How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

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How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by greeneyed »

How the Canberra Raiders could line up in Round 3

CANBERRA RAIDERS

1. Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad 2. Bailey Simonsson 3. Jarrod Croker 4. Curtis Scott 5. Nick Cotric 6. Jack Wighton 7. George Williams 8. Josh Papalii 9. Josh Hodgson 10. Corey Horsburgh 11. John Bateman 12. Elliott Whitehead 13. Joseph Tapine 14. Siliva Havili 15. Dunamis Lui 16. Iosia Soliola 17. Emre Guler

Analysis: John Bateman missed the opening two rounds but is expected to be fit for Round 3. He’ll come back into his starting spot shifting Joseph Tapine to lock and sets up a battle between Corey Horsburgh and Dunamis Lui to start alongside Josh Papalii in the front row. Michael Oldfield will slip out of the side.

Read more: https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-pr ... ed77106f44
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Re: Canberra Raiders free to train if health advice allows

Post by Sid »

And they said Bateman wouldn’t recover by round 3. Miracle
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Re: Canberra Raiders free to train if health advice allows

Post by Botman »

Sid wrote: April 14, 2020, 7:40 am And they said Bateman wouldn’t recover by round 3. Miracle
I dont know that we really needed JB to use chemical warfare in his bid to get back early... if im perfectly honest, creating a global pandemic to get back a few weeks early seems a little OTT. But im happy he's back! :lol:
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Re: Canberra Raiders free to train if health advice allows

Post by Northern Raider »

Lui seems to play better when he starts. Horse gives some impact off the bench, which we lack when Lui is there. I'd go that way.
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Re: Canberra Raiders free to train if health advice allows

Post by BJ »

Northern Raider wrote:Lui seems to play better when he starts. Horse gives some impact off the bench, which we lack when Lui is there. I'd go that way.
A simpler game plan for the first 20 minutes of a game and then expanding with offloads after that period worked has worked for us since 2019, so I see no reason to change approach.

So Lui to start with Hors off the bench. I think Guler will take Lui’s starting spot by the end of a season, but it’s good for Guler’s long term prop development to continue in his current role and Lui has laid a good platform this season.
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Re: Canberra Raiders free to train if health advice allows

Post by Northern Raider »

BJ wrote: April 14, 2020, 9:05 am
Northern Raider wrote:Lui seems to play better when he starts. Horse gives some impact off the bench, which we lack when Lui is there. I'd go that way.
A simpler game plan for the first 20 minutes of a game and then expanding with offloads after that period worked has worked for us since 2019, so I see no reason to change approach.

So Lui to start with Hors off the bench. I think Guler will take Lui’s starting spot by the end of a season, but it’s good for Guler’s long term prop development to continue in his current role and Lui has laid a good platform this season.
Guler or Horse will be starting prop at some point this season.

....feels a bit weird talking about the footy.
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Re: Canberra Raiders free to train if health advice allows

Post by Raider47 »

I'm going to say Havili will be the one to make way. Oldfield will keep his spot. Ricky has made it clear he is a fan of the the outside back on the bench. However he has also said he loves to have Siliva on the bench too for his versatility.

I'd personally omit Lui though. I'm a fan of Havili.
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Re: Canberra Raiders free to train if health advice allows

Post by Northern Raider »

Raider47 wrote: April 14, 2020, 9:12 am I'm going to say Havili will be the one to make way. Oldfield will keep his spot. Ricky has made it clear he is a fan of the the outside back on the bench. However he has also said he loves to have Siliva on the bench too for his versatility.

I'd personally omit Lui though. I'm a fan of Havili.
Yeah, reckon Oldy stays. We needed him the first 2 games as well so I doubt Stick will leave him out.

Havili is a better bench player than Lui. Added benefit he gives you cover at hooker. If Lui starts then Sia, Horse and Guler would be the bench forwards. If Horse starts I'd prefer Havili on the bench but I agree, he'll be the one to miss out.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by afgtnk »

Having an outside back on the bench is invaluable and we shouldn't need a third player that can only play in the middle anymore - Havili can slot in there for 10-15 regardless.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by Wiki Special »

I think Lui would make way for Bateman.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by zim »

1. Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad
2. Jordan Rapana
3. Jarrod Croker (c)
4. Curtis Scott
5. Nick Cotric
6. Jack Wighton
7. George Williams
8. Josh Papalii
9. Josh Hodgson (c)
10. Dunamis Lui
11. John Bateman
12. Elliot Whitehead
13. Joseph Tapine

14. Bailey Simonsson
15. Corey Horsburgh (need an off loader on the bench with Havili dropping back)
16. Emre Guler
17. Sia Soliola

18. Siliva Havili
19. Sam Williams
20. Ryan Sutton
21. Michael Oldfield

At full strength we have some pretty crazy depth.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by Old School Green »

Havili gives us so much when he comes on. He adds good punch and also can cover hooker.
We learned the lesson last year about needing a back. Guler played the house down in his minutes earlier this year so it’s Lui who moves out atm... good to have this hustle for spots.
When Jordy Raps comes back surely he slots in and simonsson to bench? Or if Scott gets the flick for a while post court, cotric to centre Jordy Raps on sting??
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by edwahu »

Jeez our team looks strong.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by -PJ- »

One behind the other with Toots and Hodgo leading us out..
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by julian87 »

Pretty spot on but Oldfield in for Lui for mine.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by BadnMean »

julian87 wrote: April 14, 2020, 7:07 pm Pretty spot on but Oldfield in for Lui for mine.
I wonder if the shortened season changes this thinking too. Dropping a game because you had 2x backs have to take HIA's during a single game or 1 back fail a HIA can be hard to make up.

Given that we has Oldfield in the team so far this year I don't see why he drops out now. The only logic I see supporting that is if JB is seen as being able to cover any backline spots in a pinch.

But I'd say Oldie stays. Also means a minimal rejig to strategy if Jordy Raps comes back via that bench spot.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by Botman »

I have said and continue to say this squad had enough versatility to cope with injuries in the backs
I think in 90% of games, Havilii will give us better value and utility than Oldy will

If you want to make a case for Oldy (or Rapana) to start and Simo being on the bench, that's a slightly different conversation, but i think we have the sqaud that can cover fullback, centre, wing and the halves with Havilii in the team
and all things going well, he beefs up our middle and provides a nice little 20 minute imapct as a middle. Simo has some value in the middle... Oldy doesnt, and i dont like playing a winger, wearing him out for 60 minutes, then bringing on oldy and expecting Simo to then go and make an impact as a middle floater in the final 20

With Havalii on our bench, i feel like if we lost a player in minute 1, we could rejig the side and cope for 1 game. And he adds real significant value in our base gameplan... i dont think an outside back helps us much at all unless an outside back get hurt
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by Botman »

1. CNK
2. Simo
3. Croker
4. Scott
5. Cotric
6. Wighton
7. Williams
8. Guler
9. Hodgson
10. Papalii
11. Bateman
12. Whitehead
13. Tapine

14. Havilii
15. Horsbrough
16. Sia
17. Sutton

That'd be my team
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by simo »

Botman wrote: April 14, 2020, 8:25 pm 1. CNK
2. Simo
3. Croker
4. Scott
5. Cotric
6. Wighton
7. Williams
8. Guler
9. Hodgson
10. Papalii
11. Bateman
12. Whitehead
13. Tapine

14. Havilii
15. Horsbrough
16. Sia
17. Sutton

That'd be my team
Completely agree. If only to see how guler shapes up starting. Its an important step for his development
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How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by gangrenous »

Thread Title wrote:How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?
1.5m apart
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by Botman »

gangrenous wrote: April 14, 2020, 9:04 pm
Thread Title wrote:How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?
1.5m apart
:roflmao
That's good.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by Botman »

simo wrote: April 14, 2020, 9:02 pm Completely agree. If only to see how guler shapes up starting. Its an important step for his development
Yep, im really bullish on him
I think he's a tremendous talent and i think he's ready to step up AND he compliments the team well as a starter. I like Hors a lot more a limited minutes bench player right now than a starter.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by julian87 »

BadnMean wrote: April 14, 2020, 7:51 pm
julian87 wrote: April 14, 2020, 7:07 pm Pretty spot on but Oldfield in for Lui for mine.
I wonder if the shortened season changes this thinking too. Dropping a game because you had 2x backs have to take HIA's during a single game or 1 back fail a HIA can be hard to make up.

Given that we has Oldfield in the team so far this year I don't see why he drops out now. The only logic I see supporting that is if JB is seen as being able to cover any backline spots in a pinch.

But I'd say Oldie stays. Also means a minimal rejig to strategy if Jordy Raps comes back via that bench spot.
Agreed that it might change some coaches and how they select teams. But not ours I’d say.

And that’s not even mentioning poor old Ryan Sutton who is good enough for first grade but hasn’t shown enough impact off the bench so far.

(By the by once players are overlooked no reserve grade will make it very, very, very hard for them I almost every way imaginable)

I will say it until I’m blue in the face; you don’t need a 4th forward. You barely need a third one with 80 minute second rowers. And we’re in this unbelievable position of having a 3rd running forward that also covers hooker. If Horsburgh starts and we have Sia + Guler on the bench then Lui is finally sort of surplus to requirements at full strength imo.

It’s another discussion when Young is again available though. I think he could replace the back though as via Bateman he covers an injury there.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by BJ »

Botman wrote:
simo wrote: April 14, 2020, 9:02 pm Completely agree. If only to see how guler shapes up starting. Its an important step for his development
Yep, im really bullish on him
I think he's a tremendous talent and i think he's ready to step up AND he compliments the team well as a starter. I like Hors a lot more a limited minutes bench player right now than a starter.
I go back to my original comment. I can see Guler as a starting prop by season end. But I think young Props need to be developed slowly.

Let’s let Guler continue to develop his play from the 20 minute mark onwards. He’s really adding value off the bench.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by BadnMean »

Botman wrote: April 14, 2020, 8:22 pm I have said and continue to say this squad had enough versatility to cope with injuries in the backs
I think in 90% of games, Havilii will give us better value and utility than Oldy will

If you want to make a case for Oldy (or Rapana) to start and Simo being on the bench, that's a slightly different conversation, but i think we have the sqaud that can cover fullback, centre, wing and the halves with Havilii in the team
and all things going well, he beefs up our middle and provides a nice little 20 minute imapct as a middle. Simo has some value in the middle... Oldy doesnt, and i dont like playing a winger, wearing him out for 60 minutes, then bringing on oldy and expecting Simo to then go and make an impact as a middle floater in the final 20

With Havalii on our bench, i feel like if we lost a player in minute 1, we could rejig the side and cope for 1 game. And he adds real significant value in our base gameplan... i dont think an outside back helps us much at all unless an outside back get hurt
I don't drop Havili to have Oldy on my bench, I drop Lui. Havilii is a better bench forward than Lui I agree, with regard to both impact and versatility. Sia, Guler and Havillii is plenty of bench firepower for mine- one reliable veteran who is a relatively mobile prop- one up and comer who is a big body and can be dynamic- Havilii is powerful, offers an offload, versatility and some ball playing ability. Good mix.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by edwahu »

Papalii is so good you probably want your 4th best prop starting with him so you avoid a big drop off. So in that respect I would think Guler over Lui makes sense already.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by zim »

BJ wrote: April 14, 2020, 10:46 pm
Botman wrote:
simo wrote: April 14, 2020, 9:02 pm Completely agree. If only to see how guler shapes up starting. Its an important step for his development
Yep, im really bullish on him
I think he's a tremendous talent and i think he's ready to step up AND he compliments the team well as a starter. I like Hors a lot more a limited minutes bench player right now than a starter.
I go back to my original comment. I can see Guler as a starting prop by season end. But I think young Props need to be developed slowly.

Let’s let Guler continue to develop his play from the 20 minute mark onwards. He’s really adding value off the bench.
Yeah my strongest side is different to my round 3 side. Unlike others I wouldn't be starting Guler in that side. Not this year anyway.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by greeneyed »

Round 3 predicted teams: How each squad's shaping up for May 28 restart

Canberra Raiders

1. Charnze Nicoll-Klokstad
2. Bailey Simonsson
3. Jarrod Croker
4. Curtis Scott
5. Nick Cotric
6. Jack Wighton
7. George Williams
8. Josh Papalii
9. Josh Hodgson
10. Corey Horsburgh
11. John Bateman
12. Elliott Whitehead
13. Joseph Tapine

14. Siliva Havili
15. Dunamis Lui
16. Sia Soliola
17. Emre Guler

Read more: https://www.nrl.com/news/2020/04/15/rou ... 8-restart/
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by AUSTEZER »

No way I'd leave Oldie out of Squad
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by BJ »

Players better be watching their exercise and diets during the lay-off. I imagine Ricky would be happy to start a number of players in reserve grade if they don’t return in reasonable condition.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by afgtnk »

Botman wrote: April 14, 2020, 8:22 pm I have said and continue to say this squad had enough versatility to cope with injuries in the backs
I think in 90% of games, Havilii will give us better value and utility than Oldy will

If you want to make a case for Oldy (or Rapana) to start and Simo being on the bench, that's a slightly different conversation, but i think we have the sqaud that can cover fullback, centre, wing and the halves with Havilii in the team
and all things going well, he beefs up our middle and provides a nice little 20 minute imapct as a middle. Simo has some value in the middle... Oldy doesnt, and i dont like playing a winger, wearing him out for 60 minutes, then bringing on oldy and expecting Simo to then go and make an impact as a middle floater in the final 20

With Havalii on our bench, i feel like if we lost a player in minute 1, we could rejig the side and cope for 1 game. And he adds real significant value in our base gameplan... i dont think an outside back helps us much at all unless an outside back get hurt
Question is do we really need three and a half middle forwards on the bench in this day and age? I don't think we do - how much more could that extra forward (naturally of lower quality) improve our game vs having our next best outside back ready to slot in at any time?. IMO Havili is a very good impact player in the middle with his low centre of gravity and leg drive, and if he's only on the bench for Hodgson he's being wasted. For a 10-15 minute stint I rate him above Lui in that regard. If it is the case that three and a half players is overkill then the best use of the spot has to be an outside back to provide cover for 1-5 (regardless of how versatile the back on the bench is, can always shift backs around in the backline).

With the frequency players going off for head assessments I just see it as a needless risk which can comfortably be averted. No back on the bench likely means shifting either Whitehead (quite slow these days) and Bateman, and losing robbing the side of the quality bring in both attack and defence, without having a edge forward to replace them.
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by BadnMean »

BJ wrote: April 15, 2020, 7:57 pm Players better be watching their exercise and diets during the lay-off. I imagine Ricky would be happy to start a number of players in reserve grade if they don’t return in reasonable condition.
Not sure if joking?
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by simo »

julian87 wrote: April 14, 2020, 9:38 pm
BadnMean wrote: April 14, 2020, 7:51 pm
julian87 wrote: April 14, 2020, 7:07 pm Pretty spot on but Oldfield in for Lui for mine.
I wonder if the shortened season changes this thinking too. Dropping a game because you had 2x backs have to take HIA's during a single game or 1 back fail a HIA can be hard to make up.

Given that we has Oldfield in the team so far this year I don't see why he drops out now. The only logic I see supporting that is if JB is seen as being able to cover any backline spots in a pinch.

But I'd say Oldie stays. Also means a minimal rejig to strategy if Jordy Raps comes back via that bench spot.
Agreed that it might change some coaches and how they select teams. But not ours I’d say.

And that’s not even mentioning poor old Ryan Sutton who is good enough for first grade but hasn’t shown enough impact off the bench so far.

(By the by once players are overlooked no reserve grade will make it very, very, very hard for them I almost every way imaginable)

I will say it until I’m blue in the face; you don’t need a 4th forward. You barely need a third one with 80 minute second rowers. And we’re in this unbelievable position of having a 3rd running forward that also covers hooker. If Horsburgh starts and we have Sia + Guler on the bench then Lui is finally sort of surplus to requirements at full strength imo.

It’s another discussion when Young is again available though. I think he could replace the back though as via Bateman he covers an injury there.
Yeah i rate young but i think ricky wants to have the like for like back cover on the bench. You would lose too much having bateman cover in those situations.
We have quite a good squad dont we
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by Botman »

afgtnk wrote: April 15, 2020, 8:00 pm
Botman wrote: April 14, 2020, 8:22 pm I have said and continue to say this squad had enough versatility to cope with injuries in the backs
I think in 90% of games, Havilii will give us better value and utility than Oldy will

If you want to make a case for Oldy (or Rapana) to start and Simo being on the bench, that's a slightly different conversation, but i think we have the sqaud that can cover fullback, centre, wing and the halves with Havilii in the team
and all things going well, he beefs up our middle and provides a nice little 20 minute imapct as a middle. Simo has some value in the middle... Oldy doesnt, and i dont like playing a winger, wearing him out for 60 minutes, then bringing on oldy and expecting Simo to then go and make an impact as a middle floater in the final 20

With Havalii on our bench, i feel like if we lost a player in minute 1, we could rejig the side and cope for 1 game. And he adds real significant value in our base gameplan... i dont think an outside back helps us much at all unless an outside back get hurt
Question is do we really need three and a half middle forwards on the bench in this day and age? I don't think we do - how much more could that extra forward (naturally of lower quality) improve our game vs having our next best outside back ready to slot in at any time?. IMO Havili is a very good impact player in the middle with his low centre of gravity and leg drive, and if he's only on the bench for Hodgson he's being wasted. For a 10-15 minute stint I rate him above Lui in that regard. If it is the case that three and a half players is overkill then the best use of the spot has to be an outside back to provide cover for 1-5 (regardless of how versatile the back on the bench is, can always shift backs around in the backline).

With the frequency players going off for head assessments I just see it as a needless risk which can comfortably be averted. No back on the bench likely means shifting either Whitehead (quite slow these days) and Bateman, and losing robbing the side of the quality bring in both attack and defence, without having a edge forward to replace them.
Yeah i can see both sides of it. I think there is a genuine case to be made for it.
I'd love to know the data on the head injury stuff because anecdotally i feel like we lose an outside back maybe once every 4-5 games... we lose forwards at a greater rate of knots than that, so i sway towards overkill in the forwards than backs if you're talking HIA... but i dont have any data on that, and ive seen some here say they feel like its once every 2-3 games... thats a big difference and i would probably change my view if the data showed that to be correct.

For me, whilst it's not my preferred option, i think Simo and Havilii on the bench is fine. Because as you said and i agree, id take Havilii over Lui as a pure middle forward for 15-20 minute stint which is all we'd be asking of him with 2x 80 minute backrowers and guys like Papalii, Tapine and Sutton who can all play long minutes as middles. I think Simo can give you something as a middle jack in the box sort, just a direct attacker who is sniffing around and waiting on offloads, getting out of hooker etc. I think that has value

What i dont think has value is Simo playing 60 minutes on the wing, and then bringing in Oldy to play wing and expecting Simo to then come into that middle and provide impact. I just dont think that works. He's not fresh at that point. Wing is a very physically demanding position these days.

I think if you want to go Oldy/Rapana to start, and have Simo on the bench with Havilii... that works for me. Because Simo doesnt need to come on in the backs to give us something. And he covers 1-5 in case.
If you want to start Simo though... then i'd rather go with Havilii and 3 forwards and give myself the ability to keep some miles off guys like Papalii and Sia
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Re: How should the Canberra Raiders line up in Round 3?

Post by GMGT »

Is Rapana a realistic chance for round 3? I have a sinking feeling that the nrl will block it again, especially since they have put a hold on new contracts.
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