Cap management
Moderator: GH Moderators
- BigPapa
- John Ferguson
- Posts: 2287
- Joined: April 10, 2013, 9:13 am
- Favourite Player: Kenny Nagas
- Location: Gold Coast
Cap management
Our salary cap is in all sorts of trouble. Without knowing players actually salaries it's hard to pin point the problem. One thing that is clear is certain players in this team are being overpaid. Which players would we be better off moving on to releive our disgraceful cap situation?
- chris83
- Brett Mullins
- Posts: 1160
- Joined: July 18, 2011, 9:44 am
- Favourite Player: Sia, hodgo, all of the magnificent b**tards!!!
- Location: in the crawlspace
Re: Cap management
Bj i think for starters, we have three centres in wighton bj and croker, bj is too much of a wildcard and probably on big money, id get him out the door first.
I've got legs, and i know how to use them
Re: Cap management
Probably all of them save for Papalii, Hodgson and maybe Whitehead
Croker too just because he’s probably got the home grown cap discount
They’ll all be overpaid relative to their position and importance
Croker too just because he’s probably got the home grown cap discount
They’ll all be overpaid relative to their position and importance
-
- John Ferguson
- Posts: 2383
- Joined: March 31, 2018, 9:30 pm
Cap management
Maybe we should just talk about keepers. My list is short though
1. Cotric - $300k
2. Hodgson - $900k
3. Whitehead - $500k
4. Tapine - $600k
5. Papilii - $800k
6. Murchie - $125k
7. Sololia - $200k
Total: $3.42m
The remaining 23 players can be shopped around far as I’m concerned
Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
1. Cotric - $300k
2. Hodgson - $900k
3. Whitehead - $500k
4. Tapine - $600k
5. Papilii - $800k
6. Murchie - $125k
7. Sololia - $200k
Total: $3.42m
The remaining 23 players can be shopped around far as I’m concerned
Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
Re: Cap management
The problem with our salary cap is we relied on some terrible intel about what the cap was going to be.
You can't gamble on something like that.
You can't gamble on something like that.
Re: Cap management
It wasnt really terrible intel. It was from the governing body. Like if your boss tells you youre going to get a pay rise you expect to get a pay rise. Because they didnt get the money they had to let Kurt Baptist go. Kurt Baptist wanted to stay but couldn't because the raiders couldn't afford his backhanded contract.
Its what happened next that is the bigger issue. Wighton was great this year while he was playing which ended up being minimal. Is he worth 900 000 a season? Was Austin worth what they offered him the first time? Wasnt it something like 700 000?
You need to ask who is agreeing to these deals on the raiders side.
Re: Cap management
Sia would be on more than 200k and no spot for Rapana?LastRaider wrote:Maybe we should just talk about keepers. My list is short though
1. Cotric - $300k
2. Hodgson - $900k
3. Whitehead - $500k
4. Tapine - $600k
5. Papilii - $800k
6. Murchie - $125k
7. Sololia - $200k
Total: $3.42m
The remaining 23 players can be shopped around far as I’m concerned
Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Raiders Review With Blake and The Pork Podcast
Listen https://soundcloud.com/blake-budak
iTunes https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/r ... 1395930852
Spotify https://open.spotify.com/show/6I7wTzqgn ... es7B1aYEgg
Listen https://soundcloud.com/blake-budak
iTunes https://podcasts.apple.com/au/podcast/r ... 1395930852
Spotify https://open.spotify.com/show/6I7wTzqgn ... es7B1aYEgg
Re: Cap management
It depends on who is on what. My feeling is we are spending far too much on our back 5 and players 14 to 30.
I think BJ is the obvious player we could move on. I love the bloke but he sums up what's wrong with our team.
I think BJ is the obvious player we could move on. I love the bloke but he sums up what's wrong with our team.
-
- John Ferguson
- Posts: 2383
- Joined: March 31, 2018, 9:30 pm
Cap management
Yeah Rapana is borderline for me at the moment. He is obvousily a good player but when we need to find salary cap room I could fill the wing spot with an up and comer.Roy Rover wrote:Sia would be on more than 200k and no spot for Rapana?LastRaider wrote:Maybe we should just talk about keepers. My list is short though
1. Cotric - $300k
2. Hodgson - $900k
3. Whitehead - $500k
4. Tapine - $600k
5. Papilii - $800k
6. Murchie - $125k
7. Sololia - $200k
Total: $3.42m
The remaining 23 players can be shopped around far as I’m concerned
Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Anyone have a guess what Sia is on?
Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
- -PJ-
- Mal Meninga
- Posts: 24835
- Joined: May 8, 2010, 1:58 pm
- Favourite Player: Josh Papalii
- Location: 416.9 km from GIO Stadium
Re: Cap management
Don says the cap is fine...all monies spent.
3rd Battalion Royal Australian Regiment..Old Faithful
#emptythetank
#emptythetank
Re: Cap management
No way you move on a player like Jordan Rapana. The club has made the right calls on who to move on so far, but I suspect you're right, there needs to be some space created for a top line half... the issue will be which year that is (as I'm not sure when they come on the market)... probably not until 2020.
Re: Cap management
No rapana?? wow
make cap space for who? you think you can just get who ever you want?
man there is some crazy talk on this site
make cap space for who? you think you can just get who ever you want?
man there is some crazy talk on this site
raider 4 life
Re: Cap management
According to Zero Tackle... five eighths and half backs off contract in 2019:
Five eighth
Blake Ayshford, Te Maire Martin, Ryan Matterson, Corey Norman, Tom Wright
Half back
Luke Brooks, Fa'amanu Brown, Nathan Cleary, Cooper Cronk, Tyson Gamble, Dean Hawkins, Ata Hingano, Trent Hodkinson, Shaun Johnson, Mason Lino, Mitchell Moses, Darren Nicholls, Connor Tracey, Sam Williams
I'll add in full back as well, given Munster is on that list...
Full back
Brad Abbey, Jesse Arthars, Matthew Dufty, Jai Field, Bevan French, Clinton Gutherson, Josh Hoffman, Valentine Holmes, Kurt Mann, Gideon Mosby-Gela, Cameron Munster, Tristan Sailor, Murray Taulagi
Who would you create room for in 2020?
This is the list for 2018... but it seems the Raiders couldn't afford anyone in any case... and the list isn't great...
Full back
Tom Carr, Mason Cerruto, Lachlan Coote, Dale Copley, Nathan Davis, Anthony Don, Jarryd Hayne, Tyrone Phillips, Tyronne Roberts-Davis, Zac Santo, Billy Slater, Dylan Smith, Young Tonumaipea
Five eighth
Alexander Brimson, Josh Cleeland, Lachlan Croker, Kane Elgey, Matt Frawley, Jack Johns, Adam Keighran, Lachlan Lam, Brock Lamb, Benji Marshall, Dean Matterson, Shaun Nona, Curtis Sironen, John Sutton
Half back
Mitch Cornish, Troy Dargan, Pita Godinet, Jackson Hastings, Christian Hazard, Ryley Jacks, Cooper Johns, Kyle Laybutt, Jarome Luai, Soni Luke, Chad O'Donnell, Johnathan Thurston, Billy Walters
Five eighth
Blake Ayshford, Te Maire Martin, Ryan Matterson, Corey Norman, Tom Wright
Half back
Luke Brooks, Fa'amanu Brown, Nathan Cleary, Cooper Cronk, Tyson Gamble, Dean Hawkins, Ata Hingano, Trent Hodkinson, Shaun Johnson, Mason Lino, Mitchell Moses, Darren Nicholls, Connor Tracey, Sam Williams
I'll add in full back as well, given Munster is on that list...
Full back
Brad Abbey, Jesse Arthars, Matthew Dufty, Jai Field, Bevan French, Clinton Gutherson, Josh Hoffman, Valentine Holmes, Kurt Mann, Gideon Mosby-Gela, Cameron Munster, Tristan Sailor, Murray Taulagi
Who would you create room for in 2020?
This is the list for 2018... but it seems the Raiders couldn't afford anyone in any case... and the list isn't great...
Full back
Tom Carr, Mason Cerruto, Lachlan Coote, Dale Copley, Nathan Davis, Anthony Don, Jarryd Hayne, Tyrone Phillips, Tyronne Roberts-Davis, Zac Santo, Billy Slater, Dylan Smith, Young Tonumaipea
Five eighth
Alexander Brimson, Josh Cleeland, Lachlan Croker, Kane Elgey, Matt Frawley, Jack Johns, Adam Keighran, Lachlan Lam, Brock Lamb, Benji Marshall, Dean Matterson, Shaun Nona, Curtis Sironen, John Sutton
Half back
Mitch Cornish, Troy Dargan, Pita Godinet, Jackson Hastings, Christian Hazard, Ryley Jacks, Cooper Johns, Kyle Laybutt, Jarome Luai, Soni Luke, Chad O'Donnell, Johnathan Thurston, Billy Walters
Re: Cap management
It's only three months until we can sign players for 2020, not that long really.
Re: Cap management
The NRL needs to take a reasonable amount of blame for the salary cap fiasco. What kind of a professional sporting organisation doesn't set the next year's salary cap until the season is over? Players need to be signed. The clubs with the most players off contract would be most effected.
- Seiffert82
- Mal Meninga
- Posts: 28126
- Joined: March 17, 2007, 12:24 pm
- Favourite Player: Bay56
Re: Cap management
With Toots and Cotric on the books, ditching Leilua is the best thing this club could do on a number of fronts.
Then we can start having a discussion about bringing in a new half to partner Sezer. I'd be happy with Luke Brooks at the right price to be honest. Munster is not a controlling half, and he sounds like a bit of a knob.
Then we can start having a discussion about bringing in a new half to partner Sezer. I'd be happy with Luke Brooks at the right price to be honest. Munster is not a controlling half, and he sounds like a bit of a knob.
Re: Cap management
All clubs were told in April last year that the cap would be 9.1 million for 2018. We had spent closer to 10m for this year already by that stage.Dr Zaius wrote: ↑July 29, 2018, 12:06 pm The NRL needs to take a reasonable amount of blame for the salary cap fiasco. What kind of a professional sporting organisation doesn't set the next year's salary cap until the season is over? Players need to be signed. The clubs with the most players off contract would be most effected.
-
- John Ferguson
- Posts: 2383
- Joined: March 31, 2018, 9:30 pm
Cap management
Yeah but GE we need to make sacrifices somewhere. He would be verging on $600k per year soon. The club needs to save money and spend money in key positions not all positionsgreeneyed wrote:No way you move on a player like Jordan Rapana. The club has made the right calls on who to move on so far, but I suspect you're right, there needs to be some space created for a top line half... the issue will be which year that is (as I'm not sure when they come on the market)... probably not until 2020.
Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
-
- John Ferguson
- Posts: 2383
- Joined: March 31, 2018, 9:30 pm
Re: Cap management
You’ve got to unload toots. He is our equivalent of Moses Mbye for the BulldogsSeiffert82 wrote:With Toots and Cotric on the books, ditching Leilua is the best thing this club could do on a number of fronts.
Then we can start having a discussion about bringing in a new half to partner Sezer. I'd be happy with Luke Brooks at the right price to be honest. Munster is not a controlling half, and he sounds like a bit of a knob.
Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
Re: Cap management
Worth noting, people have and continue to overstate the impact of our miscalculation of the salary cap
The reports indicated we had expected it to and budgeted for it to come in around 300k more than it was
300k over 10Mil is 3%
Now if you **** your budget by 3% you deserve to cop some grief about that as an administrator but in this realm of business (i.e sports salary cap budgets), getting that 3% back is very easily managed without losing much.
So that’s bad but it’s not catastrophic,
That matter was probably pretty well handled by releasing Baptiste and Turner.
it’s not the reason we’re in the **** with our cap.
The reason we’re in cap hell is we have Stuart, Mulholland and Furner offering players like Blake Austin 700k a year.
And have guys like Baptiste earning nearly 400k a year if reports were accurate
The reports indicated we had expected it to and budgeted for it to come in around 300k more than it was
300k over 10Mil is 3%
Now if you **** your budget by 3% you deserve to cop some grief about that as an administrator but in this realm of business (i.e sports salary cap budgets), getting that 3% back is very easily managed without losing much.
So that’s bad but it’s not catastrophic,
That matter was probably pretty well handled by releasing Baptiste and Turner.
it’s not the reason we’re in the **** with our cap.
The reason we’re in cap hell is we have Stuart, Mulholland and Furner offering players like Blake Austin 700k a year.
And have guys like Baptiste earning nearly 400k a year if reports were accurate
Last edited by Botman on July 29, 2018, 1:20 pm, edited 1 time in total.
- Roger Kenworthy
- Laurie Daley
- Posts: 11580
- Joined: January 7, 2005, 10:18 pm
- Favourite Player: Ruben Wiki, J-Lo, Jordan Rapana
Re: Cap management
Also a signing like Dunamis Lui on the reported terms is one that'll just prove to be an issue down the line.
At 28 he isn't improving. If it's minimum wage that's okay, but if it's a flat 3yrs that's still a guy that I'd argue would be off the pace in year 2 of that deal using up a spot we could give to a youngster.
I doubt we have competition for his signature. A one year deal with a second year option in the club's favour would be the smarter deal.
At 28 he isn't improving. If it's minimum wage that's okay, but if it's a flat 3yrs that's still a guy that I'd argue would be off the pace in year 2 of that deal using up a spot we could give to a youngster.
I doubt we have competition for his signature. A one year deal with a second year option in the club's favour would be the smarter deal.
Re: Cap management
Yeah like i said, if thats minimum wage or near enough too, ive got no issue... problem is its very unlikely to be that. A 3 year 550k a year deal is fine, but we're probably giving him 750k
- Roger Kenworthy
- Laurie Daley
- Posts: 11580
- Joined: January 7, 2005, 10:18 pm
- Favourite Player: Ruben Wiki, J-Lo, Jordan Rapana
Re: Cap management
Even on minimum it's a year too long for me. Do we really expect a bidding war for 30 year old Lui for 2021?
- -PJ-
- Mal Meninga
- Posts: 24835
- Joined: May 8, 2010, 1:58 pm
- Favourite Player: Josh Papalii
- Location: 416.9 km from GIO Stadium
Re: Cap management
Anyone suggesting we shop JordyRaps around should turn up in my driveway where you'll be slapped.
3rd Battalion Royal Australian Regiment..Old Faithful
#emptythetank
#emptythetank
Re: Cap management
No I suppose not, but if you can lock in a depth forward who you know can do a job and likely to improve (albeit very slightly) given forwards peak around 28-30, at near enough to minimum wageRoger Kenworthy wrote: ↑July 29, 2018, 1:36 pm
Even on minimum it's a year too long for me. Do we really expect a bidding war for 30 year old Lui for 2021?
I’m ok with that
But to your point, you’re far more likely to be trying to convince him to retire or move on in 2 years than you are to be looking at his contract like it’s a bargain
Re: Cap management
Look, I don’t think we should do it, but I also don’t agree that it’s that absurd
If you were taking over the club and wanted a total fresh start, one of the quickest ways to achieve cap space to get players in key positions would be to shop raps
Firstly you’d be able to find a taker and probably get out of paying any frieight
Secondly you can find good cheap reliable wingers
They won’t be game changers and match breakers like Raps, but if you’re going for a scorched earth policy, you probably don’t want that
So I don’t think it’s without merits. Again not something I’d do but it’s not a ridiculous suggestion by any means imo
- reptar
- Laurie Daley
- Posts: 16061
- Joined: January 25, 2005, 9:24 pm
- Favourite Player: Jordan Rapana
- Location: Brisbane
Re: Cap management
You're home now?-PJ- wrote:Anyone suggesting we shop JordyRaps around should turn up in my driveway where you'll be slapped.
Gina Riley: Oh, come on, John. That’s a bit old hat, the corrupt IOC delegate.
John Clarke: Old hat? Gina, in the scientific world when they see that something is happening again and again and again, repeatedly, they don’t call it old hat. They call it a pattern.
John Clarke: Old hat? Gina, in the scientific world when they see that something is happening again and again and again, repeatedly, they don’t call it old hat. They call it a pattern.
- -PJ-
- Mal Meninga
- Posts: 24835
- Joined: May 8, 2010, 1:58 pm
- Favourite Player: Josh Papalii
- Location: 416.9 km from GIO Stadium
Re: Cap management
Yes I'm home.
But be warned.. I'm putting a large dent in this carton and will take no rubbish.
Come on round..
3rd Battalion Royal Australian Regiment..Old Faithful
#emptythetank
#emptythetank
- -PJ-
- Mal Meninga
- Posts: 24835
- Joined: May 8, 2010, 1:58 pm
- Favourite Player: Josh Papalii
- Location: 416.9 km from GIO Stadium
Re: Cap management
Pig...Pigman wrote: ↑July 29, 2018, 1:48 pmLook, I don’t think we should do it, but I also don’t agree that it’s that absurd
If you were taking over the club and wanted a total fresh start, one of the quickest ways to achieve cap space to get players in key positions would be to shop raps
Firstly you’d be able to find a taker and probably get out of paying any frieight
Secondly you can find good cheap reliable wingers
They won’t be game changers and match breakers like Raps, but if you’re going for a scorched earth policy, you probably don’t want that
So I don’t think it’s without merits. Again not something I’d do but it’s not a ridiculous suggestion by any means imo
We blow.
Without Rapana..we don't win a game..ever.
3rd Battalion Royal Australian Regiment..Old Faithful
#emptythetank
#emptythetank
- yeh raiders
- Laurie Daley
- Posts: 17139
- Joined: June 21, 2008, 3:04 pm
- Favourite Player: Jack Wighton
- Location: Sydney
Re: Cap management
You can make a case for moving on from every player in the comp.... that doesn't mean the case is void of being totally ridiculous. e.g. moving Jordan Rapana on before someone like Croker. Twice the player on probably similar coin.
Last edited by yeh raiders on July 29, 2018, 5:39 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Cap management
I dont think you could. Make the case for moving on from Nathan Cleary? Kayln Ponga? James Tedesco?
Good luck
Good luck
-
- John Ferguson
- Posts: 2383
- Joined: March 31, 2018, 9:30 pm
Re: Cap management
Rapa is a great player but lacks discipline. The wing spot is an easily fill with an up and coming full back or centre junior. If the Cap is at the top like Don said and we need to find room for a good half it’s an option. You might be able to shop BJ and Rapa around as a pair-PJ- wrote:Pig...Pigman wrote: ↑July 29, 2018, 1:48 pmLook, I don’t think we should do it, but I also don’t agree that it’s that absurd
If you were taking over the club and wanted a total fresh start, one of the quickest ways to achieve cap space to get players in key positions would be to shop raps
Firstly you’d be able to find a taker and probably get out of paying any frieight
Secondly you can find good cheap reliable wingers
They won’t be game changers and match breakers like Raps, but if you’re going for a scorched earth policy, you probably don’t want that
So I don’t think it’s without merits. Again not something I’d do but it’s not a ridiculous suggestion by any means imo
We blow.
Without Rapana..we don't win a game..ever.
Ready for my slap now
Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
- gangrenous
- Laurie Daley
- Posts: 16705
- Joined: May 12, 2007, 10:42 pm
Re: Cap management
My mind reads the title as “Crap management”... which actually doesn’t change anything whatsoever...
-
- Brett Mullins
- Posts: 1473
- Joined: July 11, 2015, 5:57 pm
- Favourite Player: Laurie Daley
- Location: Canberra
Re: Cap management
Don’t like him but if we got Sidemouth we’d attract players.
- dubby
- Don Furner
- Posts: 34012
- Joined: May 16, 2006, 12:14 pm
- Favourite Player: Mal Meninga
- Location: You have never heard of it.
Re: Cap management
Nailed it, old mateSchifty wrote:The problem with our salary cap is we relied on some terrible intel about what the cap was going to be.
You can't gamble on something like that.
Sent from my SM-G950F using The Greenhouse mobile app powered by Tapatalk
The spiral of silence refers to the idea that when people fail to speak, the price of speaking rises. As the price to speak rises, still fewer speak out, which further causes the price to rise, so that fewer people yet will speak out, until a whole culture or nation is silenced. This is what happened in Germany.
If you do not speak, you are not being neutral, but are contributing to the success of the thing you refuse to name and condemn.
If you do not speak, you are not being neutral, but are contributing to the success of the thing you refuse to name and condemn.