Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Roger Kenworthy » December 21, 2019, 12:24 pm

BJ wrote:
December 21, 2019, 9:33 am
I think it’s a bit high for what he brings to the team, but hopefully he continues to improve as a player.
So would you have let him test the market at that price? To me overpaying 100-150k is worth the risk of not losing him under a near $10 million cap.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by BJ » December 21, 2019, 1:41 pm

Roger Kenworthy wrote:
BJ wrote:
December 21, 2019, 9:33 am
I think it’s a bit high for what he brings to the team, but hopefully he continues to improve as a player.
So would you have let him test the market at that price? To me overpaying 100-150k is worth the risk of not losing him under a near $10 million cap.
He’s already testing the market. Why do you think he isn’t?

Getting in ‘before he tests the market’ is what you do earlier in the contract period.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Seiffert82 » December 21, 2019, 2:37 pm

Botman wrote:
December 20, 2019, 10:21 am
T_R wrote:
December 20, 2019, 9:48 am
Jack had better be very careful with both his onfield form and off field behaviour. Clubs get very incentivised to not be very patient when there's that kind of money locked up in a player.
Yep, that's gonna come with the territory of a big contract.
He'd better make sure he's living up to that contract before he goes throwing handbags around Civic because if he's not, he does not want to be giving the club a free out on that deal.

I've actually been impressed with Jack off the field this year post that incident. He really seemed to be focused on his footy, he looked as fit as he's ever been and i didnt hear even a whisper this season about him acting like an idiot in town, which was at least a 2-3 times per season deal prior to this. (which may just mean that friends of mine who are younger and enjoying their saturday's around town arent as with "it" as they used to be, they've probably changed what "it" is and now "it" probably seems weird and scary to them)

That incident and how close he did come from being sacked and now when he kept himself fit and clean off the paddock... he's had his best year of footy ever. So you hope he's putting 1 and 1 together and getting 2 here and that 2019 really showed him that with some maturity and dedication to his footy, big things are possible for him.

Im a natural cynic when it comes to footballers and their ability to behave, so im not holding my breath, but Jack Wighton just followed the road map to success. He just needs to stay the course.
I think I read somewhere that Wighton had his contract adjusted to explicitly prevent him from going out in the city over the weekends - and that he was looking to continue that provision with his next contract. The results on the field are a testament to his change in attitude and increased professionalism off the field. It's an excellent example of how a change in a player's attitude can see them reach their potential. Stuart knew full well what Wighton was capable of and that's clearly why the club stuck by him last year.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Seiffert82 » December 21, 2019, 2:45 pm

IMO Wighton has long been our second most important player behind Hodgson. I thought he was outstanding in our 2016 finish and finals run, and his suspension in 2018 put the nail in our finals aspirations (I actually thought he was our best player that year before he got punted).

I thought $850k would be fair, based on his ability and potential to further improve. $900k is not that surprising, but it's a shame he isn't taking a bit of a personal hit to keep the squad together.

Anyway, it's obviously what he is worth on the open market (maybe a little less), so fair play by him and his manager. I never had a single doubt he would stay. This team needs him. Get it done.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by sprintman » December 21, 2019, 3:24 pm

I’m worried that this will send a message to Bateman that he can get whatever he wants. Slippery slope comes to mind

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Botman » December 21, 2019, 8:58 pm

sprintman wrote:
December 21, 2019, 3:24 pm
I’m worried that this will send a message to Bateman that he can get whatever he wants. Slippery slope comes to mind
John Bateman can get whatever he likes
And it's only a slippery slope for those players who happen to be as good as John Bateman... so maybe 8-12 players in the known world
Probably OK with that.
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by simo » December 22, 2019, 6:14 am

if a player of comparable quality to wighton was on the market in aus it would cost us minimum 1.2 a season. Theres only one player on his level and thats munster and im still taking jack over him for his overall game
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Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by LastRaider » December 22, 2019, 9:33 am

I can live with $900k a year. I think we are a risk of losing Bateman now.

Estimations
Papa - $800k + rep
Wighton - $900k + rep
Hodgson - $800k
BJ - $700k
Total: $3.2m + rep payments there (4 players, 30% of the cap)

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Botman » December 22, 2019, 9:44 am

I don’t see anyway in which the club lets John Bateman go
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by The Nickman » December 22, 2019, 9:47 am

John Bateman is worth all the money, give him all the money.

Hell, give him anything he wants, from a bag of cash to a dozen hookers!
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Roger Kenworthy » December 22, 2019, 9:48 am

BJ wrote:
December 21, 2019, 1:41 pm
Roger Kenworthy wrote:
BJ wrote:
December 21, 2019, 9:33 am
I think it’s a bit high for what he brings to the team, but hopefully he continues to improve as a player.
So would you have let him test the market at that price? To me overpaying 100-150k is worth the risk of not losing him under a near $10 million cap.
He’s already testing the market. Why do you think he isn’t?

Getting in ‘before he tests the market’ is what you do earlier in the contract period.
The jist of my question was would you play hardball and say $800k is the final offer take it or leave it?

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by -TW- » December 22, 2019, 10:10 am

LastRaider wrote:I can live with $900k a year. I think we are a risk of losing Bateman now.

Estimations
Papa - $800k + rep
Wighton - $900k + rep
Hodgson - $800k
BJ - $700k
Total: $3.2m + rep payments there (4 players, 30% of the cap)
The cap will be 10m by the time he's actually due

Also rep payments don't count to the cap, only if they have bonuses in their contracts for making rep sides

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Seiffert82 » December 22, 2019, 10:13 am

I'll be shocked if the club doesn't retain Bateman. I'm not as high on him as others might be, but I think the club will be able to squeeze in a salary upgrade for him and still retain our core. I think we still have quite a few players like CNK, Whitehead, Red Rage and Cotric who are arguably on unders, which allows us the luxury of paying a second rower premium money.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by The Nickman » December 22, 2019, 10:14 am

CNK is probably still on unders, but he probably won’t be for too much longer.
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by BadnMean » December 22, 2019, 11:04 am

The Nickman wrote:
December 22, 2019, 10:14 am
CNK is probably still on unders, but he probably won’t be for too much longer.
He just got an upgrade. He'll be on 500k (reported) for 2021-22-23.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by The Nickman » December 22, 2019, 11:07 am

BadnMean wrote:
The Nickman wrote:
December 22, 2019, 10:14 am
CNK is probably still on unders, but he probably won’t be for too much longer.
He just got an upgrade. He'll be on 500k (reported) for 2021-22-23.
Which will need to be upgraded fairly quickly if he continues on his current trajectory next season.
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by BadnMean » December 22, 2019, 12:49 pm

The Nickman wrote:
December 22, 2019, 11:07 am
BadnMean wrote:
The Nickman wrote:
December 22, 2019, 10:14 am
CNK is probably still on unders, but he probably won’t be for too much longer.
He just got an upgrade. He'll be on 500k (reported) for 2021-22-23.
Which will need to be upgraded fairly quickly if he continues on his current trajectory next season.
Maybe. He's just out of the top tier of FB's currently. Teddy, RTS, Ponga, Trbo.

He doesn't quite have the physical abilities of those guys.

He has many other good qualities and is a huge reason for our success. But he's played one good year. And to compete with those top guys or maintain his spot against all the other good FB's he'll need to keep developing as a ball player.

So I don't think we need to go too crazy with payments for the 5th best FB (ok, you could argue Ponga, because I'd take CNK's heart over Ponga's any day, but most NRL fans wouldn't) straight away. A couple more good years at his current level will earn a moderate raise, experience. Becomes a great ball player, he'll be up in the 750k range by then.

It's possible too that he'll fine tune his moments on when to step and where to be in the red zone and maximise his own footwork threat to go to near that top level. I'd love that. But much as he might be one of my favourites for other reasons, I'm not sure he'll crack that top 4 FB's list and be on huge dollars.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by LastRaider » December 22, 2019, 1:12 pm

-TW- wrote:
LastRaider wrote:I can live with $900k a year. I think we are a risk of losing Bateman now.

Estimations
Papa - $800k + rep
Wighton - $900k + rep
Hodgson - $800k
BJ - $700k
Total: $3.2m + rep payments there (4 players, 30% of the cap)
The cap will be 10m by the time he's actually due

Also rep payments don't count to the cap, only if they have bonuses in their contracts for making rep sides

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I think Bateman wants an upgrade for next year

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Dr Zaius » December 22, 2019, 1:52 pm

It's a pretty crappy situation that has crept into the game in recent years. Play a good one or two seasons and put your hand out for an upgrade. It doesn't really reward the club for taking a punt on Jack turning his life around, Bateman not being a flop and CNK not being a complete nuffie. None of them would agree to a pay cut if they were duds. I mean I get it, and you want to reward your best players and keep them happy. But it seems to be a fairly recent thing (last 5 or so years) and doesn't reward the club for creative recruitment.
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Botman » December 22, 2019, 2:42 pm

It’s across all sports now Doc
They’re calling it the player empowerment era in American sports

Basically players have realised they hold the power, not the clubs, and their exercising it
If they aren’t placated at their current club, they know they can force their way out to a club that will
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Wiki Special » December 22, 2019, 2:59 pm

Dr Zaius wrote:
December 22, 2019, 1:52 pm
It's a pretty crappy situation that has crept into the game in recent years. Play a good one or two seasons and put your hand out for an upgrade. It doesn't really reward the club for taking a punt on Jack turning his life around, Bateman not being a flop and CNK not being a complete nuffie. None of them would agree to a pay cut if they were duds. I mean I get it, and you want to reward your best players and keep them happy. But it seems to be a fairly recent thing (last 5 or so years) and doesn't reward the club for creative recruitment.
I agree, to be honest. The Matterson/Tigers situation was horrible for that club. They saw his potential, took a punt, he exceeded expectations and sooked his way out.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Roger Kenworthy » December 22, 2019, 4:45 pm

Dr Zaius wrote:
December 22, 2019, 1:52 pm
It's a pretty crappy situation that has crept into the game in recent years. Play a good one or two seasons and put your hand out for an upgrade. It doesn't really reward the club for taking a punt on Jack turning his life around, Bateman not being a flop and CNK not being a complete nuffie. None of them would agree to a pay cut if they were duds. I mean I get it, and you want to reward your best players and keep them happy. But it seems to be a fairly recent thing (last 5 or so years) and doesn't reward the club for creative recruitment.
I think the CNK deal is in our favour. He was also on an NRL show over here in NZ and when ribbed that he'd be on the big bucks now he responded along the lines that he's sacrificed a bit of money to sign with the team who took a chance on him.

As long as his form continues of course.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Bennyinthewest » December 23, 2019, 2:44 pm

I agree with what's been said, it's his value to the team and what we need. At times I think I could ball play better in a 4 on 3 n hitting the right guy.....but he can improve on that, and as a team we have strike 2nd rowers (gun ball players) and centres that we have the luxury of being able to give good early ball.

But no half can belt every player in the comp like Jack can. He turns a team weakness into a strength and that was an area where we were struggling hard

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by greeneyed » January 15, 2020, 9:29 pm

Canberra Raiders CEO Don Furner hoping to re-sign Jack Wighton, Jarrod Croker and Nick Cotric before start of the season

Raiders CEO Don Furner is hoping to lock down Jack Wighton, Jarrod Croker and Nick Cotric, re-signing them before the start of the 2020 season.

"I've had initial meetings with those three and I'd like to ramp up the talks when we get back home next week. All three are happy here and I'm sure they'd love to stick together and win a grand final.

Read more: https://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/sport/ ... 53rqf.html
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Seiffert82 » January 16, 2020, 4:46 am


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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by -PJ- » January 16, 2020, 5:50 am

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Matt » January 16, 2020, 6:29 am

Not sure what the big deal is here?!?

Jack hasn't broken a contract. He didn't take the option in his favor. (Yes, that also benefits his new manager)

Jack hasn't asked for more than what he is worth for a player in his position and with rep honours.

Good on him for doing what all sportsmen do. Earn what u can, in the time you have.

As for Bateo... hand him the cheque book, tell him to write a figure, then sign it, and give it to him.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Boomercm » January 16, 2020, 11:37 am

Dr Zaius wrote:
December 22, 2019, 1:52 pm
It's a pretty crappy situation that has crept into the game in recent years. Play a good one or two seasons and put your hand out for an upgrade. It doesn't really reward the club for taking a punt on Jack turning his life around, Bateman not being a flop and CNK not being a complete nuffie. None of them would agree to a pay cut if they were duds. I mean I get it, and you want to reward your best players and keep them happy. But it seems to be a fairly recent thing (last 5 or so years) and doesn't reward the club for creative recruitment.
It is a crappy situation because it is all one way. Players take the long term deals which gives them security, and then break the contract if it suits them. I read somewhere what I thought a very good solution. That being players can leave for another club if they are unhappy... but they are unable to receive more money than their current contract value. This would mean players and managers have to really consider the pros and cons of long/short term deals. Balances risk on both sides.

At the moment their is no point in clubs signing anyone for longer than 2 years. Can only ever work against them.

**note** this is not the case with Jack who rejected an extension that was in his favor. He was completely within his rights to do that.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Azza » January 16, 2020, 11:38 am

Boomercm wrote:
January 16, 2020, 11:37 am
Dr Zaius wrote:
December 22, 2019, 1:52 pm
It's a pretty crappy situation that has crept into the game in recent years. Play a good one or two seasons and put your hand out for an upgrade. It doesn't really reward the club for taking a punt on Jack turning his life around, Bateman not being a flop and CNK not being a complete nuffie. None of them would agree to a pay cut if they were duds. I mean I get it, and you want to reward your best players and keep them happy. But it seems to be a fairly recent thing (last 5 or so years) and doesn't reward the club for creative recruitment.
It is a crappy situation because it is all one way. Players take the long term deals which gives them security, and then break the contract if it suits them. I read somewhere what I thought a very good solution. That being players can leave for another club if they are unhappy... but they are unable to receive more money than their current contract value. This would mean players and managers have to really consider the pros and cons of long/short term deals. Balances risk on both sides.
That would probably be a restraint of trade, and illegal.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by zim » January 16, 2020, 1:35 pm

Matt wrote:
January 16, 2020, 6:29 am
Not sure what the big deal is here?!?

Jack hasn't broken a contract. He didn't take the option in his favor. (Yes, that also benefits his new manager)

Jack hasn't asked for more than what he is worth for a player in his position and with rep honours.

Good on him for doing what all sportsmen do. Earn what u can, in the time you have.

As for Bateo... hand him the cheque book, tell him to write a figure, then sign it, and give it to him.
That would make for a pretty boring story though.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Matt » January 16, 2020, 1:46 pm

zim wrote:
January 16, 2020, 1:35 pm
Matt wrote:
January 16, 2020, 6:29 am
Not sure what the big deal is here?!?

Jack hasn't broken a contract. He didn't take the option in his favor. (Yes, that also benefits his new manager)

Jack hasn't asked for more than what he is worth for a player in his position and with rep honours.

Good on him for doing what all sportsmen do. Earn what u can, in the time you have.

As for Bateo... hand him the cheque book, tell him to write a figure, then sign it, and give it to him.
That would make for a pretty boring story though.
:lol:

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by Coastalraider » January 16, 2020, 6:43 pm

Azza wrote:
January 16, 2020, 11:38 am
Boomercm wrote:
January 16, 2020, 11:37 am
Dr Zaius wrote:
December 22, 2019, 1:52 pm
It's a pretty crappy situation that has crept into the game in recent years. Play a good one or two seasons and put your hand out for an upgrade. It doesn't really reward the club for taking a punt on Jack turning his life around, Bateman not being a flop and CNK not being a complete nuffie. None of them would agree to a pay cut if they were duds. I mean I get it, and you want to reward your best players and keep them happy. But it seems to be a fairly recent thing (last 5 or so years) and doesn't reward the club for creative recruitment.
It is a crappy situation because it is all one way. Players take the long term deals which gives them security, and then break the contract if it suits them. I read somewhere what I thought a very good solution. That being players can leave for another club if they are unhappy... but they are unable to receive more money than their current contract value. This would mean players and managers have to really consider the pros and cons of long/short term deals. Balances risk on both sides.
That would probably be a restraint of trade, and illegal.
As it stands, yes.

But what if every player was technically employed by the NRL, and wages were paid by teams via them? That way a player could trade/swap teams, still be covered under the same employment contract.

Let’s say a team and a player decide on a 3 year, 1.2mill contract. This agreement then gets registered via the NRL employment division. The player wants more money - only the current team can upgrade. If the relationship is genuinely untenable for any reason, a player and new team can come to an agreement, but for the balance of the existing contract period, only the existing wage agreement will be honoured.

The salary cap is provided by the NRL anyway - why not have them pay it directly?

I think we would see a LOT more loyalty.

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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by yeh raiders » January 16, 2020, 8:54 pm

The Nickman wrote:
December 22, 2019, 11:07 am
BadnMean wrote:
The Nickman wrote:
December 22, 2019, 10:14 am
CNK is probably still on unders, but he probably won’t be for too much longer.
He just got an upgrade. He'll be on 500k (reported) for 2021-22-23.
Which will need to be upgraded fairly quickly if he continues on his current trajectory next season.
I don't see that happening, I'm not concerned that we'll be upgrading CNK any further anytime soon.
Dr Zaius wrote:
December 22, 2019, 1:52 pm
It's a pretty crappy situation that has crept into the game in recent years. Play a good one or two seasons and put your hand out for an upgrade. It doesn't really reward the club for taking a punt on Jack turning his life around, Bateman not being a flop and CNK not being a complete nuffie. None of them would agree to a pay cut if they were duds. I mean I get it, and you want to reward your best players and keep them happy. But it seems to be a fairly recent thing (last 5 or so years) and doesn't reward the club for creative recruitment.
Which is why I think it's extremely important for us to take full advantage of our "Premiership window" because I don't see it lasting. We've rolled the dice on upgrading our halfback, to hopefully put the cherry on top.

With the Roosters losing Cronk and the Storm a year older (C.Smith), our time is now.

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GreenMachine
Simon Woolford
Posts: 498
Joined: April 13, 2005, 2:22 pm
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by GreenMachine » January 17, 2020, 10:15 am

Dr Zaius wrote:
December 22, 2019, 1:52 pm
It's a pretty crappy situation that has crept into the game in recent years. Play a good one or two seasons and put your hand out for an upgrade. It doesn't really reward the club for taking a punt on Jack turning his life around, Bateman not being a flop and CNK not being a complete nuffie. None of them would agree to a pay cut if they were duds. I mean I get it, and you want to reward your best players and keep them happy. But it seems to be a fairly recent thing (last 5 or so years) and doesn't reward the club for creative recruitment.
Spot on and well said!

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papabear
Gary Belcher
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Re: Canberra Raiders offering Jack Wighton close to $3 million

Post by papabear » January 17, 2020, 10:53 am

The Nickman wrote:
December 22, 2019, 11:07 am
BadnMean wrote:
The Nickman wrote:
December 22, 2019, 10:14 am
CNK is probably still on unders, but he probably won’t be for too much longer.
He just got an upgrade. He'll be on 500k (reported) for 2021-22-23.
Which will need to be upgraded fairly quickly if he continues on his current trajectory next season.
lol, he and the club just renegotiated for 21,22 and 23 and you think that should be upgraded "quickly".

I am glad you are not running the raiders.

Though if I were a player agent I would want you running the club I was negotiating with.

Its like oprah winfrey
- You get a million dollars
and you get a million dollars
and you get a million dollars
EVERYONE GETS A MILLION DOLLARS

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