LastRaider wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 7:42 am
I don’t know if we can play J.Bateman at 13. Looking at our defence and ruck speed we really need a work horse there this year and not sure J.Bateman has the lungs to do it at this stage.
I can’t really have him in the run on team, but if I had to I would bring Whitehead to 13, and slot J.Bateman in at second row
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Bateman has a big motor, I don't think that will be a problem. He would be the most "workhorse" player in the side.
Agree with this. You'd have to ask if someone is confusing their apples and oranges if they don't think J Bateman is a work horse. His game is built on involvment.
LastRaider wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 7:42 am
I don’t know if we can play J.Bateman at 13. Looking at our defence and ruck speed we really need a work horse there this year and not sure J.Bateman has the lungs to do it at this stage.
I can’t really have him in the run on team, but if I had to I would bring Whitehead to 13, and slot J.Bateman in at second row
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Bateman has a big motor, I don't think that will be a problem. He would be the most "workhorse" player in the side.
Agree with this. You'd have to ask if someone is confusing their apples and oranges if they don't think J Bateman is a work horse. His game is built on involvment.
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Exactly. He is the definition of workhorse style player. I’d expect him to play 60-80 mins during the first round or two and 80 consistently after that. He won’t / can’t be on the bench
Saw many teams gassed yesterday. It takes time to find your legs , excitement , adrenalin have an impact and cause you to fade out early until you can get into a rhythm
You'd have to be worried about that defence today. When it was firsts v firsts, the Dogs were marching up the field with ease.
As Pigman reminds us every year, it's just a trial and it means squat come September, but I am feeling a bit deflated with what I saw today.
haha deflated? It means fair dinkum zero until we have our best side on the park playing a full strength 1st grade side. I'm stunned anyone reads anything in to trials. You wanna know how relevant trials are? Parra won both their trials last year by big margins. How'd that end up for them again?
Yes, which is why I qualified my statement.
But the point remains - last year we regluarly gave up 15 meters a hit up, with paper thin defence around and behind the ruck. Stuart said that they'd been working on it in the off-season, but it's clearly still a huge issue.
As you say, let's wait until we see the full starting side out there.
Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.
Another thing that needs a lot of work is the short kicking game.
Hodgson put in a lot of short kicks yesterday, but I don’t recall any of them paying off. Either Ennis needs to work on Hodgson with that or more of the short kicks should be done by Sezer
Sid wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 1:15 pm
Another thing that needs a lot of work is the short kicking game.
Hodgson put in a lot of short kicks yesterday, but I don’t recall any of them paying off. Either Ennis needs to work on Hodgson with that or more of the short kicks should be done by Sezer
Hodgson doesn’t seem to have toned down his habit of continually overplaying his hand... with passing or kicking.
It’s abstract, but it’s yet another potential reason why recruiting a gun half could be difficult. He doesn’t give his halves much control. Why would a decent player willingly come here to play for the Destroyer of Clubs/Destroyer of Halves, alongside a Hooker that’s as greedy as prime R.Farah. (We know how that was viewed regarding the development of the Tigers halves).
I know there will be flak coming this direction, Hodgo is a GH darling, but he’s overrated on here courtesy of one strong season. He has games where he’s a strong net negative for us.
edwahu wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 2:53 pm
Very few games. Another player some compare against a perfect baseline.
Two sentiments often heard on the GH:
- Hodgson is the second best hooker in the world
- Our halves are rubbish
Both are rendered incorrect by Hodgson’s inability to know when to hold em and know when to fold em.
And because he touches the ball more than anyone else - the effect on the team can be dramatic. He doesn’t have the luxury of being an unknown quantity any more, and I haven’t seen any development in his game since 2016 to overcome this.
Generally I like your opinions Mamando but I think maybe you're exaggerating the Hodgson thing for effect here.
He does overplay his hand sometimes and that is a part of his game where he needs to be smarter about when to carry the team with him or when to pull it back in. As I said in my post after the game he did take a lot of wrong options but he is still our most important player and he'll win us more games than he loses us. I also want to reiterate my point that we need to find a way to give Havili more time, and not just as a loose forward, some minutes at dummy half even if he shares it with Hodgo with them both out there. He gives the team something different from there and I think like Baptiste before him, he gives players the ball they're expecting rather than trying to guess whether the hooker is going to dummy and scoot or cut you out while on the burst etc. When we have momentum and are winning the middle, the hooker just needs to let the forwards roll forward and keep it simple.
If I wasn't so concerned about how keeping things simple for Sezer and Jack on a weekly basis, i'd suggest that perhaps we could weave in parts of the game where Havili plays 9 pushing Hodgo into the halves with Sezer and using Jack at the back. It could work well but I feel that for his footy team we just keep it as simple as possible and let them just concentrate on getting basic things right in their starting position.
We continue to **** about with blokes that are part of some fraternity. It's infuriating.
zim wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 1:16 am
Was really impressed with Soliola's efforts in the first half particularly in defense. Felt like Papa and Whitehead were cruising a bit for that first half. They'll obviously improve that for round 1 and adding J Bateman will help tighten that ruck up.
They haven't worked CNK into their attack properly yet but it's not surprising given the short time he's been here. Looked solid out there today.
Hodgo needs to relax a bit. Trying way too hard to do it all. Sometimes you just need to feed the ball out and let the edges handle it.
Williams looked great against the dogs when their line speed had disappeared.
Hope Horsburgh grabs a bench spot. Just has that look about him like Tapine or Rappa. Always a danger.
Best of all it looks like no injuries.
I'd agree with all of that.
You raise some points I'll be watching with interest over the first few rounds...
Hodgo already had a tendency on some occasions to commit the cardinal hooker sin of "overplaying his hand"- is the responsibility he feels as captain and this new priority in the playmaking order going to change how he plays? Personally I think he's smart enough to know he just has to do his thing and he'll find the balance. Butttt... it's one to watch.
CNK- was he always a utility because he is strong and talented but isn't really good at ballplaying or structures?
Horsburg- I agree, he had attitude. You want one of your forwards out there to look like he'd really enjoy dishing out some pain if you come near him.
to be fair CNK has only been at the club for a few weeks and the boys have travelled a bit and rested heaps of the trips so he won't know the structures yet
I don't think that objectively measured against other players in his position and the league Hodgson is anything but a very good player. He isn't perfect but no player is.
The same goes for our line speed. Is it good? No. Can it be better? Yes. Is it really so much worse than every other teams? I suspect not. In fact if you look at our meters conceded against the average, it's not that bad at all. The problem is that like Hodgo kicking it dead it sucks to watch and is easy to identify, so objectivity gets thrown out the window and it gets inflated as an issue.
Last edited by edwahu on February 24, 2019, 5:22 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Woodgers wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 4:47 pm
Generally I like your opinions Mamando but I think maybe you're exaggerating the Hodgson thing for effect here.
He does overplay his hand sometimes and that is a part of his game where he needs to be smarter about when to carry the team with him or when to pull it back in. As I said in my post after the game he did take a lot of wrong options but he is still our most important player and he'll win us more games than he loses us. I also want to reiterate my point that we need to find a way to give Havili more time, and not just as a loose forward, some minutes at dummy half even if he shares it with Hodgo with them both out there. He gives the team something different from there and I think like Baptiste before him, he gives players the ball they're expecting rather than trying to guess whether the hooker is going to dummy and scoot or cut you out while on the burst etc. When we have momentum and are winning the middle, the hooker just needs to let the forwards roll forward and keep it simple.
If I wasn't so concerned about how keeping things simple for Sezer and Jack on a weekly basis, i'd suggest that perhaps we could weave in parts of the game where Havili plays 9 pushing Hodgo into the halves with Sezer and using Jack at the back. It could work well but I feel that for his footy team we just keep it as simple as possible and let them just concentrate on getting basic things right in their starting position.
I don’t disagree with Hodgsons game breaking ability. In his great games he gives us a weapon that is above league average at the position. I just get frustrated that these past few years he’s shown no discernible self-awareness of how his selfish play affects the team when it doesn’t come off. I’d love to see him knuckle down, give good service and get the team (and especially his halves) on a roll, then pick his moments as the game allows. The short kick for the in-goal that invariably comes off his shins is such a low percentage play due to the angles involved. The repetitive crash ball didn’t work with the two largest prop forwards in the comp. So on that evidence, I’m going to call him a talented, but dumb, footballer.
The reason I highlighted above though - I reckon you’ve nailed it with that suggestion. I actually think if Stick was to promise to give him some license later in halves/games by moving him to first receiver (Havili to DH)... then maybe he can get some of these wannabe-halfback moves out of his system when opposition defences are more fatigued
edwahu wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 5:19 pm
I don't think that objectively measured against other players in his position and the league Hodgson is anything but a very good player. He isn't perfect but no player is.
The same goes for our line speed. Is it good? No. Can it be better? Yes. Is it really so much worse than every other teams? I suspect not. In fact if you look at our meters conceded against the average, it's not that bad at all. The problem is that like Hodgo kicking it dead it sucks to watch and is easy to identify, so objectivity gets thrown out the window and it gets inflated as an issue.
Middle of the pack for metres conceded is not good either.
I just watched the replay of the live stream. Boy it was hard work. Initially it wouldn’t load at all. Eventually gave upon NRL.com and got it going eventually on raiders.com.au. It got to a point just after the Dogs fourth try when it kept breaking down. All it would do is constantly stop, play the Raiders membership commercial, and then do it all over again. I switched to bulldogs.com.au and eventually was able to find a start point just before half time when it would commence.
There are professional broadcast companies who could do a much better job than the NRL is doing here.
BTW The “breeze” yesterday was an easterly, it was blowing right into our faces in the western “stand”. Could have been a bit of a south easterly I guess. But the breeze wasn’t a huge advantage for either side really. It did die down in the second half.
edwahu wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 5:19 pm
I don't think that objectively measured against other players in his position and the league Hodgson is anything but a very good player. He isn't perfect but no player is.
The same goes for our line speed. Is it good? No. Can it be better? Yes. Is it really so much worse than every other teams? I suspect not. In fact if you look at our meters conceded against the average, it's not that bad at all. The problem is that like Hodgo kicking it dead it sucks to watch and is easy to identify, so objectivity gets thrown out the window and it gets inflated as an issue.
Middle of the pack for metres conceded is not good either.
Sure, but my point is there is nothing actually different about the way we defend vs other sides. We aren't the only side that "lets the opposition march up the field" at different times of the game, every side does this throughout a game. If you look at the meters that get conceded per set, the Roosters are no better than us, so objectively the contribution of line speed to our losses has to be questionable.
edwahu wrote: ↑February 24, 2019, 5:19 pm
I don't think that objectively measured against other players in his position and the league Hodgson is anything but a very good player. He isn't perfect but no player is.
The same goes for our line speed. Is it good? No. Can it be better? Yes. Is it really so much worse than every other teams? I suspect not. In fact if you look at our meters conceded against the average, it's not that bad at all. The problem is that like Hodgo kicking it dead it sucks to watch and is easy to identify, so objectivity gets thrown out the window and it gets inflated as an issue.
Middle of the pack for metres conceded is not good either.
Sure, but my point is there is nothing actually different about the way we defend vs other sides. We aren't the only side that "lets the opposition march up the field" at different times of the game, every side does this throughout a game. If you look at the meters that get conceded per set, the Roosters are no better than us, so objectively the contribution of line speed to our losses has to be questionable.
But last year's middle of the pack was a massive improvement on previous years. Previously, the Raiders have been one of the worst teams for metres conceded. Premiers aren't middle of the pack for metres conceded.
Ricky Stuart hopes Canberra Raiders and Canterbury Bulldogs highlight good of the game
It's been the embarrassing NRL pre-season from hell, but Canberra Raiders coach Ricky Stuart hopes people see the good rugby league can do too. Stuart pointed to everything the Raiders and Canterbury Bulldogs did for the community on the NSW South Coast last week as proof of that.
"What I've seen our players and the Canterbury players do down here over the last three or four days brought a smile to a lot of kids' faces."
Kieran Foran sizes up Jack Wighton's switch to the Canberra Raiders halves
Size does matter for Jack Wighton. Not only that, but former Kiwis five-eighth Kieran Foran has backed the Canberra Raiders' new No.6 to develop into a real ball-playing half.
"I thought he really warmed into the game nicely, as you could see in that second half he really stepped up and laid on a few tries for them," Foran said. "I think it's great seeing him in the line. He's a quality footballer, he has been for some time now. He's growing his game to the point where he can help out in the halves and be a real ball-playing five-eighth.
IMO, Mounties looked better in the opening 40mins vs Eels, than the Raiders did in the opening 40mins vs Dogs. That is worrying. Esp, as Ricky and the players have been banging the defensive focus in preseason. Its also worrying that yet again, Ricky has gone with a light trails load, esp when 1 trail was really a Mounties trial.
Im not surprised. Dont think Ricky has learned a thing about trials. It worries me that we have a new spine, and they have had 40mins together 'in the heat of battle'.
All that said, im still quitely optimistic about this yr. I know its vs ISP teams, but we fought back from no where to win. I really really hope this rubs off on the team. Maybe the last min choke is a thing of the past. Hopefully.
My team post trials:
1. CNK - I really think in the 2 and a bit wks he has been here, he has busted his butt to win the FB job. I loved his willing involvement in the 2nd trial. He was safe as houses at the back too. I also love that he is sniffing around the ruck. An offload from a Papa, Sia or Jbateo and he will be in business. He isnt a rep player, probably wont ever be, and he is still a bit clunky in attack, but as previously noted, he has only been here a couple of wks. I see promise here.
2. Cotric. Its a no brainer.
3. Croker. Another easy pick, assuming that knee is ok. He took a knock in that trial, so I hope he is ok. Good to see the GKing radar is back to its best too.
4. BJ. Its another obvious pick, as he has brilliance in attack, and his meters out of our end are too valuable. Nothing against Kris, coz I thought he looked pretty solid, esp defensively. But he is still young and still gets caught out at times. Decent depth here, and a better option than Oldie at centre.
5. Oldie. Ricky likes his experienced players. Because of this, I think he is probably more likely to be error free too. Oldie is a bigger body than Simonsson too. I think Simonsson has impressed quite a few people this preseason, and i see potential there, but he isnt there yet.
6. Wighton, well he looked rusty and a little lost early. As the game wore on, he looked more comfortable, and that bullet right to left cutout came up trumps. Very like his time at FB last yr, the left edge could be pur go to side again. Played all 80mins too. I thought his kicking looked promising by games end too. The work he has done is paying off IMO. Still not sold on him at 6, but for the team its the best move.
7. Sezer. I think he will be there. I honestly believe his kicking game and defense is keeping him ahead of Williams. He looked very clunky in attack vs Dogs. Williams, with his Mounties team, did run down both opponents. He was slicker in attack, BUT, is that coz Sammy is better than ISP?
8. Hunt. TBH, I dont like this pick, but I think this is Rickys odd ball pick for 2019. He made a couple of defensive errors vs the Eels, esp the Moses kick to the corner try. Bar the try, I wasn't impressed with his 1st stint vs the Dogs. His 2nd stint was impressive, though it was vs a depleted Dogs NRL side (was not quite ISP level at that stage). I think the only reasoning behind this pick is that Ricky wants a big prop in his 17. Guler is tall, but not heavy for his size. Sutton was asked to bulk up over the preseason. He has middle/edge tweeners in Papa, Sia and Tapine. Other options include Lui and Horsbough. We also have centre/ edge cover in Whitehead, JBateman and Sia. Ive had Sia starting in my teams from day 1, Id prefer this.
9. Hodgo. Next.
10. Papa. He and Sia laid a few players out. It was pretty.
11. Tapine. He was our best vs Dogs. He was a beast! Id prefer the bigger body in the middle, but if he is gonna do that every wk, strap in and enjoy.
12. Whitehead. He was named there vs Dogs. He will be there vs Titans. So...
13. J Bateman. He is the last of our 4 backrowers left. Ricky isnt benching an international. He is in a similar mould to a Radley or Murray, as a smaller lock. No less aggressive though. I reckon he pumps out 50mins easy, probably more.
14. Havili is an obvious one. I too would like to see him on the field with Hodgo more, however, with Bateman at lock, I cant see it happening til very late in games.
15. Sia. If Hunt is at 8, this is Sias spot. I like the experience off the bench, but with that starting side, and the ability of them to play big mins someone loses out. I think Havili and/or Sutton will be that player. Id really rather see Horsbough in this spot. I think of all the options, he has really stood out. As a rookie, Ricky can blood him in low mins, allowing the rest to get the bulk. He looks tough, very willing and firey. Let the Big Red Fire Engine loose; its Tonguey in the body he needed.
16. Guler looked the second best of our props in both trials. He isnt an impact guy, despite his size. That 1st run after halftime vs Dogs was glorious though. He is still filling into that frame. He is a busy player. He played good mins in both games. I can see him pushing that 25-30mins of last yr to 35-40mins this yr.
17. Sutton. He isnt yet an international, but Im sure he will be treated as such. I have said previously that we need to treat Sutton like any other rookie prop. The edge he has is knowing how to handle himself day to day off the field and in game preparation. He took a knock in the first trial, but looked out of his depth in the second. I think he gets Gulers mins from last yr, so 30mins max.
I think our youth and depth look ok too. Murchie and Young look promising. As did Kris and Simonsson. I think Starling was very exciting in the 1st trial too, pity i dont see him making the 30.
Enormous response to Bega match positive: Canberra Raiders coach Ricky Stuart
Canberra Raiders coach Ricky Stuart said the Bega trial had illustrated the potential of rugby league and the NRL to be a positive driving force for communities.
"I believe that what our players have done, and the Canterbury players have done - especially with Adam Elliott being a local boy - has put a lot of smiles on peoples' faces, particularly the kids," Stuart said. "And that's what needs to be publicised - that is what is important about rugby league; bringing people together.
Ricky Stuart seeing double with Jody Lloyd's Canberra Raiders jumper
Jody Lloyd says she has just one possession from her 20s. A near-pristine 1993 Canberra Raiders jumper she had signed then by Ricky Stuart. Now as the club's coach, Stuart signed the jumper again during the Captain's run in Bega on Friday - 26 years after his last autograph.
"I worked as a nurse at the Queanbeyan hospital, but for 12 months I used to work in a deli next door to the Queanbeyan RSL Club [the then Raiders base of operations]," Ms Lloyd said.
@Matt I think that's how the team will likely look come round 1. I too think Hunt will be the Ricky Stuart curve ball for the start of 2019. If he has to play in round 1 then I would rather Horsburgh on the interchange than Sutton at this stage. I agree that he needs to be treated as a rookie and don't think it's a bad idea for him to spend some time with Mounties through the year.
VIDEO: Hear from Canberra Raiders co-captain Jarrod Croker on the Green Machine's win over the Canterbury Bulldogs at Bega
The Canberra Raiders have rounded out their trial games for 2019 with a come from behind win over the Bulldogs in Bega. Co-Captain Jarrod Croker happy with his side's performance - impressed with Jack Wighton's first hit out at five-eighth, WIN News Canberra reports.
@Matt I think CNK is going to be our Smokey this year. I like what I saw in the trials and he is a sniffer (aka follows the ball). He could really come alive in games for us in the last 20 minutes when fatigue sets in. I’m looking forward to seeing how he goes.
Can’t have Sutton in at this stage, he needs to spend sometime in Mounties.
Sia, i can’t speak highly enough of him. Can play anywhere and gives 120% every game. I think he will be needed to start though, we need the experience in the middle.
Canberra Raiders Sam Williams and Jarrod Croker jump into T20 at Bega
Bega took out the final leg of the Baggy Blues T20 tour by one run on Thursday afternoon. With guest players from the Sydney Thunder and Canberra Raiders, the Bega-Angledale Bulls and Tathra Sea Eagles put on a good show for cricket fans to raise awareness of mental health in rural areas.
Raiders footballer Sam Williams jumped in to bat for the Bulls, but was dismissed caught behind off some sharp pace-bowling by his captain Jarrod Croker.
Video: Mic'd up: Brett White: Ever wondered what is said on the field during the game? Take a look now as Raiders TV mic'd up Assistant Coach Brett White during Saturday's trial match against the Bulldogs: https://www.raiders.com.au/news/2019/02 ... ett-white/
How the hell did you come to that conclusion? I love it. Keg v the world is exactly what this place needs. Being a mod doesnt mean you know what everyone wants
Hahaha absolutely spot on, simo. I have to say I was excited when I saw TR vs Keghead firing up, I think I was more excited than discussions about the game itself!
Last edited by The Nickman on February 26, 2019, 5:42 pm, edited 1 time in total.
