SOK was/ is the #2 spinner in the country and he doesnt spin it.
Zampa is our short form guy, and he doesnt spin it.
We have been using Labu as our 2nd spin option for a couple of years. Its how he played in the sub continent.
Swepson is there almost by default in squad selection. 'You have to take 2 spinners to Syd', so he was the bum in the seat. I dont want that to completely dismiss his ability, but he isnt where CA hoped he would be by now.
Where exactly did they want him to be by now? Lyon isn't getting dropped any time soon so I doubt they're chasing a replacement. They need somebody in reserve in case Lyon breaks a finger on his bowling hand or something. By including Swepo in the squad for Sydney sends a clear message that right now he's their guy if that happens.
They expected a poor mans Warnie. Which I dont think he is.
Interesting take. He's only 26 and not even played a test yet. Has had no opportunity to show whether he's a poor man's Warnie, the next Warnie or the next Steve Smith (as a bowler). I'm not sure what you're basing your assessment on. Fact is he's currently been positioned as the next choice specialist spin bowler by the simple fact that he's the only one included in the extended test squad this season. Surely you can see that.
Swepson's 1st class avg is 35 and a bit.
Here are a few random spinners I can think of being here in recent times.
Ashwin 26.
Shah 28.
Santner 46 - WOW!
Moeen Ali - 38
SOK's is 24.5.
Agar - 41.19
Zampa - 48.26
Holland - 32.86
Lyon - 33.94
Warnie - 26
They might have him as the 2nd best spinner in the country ATM, but looking at his numbers and the ones above, where do you place him?
Im trying to say, our spin options arent good here ATM.
You have a very roundabout way of saying we don't have much depth in our spinning ranks. Started by saying Swepson's inclusion in the test squad "doesn't mean a lot".
Is your opinion of him purely based on his bowling average?
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.
Northern Raider wrote: ↑February 6, 2020, 2:15 pm
Where exactly did they want him to be by now? Lyon isn't getting dropped any time soon so I doubt they're chasing a replacement. They need somebody in reserve in case Lyon breaks a finger on his bowling hand or something. By including Swepo in the squad for Sydney sends a clear message that right now he's their guy if that happens.
They expected a poor mans Warnie. Which I dont think he is.
Interesting take. He's only 26 and not even played a test yet. Has had no opportunity to show whether he's a poor man's Warnie, the next Warnie or the next Steve Smith (as a bowler). I'm not sure what you're basing your assessment on. Fact is he's currently been positioned as the next choice specialist spin bowler by the simple fact that he's the only one included in the extended test squad this season. Surely you can see that.
Swepson's 1st class avg is 35 and a bit.
Here are a few random spinners I can think of being here in recent times.
Ashwin 26.
Shah 28.
Santner 46 - WOW!
Moeen Ali - 38
SOK's is 24.5.
Agar - 41.19
Zampa - 48.26
Holland - 32.86
Lyon - 33.94
Warnie - 26
They might have him as the 2nd best spinner in the country ATM, but looking at his numbers and the ones above, where do you place him?
Im trying to say, our spin options arent good here ATM.
You have a very roundabout way of saying we don't have much depth in our spinning ranks. Started by saying Swepson's inclusion in the test squad "doesn't mean a lot".
Is your opinion of him purely based on his bowling average?
Its not. What little I've seen of him, I'm underwhelmed.
But to my point, he was selected as the 2nd spinner to go to Syd, and I bet there was zero chance of him being used. Had Lyon broken his leg, I still doubt he would have played. He might be the best of a bad bunch, but thats a worry. Which just means, we still havent solved our spin stock issues since Warne, even if we found Lyon.
I know, you only have to find 1, until you need another, BUT, it was always better knowing MacGill was just a phone call away.
Don't discount Swepson so quickly. He's continually improving and has been doing a good job for QLD in the Shield this season. He's much better suited to long form cricket as he likes to give the ball a bit of air. Still relatively young and evolving with his craft. Plenty of time ahead for him as Lyon will be around for a few years yet.
I'll add that if Lyon did break his leg before the Sydney test then I'd be 100% confident Swepson would have played. No way they go in with Labuschagne as their front line spinner.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.
Best part of that was Shane Watson mooing Wasim Akram bowling half rat power for 2 massive bombs, getting 30 off 9 balls and then "thanks lads that'll do"
Azza wrote: ↑February 11, 2020, 9:55 am
Warner got the AB medal. Not sure why it wasn't Cummins tbh, especially with the former having such an abomination of an Ashes series.
AB is all 3 formats.
Warner killed it in short forms. Then home summer destroyed the Paki's and Kiwi's.
Cummins had an all round year, but got pipped at the post.
Basically, Warner got more MotM awards, while Cummins accumulated.
I know it's all 3 formats, tell me something I don't know scoop. I still think Cummins was more deserving of it - but maybe I'm biased, because I am decidedly not a Warner fan. Our most important series this year was the ashes and Warner was AWOL during it.
-TW- wrote: ↑February 11, 2020, 11:27 am
Agreed, the fact he sucked **** in the ashes and the fact he's still a **** are two reasons why he shouldn't have got it
CA probably wanted the redemption story
Sent from my ELE-L29 using Tapatalk
Im sure they did, but the players vote holds more sway then anyone elses
I enjoyed watching Lara briefly on the weekend. More than any other batsmen (other than Gilchrist) I can remember when I watched the game growing up was just a joy to watch in full flight during his career.
Azza wrote: ↑February 11, 2020, 3:03 pm
I enjoyed watching Lara briefly on the weekend. More than any other batsmen (other than Gilchrist) I can remember when I watched the game growing up was just a joy to watch in full flight during his career.
Yup. Loooooved watching him bat. The big expansive flourish of the bat. That was Calypso cricket to me.
Lara vs McGrath was probably one of the best H2H battles I can remember.
Always rated him a notch higher than Tendulkar, Kallis and Ponting who all tend to be grouped together. All have similar averages in international cricket but Lara played 70% or more of his test career in some pretty ordinary batting lineups. He only just crossed over careers with Greenidge and had maybe 3/4 years with Haynes. Gayle didn't debut until about 6 years after Haynes and they deadset did not have a genuinely test class opener in the meantime. So he played the majority of his test career averaging over 50 in the middle order with opening batsmen who were averaging generally in the 20s or low 30s at absolute best (rotating doors of Phil Simmons, Philo Wallace, Stuart Williams, Sherwin Campbell, Wavell Hinds and Daren Ganga). Richie Richardson retired early in his career too which left Lara and Chanderpaul as the only 2 consistent bats in that side for years. Hooper was an enigma, Adams played a role and later on Sarwan was good early in his career but that was about it. It was nearly all on them.
Compare that to Ponting who had probably the greatest opening partnership in front of him and absolute legends behind him. He deteriorated a bit as a bat at the same time the team was dipping as well. South Africa weren't as good but Kirsten rolled into Smith and they always had lots of talent there with the bat and often batted very deep with Pollock, Klusener etc. India's top order was a bit more transient but Sachin had Sehwag there for ages and spent much of his career with Dravid, Ganguly and Laxman around him.
All absolute legends but BC Lara was just that bit more of a genuine match winner with the willow IMO.
julian87 wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 9:18 am
I'm liking the Lara love.
Always rated him a notch higher than Tendulkar, Kallis and Ponting who all tend to be grouped together. All have similar averages in international cricket but Lara played 70% or more of his test career in some pretty ordinary batting lineups. He only just crossed over careers with Greenidge and had maybe 3/4 years with Haynes. Gayle didn't debut until about 6 years after Haynes and they deadset did not have a genuinely test class opener in the meantime. So he played the majority of his test career averaging over 50 in the middle order with opening batsmen who were averaging generally in the 20s or low 30s at absolute best (rotating doors of Phil Simmons, Philo Wallace, Stuart Williams, Sherwin Campbell, Wavell Hinds and Daren Ganga). Richie Richardson retired early in his career too which left Lara and Chanderpaul as the only 2 consistent bats in that side for years. Hooper was an enigma, Adams played a role and later on Sarwan was good early in his career but that was about it. It was nearly all on them.
Compare that to Ponting who had probably the greatest opening partnership in front of him and absolute legends behind him. He deteriorated a bit as a bat at the same time the team was dipping as well. South Africa weren't as good but Kirsten rolled into Smith and they always had lots of talent there with the bat and often batted very deep with Pollock, Klusener etc. India's top order was a bit more transient but Sachin had Sehwag there for ages and spent much of his career with Dravid, Ganguly and Laxman around him.
All absolute legends but BC Lara was just that bit more of a genuine match winner with the willow IMO.
Exceptional points.
Lara was THE WI. Get Lara, you get the WI. You can certainly draw parallels to Bradman in this respect.
julian87 wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 9:40 am
Shiv was world class too IMO. Got better with age though, showed talent early but grew into an absolute beast with experience.
Shiv certainly got better with age, and a crazy batting stance. However, his best yrs were probably post Lara.
Anyone remember Steve Waugh's first test series as captain of Aus? We played in the WI, and smashed them the first test. Lara then came out and single handed dragged them back into the series in the later matches with some incredible innings. Great player of spin too.
Azza wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 10:00 am
Anyone remember Steve Waugh's first test series as captain of Aus? We played in the WI, and smashed them the first test. Lara then came out and single handed dragged them back into the series in the later matches with some incredible innings. Great player of spin too.
Was it an Antigua that he came out and scored a double hundred and flayed us all over the ground?
bonehead wrote: ↑February 11, 2020, 8:16 pm
Warne vs Lara billed on one particular Caribbean tour, epic stuff.
Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk
Is that the 1 Lara took him to the cleaners?
yeah 1999 with Warne spiralling in that series.
The build-up was insane, CH9 had this new camera that was going to focus on the Warne release effectively tracking the delivery for replays but the reality was Lara (546 runs) owned him and McGrath was the star for the Aussies with 30 wickets in 4 tests(7 innings).
Azza wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 10:00 am
Anyone remember Steve Waugh's first test series as captain of Aus? We played in the WI, and smashed them the first test. Lara then came out and single handed dragged them back into the series in the later matches with some incredible innings. Great player of spin too.
Was it an Antigua that he came out and scored a double hundred and flayed us all over the ground?
Don't remember him getting a double hundred so can't comment, he played two corkers in a row in Barbados and Antigua though. Warne was just coming back from an operation and Lara forced him to be dropped.
EDIT: Yes he got a double hundred at Sabina Park in Jamaica, and then another 2 hundreds after that. Amazing.
Azza wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 10:00 am
Anyone remember Steve Waugh's first test series as captain of Aus? We played in the WI, and smashed them the first test. Lara then came out and single handed dragged them back into the series in the later matches with some incredible innings. Great player of spin too.
Was it an Antigua that he came out and scored a double hundred and flayed us all over the ground?
Don't remember him getting a double hundred so can't comment, he played two corkers in a row in Barbados and Antigua though. Warne was just coming back from an operation and Lara forced him to be dropped.
EDIT: Yes he got a double hundred at Sabina Park in Jamaica, and then another 2 hundreds after that. Amazing.
Sabina Park, thanks. Yep, he was untouchable in that series.
Azza wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 5:54 pm
Yeah probably the only one that consistently troubled him was McGrath... but there were days where even he couldn't do anything to stop Lara.
Esp in Australia. They just set the wide cordon, with double gully, and it was a matter of time.
Azza wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 5:54 pm
Yeah probably the only one that consistently troubled him was McGrath... but there were days where even he couldn't do anything to stop Lara.
McGrath one of my favourite all time quicks. Showed how effective you can be by keeping it simple. Just kept the ball in the old "Corridor of Uncertainty". Let the ball's natural seam provide the subtle variations. Amazed how few bowlers at the top level try to emulate this approach these days.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.
Azza wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 5:54 pm
Yeah probably the only one that consistently troubled him was McGrath... but there were days where even he couldn't do anything to stop Lara.
McGrath one of my favourite all time quicks. Showed how effective you can be by keeping it simple. Just kept the ball in the old "Corridor of Uncertainty". Let the ball's natural seam provide the subtle variations. Amazed how few bowlers at the top level try to emulate this approach these days.
Stuwie Clarke did for a while.
I thought Big Wood did that too, but he is trying things these days.
Azza wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 5:54 pm
Yeah probably the only one that consistently troubled him was McGrath... but there were days where even he couldn't do anything to stop Lara.
McGrath one of my favourite all time quicks. Showed how effective you can be by keeping it simple. Just kept the ball in the old "Corridor of Uncertainty". Let the ball's natural seam provide the subtle variations. Amazed how few bowlers at the top level try to emulate this approach these days.
Stuwie Clarke did for a while.
I thought Big Wood did that too, but he is trying things these days.
Yeah, Hazelwood the closest we've seen in Australia. Jasprit Bumrah reminds me a lot of McGrath (not his action).
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.
Azza wrote: ↑February 12, 2020, 5:54 pm
Yeah probably the only one that consistently troubled him was McGrath... but there were days where even he couldn't do anything to stop Lara.
McGrath one of my favourite all time quicks. Showed how effective you can be by keeping it simple. Just kept the ball in the old "Corridor of Uncertainty". Let the ball's natural seam provide the subtle variations. Amazed how few bowlers at the top level try to emulate this approach these days.
Stuwie Clarke did for a while.
I thought Big Wood did that too, but he is trying things these days.
Yeah, Hazelwood the closest we've seen in Australia. Jasprit Bumrah reminds me a lot of McGrath (not his action).