2021 Rd 16 V Titans: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

[-PJ-]

Sams been around so long and has gone back and forth to CBR a few times.

This isn’t even 100 FG games for us is it ?

[Rickmando]

Croker, ugh. Not this again. Especially at the expense of Timoko.

Rick’s selections and insistence on his outdated style of play make this team basically unwatchable in 2021

[Bay53]

Sams been around so long and has gone back and forth to CBR a few times.

This isn’t even 100 FG games for us is it ?

It’s 100 NRL first grade games. 96 for the Raiders. He played 4 for St George Illawarra.

[-PJ-]

Sams been around so long and has gone back and forth to CBR a few times.

This isn’t even 100 FG games for us is it ?

It’s 100 NRL first grade games. 96 for the Raiders. He played 4 for St George Illawarra.

Thank you.

[BadnMean]

I have no issue with Sutton at lock. He has been good there this year.

Hopefully they have been practicing running through the defensive line at training.

Hasn't been that good there. Most one dimensional prop lock in the comp. Not necessarily his fault but shows Sticky's stubbornness and unwillingness to learn by continuing to play toilers in the 13

It's like thinking CNK is a top fullback without seeing what Trbo, Teddy, Latrell, RTS, Gutho, Paps have clear daylight between them the way the game is played... even Brimson and Laurie...

[Botman]

Sutton has been unquestionably one of our best players this year and should be in our team.
Absolute stud.

He's not a 2021 V'Landysball #13.
Prior to Vlandysball a lock was ultimately a middle forward with not a lot of difference between an 8 or 10... that has dramatically shifted. We're seeing the reintroduction of a different sort of middle forward player. Sutton is not it. He's not a 2021 lock.

[LastRaider]

Croker in for Timoko. Back to 2019 we go. Titans by 14

[Billy Walker]

Out of curiosity have we got Timoko locked into a decent contract?

[Raiders_Pat]

hoping that this is just a part of what needs to be done for us to reach the inevitable outcome...

I think it is but you can never be too sure with this club.

It never plays out straightforward when it comes to our club. It's always a weird curve ball.

[greeneyed]

Out of curiosity have we got Timoko locked into a decent contract?

End 2022.

https://thegh.com.au/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 70#p115470

[Raiders_Pat]

Out of curiosity have we got Timoko locked into a decent contract?

End 2022.

https://thegh.com.au/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 70#p115470

Surely you'd be looking at locking him in for a couple more years before he hits the market

[Billy Walker]

Out of curiosity have we got Timoko locked into a decent contract?

End 2022.

https://thegh.com.au/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 70#p115470

Surely you'd be looking at locking him in for a couple more years before he hits the market

Thanks GE -

Raiders Pat - agree it would be good to lock him in longer but I don’t imagine it would be in his interests to sign beyond this till he has the chance to establish himself and see what he is worth.

[gerg]

Good luck to our club captain in his return game.

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[Billy Walker]

Good luck to our club captain in his return game.

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Good luck to us all

[GreenMachine]

Out of curiosity have we got Timoko locked into a decent contract?

End 2022.

https://thegh.com.au/forum/viewtopic.ph ... 70#p115470

Surely you'd be looking at locking him in for a couple more years before he hits the market

Now why would we go do something as rational as that?
I mean, the ink is barely dry on that spring chicken Croker’s contract…

[afgtnk]

Sutton has been unquestionably one of our best players this year and should be in our team.
Absolute stud.

He's not a 2021 V'Landysball #13.
Prior to Vlandysball a lock was ultimately a middle forward with not a lot of difference between an 8 or 10... that has dramatically shifted. We're seeing the reintroduction of a different sort of middle forward player. Sutton is not it. He's not a 2021 lock.

I was going to make a thread about this before, but for me I think the time has come to move Elliott there. As per Vlandysball, I think his lateral movement in defence is struggling a bit, and he's been found wanting.

Conversely, I think his ability with ball in hand is wasted being restricted to one side of the field. At the same time, we've set him to play slow and predictable block plays almost exclusively with Jack, with further negates the ability to has to play what's in front of him.

He's always been a strong line runner in terms of his intelligence and the way he adapts to the defensive line, but in today's game probably doesn't quite have the athleticism and speed to take full advantage of it. I'd really like the club to look at signing a new fast and agile edge player at some point in this next six months to a year and move Elliot to 13.

[GreenMachine]

We are really a stupid club when it comes to how we operate…
I don’t know why we think or expect nice things.

[GreenMachine]

Sutton has been unquestionably one of our best players this year and should be in our team.
Absolute stud.

He's not a 2021 V'Landysball #13.
Prior to Vlandysball a lock was ultimately a middle forward with not a lot of difference between an 8 or 10... that has dramatically shifted. We're seeing the reintroduction of a different sort of middle forward player. Sutton is not it. He's not a 2021 lock.

I was going to make a thread about this before, but for me I think the time has come to move Elliott there. As per Vlandysball, I think his lateral movement in defence is struggling a bit, and he's been found wanting.

Conversely, I think his ability with ball in hand is wasted being restricted to one side of the field. At the same time, we've set him to play slow and predictable block plays almost exclusively with Jack, with further negates the ability to has to play what's in front of him.

He's always been a strong line runner in terms of his intelligence and the way he adapts to the defensive line, but in today's game probably doesn't quite have the athleticism and speed to take full advantage of it. I'd really like the club to look at signing a new fast and agile edge player at some point in this next six months to a year and move Elliot to 13.

Everything you have said I agree with, however Elliot defending in the middle is a liability.

[afgtnk]

Personally I think he's more than fine in the middle. He's still got enough agility and athleticism to be quite effective there, and chances of being isolated in the middle are much reduced compared to the edge. Add to that he's always been a hard worker.

Having two dynamic ball runners on either edge gives the attack a better symmetry I feel. In this day and age you've got to look it spread it wide early and have players capable of making solid dents in yardage when you do, as opposed to rucking it out only in the middle third where there's limited space (i.e. what we do). Yardage has just never been Elliott's game.

[Finchy]

Croker in for Timoko. Back to 2019 we go. Titans by 14

Grand finalists?

[gangrenous]

I’d be interested to see alphabet’s idea with Whitehead.

Even if it sucked it would show that the team is experimenting with ways to adapt, instead of this stupid arrogance that sticking to their systems will bring back wins.

[Botman]

Sutton has been unquestionably one of our best players this year and should be in our team.
Absolute stud.

He's not a 2021 V'Landysball #13.
Prior to Vlandysball a lock was ultimately a middle forward with not a lot of difference between an 8 or 10... that has dramatically shifted. We're seeing the reintroduction of a different sort of middle forward player. Sutton is not it. He's not a 2021 lock.

I was going to make a thread about this before, but for me I think the time has come to move Elliott there. As per Vlandysball, I think his lateral movement in defence is struggling a bit, and he's been found wanting.

Conversely, I think his ability with ball in hand is wasted being restricted to one side of the field. At the same time, we've set him to play slow and predictable block plays almost exclusively with Jack, with further negates the ability to has to play what's in front of him.

He's always been a strong line runner in terms of his intelligence and the way he adapts to the defensive line, but in today's game probably doesn't quite have the athleticism and speed to take full advantage of it. I'd really like the club to look at signing a new fast and agile edge player at some point in this next six months to a year and move Elliot to 13.

Interestingly he's played very limited time in lock for us and each time he did i thought he was one of the best players on the park, i remember many moons back floating the idea of him being the lock and having Tapine out on the edge... probably worked out for the best going with Tapine in the middle but my general philosophy is the more Whitehead touches the footy, the better.

I think the two i think are most suited to V'landysball is Whitehead and Havilii
I wouldnt be opposed to trialing either, or both.... as gangers alluded to, what else is there to do in season 2021 but to start trying things to see what we can take into 2022

[BadnMean]

That could work from a squad perspective. I have no problems with Elliots defence in the middle.

He did play well there for us for a few games- but then it came to look like the workload vs the big boys was wearing him down. That was under the old, bash and grind style of footy. The middles are smaller now (he fits right in, even bigger than plenty of locks) and less bash and grind. So I think he'd do a good job.

Elliot + Havilii is interesting, assuming Hodgo goes to Bronco's. Gives us cover for STarling if needed + he is an offload threat so we trade 1 style of ball playing threat for another kind (offloads) when we switch. Havilii would need to size down a few kg and get fitter. He looked gassed after 2 touches every time he played this year and his output was poor as a result. Hasn't looked like himself. I do remember articles years back saying he had stopped training to play 80 and was focussing on size and power to be an impact bench forward with hooking as a the sideline.

[gerg]

I’d be interested to see alphabet’s idea with Whitehead.

Even if it sucked it would show that the team is experimenting with ways to adapt, instead of this stupid arrogance that sticking to their systems will bring back wins.

Nah Ricky's going to roll with 6 middles (essentially props) in the 17 until V'landys changes the rules again. Then we'll be OK.

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[papabear]

Yeah I like the whitehead to the middle idea.

Right now though we have way to much of our cap locked up in the middle with two props and two benches covered by
- papa
- lui
- James
- Corey
- Sia
- emre
- Sutton
- tapine

All would be on decent coin…

Really only need 4 quality middles and then some young benchies to cover…

By contrast our second rower stocks are very thin…

[Raiders_Pat]

Yeah I like the whitehead to the middle idea.

Right now though we have way to much of our cap locked up in the middle with two props and two benches covered by
- papa
- lui
- James
- Corey
- Sia
- emre
- Sutton
- tapine

All would be on decent coin…

Really only need 4 quality middles and then some young benchies to cover…

By contrast our second rower stocks are very thin…

I've mentioned this before but that's why I think it wouldn't hurt if we let one or two on that list go if we need to and bring in a second rower. It's pretty much a no brainer when you're looking at how to best upgrade our team.

[BadnMean]

Yeah I like the whitehead to the middle idea.

Right now though we have way to much of our cap locked up in the middle with two props and two benches covered by
- papa
- lui
- James
- Corey
- Sia
- emre
- Sutton
- tapine

All would be on decent coin…

Really only need 4 quality middles and then some young benchies to cover…

By contrast our second rower stocks are very thin…

Of those Sia will probably hang them up, Corey should be let to explore his options for 2022 + beyond, Lui can be let go.


Leaves us with
Papa - James - Emre- Sutton- Tapine + young guys (Medlyn, O'Donnell, Rushton).
+ Whitehead, Young, Havilii who are all versatile players as legitimate middle options. That's plenty imo.

I'm assuming Hodgo might go, Tapine is unsettled but signed long term and probably stays once the club rights the ship.

Let those 3 go, recruit an edge to the squad- or mobile/skilled lock if Whitehead and Young are still considered edges.

[Botman]

That could work from a squad perspective. I have no problems with Elliots defence in the middle.

He did play well there for us for a few games- but then it came to look like the workload vs the big boys was wearing him down. That was under the old, bash and grind style of footy. The middles are smaller now (he fits right in, even bigger than plenty of locks) and less bash and grind. So I think he'd do a good job.

Elliot + Havilii is interesting, assuming Hodgo goes to Bronco's. Gives us cover for STarling if needed + he is an offload threat so we trade 1 style of ball playing threat for another kind (offloads) when we switch. Havilii would need to size down a few kg and get fitter. He looked gassed after 2 touches every time he played this year and his output was poor as a result. Hasn't looked like himself. I do remember articles years back saying he had stopped training to play 80 and was focussing on size and power to be an impact bench forward with hooking as a the sideline.

Yeah if Havilii was going to be used in that role, he'd need to lose a bit of weight and get super fit
i mentioned it a few weeks ago but if you look at what Brandon Smith does for the Storm @13, i dont think you have to squint too hard to see Havilii being potentially a poor mans version of that

[Raiders_Pat]

Of those Sia will probably hang them up, Corey should be let to explore his options for 2022 + beyond, Lui can be let go.


Leaves us with
Papa - James - Emre- Sutton- Tapine + young guys (Medlyn, O'Donnell, Rushton).
+ Whitehead, Young, Havilii who are all versatile players as legitimate middle options. That's plenty imo.

I'm assuming Hodgo might go, Tapine is unsettled but signed long term and probably stays once the club rights the ship.

Let those 3 go, recruit an edge to the squad- or mobile/skilled lock if Whitehead and Young are still considered edges.

I know people like splitting the two up but I think ideally I'd be running out with our two best props, Papa + Tapine, with Whitehead at lock. Two bench spots would be between Sutton, Guler and James, one would be between Young, Havili and maybe Rushton if he's ready... and the younger guys would be competing for a spot. Then you'd have CHN and a recruit on the edges. There are some good backrowers who will be off contract after this year and next year.

[zim]

Even if we're not moving Whitehead to lock I think the time's going to come soon where we need to look at the 3 second row rotation. The game's speeding up and he's not getting any younger.

[Canberra Milk]

Looking at the bench too, three big boppa props and a hooker, who'll likely get 5-10 minutes only...

Where's the backrow cover? Ricky is just such a slow adopter. "Stubborn". I don't get it

[greeneyed]

[Sid]

At the start of the year one of my bold predictions was that Hudson Young would very much be in the frame for a Blues jersey.. it's a shame he's not making firsts.

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[afgtnk]

I think people got way too ahead of themselves with Young, based on that small patch of form last season (albeit very high quality).

Most forwards bar Sutton have struggled this season so I'll reserve more judgement until they all improve along with the team, but I feel like this is regression to the mean for him too.

To me he's trapped between two positions at the moment, not being good enough for either, but his shot is gonna have to be the middle.

[Mickey_Raider]

I think people got way too ahead of themselves with Young, based on that small patch of form last season (albeit very high quality).

Most forwards bar Sutton have struggled this season so I'll reserve more judgement until they all improve along with the team, but I feel like this is regression to the mean for him too.

To me he's trapped between two positions at the moment, not being good enough for either, but his shot is gonna have to be the middle.

Fans will routinely overrate their own players and Young was no different.

People were locking in Seb Kris as our starting centre for the next decade based on about a month of FG level play against average teams such as Tigers, Sharks and Titans.