite answer from him until later this season.

Read more: https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-pr ... 21075d96ab
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Seiffert82 »

Would be interesting to know what the actual status of Sutton's contract is with the Bulldogs. I suspect he's a little nervous about Gould putting the cleaners through the club.

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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by julian87 »

Mariota is really the only one there that you need to keep imo.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by magoo »

Does anyone know how mariota is playing? Does he look like making it in the NRL? Any news on Esera's progression?
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Rick »

julian87 wrote:Mariota is really the only one there that you need to keep imo.
Out of that group, given Wighton has agreed to stay,Mariota is a must keep. The rest, not worth looking at.


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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Botman »

Not only is he the only "must" keep... i think a strong argument could be made that he's the only one who is a "should" keep.
Schnieder is our primary back up half and has proven to be serviceable in that area, and we need a spot in the squad for a 4th half to develop, hopefully some young gun... so i have no qualms in letting both Frawley and Williams go. Though i expect we'll keep them both! :lol:
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Sid »

Payne Haas requests release from Broncos - SMH, Michael Chammas

All the best with his new roosters contract (probably)

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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Coastalraider »

‘He just wants to get what he is worth’



Next minute… ‘hass signs for 5 years at $500k at the roosters’
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Northern Raider »

Haas recently switched managers. No prizes for guessing the motivation here.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Seiffert82 »

Northern Raider wrote:Haas recently switched managers. No prizes for guessing the motivation here.
Yep, it's a joke.

The NRL should intervene in these situations.

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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Botman »

I think i might the most pro player poster on this site when it comes to this issue, but i was spit balling something earlier because as much as i beleive that players should get as much as they can, as quickly as they can and by any means necessary we are getting a tipping point where the balance of power needs to be slightly adjusted

I dont think making players who move clubs mid contract have to keep their same contractual value is a good thing... because the only solace for a club like the Broncos losing Haas is at least the new club is paying through the nose and decimating their cap for the pleasure. The only thing worse than losing Haas is losing him and the club getting him isnt paying him a cent more than you had him for.

So i wonder if a tax based system might be worth looking at.
In an instance where both clubs and players are all on board, they can just negotaiate whatever deal works for them. No problem
But where a club feels like a player has forced their way out, perhaps the new club should take a 20% cap penalty on top of the salary paid. So in the instance of Haas, a club prying him away for 1m a year, will actually have a cap hit per year on him of 1.2m
And if they're willing to do that, no problem

The things i like about this for me is
1. it doesnt hurt the player financially, and i know not everyone agrees with that, and that the players should be hurt, but that's not where i stand.

b. It softens the market for clubs enticing players to break contracts. And we all know all clubs do it! Even ours. But if a player breaks a contract and you have to tact on 20% as a cap hit, when in high profile cases you're already topping up their salary.... well now that's another kettle of fish... a club might want Haas for 1m, but if the cap hit on him is 1.2m, that might be a bridge too far... so they'll either not get involved at all, or perhaps lower their offer to account for th addtional cap hit, which softens the market.

iii. you can even give that taxed money, the 20% back to the original club as a "transfer fee" on their cap to allow them the ability to replace the player. Which will help with parity in the league

- I dont know if this is actually possible but, legislate that a player manager retains the commission for the duration of a deal signed under their name. So if player managers are simply unable to collect commission on deal until the years of a previous deal expire, it will take the incentive away from managers who are enticing movements for their own interests and put the interest back purely into the players. Haas is signed until 2024 (i think?), so his previous manager is entitled to the full commission of deals until then. After that his new management can take their commission based on their agreement with the player. This more than anything would be the biggest change in terms of what happens and it doesnt hurt the players AT ALL, in fact it increases the likelihood that managers are acting in their clients best interests, not their own
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by bonehead »

I've had a similar thought for some time, if a player stays at their club that club should get a cap discount or the buying club pays a tax - return on investment for club loyalty to player and subsequently penalise clubs that churn and burn.
Also the NRL should employee the managers directly but as we all know that doesn't sell media space

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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Matt »

Botman wrote: May 26, 2022, 9:00 pm I think i might the most pro player poster on this site when it comes to this issue, but i was spit balling something earlier because as much as i beleive that players should get as much as they can, as quickly as they can and by any means necessary we are getting a tipping point where the balance of power needs to be slightly adjusted

I dont think making players who move clubs mid contract have to keep their same contractual value is a good thing... because the only solace for a club like the Broncos losing Haas is at least the new club is paying through the nose and decimating their cap for the pleasure. The only thing worse than losing Haas is losing him and the club getting him isnt paying him a cent more than you had him for.

So i wonder if a tax based system might be worth looking at.
In an instance where both clubs and players are all on board, they can just negotaiate whatever deal works for them. No problem
But where a club feels like a player has forced their way out, perhaps the new club should take a 20% cap penalty on top of the salary paid. So in the instance of Haas, a club prying him away for 1m a year, will actually have a cap hit per year on him of 1.2m
And if they're willing to do that, no problem

The things i like about this for me is
1. it doesnt hurt the player financially, and i know not everyone agrees with that, and that the players should be hurt, but that's not where i stand.

b. It softens the market for clubs enticing players to break contracts. And we all know all clubs do it! Even ours. But if a player breaks a contract and you have to tact on 20% as a cap hit, when in high profile cases you're already topping up their salary.... well now that's another kettle of fish... a club might want Haas for 1m, but if the cap hit on him is 1.2m, that might be a bridge too far... so they'll either not get involved at all, or perhaps lower their offer to account for th addtional cap hit, which softens the market.

iii. you can even give that taxed money, the 20% back to the original club as a "transfer fee" on their cap to allow them the ability to replace the player. Which will help with parity in the league

- I dont know if this is actually possible but, legislate that a player manager retains the commission for the duration of a deal signed under their name. So if player managers are simply unable to collect commission on deal until the years of a previous deal expire, it will take the incentive away from managers who are enticing movements for their own interests and put the interest back purely into the players. Haas is signed until 2024 (i think?), so his previous manager is entitled to the full commission of deals until then. After that his new management can take their commission based on their agreement with the player. This more than anything would be the biggest change in terms of what happens and it doesnt hurt the players AT ALL, in fact it increases the likelihood that managers are acting in their clients best interests, not their own
Far too sensible a suggestion for the NRL mate. Seriously!?!?! What were you thinking?!?! They dont want to be the NFL or Football, geez :lol:
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Seiffert82 »

Yeah, if a club wants to move a contracted player on they are usually obligated to pay part of their salary under the club's cap for the remainder of the original contract.

Similarly, if a player agitates to break a contract to move on to another club I don't see why the gaining club shouldn't be obligated to compensate the losing club with a corresponding cap adjustment. As suggested, 20-25% of the original contract value might be fair.

Might stop some of this nonsense, particularly for very well paid players.

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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by BigPapa »



We should be looking at a few of these young Panthers players some maybe waiting a while to get a start
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Raidernation »

Seiffert82 wrote: May 28, 2022, 10:08 pm Yeah, if a club wants to move a contracted player on they are usually obligated to pay part of their salary under the club's cap for the remainder of the original contract.

Similarly, if a player agitates to break a contract to move on to another club I don't see why the gaining club shouldn't be obligated to compensate the losing club with a corresponding cap adjustment. As suggested, 20-25% of the original contract value might be fair.

Might stop some of this nonsense, particularly for very well paid players.

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This can and does happen. The club can request the gaining club provide payment for the player, they can request the club provide a player in return otherwise they can wait until the end of the players contract. These types of situations should be self regulated to allow clubs the greatest opportunity to be provided with fair compensation not additional regulation. If clubs cant handle their own affairs to their benefit than that's on them. We should be promoting clubs moving for undervalued players, we should be promoting players being paid market values as it helps level the playing field. We have benefited from Tapine and Perhaps Fogarty in this situation, hodgeson and bateman also was agreed with clubs whilst on contract. I dont agree with arbitrary regulation because clubs cant do their jobs.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Seiffert82 »


Raidernation wrote:
Seiffert82 wrote: May 28, 2022, 10:08 pm Yeah, if a club wants to move a contracted player on they are usually obligated to pay part of their salary under the club's cap for the remainder of the original contract.

Similarly, if a player agitates to break a contract to move on to another club I don't see why the gaining club shouldn't be obligated to compensate the losing club with a corresponding cap adjustment. As suggested, 20-25% of the original contract value might be fair.

Might stop some of this nonsense, particularly for very well paid players.

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This can and does happen. The club can request the gaining club provide payment for the player, they can request the club provide a player in return otherwise they can wait until the end of the players contract. These types of situations should be self regulated to allow clubs the greatest opportunity to be provided with fair compensation not additional regulation. If clubs cant handle their own affairs to their benefit than that's on them. We should be promoting clubs moving for undervalued players, we should be promoting players being paid market values as it helps level the playing field. We have benefited from Tapine and Perhaps Fogarty in this situation, hodgeson and bateman also was agreed with clubs whilst on contract. I dont agree with arbitrary regulation because clubs cant do their jobs.
An adjustment to the salary cap is different to a transfer fee, which we paid in the Williams and Bateman situations (which is irrelevant because the came from a different comp and there was no salary cap implications).

This is about compensating NRL clubs for players agitating to break a contract. I'm not sure what happened with Tapine, but the Knights effectively chose to release him from his final year when he signed a 4 year deal with us. There was nothing stopping them from playing him in his final year with them.

Payne Hass on the other hand has had regrets about the contract he just signed and now wants to have another crack at it. Different situation entirely.

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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by bonehead »

frizell player option 2023 at knights

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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

Botman wrote: May 26, 2022, 9:00 pm I think i might the most pro player poster on this site when it comes to this issue, but i was spit balling something earlier because as much as i beleive that players should get as much as they can, as quickly as they can and by any means necessary we are getting a tipping point where the balance of power needs to be slightly adjusted

I dont think making players who move clubs mid contract have to keep their same contractual value is a good thing... because the only solace for a club like the Broncos losing Haas is at least the new club is paying through the nose and decimating their cap for the pleasure. The only thing worse than losing Haas is losing him and the club getting him isnt paying him a cent more than you had him for.

So i wonder if a tax based system might be worth looking at.
In an instance where both clubs and players are all on board, they can just negotaiate whatever deal works for them. No problem
But where a club feels like a player has forced their way out, perhaps the new club should take a 20% cap penalty on top of the salary paid. So in the instance of Haas, a club prying him away for 1m a year, will actually have a cap hit per year on him of 1.2m
And if they're willing to do that, no problem

The things i like about this for me is
1. it doesnt hurt the player financially, and i know not everyone agrees with that, and that the players should be hurt, but that's not where i stand.

b. It softens the market for clubs enticing players to break contracts. And we all know all clubs do it! Even ours. But if a player breaks a contract and you have to tact on 20% as a cap hit, when in high profile cases you're already topping up their salary.... well now that's another kettle of fish... a club might want Haas for 1m, but if the cap hit on him is 1.2m, that might be a bridge too far... so they'll either not get involved at all, or perhaps lower their offer to account for th addtional cap hit, which softens the market.

iii. you can even give that taxed money, the 20% back to the original club as a "transfer fee" on their cap to allow them the ability to replace the player. Which will help with parity in the league

- I dont know if this is actually possible but, legislate that a player manager retains the commission for the duration of a deal signed under their name. So if player managers are simply unable to collect commission on deal until the years of a previous deal expire, it will take the incentive away from managers who are enticing movements for their own interests and put the interest back purely into the players. Haas is signed until 2024 (i think?), so his previous manager is entitled to the full commission of deals until then. After that his new management can take their commission based on their agreement with the player. This more than anything would be the biggest change in terms of what happens and it doesnt hurt the players AT ALL, in fact it increases the likelihood that managers are acting in their clients best interests, not their own
I reckon you might get into restraint of trade options. Take the situation where Player A is getting no playing time but there's a spot for him at another club. The other club is willing to sign him for $Y, but not 120% of $Y. He's now stuck in reserves for the remainder of his contract.

Now you could make it optional for the scorned club to enforce at their discretion. But how likely is a club to enforce that at the risk that they seek a player from that club in future and are turned away due to previous dealings.

Defintely heading down the right path thinking about ways we can make contracts hold substantially more weight than the currently do though.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Botman »

Re: restraint of trade, it might, I'm not an expert or even a novice in the field or frankly know the first bit about restraint of trade laws :lol:

but my idea isn't fundamentally different to what is in place now.

In your situation Player A who doesn't get playing time is under contract. Just like now. And if the other club wants to sign him, they can ONLY do so if the currently club agrees to a release. That's what seems to be missed in this by fans. Players aren't walking out and the NRL/clubs simply aren't enforcing the contracts. The clubs are signing off on the releases.

And they well within their rights to say no and force the player to see out their contract (as the dragons did to Tallis in 1996)... but what the players have figured out is they can simply make it too much hassle and trouble for the clubs, and what the clubs have figured out is when a player is willing to do that, it IS to much trouble and hassle and it's best for the club to simply move on.

The idea proposed simply taxes the clubs who's acquiring the player who breaks his contract, if anything i feel it provides a more formal avenue for players to more easily move in such situations, it doesn't change or restrict movement beyond what is already in placed, boiled down its a simple change in economics of the salary cap works. And I know the salary cap can/has been challenged before under this, but its in place and agreed in the CBA between league and players to be a reasonable constraint

All that being said, the middle para there is probably where this all falls down, you could very easily see a situation where no club enforces the tax and they handle matters between themselves so they can maintain healthy, resentment free working relationships for future deals
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Roger Kenworthy
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2022

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

Botman wrote: May 31, 2022, 2:49 pm Re: restraint of trade, it might, I'm not an expert or even a novice in the field or frankly know the first bit about restraint of trade laws :lol:

but my idea isn't fundamentally different to what is in place now.

In your situation Player A who doesn't get playing time is under contract. Just like now. And if the other club wants to sign him, they can ONLY do so if the currently club agrees to a release. That's what seems to be missed in this by fans. Players aren't walking out and the NRL/clubs simply aren't enforcing the contracts. The clubs are signing off on the releases.

And they well within their rights to say no and force the player to see out their contract (as the dragons did to Tallis in 1996)... but what the players have figured out is they can simply make it too much hassle and trouble for the clubs, and what the clubs have figured out is when a player is willing to do that, it IS to much trouble and hassle and it's best for the club to simply move on.

The idea proposed simply taxes the clubs who's acquiring the player who breaks his contract, if anything i feel it provides a more formal avenue for players to more easily move in such situations, it doesn't change or restrict movement beyond what is already in placed, boiled down its a simple change in economics of the salary cap works. And I know the salary cap can/has been challenged before under this, but its in place and agreed in the CBA between league and players to be a reasonable constraint

All that being said, the middle para there is probably where this all falls down, you could very easily see a situation where no club enforces the tax and they handle matters between themselves so they can maintain healthy, resentment free working relationships for future deals
Yeah restraint of trade probably wouldn't apply given they already have a contract in place. It's more restraint of play - which isn't a thing :lol:
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