Raiders player signing speculation 2020

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casta66
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by casta66 »

Colk wrote: October 5, 2020, 9:36 pm
casta66 wrote: October 5, 2020, 9:00 pm I'm with Ricky.

I really see a big future with Semi.

Can't judge him too hard on a few games.

He's been impressive. The errors can be fixed.

Hss and timoko have had very limited opportunities not only to be judged on, but to be criticised on.
I was basing my opinion on what I saw from Flegg last year but also on the Sharks game. I think he was the least impressive of the three in that game and in Flegg last year. He still has a chance to be a good first grader albeit not in the class of the very best wingers
Fair enough, you've certainly seen more of him than I have.
I just enjoyed being there and appreciated him on the weekend :D
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Northern Raider »

Colk wrote: October 5, 2020, 8:49 pm
Northern Raider wrote: October 5, 2020, 8:10 pm
Colk wrote: October 5, 2020, 6:17 pm Backline for next year (assuming Raps re-signs)

My pick
1.CNK
2.HSS
3. Croker
4. Timoko
5. Rapana

What I think Ricky will pick
1. CNK
2. Valemei
3. Croker
4. Scott
5.Rapana
You giving up on Simonssen?
No not yet. I think he will be in a tussle with Smith Shields and Valemei. I thought he was excellent last year and if his form gets back to that level then he will be picked

I think HSS has the most talent but I think Ricky likes Valemei the most judging by the way he is backing him through his early jitters
This wouldn't be an issue of Simo was fit right now. Semi wouldn't even be in 1st grade.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Dusty »

Simmo hasn't convinced me yet.
2020: 1. Nicol-Klokstad 2. Cotric 3. Croker (c) 4 Leilua 5. Scott 6. Wighton 7. G. Williams 8. Papalii 9. Hodgson (c) 10. Sutton 11. J. Bateman 12. Whitehead 13. Tapine ----
14. Simmonson 15. Soliola 16. Guler 17. Horsburgh
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by GreenMachine »

Colk wrote: October 5, 2020, 6:17 pm Backline for next year (assuming Raps re-signs)

My pick
1.CNK
2.HSS
3. Croker
4. Timoko
5. Rapana
100% how we should line up.
Perhaps Simmo battling with HSS for that wing spot.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Seiffert82 »

Dusty wrote: October 6, 2020, 8:46 am Simmo hasn't convinced me yet.
Yeah, TBH I haven't seen anything from Simonsson that makes him a sure fire thing for first grade next season.

I like Valemei's physicality and tackle breaking ability. He's got a ton of rough edges, but between he and Simo I'd have money on Semi having a more impactful first grade career.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Northern Raider »

Seiffert82 wrote: October 6, 2020, 9:04 am
Dusty wrote: October 6, 2020, 8:46 am Simmo hasn't convinced me yet.
Yeah, TBH I haven't seen anything from Simonsson that makes him a sure fire thing for first grade next season.

I like Valemei's physicality and tackle breaking ability. He's got a ton of rough edges, but between he and Simo I'd have money on Semi having a more impactful first grade career.
Simo is no star but he's very solid. Right now I'd be happy with that on our wing.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by simo »

soliola!!
Dont delete this GE
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad »

Colk wrote:Backline for next year (assuming Raps re-signs)

My pick
1.CNK
2.HSS
3. Croker
4. Timoko
5. Rapana

What I think Ricky will pick
1. CNK
2. Valemei
3. Croker
4. Scott
5.Rapana
My thinking
1. CNK
2. HSS
3. Croker
4. Timoko
5. Semi / Simmo

14. Rapana
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Colk »

Fuifui Bradbrad wrote: October 6, 2020, 4:18 pm
Colk wrote:Backline for next year (assuming Raps re-signs)

My pick
1.CNK
2.HSS
3. Croker
4. Timoko
5. Rapana

What I think Ricky will pick
1. CNK
2. Valemei
3. Croker
4. Scott
5.Rapana
My thinking
1. CNK
2. HSS
3. Croker
4. Timoko
5. Semi / Simmo

14. Rapana
Even better than mine
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Coastalraider »

With the amazing depth of forwards we will have in 2021 , plus Starling showing huge improvement, I’m not convinced we will be utilising a back on the bench next year.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Seiffert82 »

Northern Raider wrote: October 6, 2020, 10:06 am
Seiffert82 wrote: October 6, 2020, 9:04 am
Dusty wrote: October 6, 2020, 8:46 am Simmo hasn't convinced me yet.
Yeah, TBH I haven't seen anything from Simonsson that makes him a sure fire thing for first grade next season.

I like Valemei's physicality and tackle breaking ability. He's got a ton of rough edges, but between he and Simo I'd have money on Semi having a more impactful first grade career.
Simo is no star but he's very solid. Right now I'd be happy with that on our wing.
Yeah, I'm fairly happy with Simo there given most of our attack is driven by the halves and Whitehead, but the most you can say about Simonsson is that he is solid and pretty consistent.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by MrPosh »

I think Simonsson is going to be a star.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Canberra Milk »

I think we are going down the Storm strategy of having serviceable backs that don't cost too much. I don't mind it really. I love an exciting backline but it's a luxury these days with the salary cap

Although Sticky's game plan is pretty dependent on the backs rucking it out up the guts... but then again, most serviceable backs can do a job with that, even if not brilliant at it like in the Leipana days
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by bonehead »

Canberra Milk wrote:I think we are going down the Storm strategy of having serviceable backs that don't cost too much. I don't mind it really. I love an exciting backline but it's a luxury these days with the salary cap

Although Sticky's game plan is pretty dependent on the backs rucking it out up the guts... but then again, most serviceable backs can do a job with that, even if not brilliant at it like in the Leipana days
my issue with that is our pointscoring tends to come from individual ability not slick set plays

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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by BadnMean »

Storm also have a FB who is an absolute attacking livewire and a good power runner in Olam who has had a back end to the season as good as any centre in the comp attack wise. So they have a couple performing a cut above anything our back 5 is producing in attack. You'd probably take Vunivalu over what we have on the wing (sans Cotric) in terms of quality too, but some may argue the toss.

I'd say in terms of what you'd have to handle in terms of attack, most punters would fear Olam, Vunivalu, Papenhuyzen over any combo you could name from our back 5. And once you remove Cotric, it wouldn't even be close.

Roosters back 5 is an A.
Storm is a B.
Ours is a B- with Cotric, C+ without. Or just a C is you split the difference and ignore minor differences.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Pete Cash »

The storms backline is super exciting right now. JAC is really in form
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by afgtnk »

The threat that comes from the speed of Addo-Carr, Olam, and Papenhuyzen is incredible. They take so many half chances from any position on the field and manage to convert them.

Giving them a B and us an B- is either too harsh on them or too generous for us. They are comfortably better. We would be mad not to explore that kind of addition to our game.
Last edited by afgtnk on October 7, 2020, 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Pete Cash »

Also it means they can compress in defence and fancy their chances of covering it. Speed has a lot of value
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by afgtnk »

Pete Cash wrote: October 7, 2020, 4:42 pm Also it means they can compress in defence and fancy their chances of covering it. Speed has a lot of value
Conversely, also means that teams can't compress against them as much, for fear of being taken around on the outside..... something that we're seeing happen to us regularly this season possibly in part because of the lack of threat.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Canberra Milk »

They might be good players, but their buying strategy is still to buy cheap... and invariably move on once they get too expensive. Applies to Olam, Addo-Carr, Curtis Scott, Vunivalu etc

Leaving aside fullback, just talking about their centres and wings
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by BadnMean »

Canberra Milk wrote: October 7, 2020, 5:57 pm They might be good players, but their buying strategy is still to buy cheap... and invariably move on once they get too expensive. Applies to Olam, Addo-Carr, Curtis Scott, Vunivalu etc

Leaving aside fullback, just talking about their centres and wings
To a certain extent. They are very happy to keep JAC I thought, but he wants to return to Sydney. I suspect they let Scott go because he was a plonker with plates in his leg. They were paying Scott 500k for a guy that had and has done nothing near what Cotric has done, basically all on potential and he was a loose unit (compare to Cotric pure pro since juniors, when I knew him). So the "Melbourne never pay" myth can be over-stated at times. But they do apply that theory in general.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by julian87 »

Scott is definitely an exception to the rule though. An exception that stands out like dog’s balls too.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Colk »

BadnMean wrote: October 7, 2020, 6:07 pm
Canberra Milk wrote: October 7, 2020, 5:57 pm They might be good players, but their buying strategy is still to buy cheap... and invariably move on once they get too expensive. Applies to Olam, Addo-Carr, Curtis Scott, Vunivalu etc

Leaving aside fullback, just talking about their centres and wings
To a certain extent. They are very happy to keep JAC I thought, but he wants to return to Sydney. I suspect they let Scott go because he was a plonker with plates in his leg. They were paying Scott 500k for a guy that had and has done nothing near what Cotric has done, basically all on potential and he was a loose unit (compare to Cotric pure pro since juniors, when I knew him). So the "Melbourne never pay" myth can be over-stated at times. But they do apply that theory in general.
We have gone down a similar route to Melbourne though which can’t be argued against - they spend their money on the spine and some forwards and go relatively cheap in their backline. We are doing the same thing. Papenhauzen and Olam have what two years experience whilst Brenko Lee has been a fringe first grader at a few clubs. If you looked at their backline middle of last year- you would have said two good wingers but no centres and an inexperienced fullback. Their backline would not have been considered top drawer - hopefully players like Timoko and HSS follow a similar route

I also think that if you looked at most other backlines (Sharks, Knights, Panthers, Broncos (perhaps not a great example) Cowboys, Dragons, Tigers, Manly) they are all littered with young players (under 50 games) with one or two experienced players in between.

The only real examples outside of these are the Roosters (what’s a salary cap), Souths and Eels.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by BadnMean »

Colk wrote: October 7, 2020, 7:05 pm
BadnMean wrote: October 7, 2020, 6:07 pm
Canberra Milk wrote: October 7, 2020, 5:57 pm They might be good players, but their buying strategy is still to buy cheap... and invariably move on once they get too expensive. Applies to Olam, Addo-Carr, Curtis Scott, Vunivalu etc

Leaving aside fullback, just talking about their centres and wings
To a certain extent. They are very happy to keep JAC I thought, but he wants to return to Sydney. I suspect they let Scott go because he was a plonker with plates in his leg. They were paying Scott 500k for a guy that had and has done nothing near what Cotric has done, basically all on potential and he was a loose unit (compare to Cotric pure pro since juniors, when I knew him). So the "Melbourne never pay" myth can be over-stated at times. But they do apply that theory in general.
We have gone down a similar route to Melbourne though which can’t be argued against - they spend their money on the spine and some forwards and go relatively cheap in their backline. We are doing the same thing. Papenhauzen and Olam have what two years experience whilst Brenko Lee has been a fringe first grader at a few clubs. If you looked at their backline middle of last year- you would have said two good wingers but no centres and an inexperienced fullback. Their backline would not have been considered top drawer - hopefully players like Timoko and HSS follow a similar route

I also think that if you looked at most other backlines (Sharks, Knights, Panthers, Broncos (perhaps not a great example) Cowboys, Dragons, Tigers, Manly) they are all littered with young players (under 50 games) with one or two experienced players in between.

The only real examples outside of these are the Roosters (what’s a salary cap), Souths and Eels.
All fair but tell me a single season when melbourne or roosters have not had an elite strike player in the back 5.

I'll wait.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Colk »

BadnMean wrote: October 7, 2020, 7:17 pm
Colk wrote: October 7, 2020, 7:05 pm
BadnMean wrote: October 7, 2020, 6:07 pm
Canberra Milk wrote: October 7, 2020, 5:57 pm They might be good players, but their buying strategy is still to buy cheap... and invariably move on once they get too expensive. Applies to Olam, Addo-Carr, Curtis Scott, Vunivalu etc

Leaving aside fullback, just talking about their centres and wings
To a certain extent. They are very happy to keep JAC I thought, but he wants to return to Sydney. I suspect they let Scott go because he was a plonker with plates in his leg. They were paying Scott 500k for a guy that had and has done nothing near what Cotric has done, basically all on potential and he was a loose unit (compare to Cotric pure pro since juniors, when I knew him). So the "Melbourne never pay" myth can be over-stated at times. But they do apply that theory in general.
We have gone down a similar route to Melbourne though which can’t be argued against - they spend their money on the spine and some forwards and go relatively cheap in their backline. We are doing the same thing. Papenhauzen and Olam have what two years experience whilst Brenko Lee has been a fringe first grader at a few clubs. If you looked at their backline middle of last year- you would have said two good wingers but no centres and an inexperienced fullback. Their backline would not have been considered top drawer - hopefully players like Timoko and HSS follow a similar route

I also think that if you looked at most other backlines (Sharks, Knights, Panthers, Broncos (perhaps not a great example) Cowboys, Dragons, Tigers, Manly) they are all littered with young players (under 50 games) with one or two experienced players in between.

The only real examples outside of these are the Roosters (what’s a salary cap), Souths and Eels.
All fair but tell me a single season when melbourne or roosters have not had an elite strike player in the back 5.

I'll wait.
The Roosters came second last in 2016. Their backline wasn’t stunning then. Even then, are the Roosters the best example to make - they just buy whoever they want and we can’t do that without paying excessive amounts.

Melbourne went and replaced Slater with Papenhauzen. Had you heard of Justin Olam and him two years ago? They also had Curtis Scott who is being rightfully panned for his performances. On paper people would have considered them to have a poor backline. Their progression in the backline has come mainly from huge improvement of a couple of players.

The greatest example would be Penrith. Crichton, Naden, To’o, Dylan Edwards were all players with potential and less than 30-40 games. Look at other clubs like those I mentioned earlier. The best way, unless you want to get rid of some of our good forwards, is to buy cheap or promote within.

All I’m saying is that we don’t know what is going to happen with our backline. I would agree that it doesn’t look good at this stage (we would be near the bottom) but let’s re-evaluate at the end of next year.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Seiffert82 »

Is Justin Olam now considered an elite player?
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by julian87 »

Seiffert82 wrote: October 8, 2020, 6:46 am Is Justin Olam now considered an elite player?
I think he has a long way to go to get there with genuine pundits. Playing centre or second row for Melbourne is probably the easiest attacking position to look good in in the competition.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Seiffert82 »

julian87 wrote: October 8, 2020, 7:09 am
Seiffert82 wrote: October 8, 2020, 6:46 am Is Justin Olam now considered an elite player?
I think he has a long way to go to get there with genuine pundits. Playing centre or second row for Melbourne is probably the easiest attacking position to look good in in the competition.
Yeah, I just don't see it. He has had one try assist this season and his defence can look incredibly ordinary against decent opposition. The bloke has a solid running game - which as you say can always look damaging at centre or second row in that Melbourne setup. That's it.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by julian87 »

I think the Melbourne system pulling the wool will be even more evident when Brenko Lee is named in the Qld Origin squad in a few weeks tbh.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Colk »

julian87 wrote: October 8, 2020, 7:31 am I think the Melbourne system pulling the wool will be even more evident when Brenko Lee is named in the Qld Origin squad in a few weeks tbh.
Exactly
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Seiffert82 »

Brenko Lee. ****.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by BadnMean »

Seiffert82 wrote: October 8, 2020, 6:46 am Is Justin Olam now considered an elite player?
I didn't say he was an elite player. When assessing the attacking threats in backlines, I rightly pointed out that as a centre he's had a back half ofthe season as good as anyone and better than 90% of the comp in attack.

But you guys go wherever you want with it. (I do think Olam has developed really well and is rapidly expanding his game and improving his positional and decision making play)

Brenk gets brought up... again... the point was that whatever other dross is around, other teams have some outright attacking stars in the back 5. We do not (sans Cotric).

The point was not they are ALL stars. Or whether they just look like stars when playing for MElbourbe- i wouldnt have to make the point if OUR guys looked like stars when playign for us and no one else.

If Cotric goes and looks awful for Dogs, it won't change the fact we've lost a very good player and replaced him with no one and that we have what looks like- on paper, the least threatening backline of any top 6 team next year.


(cue for people start trying to tell me Latrell can't play because he simultaneously manages to top all try and line break assist charts while doing nothing for his team...)
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Colk »

BadnMean wrote: October 8, 2020, 9:43 am
Seiffert82 wrote: October 8, 2020, 6:46 am Is Justin Olam now considered an elite player?
I didn't say he was an elite player. When assessing the attacking threats in backlines, I rightly pointed out that as a centre he's had a back half ofthe season as good as anyone and better than 90% of the comp in attack.

But you guys go wherever you want with it. (I do think Olam has developed really well and is rapidly expanding his game and improving his positional and decision making play)

Brenk gets brought up... again... the point was that whatever other dross is around, other teams have some outright attacking stars in the back 5. We do not (sans Cotric).

The point was not they are ALL stars. Or whether they just look like stars when playing for MElbourbe- i wouldnt have to make the point if OUR guys looked like stars when playign for us and no one else.

If Cotric goes and looks awful for Dogs, it won't change the fact we've lost a very good player and replaced him with no one and that we have what looks like- on paper, the least threatening backline of any top 6 team next year.


(cue for people start trying to tell me Latrell can't play because he simultaneously manages to top all try and line break assist charts while doing nothing for his team...)
I do agree with the fact that on paper we don’t look threatening at all and I’m concerned by that fact. But it seems like the club are quite optimistic about some of our young backs - let’s hope that some of them progress as well as some examples from other clubs
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by BadnMean »

I'm actually excited about Timoko or HSS too. Could be good.

I'm a bit disappointed CNK's ball playing hasn't emerged yet. We may be approaching a ceiling there.

I was very high on Simo his first year- he did some remarkable things actually. But he didn't manage to make an impact at all this year, which leaves guys like Semi right in the hunt for his spot.

Hopefully Rapana will wind back the clock vs Chooks and make me look a goose.
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Re: Raiders player signing speculation 2020

Post by Dusty »

If all are fit and healthy our top side and the Reserves could look very strong:

1. CNK
2. Valemei
3. Croker
4. Scott
5. Rapana
6. Wighton
7. G. Williams
8. Papalii
9. Hodgson
10. Lui
11. CHN
12. Whitehead
13. Tapine

14. Starling
15. Young
16. Horsburgh
17. Guler


Reserve Grade

1. Simmonson
2.
3. HSS
4. Timoko
5. Oldfield
6. Frawley
7. S.Williams
8. James
9. Havili
10. Soliola
11. ODonnell
12. Medlyn
13. Sutton


Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
2020: 1. Nicol-Klokstad 2. Cotric 3. Croker (c) 4 Leilua 5. Scott 6. Wighton 7. G. Williams 8. Papalii 9. Hodgson (c) 10. Sutton 11. J. Bateman 12. Whitehead 13. Tapine ----
14. Simmonson 15. Soliola 16. Guler 17. Horsburgh
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