The Politics Thread 2019

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Sterlk » May 16, 2019, 9:19 pm

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by The Rickman » May 16, 2019, 9:57 pm

Northern Raider wrote:What are people's current views on nuclear energy? Outside of isolated disasters such as Chernobyl and Fukushima are we in a better position to create safer, cleaner energy with it? Can measures be taken to ensure disasters like those don't reoccur?
I think it’s a very viable option, provided you don’t build plants on fault lines or anywhere they can be hit by tsunamis, and you have a very, VERY sensible option for waste disposal.

But if we’re being 100% honest here, if we can’t power this planet from the energy generated from our very own sun, then we’re just not being fair dinkum


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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Northern Raider » May 16, 2019, 11:03 pm

The Rickman wrote:
May 16, 2019, 9:57 pm
Northern Raider wrote:What are people's current views on nuclear energy? Outside of isolated disasters such as Chernobyl and Fukushima are we in a better position to create safer, cleaner energy with it? Can measures be taken to ensure disasters like those don't reoccur?
I think it’s a very viable option, provided you don’t build plants on fault lines or anywhere they can be hit by tsunamis, and you have a very, VERY sensible option for waste disposal.

But if we’re being 100% honest here, if we can’t power this planet from the energy generated from our very own sun, then we’re just not being fair dinkum


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Obviously location of the plant is key. Not a lot of options somewhere like Japan. No such issues here. Which of the major parties would be brave enough to venture down that path though. Scaremongering by those opposed would be an irresistible force.

Solar is a great option for generating power. Storage and distribution is the challenge there as it is only working public service hours and we require power 24/7.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Manbush » May 17, 2019, 7:59 am

T_R wrote:
May 16, 2019, 6:27 pm
Manbush wrote:
T_R wrote:
May 16, 2019, 4:29 pm
I've heard Morrison come out and say directly that he doesn't believe gay people go to hell.

There's nothing equivocal about that, no matter how much Manbush wants to rave.
Hats off to him then, don’t know why he couldn’t have said as much when he was asked.

I’m just seeing religion play a major role in the USA politics and really don’t want it expanding its already strong influence here, abortion laws, euthanasia, chaplaincy program, public school funding versus private school, religious privilege to discriminate, even the correlation with climate change, the religious rights influence over the LNP is just too strong for me to consider them.
And the massive control the Catholic dominated unions have over the ALP is OK with you?

SDA influence is why we had Penny Wong opposed to SSM a few years back ... while the LNP, which you think is under religious control, got it passed.

I think you are being a little inconsistent.
No doubt have too much control over both parties but would you really deny they have more power over the LNP, look at the issues I mentioned who do you think is more likely to support the religious values and who more likely to support the secular values?

Let’s look at chaplaincy program as a start, LNP made it religious only, Labor got in opened it up for secular ones then LNP got back in and made it religious only again.

Ah marriage equality, yep at the time Labor was against it and then they made it their actual policy, where as the LNP instead of making it policy wasted money on a hateful plebiscite (because they knew if they said no they’d have been kicked out) and then parliament voted on it which a few of their members including Morrison abstained from voting. At the end only one of the two major parties supported SSM and it sure as hell wasnt the LNP.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by gangrenous » May 17, 2019, 8:03 am

Did Morrison abstain in the SSM vote?

Surprised Labor hasn’t brought that out during the campaign.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by T_R » May 17, 2019, 9:13 am

gangrenous wrote:Did Morrison abstain in the SSM vote?

Surprised Labor hasn’t brought that out during the campaign.
He did.

I'm surprised that Manbush hasn't showered him with praise - he felt that in good conscience he could not support the policy, but certainly didn't want to impose his religuous views on others by voting against it. Seems to be exactly the ethical position that MB is pushing for.
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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by The Rickman » May 17, 2019, 10:20 am

Hahaha that's right, the "hateful plebiscite"... remember a hysterical Manbush telling us the sky was going to fall in and all the problems it was going to cause?

Apart from some hate speech from the usual parties (who do that anyway), the rest of the nation got behind our same-sex couples, the vote was overwhelmingly a yes and the laws were passed. Who would've thunk it??
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by T_R » May 17, 2019, 10:48 am

How'd that tsunami of mental health issues play out?

By the way, I was actually at my first gsy marriage on the weekend. Amazing how many people there who had been married in the last year. The celebrant reckoned about 40% of her bookings now are same sex couples.
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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by The Rickman » May 17, 2019, 10:51 am

T_R wrote:
May 17, 2019, 10:48 am
How'd that tsunami of mental health issues play out?

By the way, I was actually at my first gsy marriage on the weekend. Amazing how many people there who had been married in the last year. The celebrant reckoned about 40% of her bookings now are same sex couples.
That's interesting, considering the plebiscite isn't even legally binding and even if the country votes overwhelmingly yes, the Liberal party probably won't even pass the laws anyway.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Northern Raider » May 17, 2019, 1:19 pm

T_R wrote:
May 17, 2019, 10:48 am
How'd that tsunami of mental health issues play out?

By the way, I was actually at my first gsy marriage on the weekend. Amazing how many people there who had been married in the last year. The celebrant reckoned about 40% of her bookings now are same sex couples.
I've been to 2 same sex weddings that took place well before the plebiscite. Neither bothered to go out and get married again. Read into that what you will but looking on the outside nothing really changed for them.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Dibbers » May 17, 2019, 1:54 pm

gangrenous wrote:
May 16, 2019, 6:33 pm
papabear wrote:waiting to hear it instead of snide bull **** comments coming from individuals who should know better.
Below is what I have written recently in the Climate Change thread. Nickman commented that it actually had an impact on his opinion, which reflected why it’s worth the time discussing and debating with people like Nickman because he actually engages with your response even if he disagrees you.
gangrenous wrote: Do we need other countries to help - absolutely!

Are we an insignificant part of the problem? Absolutely not. 300 countries and we’re over 1% of the total, so we’re at least triple the average per country. Plus if I recall correctly we’re the absolute worst in the world per capita.

We have benefitted from the advantages of being a polluting developed nation for a long time. It’s time we at the very least pulled our heads in on a per capita basis, and ideally took a leading stance in this problem. It absolutely is “our” problem, and it defies all logic to me why people think Chinese people should be finding a way to live on a quarter of our emissions per capita because they happen to be in the one country. The only thing that makes it easier is that when they change laws and behaviour their cumulative effect is much bigger. But there is absolutely no fairness in the large countries being the only ones needing to tighten their belts.

And you know what? It might just make us some cash if we’re the ones who can crack the problem and license the technology. But yeah yeah, it’s not as certain as the cash we get from watching the planet burn. I’m sure that won’t impact the economy hey Liberals?
One key point I’d like to emphasise further is that everyone in the world is facing the same problem. If we’re clever enough to find a good renewable resource/storage energy solution, it won’t be used just to remove our emissions and leave everyone else mucking around with coal.
Coming to the party late here, but this! ducking hell this!!!

How much will the crazy renewables target ALP are proposing going to cost? Ducking This!!!

This is what frustrates me with the ALP. Instead of carping on about "the cost of inaction" basically recite gangers post and you shut down the arguement.

We might not have a direct impact on the climate, but by countries like China and India using the technology we can potentially develop (and charge a pretty penny for) the indirect impact is potentially huge, and we stand to benefit financially from it.

Look at the Arabian countries with their oil, they're loaded because of an abundance of the stuff, we could be just as rich (ok maybe not to that extent) from our renewables tech, we just need money to go into R&D. be proactive instead of reactive. Lest host the party instead of paying the cover charge...

sorry, rant over!
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by The Rickman » May 17, 2019, 3:11 pm

Wait, wait... did gangers just say he likes debating with me?? REALLY?

Huh. I thought I was an absolute prick.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Northern Raider » May 17, 2019, 3:30 pm

Dibbers wrote:
May 17, 2019, 1:54 pm

This is what frustrates me with the ALP. Instead of carping on about "the cost of inaction" basically recite gangers post and you shut down the arguement.
Simple answer. Ganger's post, while logical has too many words in it. Politicians these days can only work in short sound bites. Not really their fault either. This is how the majority of the voting community consume their information these days. The pollies are marketers. They deliver a message in a format that gets through the people who vote them into their job.

These messages often fall over if challenged on the detail behind it and the people delivering the message aren't savvy enough to handle it. As we've seen in this campaign the worst culprits are the respective leaders of the parties.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Northern Raider » May 17, 2019, 3:32 pm

The Rickman wrote:
May 17, 2019, 3:11 pm
Wait, wait... did gangers just say he likes debating with me?? REALLY?

Huh. I thought I was an absolute prick.
The two are not mutually exclusive.
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The Politics Thread 2019

Post by gangrenous » May 17, 2019, 6:36 pm



Yeah I absolutely mean it Nickman. How many people on the internet actually will change their opinion based on considering the argument? Certainly not pigman

Plus I reckon we’d get on quite well in real life.

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The Politics Thread 2019

Post by gangrenous » May 17, 2019, 7:17 pm

So, what do we think for tomorrow? Libs to hold on and Plibersek to take the reigns as opposition leader?

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by PigRickman » May 17, 2019, 8:02 pm

T_R wrote:
May 17, 2019, 10:48 am
How'd that tsunami of mental health issues play out?

By the way, I was actually at my first gsy marriage on the weekend. Amazing how many people there who had been married in the last year. The celebrant reckoned about 40% of her bookings now are same sex couples.
I've always wondered why there we havent seen a **** ton of news articles about the toll of the SSM plebiscite... i was told we'd see a spike in suicide and all that jazz, and maybe it happened but i havent seen anything about it?
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by PigRickman » May 17, 2019, 8:04 pm

gangrenous wrote:
May 17, 2019, 7:17 pm
So, what do we think for tomorrow? Libs to hold on and Plibersek to take the reigns as opposition leader?
LOL. No.
The Libs are VERY heavy dogs for a good reason. They've been a terrible government and deserve to lose, and they will. I doubt Shorton and his mob will be any better but ill be stunned if they dont get their chance... though i also though Trump didnt have a prayer
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Matt wrote:
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by The Rickman » May 17, 2019, 8:45 pm

The betting odds suggest that Labor can’t lose tomorrow, but... we’ve eerily all seen this movie before


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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by T_R » May 17, 2019, 9:18 pm

The Rickman wrote:The betting odds suggest that Labor can’t lose tomorrow, but... we’ve eerily all seen this movie before


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Still sticking to your guns?
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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Northern Raider » May 18, 2019, 7:27 am

ALP will win. Main reason being the majority don't want this current government to remain. By the same token most people don't want Shorten as PM. That's the only thing keeping it close. If the ALP had a remotely palatable leader it would be a landslide.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by The Rickman » May 18, 2019, 7:52 am

Northern Raider wrote:ALP will win. Main reason being the majority don't want this current government to remain. By the same token most people don't want Shorten as PM. That's the only thing keeping it close. If the ALP had a remotely palatable leader it would be a landslide.
Same goes if the Libs still had Turnbull


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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Northern Raider » May 18, 2019, 8:01 am

The Rickman wrote:
May 18, 2019, 7:52 am
Northern Raider wrote:ALP will win. Main reason being the majority don't want this current government to remain. By the same token most people don't want Shorten as PM. That's the only thing keeping it close. If the ALP had a remotely palatable leader it would be a landslide.
Same goes if the Libs still had Turnbull


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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad » May 18, 2019, 12:48 pm

Waleed Aly made a good point last night. The key for the Libs will be if Abbott, Dutton Hunt to a lesser extent keep their seats.
An LNP without those 3 is a totally different party than with them


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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by T_R » May 18, 2019, 1:15 pm

Very hard to find palatable options in the QLD senate for 6 preference allocations. What a stunning collection of fascists, cranks and loons.
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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by greeneyed » May 18, 2019, 2:02 pm

It was the same in the ACT... you had to pick six if you voted above the line in the Senate... and there were really only two options I was comfortable putting a number beside. I've never felt so disinclined to vote... with no party really espousing sensible economic policy in combination with progressive views on social issues.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by The Rickman » May 18, 2019, 2:26 pm

greeneyed wrote:It was the same in the ACT... you had to pick six if you voted above the line in the Senate... and there were really only two options I was comfortable putting a number beside. I've never felt so disinclined to vote... with no party really espousing sensible economic policy in combination with progressive views on social issues.
So after Fraser and Pauline you really struggled for choices??


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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by greeneyed » May 18, 2019, 2:31 pm

One Nation didn’t stand, and Anning was the seventh option that didn’t get one of my numbers.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Dr Zaius » May 18, 2019, 5:44 pm

T_R wrote:Very hard to find palatable options in the QLD senate for 6 preference allocations. What a stunning collection of fascists, cranks and loons.
I numbered 1 to 12, giving them all to major parties
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by T_R » May 18, 2019, 6:06 pm

So, are we doing predictions this time?

Labor by 8
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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Dr Zaius » May 18, 2019, 6:07 pm

T_R wrote:So, are we doing predictions this time?

Labor by 8
Some **** to be PM
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Manbush » May 18, 2019, 8:22 pm

T_R wrote:
May 17, 2019, 10:48 am
How'd that tsunami of mental health issues play out?

By the way, I was actually at my first gsy marriage on the weekend. Amazing how many people there who had been married in the last year. The celebrant reckoned about 40% of her bookings now are same sex couples.
As was reported at the time and posted here there was an influx of calls to mental health hotlines, reported depression etc, it’s disingenuous to claim otherwise but that seems to be a constant theme of yours.
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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Northern Raider
Mal Meninga
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by Northern Raider » May 18, 2019, 8:29 pm

Andrew Bolt calling it a already as a minority government whoever gets ot.
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gangrenous
Ricky Stuart
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by gangrenous » May 18, 2019, 8:30 pm

Looks pretty solidly Liberal doesn’t it?

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PigRickman
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Re: The Politics Thread 2019

Post by PigRickman » May 18, 2019, 8:31 pm

Rickman, like Babe Ruth... called his shot for the second time on a major political upset.
Give the man his damn respect
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Matt wrote:
July 18, 2018, 3:49 pm
Edrick Lee 5. Jordan Rapana
Matt wrote:
June 25, 2019, 9:29 pm
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