POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

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Who join Josh Papalii at starting prop in 2021?

Emre Guler
4
17%
Corey Horsburgh
3
13%
Ryan James
4
17%
Dunamis Lui
10
43%
Sia Soliola
1
4%
Ryan Sutton
1
4%
Hudson Young
0
No votes
 
Total votes: 23

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greeneyed
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POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by greeneyed »

POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

What's your strongest possible 2021 Canberra Raiders line up? That's what we are asking the readers of The Greenhouse. We're looking at the "Locks and contenders" for each position in the team in a special series of articles. Some players have clearly locked down their spot but we're looking at all the contenders for places in the Green Machine's top 17. For contentious positions, we're supplementing the discussion with a series of polls... and in the third of those polls, we're asking: Who should join Josh Papalii as a starting prop in 2021?

We're taking Big Papa to be a "lock" on the No. 8 jersey, first forward picked, if not the first player. We will also be locking in Joe Tapine at No. 13... but if you want to vote for him here, list him in the thread.

Remember, we're looking at the strongest possible team, irrespective of injuries.

Click here to read more: Locks and contenders: Props

You have ONE vote in this poll and you may change your vote.
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Wiki Special
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Wiki Special »

Tapine.
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-PJ-
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by -PJ- »

This is extremely tough for a lot of reasons.

There’s upside with all these boys.

Getting the starters/bench rotation right for how we want to play is important.

I’m on the fence.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Cranky Old Man »

Current starting prop in the form of his life, last game played was in a winning origin game, I think Lui deserves to start the year as prop, BUT there are plenty of big dogs barking at his heels, hold his form or off to the Gungahlin Bulls.
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BJ
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by BJ »

I’m starting with Lui because he finished the season extremely well and he is excellent defensively on the line and in stopping offloads.

But as long as Guler and Horsburgh come back from injury well, train strongly and return to form, I expect them to be in the starting team by seasons end.

But Lui holds his spot until someone takes it. I would feel the same if the roles were reversed and Lui had been injured through 2020. Stuart sticks solid with players who performing on and off the field. Plus Lui is Papa’s best mate.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Matt »

Ive gone with Lui, as I think he deserves 1st crack after last yr. If im honest, I'd rather the young brigade. Just not sure which way around I'd pick them.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by simo »

Tapine and Papa up front. I think front row rotation suits tapine better for game time than lock at this point.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Matt »

simo wrote: January 11, 2021, 6:57 pm Tapine and Papa up front. I think front row rotation suits tapine better for game time than lock at this point.
Its just a number, but I agree with the meaning
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by simo »

Matt wrote: January 11, 2021, 7:01 pm
simo wrote: January 11, 2021, 6:57 pm Tapine and Papa up front. I think front row rotation suits tapine better for game time than lock at this point.
Its just a number, but I agree with the meaning
Fully aware of that, but you know what i mean rotationally.
I think lock is rotated with an edge initially. Chn and young both spending time on the edge with young also spending time in the middle
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Seiffert82 »

If James gets back to his best it's a toss-up between him and Guler IMO.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Matt »

Seiffert82 wrote: January 16, 2021, 8:21 am If James gets back to his best it's a toss-up between him and Guler IMO.
If you look at the props/middles, outside of Papa and Tapine, we possess, and assess their game strengths:
Lui - defence
James - motor, aggression come grubbiness
Sia - experience, intangibles
Horse - motor, aggression
Guler - big body impact
Young - footwork/speed, workrate
Sutton - motor, fearless, workmate
Then I'd argue Guler is best suited to the bench 1st/2nd change impact role
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Seiffert82 »

Matt wrote: January 16, 2021, 8:03 pm
Seiffert82 wrote: January 16, 2021, 8:21 am If James gets back to his best it's a toss-up between him and Guler IMO.
If you look at the props/middles, outside of Papa and Tapine, we possess, and assess their game strengths:
Lui - defence
James - motor, aggression come grubbiness
Sia - experience, intangibles
Horse - motor, aggression
Guler - big body impact
Young - footwork/speed, workrate
Sutton - motor, fearless, workmate
Then I'd argue Guler is best suited to the bench 1st/2nd change impact role
I like James. He is aggressive, but also has that footwork and skill to provide a bit of X factor in the middle. He reminds me of Vaughan. You don't score that many tries in that position without being smart. Papa, Tapine and James could be a real handful.

Guler is destined to start eventually, but I really love the idea of him coming off the bench and terrorising the opposition's second unit. He's still young and has plenty of time to develop his game.

I'm happy with whoever though. Guler, Lui, James, Sutton. They all have their benefits.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Botman »

I've got three absolute musts in the front row (Tapine is a middle also and is a lock at... well lock):

Papalii,Guler, Young
Those are IMO the best three middles in our team... Paps is Paps. Nothing more to needs to be said.
I feel very strongly about Young playing from the bench and being used as an impact middle who also doubles up as an ingame servicable edge should one of our back rowers need to come off for some reason.
Guler i am genuinely torn on re: starting vs bench, it doesnt worry me greatly. I think both ideas have merit. But he's locked in to my 17. Absolutely locked. He's such a impressive young footballer

The 4th middle? That gets tough for me. Hors is my answer because his ceiling is incredibly high and i like that sort of player off the bench... I think all 4 of those named are objectively better footballers, with higher ceilings than any of Lui, Sia and James... But i dont think there is any chance those guys arent in line for playing time for Ricky's team. He's a veteran players coach. Injury and suspension will help make these decisions easier for Stuart. But i have GRAVE concerns about what happens if we get lucky on that front and where we are at with Guler/Young/Hors in 12 months time if 1,2 or even 3 have been "devalued" by coach in favour of aging vets
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by afgtnk »

If we lose any of them, or even all of them, due to over stacking then so be it. It's a problem Ricky would have created.

I'm not gonna lose too much sleep seeing middle forwards go, unless it's Papalii or maybe Tapine. They're a dime a dozen. We've got at least eight who either now or throughout their careers have been considered rep quality, or close to. Eight. Yet we battled to find a guy worthy of wearing the coach's old 7 jersey for over 20 years.

That a guy like Hudson Young can go from a serviceable (at best) second rower to a game breaker moving inwards tell me enough of what I need to know about the position.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Botman »

Hard disagree... losing all three given our "overstacked" situation is built around Papalii who might be gone sooner than we all think, Lui who is already 31, James who will be 30 this year coming off 2 years lay off and back to back ACL's, and Sia who is THIRTY FOUR... mother mary!

I know we're in a "win now" mode, so sure if those young guys drop off, and the old guys step up. Cool, play them.. but if all players continue along their current trajectories, Guler, Young and Hors are the three best middle forwards after Papalii and Tapine.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by afgtnk »

Although the likely reality is that we won't lose all of them, if we do lose them, we'll just find others just as easy. If you said a few seasons ago that by now we would've lost Vaughan, Boyd, and Paulo by now, they'd think something would be seriously wrong as a result, that we completely **** up. What happened? We did fine. They were all replaced.

I think guys like Horsburgh and Guler are fine young players, but they're not real elite talents. They may make rep football and become mainstays. It's a toss of a coin at the moment, not a 'matter of when' situation. I don't see them as destined for it.

We can't go forward with the mentality that we're gonna keep all of our forwards and have this big high quality middle rotation.... we've made that mistake before. It cost us. Nor can we think we will or should keep every talented player outside of our spine. That thinking is dated and belongs in the past, right where other teams have left it.

Guys like Jack, George, Hodgo are the priorities in the squad. Whatever happens to any of the rest can be dealt with, as history shows with plenty of other teams. If we want to experience sustained success, it's those middle forwards that have to be the first to make way when others teams come knocking on their door with bigger contracts than what we can muster.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by BJ »

Agree with both you guys that the young guys are our future, however contract rates on the forwards outside of Papa and Tapine are the key to our ongoing success.

An older experienced forward playing good football on 250k is better than a young developing forward on $450k.

Wouldn’t surprise me that Lui gets a reasonable payday from another club for his final playing contract and Sia retires end season.

This coming season, may the best man win their preferred position.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by -PJ- »

Hors, Young and Guler are still very young..there’s our next 3-5 yrs.

This is tough. I don’t think Stick bought RJames here to play reggies. Sia gives his all and Lui is a SOO rep.

And there’s Sutton as well.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Matt »

Botman wrote: January 16, 2021, 8:45 pm I've got three absolute musts in the front row (Tapine is a middle also and is a lock at... well lock):

Papalii,Guler, Young
Those are IMO the best three middles in our team... Paps is Paps. Nothing more to needs to be said.
I feel very strongly about Young playing from the bench and being used as an impact middle who also doubles up as an ingame servicable edge should one of our back rowers need to come off for some reason.
Guler i am genuinely torn on re: starting vs bench, it doesnt worry me greatly. I think both ideas have merit. But he's locked in to my 17. Absolutely locked. He's such a impressive young footballer

The 4th middle? That gets tough for me. Hors is my answer because his ceiling is incredibly high and i like that sort of player off the bench... I think all 4 of those named are objectively better footballers, with higher ceilings than any of Lui, Sia and James... But i dont think there is any chance those guys arent in line for playing time for Ricky's team. He's a veteran players coach. Injury and suspension will help make these decisions easier for Stuart. But i have GRAVE concerns about what happens if we get lucky on that front and where we are at with Guler/Young/Hors in 12 months time if 1,2 or even 3 have been "devalued" by coach in favour of aging vets
Agreed
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Matt »

BJ wrote: January 17, 2021, 6:24 am Agree with both you guys that the young guys are our future, however contract rates on the forwards outside of Papa and Tapine are the key to our ongoing success.

An older experienced forward playing good football on 250k is better than a young developing forward on $450k.

Wouldn’t surprise me that Lui gets a reasonable payday from another club for his final playing contract and Sia retires end season.

This coming season, may the best man win their preferred position.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Matt »

-PJ- wrote: January 17, 2021, 7:25 am Hors, Young and Guler are still very young..there’s our next 3-5 yrs.

This is tough. I don’t think Stick bought RJames here to play reggies. Sia gives his all and Lui is a SOO rep.

And there’s Sutton as well.
Poor Sutto looks the odd man out again. He is a top 17 player at so many clubs.

I agree RE the other 3.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by Seiffert82 »

Young most likely fills one bench spot to cover both second row and middles. I still think he can be a top quality second rower with those games last year under his belt.

It will surprise me if Soliola gets a gig unless there are injuries. Hors won't be fit to start the season. That leaves James, Guler, Sutton and Lui to fill 3 middles behind Papa and Taps.

Pretty good spot for us to be in.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by greeneyed »

All the polls for starting team positions will close at 11:59pm AEDT tonight (Monday). Last chance to vote!
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by greeneyed »

Dunamis Lui takes out this poll.
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Re: POLL: Strongest 2020 line up: Props

Post by BadnMean »

Well done Dunamis. Most of us had him missing out on our 17 at this time last year. Now he's become 2nd prop picked.
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