2, 4, and 14

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2, 4, and 14

Post by Billy Walker » September 8, 2019, 8:36 am

Havilli
Simmonsen
BJ
Cotric

Four players into three positions doesn’t go - who misses out?

I wanted Cotric at 4 and Simmonsen at 2 for the rest of the season but Cotric has been very average.

I suspect it will be:

2 - Cotric
4 - BJ
14 - Simmonsen
Havilli misses out.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by edwahu » September 8, 2019, 8:47 am

Yeah, hard to argue with that, although I would consider Havilli over Simo depending on whether Tapine is fit.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Coastalraider » September 8, 2019, 8:48 am

I really hate to say this, and hopefully I get it ‘shoved in my face’ for the finals, but for me the based purely on who is best for the positions available it would be:
2. Simmonsen - just doesn’t put a foot wrong, breaks tackles, doesn’t make errors
4. BJ - game breaker, and I hope his 2 week break has given him the perspective of when to be aggressive and the realities of what happens when you overdo it. We need him and Rapa for a deep finals push.
14. Havilli - he was good again last night, he is almost getting into the Cam Murray/Victor Radley style of player - smaller than most forwards but provides a point of difference. And we can underestimate the advantage of giving Hodgo a little time at first receiver late in the match.

That leaves Cotric out. An unpopular opinion and a hard one for me to come to, but BJ is currently a better centre. Simmonsen has been more influential on the wing. Havilli is a better impact player. Cotric just hasn’t owned a positiin this year, I thought he got picked for origin based off last years form, and hasn’t looked the same since.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Dusty » September 8, 2019, 8:53 am

Coastalraider wrote:I really hate to say this, and hopefully I get it ‘shoved in my face’ for the finals, but for me the based purely on who is best for the positions available it would be:
2. Simmonsen - just doesn’t put a foot wrong, breaks tackles, doesn’t make errors
4. BJ - game breaker, and I hope his 2 week break has given him the perspective of when to be aggressive and the realities of what happens when you overdo it. We need him and Rapa for a deep finals push.
14. Havilli - he was good again last night, he is almost getting into the Cam Murray/Victor Radley style of player - smaller than most forwards but provides a point of difference. And we can underestimate the advantage of giving Hodgo a little time at first receiver late in the match.

That leaves Cotric out. An unpopular opinion and a hard one for me to come to, but BJ is currently a better centre. Simmonsen has been more influential on the wing. Havilli is a better impact player. Cotric just hasn’t owned a positiin this year, I thought he got picked for origin based off last years form, and hasn’t looked the same since.

I think I agree with this, even though I don’t think it’ll happen.




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2019: 1. Wighton 2. Cotric 3. Croker (c) 4 Leilua 5. Oldfield (Rapana) 6. Williams 7. Sezer 8. Sutton 9. Hodgson (c) 10. Papalii 11. Tapine 12. Whitehead 13. J.Bateman ----
14. Havili 15. Soliola 16. Guler 17. Lui

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Ruben Daley » September 8, 2019, 8:57 am

Dusty wrote:
September 8, 2019, 8:53 am
Coastalraider wrote:I really hate to say this, and hopefully I get it ‘shoved in my face’ for the finals, but for me the based purely on who is best for the positions available it would be:
2. Simmonsen - just doesn’t put a foot wrong, breaks tackles, doesn’t make errors
4. BJ - game breaker, and I hope his 2 week break has given him the perspective of when to be aggressive and the realities of what happens when you overdo it. We need him and Rapa for a deep finals push.
14. Havilli - he was good again last night, he is almost getting into the Cam Murray/Victor Radley style of player - smaller than most forwards but provides a point of difference. And we can underestimate the advantage of giving Hodgo a little time at first receiver late in the match.

That leaves Cotric out. An unpopular opinion and a hard one for me to come to, but BJ is currently a better centre. Simmonsen has been more influential on the wing. Havilli is a better impact player. Cotric just hasn’t owned a positiin this year, I thought he got picked for origin based off last years form, and hasn’t looked the same since.

I think I agree with this, even though I don’t think it’ll happen.




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I get your thinking but, like you say, it’ll never happen.

I don’t agree that Simonsson doesn’t put a foot wrong. I rate him but he’s regularly been caught out of position defensively and his misread yesterday cost us the Green try.

Just he errors a young player makes but his defensive combo with Croker isn’t as good as Cotric’s.

I rate Havili but he seems less in favour lately so I figure he’ll miss out. Shame as he brings a lot. I’d like to see him get more minutes and earlier.

Looking forward to BJ returning.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Billy Walker » September 8, 2019, 9:00 am

Dusty wrote:
September 8, 2019, 8:53 am
Coastalraider wrote:I really hate to say this, and hopefully I get it ‘shoved in my face’ for the finals, but for me the based purely on who is best for the positions available it would be:
2. Simmonsen - just doesn’t put a foot wrong, breaks tackles, doesn’t make errors
4. BJ - game breaker, and I hope his 2 week break has given him the perspective of when to be aggressive and the realities of what happens when you overdo it. We need him and Rapa for a deep finals push.
14. Havilli - he was good again last night, he is almost getting into the Cam Murray/Victor Radley style of player - smaller than most forwards but provides a point of difference. And we can underestimate the advantage of giving Hodgo a little time at first receiver late in the match.

That leaves Cotric out. An unpopular opinion and a hard one for me to come to, but BJ is currently a better centre. Simmonsen has been more influential on the wing. Havilli is a better impact player. Cotric just hasn’t owned a positiin this year, I thought he got picked for origin based off last years form, and hasn’t looked the same since.

I think I agree with this, even though I don’t think it’ll happen.




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On form that’s the way I would pick it - Cotric has been poor and Simmonsen has been good.

I suspect Cotric will be at 2 and Simmonsen at 14 partially because Raps has also been a little up and down on form and Simmonsen at 14 covers a HIA replacement from 1 - 5.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by raiderskater » September 8, 2019, 9:02 am

Hesitantly, I think it's a risk to bring BJ back in for finals. He'll be lacking match puff and it disorganises our backline AGAIN.
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by GreenMachine » September 8, 2019, 9:04 am

I’d keep:

2. Cotric
4. BJ

14. Simonsson
15. Havili
16. Guler
17. Horsburgh

Havili can play as a running forward, he’s having more impact than Lui and Sutton.

This is assuming Young is out.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Billy Walker » September 8, 2019, 9:05 am

BJ is a massive worry for me both his fitness and his discipline. I was quite happy for him to miss the rest of the season but Cotric hasn’t offered enough at 4. I hope BJ kills it and I feel silly for questioning him, but I worry there is a strong link between low match fitness, high frustration and poor discipline and that’s a terrible recipe for BJ.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Billy Walker » September 8, 2019, 9:07 am

GreenMachine wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:04 am
I’d keep:

2. Cotric
4. BJ

14. Simonsson
15. Havili
16. Guler
17. Horsburgh

Havili can play as a running forward, he’s having more impact than Lui and Sutton.

This is assuming Young is out.
I’d be shocked if Simmonsen, Havilli and Guler were all named on the bench

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by GreenMachine » September 8, 2019, 9:14 am

Billy Walker wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:07 am
GreenMachine wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:04 am
I’d keep:

2. Cotric
4. BJ

14. Simonsson
15. Havili
16. Guler
17. Horsburgh

Havili can play as a running forward, he’s having more impact than Lui and Sutton.

This is assuming Young is out.
I’d be shocked if Simmonsen, Havilli and Guler were all named on the bench
Me too. But I think we’re here now.

-Young looks to have rubbed himself out.
- Lui has too many errors lately and seems to get dominated.
-Sutton v Guler, I like Guler’s form more.
-Havili always has an impact.
-Simonsson our second best yesterday (behind Papalii).

If form is worth anything and considering Ricky barely uses all 4 interchange players equally, I like the versatility the 4 players I named offer.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Wiki Special » September 8, 2019, 9:18 am

I think all four of the players the OP mentioned will make the cut. Lui misses out for me, his game yesterday was quite poor and he has proven to be a penalty in waiting for much of the year. Whether that is rightly or wrongly, I am unsure. We can't afford the cheap penalties he has been giving the opposition come Finals.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by edwahu » September 8, 2019, 9:19 am

I was a bit disappointed in Simonsson yesterday to be honest. I expected we would see him chime into the backline a lot more, he was very quiet in attack other then the break.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Wiki Special » September 8, 2019, 9:21 am

GreenMachine wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:14 am
Billy Walker wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:07 am
GreenMachine wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:04 am
I’d keep:

2. Cotric
4. BJ

14. Simonsson
15. Havili
16. Guler
17. Horsburgh

Havili can play as a running forward, he’s having more impact than Lui and Sutton.

This is assuming Young is out.
I’d be shocked if Simmonsen, Havilli and Guler were all named on the bench
Me too. But I think we’re here now.

-Young looks to have rubbed himself out.
- Lui has too many errors lately and seems to get dominated.
-Sutton v Guler, I like Guler’s form more.
-Havili always has an impact.
-Simonsson our second best yesterday (behind Papalii).

If form is worth anything and considering Ricky barely uses all 4 interchange players equally, I like the versatility the 4 players I named offer.
Guler has improved since the start of the year but I think he is still an offseason away from regular FG. If Sutton plays next week (especially if starting) I think we will see his true value to the team be shown. I will eat crow if wrong and feel free to remind me but I believe he will be huge during the Finals.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Billy Walker » September 8, 2019, 9:22 am

Lui has had a great season - I wouldn’t drop him on the back of one poor game. Havilli has been getting 10 minutes and it’s not clear he can step up to fill a greater rotation role. Lui, and Sutton are In the side for sure. Guler maybe and Simmonsen over Havilli (unless Ricky starts Simmonsen and leaves out Cotric)

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Northern Raider » September 8, 2019, 10:46 am

edwahu wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:19 am
I was a bit disappointed in Simonsson yesterday to be honest. I expected we would see him chime into the backline a lot more, he was very quiet in attack other then the break.
Simonsson's form has been somewhat overstated on this forum. He's been quite solid and credit to him for the job he's done. However he's not up to the level of Cotric and Rapana who are rep standard. It's a no brainer who gets picked first if everyone is available.
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Billy Walker » September 8, 2019, 11:11 am

Northern Raider wrote:
September 8, 2019, 10:46 am
edwahu wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:19 am
I was a bit disappointed in Simonsson yesterday to be honest. I expected we would see him chime into the backline a lot more, he was very quiet in attack other then the break.
Simonsson's form has been somewhat overstated on this forum. He's been quite solid and credit to him for the job he's done. However he's not up to the level of Cotric and Rapana who are rep standard. It's a no brainer who gets picked first if everyone is available.
Agree Simmonsen has been overstated a little but geez Cotric has been poor and on form Simmonsen is offering more than him. I suspect Cotric will get the nod ahead of him though

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by BadnMean » September 8, 2019, 11:24 am

Ricky will pick
2 Cotric'
4 Leilua
14 Simonsen

That's the way he's been leaning lately.

Joey isn't any LESS fit than when he picked him last time. Although I share peoples concerns about him, he's the best #4 in our team. By some distance. Daylight between him and our next best #4 really, given that Cotric hasn't adjusted well.
We are trying to win a minimum of 3 games (perhaps 4) over the next month. We need Joey to win the GF. You start playing him now or you face the same issue down the track. Would you rather be trying to win the comp with Cotric struggling at 4 and Simo on the wing or BJ with 2-3 games under his belt lining up at #4, with his strut back on, kinks worked out and Cotric back where he has played best?

Cotric back to wing. Simonsen is good. I still think Cotric is better. If needed, a change can be made after a week or two here. But I REALLY hope it doesn't come to that. I don't think it will.

Ricky hasn't seemed as warm on Havili this year, despite how good I think he is. And he was been willing to play Simo on the bench. So I think he'll be there at #14.

Young's stuff up means Havilli has two paths to still make the bench- either if Tapine isn't good to go or if Lui gets pushed.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by BadnMean » September 8, 2019, 11:28 am

edwahu wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:19 am
I was a bit disappointed in Simonsson yesterday to be honest. I expected we would see him chime into the backline a lot more, he was very quiet in attack other then the break.
I think at this stage he's a remarkable physical talent, who can do great things when the play comes for him (strong to hold a player up in D, or step a guy in front of him with agility) but doesn't have any instincts for the game. Yet.

That's why we've only seen him able to get in space once despite all his speed and footwork and he isn't setting the world on fire like Cotric (slower but better instincts for the game) was when outside Toots. He just doesn't know where to put himself.

Hopefully they'll come.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Billy Walker » September 8, 2019, 11:48 am

BadnMean wrote:
September 8, 2019, 11:24 am
Ricky will pick
2 Cotric'
4 Leilua
14 Simonsen

That's the way he's been leaning lately.

Joey isn't any LESS fit than when he picked him last time. Although I share peoples concerns about him, he's the best #4 in our team. By some distance. Daylight between him and our next best #4 really, given that Cotric hasn't adjusted well.
We are trying to win a minimum of 3 games (perhaps 4) over the next month. We need Joey to win the GF. You start playing him now or you face the same issue down the track. Would you rather be trying to win the comp with Cotric struggling at 4 and Simo on the wing or BJ with 2-3 games under his belt lining up at #4, with his strut back on, kinks worked out and Cotric back where he has played best?

Cotric back to wing. Simonsen is good. I still think Cotric is better. If needed, a change can be made after a week or two here. But I REALLY hope it doesn't come to that. I don't think it will.

Ricky hasn't seemed as warm on Havili this year, despite how good I think he is. And he was been willing to play Simo on the bench. So I think he'll be there at #14.

Young's stuff up means Havilli has two paths to still make the bench- either if Tapine isn't good to go or if Lui gets pushed.
Can’t disagree with anything you’ve said here. You’ve convinced me.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by -PJ- » September 8, 2019, 1:12 pm

I want BJ back in #4.

He'll do something special..we know it.

As for Simo, Cotric and Rapana, it's win win win..not fussed.
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by gangrenous » September 8, 2019, 1:20 pm

Northern Raider wrote:
edwahu wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:19 am
I was a bit disappointed in Simonsson yesterday to be honest. I expected we would see him chime into the backline a lot more, he was very quiet in attack other then the break.
Simonsson's form has been somewhat overstated on this forum. He's been quite solid and credit to him for the job he's done. However he's not up to the level of Cotric and Rapana who are rep standard. It's a no brainer who gets picked first if everyone is available.
You mean the same Cotric who took Simonsson’s break and set it on fire?

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by PigRickman » September 8, 2019, 2:33 pm

1. CNK
2. Cotric
3. Croker
4. Beej
5. Rapana
6. Wighton
7. Sezer
8. Papalii
9. Hodgson
10. Lui
11. Bateman
12. Whitehead
13. Sutton

14. Havilii
15. Sia
16. Horsburgh
17. Tapine

Simple as it gets. Let go and beat the **** out of Melbourne.
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by The Rickman » September 8, 2019, 2:56 pm

Why does Billy Walker continually make these threads when there’s a clear teams and selections thread for this discussion?

(And FTR I agree with Pig’s team)
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by 89_90_94_?? » September 8, 2019, 3:30 pm

After his best game of the year last week, cotrics form was back to how it has been all year yesterday, average at best. What was he thinking running from dummy half after simonssons long run. He has been the biggest disappointment of 2019

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by Ilanraiders » September 8, 2019, 9:10 pm

2. Simmonson
4. Leilua
14. Havili
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by papabear » September 8, 2019, 9:18 pm

Billy Walker wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:22 am
Lui has had a great season - I wouldn’t drop him on the back of one poor game. Havilli has been getting 10 minutes and it’s not clear he can step up to fill a greater rotation role. Lui, and Sutton are In the side for sure. Guler maybe and Simmonsen over Havilli (unless Ricky starts Simmonsen and leaves out Cotric)
I agree re Lui

Honestly, some people in here.

Outside of papalii who has been the best middle in the game ( I don’t watch much footy outside of the raiders, but I imagine tuamalolo is the only one who could be close) lui is our next best middle and noticeably so in many many games.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by papabear » September 8, 2019, 9:19 pm

The Rickman wrote:
September 8, 2019, 2:56 pm
Why does Billy Walker continually make these threads when there’s a clear teams and selections thread for this discussion?

(And FTR I agree with Pig’s team)
I agree with the team You posted as well as well u don’t need to agree with yourself.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by The Rickman » September 8, 2019, 9:27 pm

papabear wrote:
The Rickman wrote:
September 8, 2019, 2:56 pm
Why does Billy Walker continually make these threads when there’s a clear teams and selections thread for this discussion?

(And FTR I agree with Pig’s team)
I agree with the team You posted as well as well u don’t need to agree with yourself.
Wot
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by PigRickman » September 8, 2019, 9:29 pm

Scratch my above wot
im keen to see where he's going with this.
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Edrick Lee 5. Jordan Rapana
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by zim » September 9, 2019, 1:48 am

papabear wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:18 pm
Billy Walker wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:22 am
Lui has had a great season - I wouldn’t drop him on the back of one poor game. Havilli has been getting 10 minutes and it’s not clear he can step up to fill a greater rotation role. Lui, and Sutton are In the side for sure. Guler maybe and Simmonsen over Havilli (unless Ricky starts Simmonsen and leaves out Cotric)
I agree re Lui

Honestly, some people in here.

Outside of papalii who has been the best middle in the game ( I don’t watch much footy outside of the raiders, but I imagine tuamalolo is the only one who could be close) lui is our next best middle and noticeably so in many many games.
Soliola is better than Lui. Way better.

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by The Rickman » September 9, 2019, 7:14 am

PigRickman wrote:Scratch my above wot
im keen to see where he's going with this.
To hospital with an aneurysm by the looks of things
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by papabear » September 9, 2019, 8:29 am

You should get checked for schizophrenia

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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by papabear » September 9, 2019, 8:31 am

zim wrote:
September 9, 2019, 1:48 am
papabear wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:18 pm
Billy Walker wrote:
September 8, 2019, 9:22 am
Lui has had a great season - I wouldn’t drop him on the back of one poor game. Havilli has been getting 10 minutes and it’s not clear he can step up to fill a greater rotation role. Lui, and Sutton are In the side for sure. Guler maybe and Simmonsen over Havilli (unless Ricky starts Simmonsen and leaves out Cotric)
I agree re Lui

Honestly, some people in here.

Outside of papalii who has been the best middle in the game ( I don’t watch much footy outside of the raiders, but I imagine tuamalolo is the only one who could be close) lui is our next best middle and noticeably so in many many games.
Soliola is better than Lui. Way better.
Better career yes.

More inspirational for the team yes.

Look it is close I like soliolas line speed. But I would have lui just ahead of him this year, I did think of soli when I posted that because he has performed well this year as well.

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The Rickman
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Re: 2, 4, and 14

Post by The Rickman » September 9, 2019, 8:48 am

papabear wrote:You should get checked for schizophrenia
Haha this is fantastic stuff here
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