Botman wrote: ↑November 2, 2021, 9:05 pm
T_R wrote: ↑November 2, 2021, 8:48 pm
Botman wrote: ↑November 2, 2021, 7:45 pm
**** that cheese eating surrender monkey
I mean i dont really understand what the **** australian needs subs for, like the greatest risk to this country is some country landing on our shore in darwin and what? marching on the capital from there? Good luck to them on that journey
If australia comes into any kind of serious conflict i doubt the best subs in the world will save us when it's drones, nukes and cyber warefare that's going on... so im pretty out on paying even a dollar for submarines but also, the french are really being ramping up the sooking on this to 11.
There is no threat that anyone is going to invade Australia.
The issue is that the Chinese have claimed the entirety of the South China Sea, and fortified it with artificial islands from which they can deny Australia (and all of SE Asia) access to almost all of our trade routes. The only possible way for Australia to combat this is to have fortified islands of our own - and the only way we can do that is nuclear submarines.
OK, i can understgand the theoretically... but combat that?
And i ask this earnestly, is there any realistic chance we're deploying these nuclear submarines in an act of agression/defence on our own unless it was open warfare... its hard to imagine we'd wage war against China unless it we were heavily supported by allied reinforcments... or is this more a more of a insurance policy style/message sending thing to at least theoretically capable of making an aggressive move even if its really not really practically something we'd consider?
A and B, I guess. These things are serious tech, Botman...it's astounding the the US was prepared to share. The French diesel subs we had on order were next to useless; they would have been oil slicks quite literally in the first few hours of any serious conflict. These nuclear jobs are invisible. They are quite simply impossible to find.
And if you're China, and you're in the mood for a flex in whatever world we're in in 2040 when these things are online...well, the fact that one could be parked off Shanghai will a full load of cruise missiles might just make you think for a minute or two before hitting a button.
Read Turnbull's bio. He talks about a time the US asked us to join them in a 'freedom of navigation' exercise through the SCC. He declined, and his argument was that while China wouldn't risk war with the US by sinking one of their naval vessels, both US intelligence and our own folk agreed that they may just decide to knock off an Australia boat or two to make a point. These submarines change that kind of conversation, and they change it quite dramatically.
So, I don't think we'll be declaring war on China anytime soon, but the balance of power in the region just took a serious shift.
EDIT: By the way, no one seriously believes that we're building these to carry conventional weapons. In 20 years time, when these are sailing about the place, they'll be nuclear armed. Take it to the bank.