2020 Rd 7 V Parramatta Eels: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

[amiafish]

Yep. Taps is not great with edge defence at any rate, and edge defence for second rowers is primarily attitude and fitness. Hudson is going to bust a gut covering from the inside...he has everything to prove.
Defence in the centres is also about making good reads, and while Cotric is not currently a great defensive read, he's better than Scott...and he's way better with the ball.

I would note that I'm not the only one opting for Young into the side at second row...in fact it seems to be the prevailing view. What's your alternative?

[Azza]

We stink.

[BadnMean]

Yep. Taps is not great with edge defence at any rate, and edge defence for second rowers is primarily attitude and fitness. Hudson is going to bust a gut covering from the inside...he has everything to prove.
Defence in the centres is also about making good reads, and while Cotric is not currently a great defensive read, he's better than Scott...and he's way better with the ball.

I would note that I'm not the only one opting for Young into the side at second row...in fact it seems to be the prevailing view. What's your alternative?

I think Tapine is a better player in the middle. I think the team is balanced better and plays better with Tapine in the middle. So yeah, I support Young to 2nd row while Bateman is out. I think his engine is capable of it, whereas Tapine becomes much less effective, has little impact when he has to play 80 mins.

So if we get Young in there I think he handles the defence ok. I haven't seen much of his attack but he looks mobile. Not sure he can pass at all though, we'll see. That way we can also see if Young is a viable long term Bateman replacement if it does come to that, or if we need to go heavy on a backrow recruit.

Cotric is stagnating a bit out on that wing. Either to centre or at least back outside Toots and Jordy Raps back where he's shown his best on the right (don't care if he says he likes left better, he just isn't).

Scott can go away. Ricky will pick him for at least another fortnight I fear (Matt Allwood style). But he's not able to match even NRL rookies consistently, let alone top players.

[Coastalraider]

Yep. Taps is not great with edge defence at any rate, and edge defence for second rowers is primarily attitude and fitness. Hudson is going to bust a gut covering from the inside...he has everything to prove.
Defence in the centres is also about making good reads, and while Cotric is not currently a great defensive read, he's better than Scott...and he's way better with the ball.

I would note that I'm not the only one opting for Young into the side at second row...in fact it seems to be the prevailing view. What's your alternative?

Currently I think we are at least 1 week away from shifting Young to the edge. He hasn’t got the experience or game time in him yet. I see the value in your plan, just don’t agree with the timing. I also think it’s a really tough call to bring in a centre line Oldy to fill in against Jennings. Shifting Cotric in to centre and bringing Simo into the 13 makes the most sense to me, to send a message. That may be all that’s needed to get Scott back in the headspace he was in before the break. He was fine there early on, I was pretty happy with his efforts and defense. No idea what has happened since the return though, so can only think it’s a confidence or attitude thing.

I think the biggest component that most are missing is Williams’ role in all of these right edge issues. In nearly all of the sweep play tries we have conceded, our issues start with him turning the shoulder or planting the feet. Scott is reacting to that and getting exposed. He’s stuck in between bolting out of the line to try and shut down the play and back-pedalling to see what Williams is going to do. He hasn’t been good enough at making the right calls in those decisions, and if there was a reserve grade Scott would be getting a few weeks there in my mind, but it’s not as simple as saying it’s all his fault as some seem to think - not a personal comment aimed at you, just a general reading of the vibe.

[papabear]

Yep. Taps is not great with edge defence at any rate, and edge defence for second rowers is primarily attitude and fitness. Hudson is going to bust a gut covering from the inside...he has everything to prove.
Defence in the centres is also about making good reads, and while Cotric is not currently a great defensive read, he's better than Scott...and he's way better with the ball.

I would note that I'm not the only one opting for Young into the side at second row...in fact it seems to be the prevailing view. What's your alternative?

Hudson Young is not the prevailing view at second row imo.

he has had a long break and he looked the lest effective of all our middles on the weekend, I am not sure why everyone is so high on him, he seems like a plodder to me.

[amiafish]

Currently I think we are at least 1 week away from shifting Young to the edge. He hasn’t got the experience or game time in him yet. I see the value in your plan, just don’t agree with the timing. I also think it’s a really tough call to bring in a centre line Oldy to fill in against Jennings. Shifting Cotric in to centre and bringing Simo into the 13 makes the most sense to me, to send a message. That may be all that’s needed to get Scott back in the headspace he was in before the break. He was fine there early on, I was pretty happy with his efforts and defense. No idea what has happened since the return though, so can only think it’s a confidence or attitude thing.

I think the biggest component that most are missing is Williams’ role in all of these right edge issues. In nearly all of the sweep play tries we have conceded, our issues start with him turning the shoulder or planting the feet. Scott is reacting to that and getting exposed. He’s stuck in between bolting out of the line to try and shut down the play and back-pedalling to see what Williams is going to do. He hasn’t been good enough at making the right calls in those decisions, and if there was a reserve grade Scott would be getting a few weeks there in my mind, but it’s not as simple as saying it’s all his fault as some seem to think - not a personal comment aimed at you, just a general reading of the vibe.

Yeah, I can see that Hudson is underdone...but I think he has a lot of improving in him...and I place a lot of stock on the value of players that are out to prove something or pay back support from the coach.
I agree, Simmo is a better option than Oldy for defending against Jennings' lateral style attack.

I think the problem with Williams and the right edge isn't actually Williams...it's the fact that Scott doesn't seem to comprehend how solid a defender Williams is. So every time someone gets on Williams' outside shoulder, Scott ***** the bed and jams in/rushes up...unnecessarily in most cases. I don't read Scott's issues as being attitude based...to the contrary, he looks to be trying hard every game. I just think he's a bit of a dufus (on and off the field it would seem) and is constitutionally unsuited to high pressure defensive reads close to the goal line. BJ was the same...but at least he was sometimes outstanding with the ball.

[amiafish]

Hudson Young is not the prevailing view at second row imo.

he has had a long break and he looked the lest effective of all our middles on the weekend, I am not sure why everyone is so high on him, he seems like a plodder to me.

I'm just going by the lists people have posted on this thread. Where are you getting your information on what the prevailing view is? Besides, saying that' he's not the prevailing view and then saying you're not sure "why everyone" is so high on him is a contradiction in terms, no?

[BadnMean]

Hudson Young is not the prevailing view at second row imo.

he has had a long break and he looked the lest effective of all our middles on the weekend, I am not sure why everyone is so high on him, he seems like a plodder to me.

Just because we have zero other forwards capable of even looking like they can handle an edge. Tapine has been makeshifted back out there even though it's been clear for 2 seasons now it's not really the best use of him and it'snot doing our edge much good.

The fact we've tried Hors there tells you the edge is an issue in need of a solution. Young at least looks like he has the mobility and you're right, Young isn't in our best middles right now. Tapine and Havilii are better locks than him. Let's use them at lock and Young on an edge.

I'm not sold on him either but given the dire state of our backrow stocks and JB's future up in the air with doubts about both long term injury and willingness to stay and play for the club then, in that state of affairs then yeah, Young at edge begins to look worth pursuing.

[afgtnk]

How odd is it that a Ricky Stuart coached side all of a sudden has a shortage of options to play in the second row. Like, first time you could probably say that about a side of his ever.

[Matt]

Ill start with the 'elephant in the room', Mr Curtis Scott. 2 quality FBs have made him look pretty stupid in the past 3 wks. Ricky said as much in the presser last night. However, his defensive flaws are not entirely his own. This is the same argument we had on this forum RE Croker. The argument for Croker was he has the 1 legged man, Campo OR, speedbump Sammy on his inside, and leave my wing wide open Lee on his outside. Now, with Wighton inside and Cotric outside last yr, how good did he look?

Anyway, back to Scott. Yes, he rushes out of the line. However, if memory serves, we are yet to conceed points when he does. Vs Storm he was all over Munster, and he got DCE the other night too. However, as soon as he slides, he looks lost, even more so if back peddling.

Both tries last night were conceeded via similar sweep plays to Manly's left. On both occasions Tapine didnt push across fast enough, which is a trait of a bigger BR, as its harder for them to adjust to players coming back across the grain, so they dont want to over commit, theory being, easier to more forward than backwards/ change direction - this is something we were blessed with having Bateman and Whitehead last yr. The second thing is, on both occasions, as Turbo is receiving the ball, GWill is flatfooted/ stationary/ planting his feet. This is a giant mistake, and as such, he gets burnt on the outside as Turbo hits the afterburners. Scott is then left in no mans land, 3 on 2. Now, it also didnt help that on both occasions Cotric doesnt close on his winger, but rather backs off to the corner post (im sure this is standard practice, however, im pretty confident you dont give your man half the distance to the goal line in doing so, esp on your line). So, on the 1st try, while Scott gets his hands on Turbo, Cotric, Williams and CNK are all too far away to help. On the 2nd try, Cotric is 'shadow boxing' a winger who stayed on the 10m tramline as he headed to the corner post. Worse still, he calls the play, then doesnt execute. Funa beats him easily on the inside and strolls over. Thats Cotrics miss, not Scott. Scott actually tackles Turbo this time forcing the pass. If Cotric is actually on his man, that is easily defused.

I know I analysed the Knights game where Ponga and Pearce did similar things, but I didnt notice GWill planting his feet, only that he was drawn an passed on. I suspect on reflection, he probably planted his feet. Also, those are 2 classy players making the best of an attacking mid field scrum - something we are yet to do much of with Wighton very capable of doing what Ponga did to Scott.

Now, Im not as worried about Guth having the speed like those 2 to have Scott double guessing, and giving GWill a fraction longer to close, BUT, Teddy the following week will be the same result, if not worse, if its not dealt with.

Centre is the toughest place to defend in the entire line, and these are the examples of why. NOW... I really dont want to see the return of our leaky left edge of teams past, show up on the right. Also, this is not me absolving Scott. He is at fault, however, he has some others that need blame here too.

Im more concerned by the drop he has in his game ATM. We all talked about Tilse being good for 1, but he fixed it. Lui has that issue ATM, he was rotated (aka dropped). Now we have Scott doing it. They have all been costly drops this yr too. Something to keep an eye on.

What do I do? What should Ricky do? Well, Ill refer back to Dan Gerritson's article about a month ago, where he suggested Young had similar playing style to that of Bateman. Now, he isnt him, dont mix that up, but he is aggressive, agile, and solid defensively. Not the same X factor, no the same quality, BUT, id be happy to call him a poor mans Bateman at this stage of his career. Now, he looked rusty the other night, forgivable after 9-12 months without a game (yes, his own fault). You could plug him in for 80mins on the edge. Given the issues on that side, not sure thats a great idea. Combos are so important. That said, I liked the rotation of he and Tapine last night, as I think Tapine gets gassed on the edge playing 80, and has to save himself for defensive work, meaning no energy to attack. This could be something to monitor going forward. Perhaps a gradual change on that edge. Give it 2 or 3 games, see how it goes.

I stated on GH Live that I wasnt impressed with Rapa. Dropped a ball with the line open. Very un-Rapa like. Losing a kick return to a 1 on 1 steal, while chasing the game, unforgivable. TBH, I was worried every time he touched the ball. Looked loose and risky last night. Given how Simmo was scapegoated, Id say that performance requires a similar result.

Now, before you think Im going down the road of mass changes, as those guys werent the only ones making mistakes. We are currently one of the worst teams for errors, 6 again and penalties. We are making 100 more tackles a game than our opponents. Thats a MASSIVE problem. Defending errors is far more difficult now. Keeping momentum is the way to defend now. So get in the arm wrestle, win momentum, and dont give it up! Its this fact that needs fixing 1st, coz if your making 100 more tackles a game you are too fatigued to attack, hence we look clunky as.

So, whats more important? Player changes, or fixing team discipline?

[Coastalraider]

Discipline.

[GreenMachine]

I'm 100% on Tapine to 13 and Young to the right edge.
I've given up on Scott at right centre - bite the bullet now and get Cotric in there.
I'd also keep an eye out on the Fullback market...it's worrying how little CNK offers in attack from there. I love the kid, but he needs to do more around the ruck if he can't be involved in back line plays. Otherwise, I'd give him a run at right centre.

[Matt]

Discipline.

Some bloke I know gave me some very good points in this regard.

[Matt]

I'm 100% on Tapine to 13 and Young to the right edge.
I've given up on Scott at right centre - bite the bullet now and get Cotric in there.
I'd also keep an eye out on the Fullback market...it's worrying how little CNK offers in attack from there. I love the kid, but he needs to do more around the ruck if he can't be involved in back line plays. Otherwise, I'd give him a run at right centre.

This is an interesting thought. He played centre for NZ, correct?
As far as alternate selection of teams, this is less crazy that Croker to the wing or Jack to centre for Sammy in the halves. This would be a way of having Simmo, Rapa and Cotric out there. TBH, you could interchange them in any of the 3 back spots, you could even do it mid game.
This would also solve our 'rucking it out of our end' issues. As Scott and Croker as not that big, and its those tough carries that are bringing Scott unstuck. CNK is big enough, or at least, built solid enough, to do it.

Not sure how the defensive stuff would work, but its certainly an option. Like the Cotric to centre though, I feel it would be down the list of solutions for Ricky. But lets wait and see.

[IBG]

1. Rapana
2. Cotric
3. Croker
4. CNK
5. Simonsson

Will never happen, but I always wonder how Jordy would've gone (in his prime) as a permanent FB option.

[GMGT]

1. Rapana
2. Cotric
3. Croker
4. CNK
5. Simonsson

Will never happen, but I always wonder how Jordy would've gone (in his prime) as a permanent FB option.

In the few games I remember him playing there he was a dominant force.

[greeneyed]

Jack Wighton puts halves hands up in Canberra Raiders attack

Jack Wighton says he and George Williams need to take ownership of the Canberra Raiders' misfiring attack.

"We created a lot of opportunities, we could've scored a few times so it's definitely on us. "I spose me and Georgie could take a bit of ownership, you know, a bit of direction. I feel like we created opportunities, we just didn't capitalise on them.

Read more: https://www.canberratimes.com.au/story/ ... #gsc.tab=0

Parramatta enforcer Nathan Brown will fight a two-match suspension at the NRL judiciary, hoping to play for the ladder leaders in Saturday's night's big clash with Canberra: https://wwos.nine.com.au/nrl/dogs-winge ... 036bd4c768

Stuart puts focus on Canberra's attack: https://wwos.nine.com.au/nrl/stuart-put ... 320e5f04a9

Set of Six: Raiders v Eels: https://www.raiders.com.au/news/2020/06 ... rs-v-eels/

[Crusader]

Raiders will win this.

[Neeeegz]

Ya think Jack ??? Your playing like a centre. Not a director of attack... old George had to try any create everything yesterday...
at least you still get paid I guess

[-PJ-]

Raiders will win this.

That's the attitude..

More of this everyone.

[Mickey_Raider]

Being favourites is just complete anathema to the Raiders.

Every time we get hyped and play in a big game we fail. The only way we are successful is if we do it from being underdogs.

Pretty much the only time last year we were solid favourites in a big meaningful game and came out and won was the preliminary final against Souths, which we should rightfully be proud of.

Apart from that we either lost (think Roosters x3, Manly x2, Souths, Storm) or came from behind (Storm).

I'm hoping that because we have squandered our goodwill we won't be favourites anymore and we will win this weekend off the back of being underdogs. That's all I've got unfortunately.

[radicalraider]

No one can convince me Jack is a 6. He's a tough edge back rower.. not even skillful enough to be a centre.. Williams 6 Williams 7

[IBG]

No one can convince me Jack is a 6. He's a tough edge back rower.. not even skillful enough to be a centre.. Williams 6 Williams 7

Sorry did you just wake up out of a coma for the last year and a half?

[-TW-]

No one can convince me Jack is a 6. He's a tough edge back rower.. not even skillful enough to be a centre.. Williams 6 Williams 7

No he's not..

This one of the biggest hot takes I've read on here

Sent from my ELE-L29 using Tapatalk

[Perth Raiders]

No one can convince me Jack is a 6. He's a tough edge back rower.. not even skillful enough to be a centre.. Williams 6 Williams 7

That will do me! One of the silliest comments I’ve seen! Probably the form 6 in the comp over the last 18 months!

Very hard to be a play maker when your dummy half is massively overplaying his hand and only giving you the clean ball you need once every third set!

Jack and George aren’t playing well, but Hodgson is the number one issue for our attack right now!

[BadnMean]

No one can convince me Jack is a 6. He's a tough edge back rower.. not even skillful enough to be a centre.. Williams 6 Williams 7

Sorry did you just wake up out of a coma for the last year and a half?

Join date 2014...

82 posts...

Reckons Jack can't play #6...

Yeah... Nah... I'm not biting.

[Northern Raider]

No one can convince me Jack is a 6. He's a tough edge back rower.. not even skillful enough to be a centre.. Williams 6 Williams 7

Sorry did you just wake up out of a coma for the last year and a half?

Join date 2014...

82 posts...

Reckons Jack can't play #6...

Yeah... Nah... I'm not biting.

Lucy alt. He's dipping into the stockpile.

[GreenMachine]

No one can convince me Jack is a 6. He's a tough edge back rower.. not even skillful enough to be a centre.. Williams 6 Williams 7

That will do me! One of the silliest comments I’ve seen! Probably the form 6 in the comp over the last 18 months!

Very hard to be a play maker when your dummy half is massively overplaying his hand and only giving you the clean ball you need once every third set!

Jack and George aren’t playing well, but Hodgson is the number one issue for our attack right now!

Agree.

[Botman]

Guys... lets stop the witch hunt. There is no need to starting throwing wild accusations around

I for one welcome Sam back to our forums, and look forward to what he's got to say. Obviously with the state competition down he's got a bit more time on his hands than he was expected to have

[radicalraider]

Jack cost us the gf. He got so much ball and offered very little with it.. other than bombing to Morris and slow sweep plays to toots.. he's not a natural ball player and struggles to kick a ball in play each game.. yes I don't post too much here but I havnt missed a raiders game in 20 years.. I know my team and we aren't winning a comp with Jack at 6 or Scott and toots in the centres.

[radicalraider]

And Freddy isn't stupid for not putting Jack at 6.. He knows he's lacking with the ball..

[Azza]

Jack cost us the gf. He got so much ball and offered very little with it.. other than bombing to Morris and slow sweep plays to toots.. he's not a natural ball player and struggles to kick a ball in play each game.\

Oh GH, just when I think I've seen it all you surprise me with something new. The gift that keeps on giving.

[gangrenous]

Being favourites is just complete anathema to the Raiders.

Every time we get hyped and play in a big game we fail. The only way we are successful is if we do it from being underdogs.

Pretty much the only time last year we were solid favourites in a big meaningful game and came out and won was the preliminary final against Souths, which we should rightfully be proud of.

Apart from that we either lost (think Roosters x3, Manly x2, Souths, Storm) or came from behind (Storm).

I'm hoping that because we have squandered our goodwill we won't be favourites anymore and we will win this weekend off the back of being underdogs. That's all I've got unfortunately.

Isn’t this the truth. Channel Nine games we almost always play like ****. Need to get the psychologist back in to have a crack at this blowing up when favoured stuff.

Separately - the Hodgson play of letting the ball die with a forward on the 5th needs to die in a fire. It was vaguely acceptable (albeit incredibly frustrating) last year when it was a safe territorial advantage play. This year we’re giving away a six again or a penalty about 1 in 2 sets at it feels like at the moment. So the territory just isn’t valuable because there’s a good chance they’ll be back up the other end. So please play for the repeat set or try to score.

[Botman]

Jack cost us the gf. He got so much ball and offered very little with it.. other than bombing to Morris and slow sweep plays to toots.. he's not a natural ball player and struggles to kick a ball in play each game.. yes I don't post too much here but I havnt missed a raiders game in 20 years.. I know my team and we aren't winning a comp with Jack at 6 or Scott and toots in the centres.

OK, Sam.
You're overstimulated. Let's get some beer into you and then straight to bed.

[-PJ-]

I thought Sam was a team player..

So much hurt..