2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

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Who will win?

Raiders 13+
1
10%
Raiders 1-12
7
70%
Storm 1-12
0
No votes
Storm 13+
2
20%
 
Total votes: 10

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Kryptonite
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Kryptonite »

Green_Hammock wrote: October 16, 2020, 8:55 pm Feeling very down after this game. As I thought after the Sharks game, if we start slow like that then it's gonna cost us, and it did.
No need to feel down mate, we have a Premiership window that will be open for a few more seasons and we have the roster and the will, in the end fatigue via all the extra travel and some inconsistant early form cost us, 2021, Bring it on i say!
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Kryptonite »

Is it wrong to feel relieved that we wont lose two GFs in a row?
I think that even if we managed to come back and win from that we would not have the legs for a GF, particularly against the Panthers, i have been thinking about 2021 since July TBH
Does anyone else feel this way now?
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pickles
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by pickles »

Really disappointing way to end the season. Ricky nailed it in his presser. We were well below our best and the Storm blew us off the park with an incredibly fast start that we never made it back from.

The performance was much more disappointing than the result. It is so hard to make it to a prelim it grand final that you really want to make sure that you win them and the players will be disappointed with what they put out there last night. I know that I was.

Our team will look different next year but we still have a solid core with big game experience and I have no doubt we will be playing finals footy next year.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Northern Raider »

Kryptonite wrote: October 17, 2020, 7:13 am Is it wrong to feel relieved that we wont lose two GFs in a row?
I think that even if we managed to come back and win from that we would not have the legs for a GF, particularly against the Panthers, i have been thinking about 2021 since July TBH
Does anyone else feel this way now?
I said something similar during the game. That if we did manage to come back and win this game we’d be roadkill next week. In context I think it’s easier to cop a preliminary final exit than be a 2 time GF loser.

We’ll be back next year and give it a real good shake.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Kryptonite »

amiafish wrote: October 16, 2020, 10:53 pm In 2020, our outstanding halves + Papa and Taps have papered over the awful truth...we are a middling side, playing a gormless, soulless brand of football.
Our coach is an infuriating confection of outstanding man management coupled with dour tactical conservatism.
Our team defends with tenacity, but attacks with myopia.
Our outside backs are either inept, inexperienced, or decrepit...and nary a suggestion of speed in any of the back five.
This team needs to look to the future. Bleeding green will not suffice thrice to elevate us to the summit of preliminary final. We need speed, youth, and a refreshed game plan that reveals, rather than conceals, the latent talents of our skilled players.
With the excellent, and conspicuously professional English half in our fold for a while longer, we must seize the opportunity to explore the limits of our talent, and to resist the temptation to once more go to the well of one-out smash ball.
Please, Ricky, please.
I am using Google to convert this commentary into Straylian
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by radicalraider »

Kryptonite wrote: October 17, 2020, 7:29 am
amiafish wrote: October 16, 2020, 10:53 pm In 2020, our outstanding halves + Papa and Taps have papered over the awful truth...we are a middling side, playing a gormless, soulless brand of football.
Our coach is an infuriating confection of outstanding man management coupled with dour tactical conservatism.
Our team defends with tenacity, but attacks with myopia.
Our outside backs are either inept, inexperienced, or decrepit...and nary a suggestion of speed in any of the back five.
This team needs to look to the future. Bleeding green will not suffice thrice to elevate us to the summit of preliminary final. We need speed, youth, and a refreshed game plan that reveals, rather than conceals, the latent talents of our skilled players.
With the excellent, and conspicuously professional English half in our fold for a while longer, we must seize the opportunity to explore the limits of our talent, and to resist the temptation to once more go to the well of one-out smash ball.
Please, Ricky, please.
I am using Google to convert this commentary into Straylian
Genius stuff kyrpto.. also papalii in our fold for another 3 yrs max.. ricky needs to make changes to our players in the backs and game style
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Boomercm »

That was disappointing. Reminded me of the Penrith game where it was all over after 25mins. Just blew us off the park with fast play and accurately targeting our weak spots.

But we were tired and had 6 of our top 18 players out injured. 6 of 18! To be a top 4 side given that stat is pretty amazing. It would have been a miracle to have have won it this year.

Agree we could use more speed and a bit of a freshen up in the backs. But there is no major reconstruction required. Just a tweak here and there.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by mick63 »

This whole NRL season should have an asterisk affixed to it.
The unevenness of travel ,draw has had an immeasurable impact on some clubs while inversely favouring others.
We all know that.
So while I am disappointed about last night I couldn’t be more proud of how they represented the jumper.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by mick63 »

Question wrote: October 17, 2020, 6:44 am Unfortanately i think the game has passed Mr Croker head gear and all... he does not have the raw power, size or strength of the new brigade, could have hung around forever if it was the early 80S mid 90S though.

There is definitely a call to be made.Probably by Jarrod himself.I can’t see Ricky removing a club stalwart,that would be too close to the bone considering how he departed the Raiders.
He alluded to being the worst of the 17 against the roosters.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by radicalraider »

mick63 wrote: October 17, 2020, 8:11 am
Question wrote: October 17, 2020, 6:44 am Unfortanately i think the game has passed Mr Croker head gear and all... he does not have the raw power, size or strength of the new brigade, could have hung around forever if it was the early 80S mid 90S though.

There is definitely a call to be made.Probably by Jarrod himself.I can’t see Ricky removing a club stalwart,that would be too close to the bone considering how he departed the Raiders.
He alluded to being the worst of the 17 against the roosters.
The unselfish decision from Croker would be to retire. Wont happen.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Mullins_y2k »

Start 2021 like this...

1. CNK
2. Simonson - underrated
3. Croker - must improve or move on
4. Scott - Will be much better
5. Rapana - 3 games to prove he's not past it.

I'm not too worried about that since we have Caleb Aekins, Timoko, Valemi, and HSS waiting to replace whoever is playing ****. There's a solid 5 out of those 9... But buying one speedy proven game breaker would be great now that we lost Cotric.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by raiderskater »

Of course people are slamming on Croker. Yeah, he missed that one tackle which was not great, but he was okay in defense otherwise I thought. And at least him and Valemei looked like they were communicating and at least trying in attack.

I was absolutely disgusted with Bateman, Cotric and Rapana. They honestly looked like three guys who'd met each other for the first time in a pub earlier that day and decided to play. There were no communication and all three of them were guilty of not throwing passes that would have ended in certain tries. This is where the majority of the ire should be directed.

*

Regardless, I'm still proud of the team. When Hodgo went down everyone said we were toast. When we lost so many to injury everyone said it was impossible. And yet we still came within a whisker of making our second GF in a row. It was just a stretch too far this year. We pulled off so many miracles, so many impossibles, and so many saves that we finally reached into the bag and came up empty.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by T_R »

RS, I've never said a bad word on Croker, but he was lost last night. He was too slow and outmuscled each and every time he was involved. He was constantly scrambling to keep in the game, and even when he made the tackles it was by the akin of his teeth - a grabbed ankle, or a handful of jersey.

I knew he'd been struggling, but until last night I didn't realise how badly.

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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Seiffert82 »

Ultimately we played 5 minutes of complete trash which conceded 18 points. Other than that, the score was 10-12 and we butchered quite a few scoring opportunities and were denied a couple more.

All things considered, we were outplayed when it mattered, but we were far from disgraced during the majority of the game. We just looked cooked early. The travel situation can't have helped our prep.

No time to throw the baby out with the bath water. One or two new players, with Hodgo, Guler, Sutto and Simon etc back and we'll be OK. I even expect Scott to be better next season if Stick holds onto him.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by benda »

While it is disappointing we should remember ehat happened was realistic.
The travel would have killed the players. Cant play footy by travelling in and out on the same day.
We had injuries too.
And we were outplayed by a fresh side.

I wouldnt overthink this. Back to drawing board for 2021.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by jimmy82 »

Mullins_y2k wrote: October 17, 2020, 8:14 am Start 2021 like this...

1. CNK
2. Simonson - underrated
3. Croker - must improve or move on
4. Scott - Will be much better
5. Rapana - 3 games to prove he's not past it.

I'm not too worried about that since we have Caleb Aekins, Timoko, Valemi, and HSS waiting to replace whoever is playing ****. There's a solid 5 out of those 9... But buying one speedy proven game breaker would be great now that we lost Cotric.
Yep this exactly that would be my starting 5
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Seiffert82 »

Stuart and Toots will have to have a few frank conversations over the offseason. He's really struggling out there, Darius Boyd level.

And I've backed Croker for years.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Old School Green »

T_R wrote: October 17, 2020, 8:25 am RS, I've never said a bad word on Croker, but he was lost last night. He was too slow and outmuscled each and every time he was involved. He was constantly scrambling to keep in the game, and even when he made the tackles it was by the akin of his teeth - a grabbed ankle, or a handful of jersey.

I knew he'd been struggling, but until last night I didn't realise how badly.

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Yeh felt the same. Looked like he was barely hanging on last night. It’s been that way for a couple of games.
Having a rookie outside him means that he hasn't had that quick pass fluency he has had when it was Cotric or Raps outside him.
I suspect the whole Semi factor has played a role in that he probably lacks confidence in him; knows they are targeting; is thinking about positioning to assist for the 5th tackle kick invariably coming Semi’s way etc.
All possible but fact is he’s been noticeably off the pace last few games.
Maybe it’s a big year; personally too with new bub etc....but he needs a strong off season and a really solid start to next year imo. Big year for him at 31 in the bigger scheme of things me thinks.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by benda »

Seiffert82 wrote: October 17, 2020, 8:32 am Ultimately we played 5 minutes of complete trash which conceded 18 points. Other than that, the score was 10-12 and we butchered quite a few scoring opportunities and were denied a couple more.

All things considered, we were outplayed when it mattered, but we were far from disgraced during the majority of the game. We just looked cooked early. The travel situation can't have helped our prep.

No time to throw the baby out with the bath water. One or two new players, with Hodgo, Guler, Sutto and Simon etc back and we'll be OK. I even expect Scott to be better next season if Stick holds onto him.
100% agree.
We have a great team and club culture. Hopefully its going to be a better playing arrangements next year.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by mobrulesall »

Question wrote: October 17, 2020, 6:44 am Unfortanately i think the game has passed Mr Croker head gear and all... he does not have the raw power, size or strength of the new brigade, could have hung around forever if it was the early 80S mid 90S though.
Two awful weeks in a row too. He confuses me - shows he is capable of defensive reads, but then offers pissweak efforts like he did on Vunivalu along the touch line last night.

I suspect having a new born and being in the bubble has taken its toll. He just needs to find the desire and I expect at least one or two more seasons of consistent footy from him, just needs to work on it.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by raiderskater »

Seiffert82 wrote: October 17, 2020, 8:35 am Stuart and Toots will have to have a few frank conversations over the offseason. He's really struggling out there, Darius Boyd level.

And I've backed Croker for years.
That's a ****ing insult right there and you take it back right now.

Croker may have struggled, but he's STILL TRYING. Boyd completely gave up and flopped around uselessly. Don't you DARE put Croker in the same category as that worthless lump of garbage.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by afgtnk »

benda wrote: October 17, 2020, 8:33 am While it is disappointing we should remember ehat happened was realistic.
The travel would have killed the players. Cant play footy by travelling in and out on the same day.
We had injuries too.
And we were outplayed by a fresh side.

I wouldnt overthink this. Back to drawing board for 2021.
The Storm do and did, and comprehensively outplayed us.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Green Taipan »

amiafish wrote: October 16, 2020, 10:53 pm In 2020, our outstanding halves + Papa and Taps have papered over the awful truth...we are a middling side, playing a gormless, soulless brand of football.
Our coach is an infuriating confection of outstanding man management coupled with dour tactical conservatism.
Our team defends with tenacity, but attacks with myopia.
Our outside backs are either inept, inexperienced, or decrepit...and nary a suggestion of speed in any of the back five.
This team needs to look to the future. Bleeding green will not suffice thrice to elevate us to the summit of preliminary final. We need speed, youth, and a refreshed game plan that reveals, rather than conceals, the latent talents of our skilled players.
With the excellent, and conspicuously professional English half in our fold for a while longer, we must seize the opportunity to explore the limits of our talent, and to resist the temptation to once more go to the well of one-out smash ball.
Please, Ricky, please.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Mickey_Raider »

Tough to cop the season ending in that fashion but there are plenty of reasons why it happened.

1. Injuries. Yes we adjusted well to losing Hodgo and we had some middle forwards step up in the absence of Guler, Hors, Sutton etc but when you win a title typically you need a blessed run with injuries. We had that in 2019 but not in 2020.

2. The Roosters game was our Grand Final. We expended all our emotional energy ending their season and didn't have enough in the tank to do it again for 1 or 2 more weeks.

3. The travel. There is no way around it, in a game of fine margins. on top of the Storm's fortnight of rest they simply didn't have to contend with what we did in the lead up. They looked fresh, we didn't; and they blitzed us accordingly.

4. Exploitation of our weaknesses. Our backline is weak and the Storm exposed it brutally. In addition to all the other factors, Stuart was outcoached tonight.

When the dust settles I think most will realise that this was a pretty successful season in the circumstances. But the premiership window does not hang around for ever and while the core of the team is there for another tilt, I am worried about Croker and Rapana. Im not sure we can win with them as a centre pairing.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by moto748 »

I think you need a bit more than just some promising kids to strengthen your back-line. Timoko looked useful in a few cameos this season, but even if you include him and some of the others mentioned, again, the same questions will be asked: is there anyone there to frighten the top teams, the Roosters, Panthers, etc? Anyone who would get into their first 13? I think not. I would have thought you need an established top-quality winger, at least. Your big bonus is that Wighton has been so successful in the halves, and you have a decent (although not world-beating) full-back now.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Whitty »

Has anyone on this forum been able to say that since Valemei has been starting, that you have felt confident that the outcome of any type of play (bomb, grubber, passing movement) towards his wing would be positive, ie. he would catch/tackle/stay in play ? He is quickly turning into the Albert Fulivai of wingers (some of you kids might have to look that up) I am baffled how he has been getting a jersey week after week, and last night only cemented my opinion of him.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Seiffert82 »

raiderskater wrote: October 17, 2020, 8:50 am
Seiffert82 wrote: October 17, 2020, 8:35 am Stuart and Toots will have to have a few frank conversations over the offseason. He's really struggling out there, Darius Boyd level.

And I've backed Croker for years.
That's a ****ing insult right there and you take it back right now.

Croker may have struggled, but he's STILL TRYING. Boyd completely gave up and flopped around uselessly. Don't you DARE put Croker in the same category as that worthless lump of garbage.
Haha, yeah it might have been a bit extreme. Boyd just phoned it in at the end.

Still, I thought Croker was good last season and played a great defensive game on Manu in the Grand Final. I honestly thought he was back to near his best. However this season his defence has been quite poor. His combo changes didn't help, but he's not looking good out there. :(
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Begbie »

We all love Croker, but we need to be sensible and honest.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Hong Kong Raider »

Pretty gutted last night but the sun always rises. Spent 1-2 hours per day just reading this forum and Raiders' articles this season, so looking forward to having more time on my hands! The Raiders gave me enjoyment and hope in what has been a !@#$ year with COVID. Needed to deal with protests and other negativity in Hong Kong as well. Hope Aust beats India in the cricket. Don't care who wins GF.

Overall this was a good season for us in trying circumstances. Worst performance of the season last night and I didn't see that coming. Storm and Penrith changed the way they played this season and so should we in 2021.

We need an attack coach.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Lordo »

Lads our grand final was last week. The fact that we got revenge on the rorters when it counts and stopped them from getting the three-peat is enough for me. Realistically even if we made the GF we didn't deserve to be there.

Next year is going to be a big test, whether we can keep our motivation despite losing Bateman and having been heartbroken 2 years in a row while also having to manage a somewhat aging squad remains to be seen. We go again.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by RedRaider »

Begbie wrote: October 16, 2020, 11:53 pm Croker and Timoko as I read it from red raider - but what of Scott?
That's who I'd go with Begbie, Croker and Timoko. I know Scott had a lot on his mind and was then injured. But the fact that the Storm released him in favour of journeyman Brenko Lee says to me that a very successful coach, Bellamy, didn't believe he was up for his Premiership plans.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Damoni »

moto748 wrote:I think you need a bit more than just some promising kids to strengthen your back-line. Timoko looked useful in a few cameos this season, but even if you include him and some of the others mentioned, again, the same questions will be asked: is there anyone there to frighten the top teams, the Roosters, Panthers, etc? Anyone who would get into their first 13? I think not. I would have thought you need an established top-quality winger, at least. Your big bonus is that Wighton has been so successful in the halves, and you have a decent (although not world-beating) full-back now.
Totally agree we can’t go into next year thinking 3 rookies are going to take us to a GF, simply won’t happen.

By comparison one of the most consistent rookie years of late has been Cotric, rarely made an error until his second year, would you have timoko, Val and HSS at his level?

I know it’s a small sample size but I really don’t see it and we need at least one guy in the backline to be Origin level or as Moto put it frighten the top teams

Our worst nightmare is that Timoko and HSS make the same amount of errors that Valemi makes a game.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Begbie »

RedRaider wrote: October 17, 2020, 9:49 am
Begbie wrote: October 16, 2020, 11:53 pm Croker and Timoko as I read it from red raider - but what of Scott?
That's who I'd go with Begbie, Croker and Timoko. I know Scott had a lot on his mind and was then injured. But the fact that the Storm released him in favour of journeyman Brenko Lee says to me that a very successful coach, Bellamy, didn't believe he was up for his Premiership plans.
I'm happy with this solution! Scott on standby.
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by RedRaider »

Just focusing on the right side for a moment. Next year we will be without an England International backrower and a SOO standard winger. At this point it would be rookie Timoko in the center for me with Rapa outside him. Backrow spot most likely CHN but he does not seem to be an 80 minute player so the right side will be shuffled in defence during matches. Hudson Young could be an 80 minute option on the right edge. He has the mobility and defensive game. I know he is being groomed as a middle but with Hors, Sutton and Guler to come back in, it would probably be better for the team if he was on an edge. Thoughts?
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Re: 2020 Finals Week 3 V Storm: Game Day

Post by Begbie »

I'd like Young to stick to the middle at all costs even if it means trialing others on the edge.
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