Jack Wighton confirms switch to five eighth

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Green eyed Mick
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Re: Jack Wighton set for

Post by Green eyed Mick »

dubby wrote: January 21, 2019, 1:52 pm Our idiot coach did drop Austin, remember.


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Austin played one game of reserve grade and his performance was below par. He didn't earn his recall and he didn't play well enough to keep his spot once recalled.
zim wrote: January 21, 2019, 1:55 pm It's very subtle, but I get the impression GEM doesn't like the way Austin plays.
What's to like? He was a ball hog and a lazy, uncommitted defender. As soon as rival coaches figured out the **** didn't have the ticker to go to the line, draw defenders and get belted in order to create for his outside men, they had his and therefore our measure.

A good half has to create uncertainty for defenders and opportunities for his teammates. Austin didn't do either. He was predictably selfish and it cost us dearly these last two seasons.

**** that guy.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for

Post by gerg »


Green eyed Mick wrote:
dubby wrote: January 21, 2019, 1:52 pm Our idiot coach did drop Austin, remember.


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Austin played one game of reserve grade and his performance was below par. He didn't earn his recall and he didn't play well enough to keep his spot once recalled.
zim wrote: January 21, 2019, 1:55 pm It's very subtle, but I get the impression GEM doesn't like the way Austin plays.
.
Ricky probably apologised to Blake for dropping him too. Just like the others he dropped.

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Re: Jack Wighton set for

Post by Seiffert82 »

Green eyed Mick wrote: January 21, 2019, 7:03 pm
dubby wrote: January 21, 2019, 1:52 pm Our idiot coach did drop Austin, remember.


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Austin played one game of reserve grade and his performance was below par. He didn't earn his recall and he didn't play well enough to keep his spot once recalled.
zim wrote: January 21, 2019, 1:55 pm It's very subtle, but I get the impression GEM doesn't like the way Austin plays.
What's to like? He was a ball hog and a lazy, uncommitted defender. As soon as rival coaches figured out the **** didn't have the ticker to go to the line, draw defenders and get belted in order to create for his outside men, they had his and therefore our measure.

A good half has to create uncertainty for defenders and opportunities for his teammates. Austin didn't do either. He was predictably selfish and it cost us dearly these last two seasons.

**** that guy.
All fair points! He really did let the team down on a regular basis the last couple of seasons. That's why I give Williams credit for giving it a crack, despite physical limitations.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Botman »

RedRaider wrote: January 20, 2019, 12:23 am
edwahu wrote: January 19, 2019, 3:58 pm
RedRaider wrote: January 19, 2019, 3:53 pm I disagree LPR. Sammy defence stats were slightly better than Sezer last season. We have removed Austen who imo was our worst last season. The stats don't show when Austen didn't even attempt to make a tackle. I thought Sammy showed some improved D last year.

I also thought Jack was finally showing some FB consistency last year. I wouldn't move him after the development work is finally bearing fruit.
Sammy's defence stats were not better. They were much, much worse.

https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-pr ... =tryCauses
Thanks for all those stats Ed. I was recalling the 'missed tackle' stat from our end of year review and Sam is slightly better than Sezer. To me a player either makes a tackle or they don't. Interesting that Sezer is slightly worse per game on missed tackles but those misses didn't lead to a line break? That seems an anomaly to me.
I love this post so much.
:lol: :lol: :lol:
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Botman »

Woodgers wrote: January 21, 2019, 10:15 am Which side will Sezer defend at because we've seen us swap that around before to try shift our problems to the other side of the field. The reason for the question is that if Sezer is back to defending on the left and the #6 on the right, it strengthens the 'pro' for playing Wighton in the line because that will instantly make BJ a more confident and competent defender than having Williams there. The issues BJ has a lot of the time are his trust on his inside man, he's got enough strength and technique to do the job.
It's always Beej's problem. When he and austin we're not speaking and they switched Sezer and Austin, you all of a sudden saw Croker begin to stink again defensively and Beej improve dramatically
It's not a coincidence. Players like Sam Williams and Blake Austin make those around them much worse, because they are no longer playing what they see, they are hedging their bets and purposely playing out of position and structure because they know Williams/Austin are going to need help. And then teams expose them
Sezer doesnt need help. He's a half, and he's not a strong defender graded against the entire NRL. They get beat, often. Even the best NRL defensive halves are below average defenders overall, but the difference between being a defender on Sezer's level and Austin's level is you can live with the times Sezer concedes, most weeks your not going to concede points direction through him. You can't suvive week to week with Austin because you're spotting the opposition 10 points most weeks. Williams isnt quite Blake Austin but he's closer to that than he is Sezer.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Matt »

Pigman wrote: January 22, 2019, 7:19 am
Woodgers wrote: January 21, 2019, 10:15 am Which side will Sezer defend at because we've seen us swap that around before to try shift our problems to the other side of the field. The reason for the question is that if Sezer is back to defending on the left and the #6 on the right, it strengthens the 'pro' for playing Wighton in the line because that will instantly make BJ a more confident and competent defender than having Williams there. The issues BJ has a lot of the time are his trust on his inside man, he's got enough strength and technique to do the job.
It's always Beej's problem. When he and austin we're not speaking and they switched Sezer and Austin, you all of a sudden saw Croker begin to stink again defensively and Beej improve dramatically
It's not a coincidence. Players like Sam Williams and Blake Austin make those around them much worse, because they are no longer playing what they see, they are hedging their bets and purposely playing out of position and structure because they know Williams/Austin are going to need help. And then teams expose them
Sezer doesnt need help. He's a half, and he's not a strong defender graded against the entire NRL. They get beat, often. Even the best NRL defensive halves are below average defenders overall, but the difference between being a defender on Sezer's level and Austin's level is you can live with the times Sezer concedes, most weeks your not going to concede points direction through him. You can't suvive week to week with Austin because you're spotting the opposition 10 points most weeks. Williams isnt quite Blake Austin but he's closer to that than he is Sezer.
^^^
Yep. Thats the difference between being able to tackle and being able to defend. When Sammy gets beat its because he missed the tackle. When Austin go beat it was coz he was doing something stupid.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Woodgers »

Agree. I made my mind up that we finally had to do something last year when we played a really solid 1st half against the Broncos as Suncorp (with Abbey at fullback) and then got run down in the 2nd half where I think Austin was targeted and at fault for 4 tries in that 40 minute period. Now obviously there was a lot leading up to that game but I recall thinking after the match that if Wighton played where Blake did that night (who did little in attack as well) we would have won in a canter. Opposition teams know how to turn us over and yes now Austin is gone but what we don't want to do it slot the equivalent in where the black hole was. If we can fix this up we don't need to rely so much on whether Abbey is a solid last line defender, he'll do a job and a full preseason under his belt here will be interesting to see what his level is now. However if this move happens we will need to work hard on protecting him from kicks, but having said that, Jack isn't one of the leading fullbacks in the comp to bet your house on not to spill a bomb or get to a grubber.

I said it before and i'll say it again, i'm not going to die in a ditch if Sticky starts R1 with Williams and Jack at the back. I just feel that we can improve our defence by a large margin by moving Jack there and I think once they start to get that right we'll have more confidence with ball in hand too. We're clearly a confidence team that go from the penthouse to the **** 13 times in the one 80 minute game depending on where our confidence/frustration levels are. If we can get some attitude and wins in the defensive line I think it gives us the best chance to win more games.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Matt »

Woodgers wrote: January 22, 2019, 8:25 am Agree. I made my mind up that we finally had to do something last year when we played a really solid 1st half against the Broncos as Suncorp (with Abbey at fullback) and then got run down in the 2nd half where I think Austin was targeted and at fault for 4 tries in that 40 minute period. Now obviously there was a lot leading up to that game but I recall thinking after the match that if Wighton played where Blake did that night (who did little in attack as well) we would have won in a canter. Opposition teams know how to turn us over and yes now Austin is gone but what we don't want to do it slot the equivalent in where the black hole was. If we can fix this up we don't need to rely so much on whether Abbey is a solid last line defender, he'll do a job and a full preseason under his belt here will be interesting to see what his level is now. However if this move happens we will need to work hard on protecting him from kicks, but having said that, Jack isn't one of the leading fullbacks in the comp to bet your house on not to spill a bomb or get to a grubber.

I said it before and i'll say it again, i'm not going to die in a ditch if Sticky starts R1 with Williams and Jack at the back. I just feel that we can improve our defence by a large margin by moving Jack there and I think once they start to get that right we'll have more confidence with ball in hand too. We're clearly a confidence team that go from the penthouse to the **** 13 times in the one 80 minute game depending on where our confidence/frustration levels are. If we can get some attitude and wins in the defensive line I think it gives us the best chance to win more games.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by twistedbydesign »

Woodgers wrote: January 22, 2019, 8:25 am Agree. I made my mind up that we finally had to do something last year when we played a really solid 1st half against the Broncos as Suncorp (with Abbey at fullback) and then got run down in the 2nd half where I think Austin was targeted and at fault for 4 tries in that 40 minute period. Now obviously there was a lot leading up to that game but I recall thinking after the match that if Wighton played where Blake did that night (who did little in attack as well) we would have won in a canter. Opposition teams know how to turn us over and yes now Austin is gone but what we don't want to do it slot the equivalent in where the black hole was. If we can fix this up we don't need to rely so much on whether Abbey is a solid last line defender, he'll do a job and a full preseason under his belt here will be interesting to see what his level is now. However if this move happens we will need to work hard on protecting him from kicks, but having said that, Jack isn't one of the leading fullbacks in the comp to bet your house on not to spill a bomb or get to a grubber.

I said it before and i'll say it again, i'm not going to die in a ditch if Sticky starts R1 with Williams and Jack at the back. I just feel that we can improve our defence by a large margin by moving Jack there and I think once they start to get that right we'll have more confidence with ball in hand too. We're clearly a confidence team that go from the penthouse to the **** 13 times in the one 80 minute game depending on where our confidence/frustration levels are. If we can get some attitude and wins in the defensive line I think it gives us the best chance to win more games.
This is a pretty compelling argument. I must admit I was previously in the camp of put your best players out there and then sort out the positions - in which case my faith in Williams is higher than Abbey, meaning Jack plays fullback with Sam and Aidan in the halves - but with improving our defence the number one priority, it´s hard to argue with your logic.

Unfortunately the reality is that we´re (at least) one quality key position short going into next year, any scenario imaginable has a number of evident deficiencies. It´s fine to dance on the Austin grave but it doesn´t count for much if we can´t bring in any quality to replace him.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by LimeGreenMachine »

Cotric not focused on possible fullback switch

Nick Cotric is no guarantee to line up at fullback for Canberra in 2019 despite Jack Wighton training with the halves in the pre-season.

"I'm training on the wing at the moment and will fill in sometimes," Cotric said. "We'll have to see what Stick [Stuart] comes up with. Jack could easily slot into a halves position. He's been training there. If I get moved again I'm happy to but you've also got Oldie training well too."

Read more: https://www.nrl.com/news/2019/01/23/nic ... ck-switch/
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Coastalraider »

Sounds like no-one is actually training full time at fullback - hopefully that a good sign that Edwards will be arriving soon.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Toviii »

God you’d hope so


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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Botman »

I have to believe they know something is coming. And i think it's going to be Edwards.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Toviii »

I guess there’s always the possibility Abbey is going to be our first choice fullback


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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by greeneyed »

I can not believe Abbey is in the plans for first choice fullback. I am hoping that negotiations for Dylan Edwards to join the Raiders are continuing... despite the "official" denials.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Seiffert82 »

If Stuart ends up playing Abbey at fullback over Williams in the halves he is dead set kidding himself.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Rick »

Seiffert82 wrote:If Stuart ends up playing Abbey at fullback over Williams in the halves he is dead set kidding himself.
I can kinda see the sense in it. Focus needs to be 100% on defence.

If you go back to the old school just pick your best 13 players then yes Williams gets a gig. Now if we look at that same theory but with a defensive focus; pick your best 13 defensive players then Abby at 1 beats Sam at 7.

Ricky first and foremost should be picking the stronger defender in every position. Carry Sam on the bench for a bit of points insurance.


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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by gangrenous »

I don’t know that Abbey at 1 beats Sam at 7 defensively
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by julian87 »

I’d have been happy to retry Wighton at 6 if they were going to give Rapana an opportunity at fullback. But the current fullback options just aren’t viable to roll with it imo.

I really do like the gist of Woodgers theory but I’m just not sold on Abbey ‘doing a job’ as he suggested. That performance for Mounties in their final is burned into my brain. One of the worst individua performances I’ve seen from a pro league player.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Seiffert82 »

There is no way that Abbey at fullback is a better option than Williams in the halves. Williams has put in good performances in big games, Abbey has not. I don't care if Williams has ordinary defence, it's not unusual in the halves and the better teams can compensate for it.

Playing Abbey over Williams makes no sense. Hopefully Dylan Edwards is an option.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by LimeGreenMachine »

greeneyed wrote: January 23, 2019, 10:18 pm I can not believe Abbey is in the plans for first choice fullback. I am hoping that negotiations for Dylan Edwards to join the Raiders are continuing... despite the "official" denials.
DWZ might be fit by round 1 after knee surgery , he is going to miss the All Star game. Could the Panthers be holding out until he is cleared to play
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by simo »

Seiffert82 wrote: January 24, 2019, 8:33 am There is no way that Abbey at fullback is a better option than Williams in the halves. Williams has put in good performances in big games, Abbey has not. I don't care if Williams has ordinary defence, it's not unusual in the halves and the better teams can compensate for it.

Playing Abbey over Williams makes no sense. Hopefully Dylan Edwards is an option.
If there is any option other than having williams as your starting half then you take it. If its abbey at fullback to allow jack to play in the halves then thats what you take until rapana is back
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Botman »

simo wrote: January 24, 2019, 9:05 am
Seiffert82 wrote: January 24, 2019, 8:33 am There is no way that Abbey at fullback is a better option than Williams in the halves. Williams has put in good performances in big games, Abbey has not. I don't care if Williams has ordinary defence, it's not unusual in the halves and the better teams can compensate for it.

Playing Abbey over Williams makes no sense. Hopefully Dylan Edwards is an option.
If there is any option other than having williams as your starting half then you take it. If its abbey at fullback to allow jack to play in the halves then thats what you take until rapana is back
yeah that's my view.
Im not sure that we can be successful with Abbey at fullback, but maybe we can...
And i am fairly certain that replacing Williams with Austin is virtually maintaining the status quo, and expecting any different results from that is not something i can do.

Both bad options... but if im given the choice between a **** sandwich and a **** sub, and i already tried the **** sandwich and it was exactly as it sounds, what option do i have but to take my chances with the **** sub and see if that's not any better?
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Bennyinthewest »

Pigman wrote:
simo wrote: January 24, 2019, 9:05 am
Seiffert82 wrote: January 24, 2019, 8:33 am There is no way that Abbey at fullback is a better option than Williams in the halves. Williams has put in good performances in big games, Abbey has not. I don't care if Williams has ordinary defence, it's not unusual in the halves and the better teams can compensate for it.

Playing Abbey over Williams makes no sense. Hopefully Dylan Edwards is an option.
If there is any option other than having williams as your starting half then you take it. If its abbey at fullback to allow jack to play in the halves then thats what you take until rapana is back
yeah that's my view.
Im not sure that we can be successful with Abbey at fullback, but maybe we can...
And i am fairly certain that replacing Williams with Austin is virtually maintaining the status quo, and expecting any different results from that is not something i can do.

Both bad options... but if im given the choice between a **** sandwich and a **** sub, and i already tried the **** sandwich and it was exactly as it sounds, what option do i have but to take my chances with the **** sub and see if that's not any better?
Totally agree Pigman, just don’t ask for double meat on the **** sub


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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by zim »

As julian mentioned, I too have Abbey's Mounties performance burned into my brain. Just simply embarrassing stuff. Having him as first choice fullback is a bad call. It's like hoping the **** sandwich at the bottom of the sewage lake will taste better.

But it may be the only call we're left with.

Let's just hope someone is signed.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by boydy80 »

Personally.... I can't wait have a Cobbled together #### of a spine to start the season. Its worked pretty well for us in the past........ Wait
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Beejay »

Pigman wrote: January 23, 2019, 9:15 pm I have to believe they know something is coming. And i think it's going to be Edwards.
With this news, and with Sam Williams optimism that he will be given a shot at halfback....
I think we have missed the obvious answer that Ricky has pencilled Aiden Sezer in for the fullback spot. He tried him as a bench hooker to start 2018, and what a chance at a genius move to have our best half actually play fullback.
Watch this space.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Matt »

Beejay wrote: January 25, 2019, 8:09 am
Pigman wrote: January 23, 2019, 9:15 pm I have to believe they know something is coming. And i think it's going to be Edwards.
With this news, and with Sam Williams optimism that he will be given a shot at halfback....
I think we have missed the obvious answer that Ricky has pencilled Aiden Sezer in for the fullback spot. He tried him as a bench hooker to start 2018, and what a chance at a genius move to have our best half actually play fullback.
Watch this space.
If Mbye can do it, why not Sezer?!?
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Seiffert82 »

Time will tell if the Williams vs Abbey debate is even a thing, but IMO there I no way Abbey is a more reliable option in any aspect of the game.

Anyway, hopefully it's not even an issue.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Northern Raider »

Seiffert82 wrote: January 25, 2019, 10:19 am Time will tell if the Williams vs Abbey debate is even a thing, but IMO there I no way Abbey is a more reliable option in any aspect of the game.

Anyway, hopefully it's not even an issue.
I concur 100%. As concerning it is that Williams is our starting half I find it beyond ludicrous that Wighton to 6 and Abbey to 1 is in any way considered an upgrade. If Wighton moves into the halves it can only because we have a moderately capable fullback to replace him. Abbey has proven to be several levels below that and I have no reson the believe he's improved in the off season.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Woodgers »

I'm actually starting to think that something else is going to happen and I say that because there is talk about that 7's winger (I should learn his name) being a red hot chance at being there R1. Then there has been talk of Oldfield training strongly and he looks like he's in career best shape as well. Cotric then denied being considered for fullback so all signs point to him being the #1 come R1.

As i've said before i'm not really up for a debate on the merits of who plays where because I'm not convinced either way but what I find interesting is that Abbey is being judged from what he did on his last match for Mounties at the end of the year when he was probably busted and been on the sauce with the 1st grade squad since they got knocked out. Why isn't anyone mentioning his match he had against the Broncos on debut, he had a good game for someone playing their 1st match in 1st grade at fullback. I would've thought that the measuring stick for his game is his performances in 1st grade and I know people will come back and say he got dropped (knocked out whatever it is all a blur for me now) and we moved Cotric there, but I don't remember him being as shocking as is being portrayed here. Regardless if he has given everything all offseason and gets a chance i'm happy to give him a clean slate.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by SeeBee101 »

Woodgers wrote: January 25, 2019, 11:27 am I'm actually starting to think that something else is going to happen and I say that because there is talk about that 7's winger (I should learn his name) being a red hot chance at being there R1. Then there has been talk of Oldfield training strongly and he looks like he's in career best shape as well. Cotric then denied being considered for fullback so all signs point to him being the #1 come R1.

As i've said before i'm not really up for a debate on the merits of who plays where because I'm not convinced either way but what I find interesting is that Abbey is being judged from what he did on his last match for Mounties at the end of the year when he was probably busted and been on the sauce with the 1st grade squad since they got knocked out. Why isn't anyone mentioning his match he had against the Broncos on debut, he had a good game for someone playing their 1st match in 1st grade at fullback. I would've thought that the measuring stick for his game is his performances in 1st grade and I know people will come back and say he got dropped (knocked out whatever it is all a blur for me now) and we moved Cotric there, but I don't remember him being as shocking as is being portrayed here. Regardless if he has given everything all offseason and gets a chance i'm happy to give him a clean slate.
In that Broncos game, he was ok in the first half, then he got too nervous and started dropping the ball.

All I can keep thinking about are the couple games he spent at wing especially against Melbourne where he was found to be too slow and not strong enough to play first grade.

I am also worried that if Abbey isn't made fullback (due to Wighton to 5/8) and someone like Cotric or Oldfield goes there, he is a guaranteed starter.

I wonder why we didn't try resigning Earl considering his previous time here. He would have been a good backup...
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zim
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by zim »

Woodgers wrote: January 25, 2019, 11:27 am I'm actually starting to think that something else is going to happen and I say that because there is talk about that 7's winger (I should learn his name) being a red hot chance at being there R1. Then there has been talk of Oldfield training strongly and he looks like he's in career best shape as well. Cotric then denied being considered for fullback so all signs point to him being the #1 come R1.

As i've said before i'm not really up for a debate on the merits of who plays where because I'm not convinced either way but what I find interesting is that Abbey is being judged from what he did on his last match for Mounties at the end of the year when he was probably busted and been on the sauce with the 1st grade squad since they got knocked out. Why isn't anyone mentioning his match he had against the Broncos on debut, he had a good game for someone playing their 1st match in 1st grade at fullback. I would've thought that the measuring stick for his game is his performances in 1st grade and I know people will come back and say he got dropped (knocked out whatever it is all a blur for me now) and we moved Cotric there, but I don't remember him being as shocking as is being portrayed here. Regardless if he has given everything all offseason and gets a chance i'm happy to give him a clean slate.
Abbey's 1st match in 1st grade at fullback was for the bulldogs Round 3, March 17th 2017.
Why should his performance in a reserve grade final not be a measuring stick? He'd had enough time in 1st grade to be able to come back and if not dominate, look at least competent. Instead he pretty much single-handedly cost Mounties any chance they had of winning. Would have been better for them if he never played.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by greeneyed »

If Bailey Simonsson makes his debut Round 1, that’ll be quite a promotion for development player. But I’ve also been hearing he’s gone very well at training.
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Re: Jack Wighton set for "shock" switch in Raiders shake-up

Post by Sid »

an article comes out about shaun johnson saying he doesn't regret signing with the sharks but he is feeling a bit homesick knowing he isn't going back home and gets blasted by his fans on social media

when we sign a players cousin who nobody had heard of before as a development player we get all excited and earmark him as a starter for round 1 haha
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