Adam Elliott to join Newcastle Knights

[sprintman]

I guess they’ll be doing his Zoom interview from his hospital bed…

[Rickmando]

Why the clamour to sign him? Surely we can aim a bit higher than this numb nut

[Billy Walker]

I guess they’ll be doing his Zoom interview from his hospital bed…

“Why do you want to come to Canberra Adam?”

“Duh - I’m not a big fan of the heat and humidity”

[Raiders666]

Why the clamour to sign him? Surely we can aim a bit higher than this numb nut

There isn't much quality available at the moment

[Timbo]

Why the clamour to sign him? Surely we can aim a bit higher than this numb nut

The cupboard is pretty bare at the moment.

[greeneyed]

[Raiders666]

Happy with that..I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt

[greeneyed]

Canberra Raiders close to landing ex-Bulldog Adam Elliott

The Canberra Raiders are close to finalising a one-year deal with Adam Elliott and he could be onboard the Green Machine by the end of the week. Elliott's signing would leave one spot remaining in the Raiders' top 30 - depending on whether hooker Josh Hodgson shifts to the Wests Tigers.

Read more: https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/ ... /?cs=14239

[Colk]

Truly awful signing. I hope our juniors really pull us out of a fire next year because I don’t hold much hope otherwise

[Rick]

Great…

Pretty hard to get excited about our recruiting for 2022. By all reports we should have had a fair bit of money freed up and we end up with Fogarty and Elliot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[GreenMachine]

Jesus why???

[Sthsea22]

Deal about to be finalised

I guess its up to Elliott now to save his career and get himself right off field

[Rickmando]

Truly awful signing. I hope our juniors really pull us out of a fire next year because I don’t hold much hope otherwise

The only silver lining is it appears to be only one year. Honestly though, I hope he is nowhere near our first grade team (and even further from their wives!)

[Hong Kong Raider]

Great…

Pretty hard to get excited about our recruiting for 2022. By all reports we should have had a fair bit of money freed up and we end up with Fogarty and Elliot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Exactly my sentiments, though Fogarty was the best available. I haven't seen much of Hola so I'll refrain from commenting. Elliott's best game was three years ago.

The club could've used some imagination and recruited Dufty, Momorovski ($300,000 is a steal) and much better than our centres. Curtis Sironen is even better than Elliott (though would be more expensive than $200,000)

[Timbo]

He was on really good coin at the Dogs. Starting backrower money.

I know that doesn't always mean anything but it does mean that he was identified as having some very good talent at some point.

If he can be reigned in and convinced to work on his footy and not the other players wives it could be a shrewd signing.

If he continues to be a **** it's only twelve months anyway.

[Hong Kong Raider]

With Elliott, I was interested to hear Croker, Papa and Jack all gave the go ahead to sign him. What do they see in him in terms of his ability? Those two tries against us in 2017?

[Matt]

Great…

Pretty hard to get excited about our recruiting for 2022. By all reports we should have had a fair bit of money freed up and we end up with Fogarty and Elliot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Exactly my sentiments, though Fogarty was the best available. I haven't seen much of Hola so I'll refrain from commenting. Elliott's best game was three years ago.

The club could've used some imagination and recruited Dufty, Momorovski ($300,000 is a steal) and much better than our centres. Curtis Sironen is even better than Elliott (though would be more expensive than $200,000)

Fog is a great pickup. With Pearce gone, I think he is the 8th best 7 in the league. Which is much better than the 15th or 16th we had for most of last yr. Its arguably better than we had with Sezer TBH too.

Hola is going to be very solid depth at worst. Ive said it a few times, but had he not go injured early in the yr, he may well have played on the edge for the Cows. He is a 'mini Lolo', an impact forward. BIIIG unit too. I see him vs Guler as our 4th prop for next yr (Papa, Tarpz and Suttgod 1, 2, 3). Could easily become like Ola'kuato for Manly, or mature into an impact middle like a Lolo.

Dufty would have been a very handy pickup, and I was all for it. BUT, having seen Savage, maybe we have a similar player already. Dufty had to work on his ball playing initially, Savage will need to do the same.

I really like Momi, no clue why he keeps bouncing all over the league, BUT, we dont need a centre - HSS, Timoko, Kris, Croker, Hoppa, even CNK are options.

Siro is busted, thats why he spent so much of this yr not playing. So Elliot is a better move here.

[Raiders_Pat]

Fog is a great pickup. With Pearce gone, I think he is the 8th best 7 in the league. Which is much better than the 15th or 16th we had for most of last yr. Its arguably better than we had with Sezer TBH too.

Hola is going to be very solid depth at worst. Ive said it a few times, but had he not go injured early in the yr, he may well have played on the edge for the Cows. He is a 'mini Lolo', an impact forward. BIIIG unit too. I see him vs Guler as our 4th prop for next yr (Papa, Tarpz and Suttgod 1, 2, 3). Could easily become like Ola'kuato for Manly, or mature into an impact middle like a Lolo.

Dufty would have been a very handy pickup, and I was all for it. BUT, having seen Savage, maybe we have a similar player already. Dufty had to work on his ball playing initially, Savage will need to do the same.

I really like Momi, no clue why he keeps bouncing all over the league, BUT, we dont need a centre - HSS, Timoko, Kris, Croker, Hoppa, even CNK are options.

Siro is busted, thats why he spent so much of this yr not playing. So Elliot is a better move here.

Agree that this Fogarty signing is better than the Sezer signing. $500k for Sezer vs $350k for somebody who is arguably a bit better. I'm quite comfortable with opting out on Dufty. Savage looks like a good bet. Hola is a really good pick up. He has potential to be the third prop if he wants it. Sutton and Guler will have to work hard if they want to ensure their selection. There is also the option of having him share some time with Whitehead at second row if that's the balance we need. Elliott for $200k is a good pick up too. Regardless of how people rate him, $200k is squad filler money. You're doing well to get a guy with experience as a regular starter for that price.

The only thing for me is that we've cleared a lot of cap room but haven't really made the type of signing to show for it. Great value signings so far but what are we doing with the extra money? That's what I'm keen to find out.

[Matt]

Fog is a great pickup. With Pearce gone, I think he is the 8th best 7 in the league. Which is much better than the 15th or 16th we had for most of last yr. Its arguably better than we had with Sezer TBH too.

Hola is going to be very solid depth at worst. Ive said it a few times, but had he not go injured early in the yr, he may well have played on the edge for the Cows. He is a 'mini Lolo', an impact forward. BIIIG unit too. I see him vs Guler as our 4th prop for next yr (Papa, Tarpz and Suttgod 1, 2, 3). Could easily become like Ola'kuato for Manly, or mature into an impact middle like a Lolo.

Dufty would have been a very handy pickup, and I was all for it. BUT, having seen Savage, maybe we have a similar player already. Dufty had to work on his ball playing initially, Savage will need to do the same.

I really like Momi, no clue why he keeps bouncing all over the league, BUT, we dont need a centre - HSS, Timoko, Kris, Croker, Hoppa, even CNK are options.

Siro is busted, thats why he spent so much of this yr not playing. So Elliot is a better move here.

Agree that this Fogarty signing is better than the Sezer signing. $500k for Sezer vs $350k for somebody who is arguably a bit better. I'm quite comfortable with opting out on Dufty. Savage looks like a good bet. Hola is a really good pick up. He has potential to be the third prop if he wants it. Sutton and Guler will have to work hard if they want to ensure their selection. There is also the option of having him share some time with Whitehead at second row if that's the balance we need. Elliott for $200k is a good pick up too. Regardless of how people rate him, $200k is squad filler money. You're doing well to get a guy with experience as a regular starter for that price.

The only thing for me is that we've cleared a lot of cap room but haven't really made the type of signing to show for it. Great value signings so far but what are we doing with the extra money? That's what I'm keen to find out.

I'd agree with all that

[Raider47]

Fog is a great pickup. With Pearce gone, I think he is the 8th best 7 in the league. Which is much better than the 15th or 16th we had for most of last yr. Its arguably better than we had with Sezer TBH too.

Hola is going to be very solid depth at worst. Ive said it a few times, but had he not go injured early in the yr, he may well have played on the edge for the Cows. He is a 'mini Lolo', an impact forward. BIIIG unit too. I see him vs Guler as our 4th prop for next yr (Papa, Tarpz and Suttgod 1, 2, 3). Could easily become like Ola'kuato for Manly, or mature into an impact middle like a Lolo.

Dufty would have been a very handy pickup, and I was all for it. BUT, having seen Savage, maybe we have a similar player already. Dufty had to work on his ball playing initially, Savage will need to do the same.

I really like Momi, no clue why he keeps bouncing all over the league, BUT, we dont need a centre - HSS, Timoko, Kris, Croker, Hoppa, even CNK are options.

Siro is busted, thats why he spent so much of this yr not playing. So Elliot is a better move here.

Agree that this Fogarty signing is better than the Sezer signing. $500k for Sezer vs $350k for somebody who is arguably a bit better. I'm quite comfortable with opting out on Dufty. Savage looks like a good bet. Hola is a really good pick up. He has potential to be the third prop if he wants it. Sutton and Guler will have to work hard if they want to ensure their selection. There is also the option of having him share some time with Whitehead at second row if that's the balance we need. Elliott for $200k is a good pick up too. Regardless of how people rate him, $200k is squad filler money. You're doing well to get a guy with experience as a regular starter for that price.

The only thing for me is that we've cleared a lot of cap room but haven't really made the type of signing to show for it. Great value signings so far but what are we doing with the extra money? That's what I'm keen to find out.

I'd agree with all that

In terms of there being a lot of extra money left over, it makes sense to have that in a squad rebuild.

1) Presumably the club has a lot of trust in the young guys: Savage, HSS, Timoko, Morkos, Mooney, Hola, Young, Starling, Trevilyan, Kris etc.

These guys wouldn't be on massive money atm however if this rebuild is successful and the young guns succeed presumably they're going to be demanding more money. Would be an awful situation if we had no cap room to give these guys an upgrade if their performances demand it.

2) On the flipside if these blokes flop and their performances don't demand upgrades, then at least we have money to spend to upgrade them or at least have money to bring in adequate competition.

[Matt]

Fog is a great pickup. With Pearce gone, I think he is the 8th best 7 in the league. Which is much better than the 15th or 16th we had for most of last yr. Its arguably better than we had with Sezer TBH too.

Hola is going to be very solid depth at worst. Ive said it a few times, but had he not go injured early in the yr, he may well have played on the edge for the Cows. He is a 'mini Lolo', an impact forward. BIIIG unit too. I see him vs Guler as our 4th prop for next yr (Papa, Tarpz and Suttgod 1, 2, 3). Could easily become like Ola'kuato for Manly, or mature into an impact middle like a Lolo.

Dufty would have been a very handy pickup, and I was all for it. BUT, having seen Savage, maybe we have a similar player already. Dufty had to work on his ball playing initially, Savage will need to do the same.

I really like Momi, no clue why he keeps bouncing all over the league, BUT, we dont need a centre - HSS, Timoko, Kris, Croker, Hoppa, even CNK are options.

Siro is busted, thats why he spent so much of this yr not playing. So Elliot is a better move here.

Agree that this Fogarty signing is better than the Sezer signing. $500k for Sezer vs $350k for somebody who is arguably a bit better. I'm quite comfortable with opting out on Dufty. Savage looks like a good bet. Hola is a really good pick up. He has potential to be the third prop if he wants it. Sutton and Guler will have to work hard if they want to ensure their selection. There is also the option of having him share some time with Whitehead at second row if that's the balance we need. Elliott for $200k is a good pick up too. Regardless of how people rate him, $200k is squad filler money. You're doing well to get a guy with experience as a regular starter for that price.

The only thing for me is that we've cleared a lot of cap room but haven't really made the type of signing to show for it. Great value signings so far but what are we doing with the extra money? That's what I'm keen to find out.

I'd agree with all that

In terms of there being a lot of extra money left over, it makes sense to have that in a squad rebuild.

1) Presumably the club has a lot of trust in the young guys: Savage, HSS, Timoko, Morkos, Mooney, Hola, Young, Starling, Trevilyan, Kris etc.

These guys wouldn't be on massive money atm however if this rebuild is successful and the young guns succeed presumably they're going to be demanding more money. Would be an awful situation if we had no cap room to give these guys an upgrade if their performances demand it.

2) On the flipside if these blokes flop and their performances don't demand upgrades, then at least we have money to spend to upgrade them or at least have money to bring in adequate competition.

Also true, but I feel like they are saving for a big play at something

[Raiders_Pat]

Fog is a great pickup. With Pearce gone, I think he is the 8th best 7 in the league. Which is much better than the 15th or 16th we had for most of last yr. Its arguably better than we had with Sezer TBH too.

Hola is going to be very solid depth at worst. Ive said it a few times, but had he not go injured early in the yr, he may well have played on the edge for the Cows. He is a 'mini Lolo', an impact forward. BIIIG unit too. I see him vs Guler as our 4th prop for next yr (Papa, Tarpz and Suttgod 1, 2, 3). Could easily become like Ola'kuato for Manly, or mature into an impact middle like a Lolo.

Dufty would have been a very handy pickup, and I was all for it. BUT, having seen Savage, maybe we have a similar player already. Dufty had to work on his ball playing initially, Savage will need to do the same.

I really like Momi, no clue why he keeps bouncing all over the league, BUT, we dont need a centre - HSS, Timoko, Kris, Croker, Hoppa, even CNK are options.

Siro is busted, thats why he spent so much of this yr not playing. So Elliot is a better move here.

Agree that this Fogarty signing is better than the Sezer signing. $500k for Sezer vs $350k for somebody who is arguably a bit better. I'm quite comfortable with opting out on Dufty. Savage looks like a good bet. Hola is a really good pick up. He has potential to be the third prop if he wants it. Sutton and Guler will have to work hard if they want to ensure their selection. There is also the option of having him share some time with Whitehead at second row if that's the balance we need. Elliott for $200k is a good pick up too. Regardless of how people rate him, $200k is squad filler money. You're doing well to get a guy with experience as a regular starter for that price.

The only thing for me is that we've cleared a lot of cap room but haven't really made the type of signing to show for it. Great value signings so far but what are we doing with the extra money? That's what I'm keen to find out.

I'd agree with all that

In terms of there being a lot of extra money left over, it makes sense to have that in a squad rebuild.

1) Presumably the club has a lot of trust in the young guys: Savage, HSS, Timoko, Morkos, Mooney, Hola, Young, Starling, Trevilyan, Kris etc.

These guys wouldn't be on massive money atm however if this rebuild is successful and the young guns succeed presumably they're going to be demanding more money. Would be an awful situation if we had no cap room to give these guys an upgrade if their performances demand it.

2) On the flipside if these blokes flop and their performances don't demand upgrades, then at least we have money to spend to upgrade them or at least have money to bring in adequate competition.

Although you don't get extra money the following year by saving it (and you need to spend up to a certain amount of the salary cap each year). If we don't sign anybody of note, then we need to frontload contracts to make that money available in the following year, and then you can only frontload the guys who are contracted in 2023 and beyond. You're right in that we would need to save space to upgrade some of the guys mentioned but that's a 2023 problem.

[Northern Raider]

Great…

Pretty hard to get excited about our recruiting for 2022. By all reports we should have had a fair bit of money freed up and we end up with Fogarty and Elliot.

Agree our 2022 rectruitment has been a non-event, although Fogarty is OK. Elliot is only 1 year so get the feeling they are positioning themselves for bigger targets in 2023, particularly with Hodgo coming off the books. Of course there will be competition for the top talent with the Dolphins entering the comp.

[sprintman]

Fog is a great pickup. With Pearce gone, I think he is the 8th best 7 in the league. Which is much better than the 15th or 16th we had for most of last yr. Its arguably better than we had with Sezer TBH too.

Hola is going to be very solid depth at worst. Ive said it a few times, but had he not go injured early in the yr, he may well have played on the edge for the Cows. He is a 'mini Lolo', an impact forward. BIIIG unit too. I see him vs Guler as our 4th prop for next yr (Papa, Tarpz and Suttgod 1, 2, 3). Could easily become like Ola'kuato for Manly, or mature into an impact middle like a Lolo.

Dufty would have been a very handy pickup, and I was all for it. BUT, having seen Savage, maybe we have a similar player already. Dufty had to work on his ball playing initially, Savage will need to do the same.

I really like Momi, no clue why he keeps bouncing all over the league, BUT, we dont need a centre - HSS, Timoko, Kris, Croker, Hoppa, even CNK are options.

Siro is busted, thats why he spent so much of this yr not playing. So Elliot is a better move here.

Agree that this Fogarty signing is better than the Sezer signing. $500k for Sezer vs $350k for somebody who is arguably a bit better. I'm quite comfortable with opting out on Dufty. Savage looks like a good bet. Hola is a really good pick up. He has potential to be the third prop if he wants it. Sutton and Guler will have to work hard if they want to ensure their selection. There is also the option of having him share some time with Whitehead at second row if that's the balance we need. Elliott for $200k is a good pick up too. Regardless of how people rate him, $200k is squad filler money. You're doing well to get a guy with experience as a regular starter for that price.

The only thing for me is that we've cleared a lot of cap room but haven't really made the type of signing to show for it. Great value signings so far but what are we doing with the extra money? That's what I'm keen to find out.

I'd agree with all that

In terms of there being a lot of extra money left over, it makes sense to have that in a squad rebuild.

1) Presumably the club has a lot of trust in the young guys: Savage, HSS, Timoko, Morkos, Mooney, Hola, Young, Starling, Trevilyan, Kris etc.

These guys wouldn't be on massive money atm however if this rebuild is successful and the young guns succeed presumably they're going to be demanding more money. Would be an awful situation if we had no cap room to give these guys an upgrade if their performances demand it.

2) On the flipside if these blokes flop and their performances don't demand upgrades, then at least we have money to spend to upgrade them or at least have money to bring in adequate competition.

Also true, but I feel like they are saving for a big play at something

They’re saving to ward off the Dolphins.

[Billy Walker]

Agree that this Fogarty signing is better than the Sezer signing. $500k for Sezer vs $350k for somebody who is arguably a bit better. I'm quite comfortable with opting out on Dufty. Savage looks like a good bet. Hola is a really good pick up. He has potential to be the third prop if he wants it. Sutton and Guler will have to work hard if they want to ensure their selection. There is also the option of having him share some time with Whitehead at second row if that's the balance we need. Elliott for $200k is a good pick up too. Regardless of how people rate him, $200k is squad filler money. You're doing well to get a guy with experience as a regular starter for that price.

The only thing for me is that we've cleared a lot of cap room but haven't really made the type of signing to show for it. Great value signings so far but what are we doing with the extra money? That's what I'm keen to find out.

I'd agree with all that

In terms of there being a lot of extra money left over, it makes sense to have that in a squad rebuild.

1) Presumably the club has a lot of trust in the young guys: Savage, HSS, Timoko, Morkos, Mooney, Hola, Young, Starling, Trevilyan, Kris etc.

These guys wouldn't be on massive money atm however if this rebuild is successful and the young guns succeed presumably they're going to be demanding more money. Would be an awful situation if we had no cap room to give these guys an upgrade if their performances demand it.

2) On the flipside if these blokes flop and their performances don't demand upgrades, then at least we have money to spend to upgrade them or at least have money to bring in adequate competition.

Also true, but I feel like they are saving for a big play at something

They’re saving to ward off the Dolphins.

Please…. We are like Aldi brand tuna. Taking the recruits John West rejects but still dolphin friendly!

[Raiders666]

Billy please stop

[julian87]

Great…

Pretty hard to get excited about our recruiting for 2022. By all reports we should have had a fair bit of money freed up and we end up with Fogarty and Elliot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Exactly my sentiments, though Fogarty was the best available. I haven't seen much of Hola so I'll refrain from commenting. Elliott's best game was three years ago.

The club could've used some imagination and recruited Dufty, Momorovski ($300,000 is a steal) and much better than our centres. Curtis Sironen is even better than Elliott (though would be more expensive than $200,000)

I would much,much rather Timoko and HSS on way less money than Momirovski. If he played for Canterbury or Wests no one would be interested.

[Brew]

Good deal, someone on his last chance playing for his career at a small price. The deal favours the club, low risk with a potential high reward.

I don’t care much for him but when he pulls on the jersey I’ll support him.

I still remember him ripping us at ANZ Stadium in 2017


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[Billy Walker]

Good deal, someone on his last chance playing for his career at a small price. The deal favours the club, low risk with a potential high reward.

I don’t care much for him but when he pulls on the jersey I’ll support him.

I still remember him ripping us at ANZ Stadium in 2017


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

At some point you need to draw a line and define the standards your club is about. There are some players that need to be a hard no even if you were paid to play them.

[FuiFui BradBrad]

Good deal, someone on his last chance playing for his career at a small price. The deal favours the club, low risk with a potential high reward.

I don’t care much for him but when he pulls on the jersey I’ll support him.

I still remember him ripping us at ANZ Stadium in 2017


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

At some point you need to draw a line and define the standards your club is about. There are some players that need to be a hard no even if you were paid to play them.

This makes me think of a comment Cooper Cronk made when Paul Vaughan was looking for clubs.

He said Vaughan is the kind of player who bottom clubs will nab, because he can make them a top 8 side. The top 8 sides won’t be interested though, because they’ll want players with the right cultural fit to push them to a premiership.

I’m thinking Elliott is of the same ilk. You won’t see a Roosters or Storm grab him, but a side wanting to push into the 8 and do a rebuild will take the gamble.

Are we a non-top 8 side needing to take a gamble on these kind of people though?

[Rick]

I would take Paul Vaughn 10 times before I would consider Adam Elliot.


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[Finchy]

Good deal, someone on his last chance playing for his career at a small price. The deal favours the club, low risk with a potential high reward.

I don’t care much for him but when he pulls on the jersey I’ll support him.

I still remember him ripping us at ANZ Stadium in 2017


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

At some point you need to draw a line and define the standards your club is about. There are some players that need to be a hard no even if you were paid to play them.

This makes me think of a comment Cooper Cronk made when Paul Vaughan was looking for clubs.

He said Vaughan is the kind of player who bottom clubs will nab, because he can make them a top 8 side. The top 8 sides won’t be interested though, because they’ll want players with the right cultural fit to push them to a premiership.

I’m thinking Elliott is of the same ilk. You won’t see a Roosters or Storm grab him, but a side wanting to push into the 8 and do a rebuild will take the gamble.

Are we a non-top 8 side needing to take a gamble on these kind of people though?

I agree with that philosophy, but I just don’t think Elliott is the quality of player that drags us from a bottom 8 side to a top 8 side. At least Vaughan was Origin quality. I think players like a BJ or Dugan (from a few years ago, not now) are those types of players. Fairly toxic people with off field issues, but talented enough to drag a crappy team up the ladder in the short term.

[Rickmando]

Elliott is not a needle mover! Plodding forwards are a dime a dozen, so surely we can sign one with a bit more professionalism???

[Hong Kong Raider]

Great…

Pretty hard to get excited about our recruiting for 2022. By all reports we should have had a fair bit of money freed up and we end up with Fogarty and Elliot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Exactly my sentiments, though Fogarty was the best available. I haven't seen much of Hola so I'll refrain from commenting. Elliott's best game was three years ago.

The club could've used some imagination and recruited Dufty, Momorovski ($300,000 is a steal) and much better than our centres. Curtis Sironen is even better than Elliott (though would be more expensive than $200,000)

I would much,much rather Timoko and HSS on way less money than Momirovski. If he played for Canterbury or Wests no one would be interested.

Except a top club like the Roosters were interested - and they have Joey Manu, Suaalii and Billy Smith on their books. HSS and Timoko are our future. I just hope we don't play Jarrod Croker in the centres in the first round.

[Billy Walker]

Great…

Pretty hard to get excited about our recruiting for 2022. By all reports we should have had a fair bit of money freed up and we end up with Fogarty and Elliot.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Exactly my sentiments, though Fogarty was the best available. I haven't seen much of Hola so I'll refrain from commenting. Elliott's best game was three years ago.

The club could've used some imagination and recruited Dufty, Momorovski ($300,000 is a steal) and much better than our centres. Curtis Sironen is even better than Elliott (though would be more expensive than $200,000)

I would much,much rather Timoko and HSS on way less money than Momirovski. If he played for Canterbury or Wests no one would be interested.

Except a top club like the Roosters were interested - and they have Joey Manu, Suaalii and Billy Smith on their books. HSS and Timoko are our future. I just hope we don't play Jarrod Croker in the centres in the first round.

If we need to go back to Croker at any stage it is very fair to say that 2022 is not our season. He’s not getting a start in any other team in the comp.