2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

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Who will win?

Raiders 13+
8
50%
Raiders 1-12
4
25%
Draw
1
6%
Warriors 1-12
2
13%
Warriors 13+
1
6%
 
Total votes: 16

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Azza
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Azza » September 5, 2019, 9:58 pm

Good. It's good for us to be playing for something rather than playing a pointless game.

If we drop the game on Saturday we are muppets

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by PigRickman » September 5, 2019, 9:59 pm

gangrenous wrote:
September 5, 2019, 9:56 pm
Winning just became important again Image
It really did. We need to win and get this this trashbag Roosters unit and put them to the sword... but i might be tilting
haha

who cares... GE is right, to win the comp we're going to have go through BOTH the roosters and storm. Whatever the order they come, they come.
Just win, Baby
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by greeneyed » September 5, 2019, 10:14 pm

Azza wrote:
September 5, 2019, 9:58 pm
Good. It's good for us to be playing for something rather than playing a pointless game.

If we drop the game on Saturday we are muppets
I agree with the first sentence in particular.
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by The Rickman » September 5, 2019, 10:29 pm

greeneyed wrote:
September 5, 2019, 10:14 pm
Azza wrote:
September 5, 2019, 9:58 pm
Good. It's good for us to be playing for something rather than playing a pointless game.

If we drop the game on Saturday we are muppets
I agree with the first sentence in particular.
I agree more with the second line and believe all those advocating for us losing are also muppets.
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by RedRaider » September 5, 2019, 10:32 pm

I can't think of anytime when we shouldn't do everything we can to win. Each game matters as does winning. It sure beats the alternative.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by greeneyed » September 5, 2019, 10:37 pm

RedRaider wrote:
September 5, 2019, 10:32 pm
I can't think of anytime when we shouldn't do everything we can to win. Each game matters as does winning. It sure beats the alternative.
Agree.
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Woodgers » September 5, 2019, 10:49 pm

Thinking like that literally cost this club a premiership in 1993.

Again i'm utterly surprised that people do not think our fringe side can't beat the a Warriors side with nothing to play for at home. Imagine thrashing Warriors 40-10 but losing Wighton or Papali for the season?

The major key to this finals series is winning week 1 so we play at home week 3 with everyone primed. It's astonishing to me that people can't see through the trees and just want to get a meaningless 2 points at home to the Warriors. It's not a losing mentality whatsoever, the players that take the park on Saturday are there to win and are capable of doing so. It's acknowledging that the 25 rounds have been accomplished and we've done a job, and prepping best for the next 4 weeks which is a new comp.
We continue to **** about with blokes that are part of some fraternity. It's infuriating.

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Azza
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Azza » September 5, 2019, 10:56 pm

It's not a meaningless 2 points now however. Third place is up for grabs and we should go for it hell for leather. I'm still fine with resting players if they are genuinely in need of one but that's it. Other than that we are going out there to win, full stop.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Woodgers » September 5, 2019, 11:57 pm

So basically unless you hang your hat on 3rd or 4th Place (which everyone will remember), we’re putting in effort because we believe Roosters in Sydney is easier than Storm in Melbourne?

For some unknown reason I feel like we’re a better chance winning next week in Sydney, but I’m still in the camp to rest players and minimise risk.
We continue to **** about with blokes that are part of some fraternity. It's infuriating.

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Azza
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Azza » September 6, 2019, 12:10 am

yes I believe playing the roosters would be the better option but regardless we should just focus on winning and forget about everything else

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greeneyed
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by greeneyed » September 6, 2019, 12:22 am

Azza wrote:
September 6, 2019, 12:10 am
yes I believe playing the roosters would be the better option but regardless we should just focus on winning and forget about everything else
Exactly. You don’t take the foot off the accelerator at this stage of the season. Especially not now.
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by RedRaider » September 6, 2019, 1:57 am

Can't agree Woodgers. In 1993 the game had been well won long before Sticky was injured. He should have been replaced. Imo that should have been first Raiders try after half time.

If we are in a similar position on Saturday I think Sticky will give longer minutes to the bench players. But we have to get to that position first. I don't think the Warriors should be dismissed as easy beats. If a side doesn't show respect for the opposition then they are one step towards defeat. The focus has to be on getting the job done and having key players on the park is essential for that outcome. We have rested 4 injured players and have BJ suspended and Tapine injured. We are nowhere near full strength. We shouldn't be fearful of what hasn't happened ie possible injury. Even at training the players are a chance of injury, but we can't have them not training for fear of injury.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by GreenMachine » September 6, 2019, 6:21 am

hobbsy wrote:
September 5, 2019, 9:26 pm
If you can't see the importance of continuing winning in this competition you haven't been paying attention.
Please explain it to me.
Roosters lost last night. Should we put a red line through them now?

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by gangrenous » September 6, 2019, 6:26 am

The Rickman wrote: I agree more with the second line and believe all those advocating for us losing are also muppets.
Who is doing that? Or is this typical StrawNickman?

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by GreenMachine » September 6, 2019, 6:30 am

gangrenous wrote:
September 6, 2019, 6:26 am
The Rickman wrote: I agree more with the second line and believe all those advocating for us losing are also muppets.
Who is doing that? Or is this typical StrawNickman?
It amazes me that comprehension levels are sill so low in Australia.
I can’t recall one person saying we need to lose the game.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by hobbsy » September 6, 2019, 6:57 am

GreenMachine wrote:
September 6, 2019, 6:21 am
hobbsy wrote:
September 5, 2019, 9:26 pm
If you can't see the importance of continuing winning in this competition you haven't been paying attention.
Please explain it to me.
Roosters lost last night. Should we put a red line through them now?
I've already posted explaining it, but again, momentum is massive. There are so many teams in this competition who can beat anyone if they are in form. We've seen it happen numerous times this year. Last night's game is actually a great example. A few weeks ago the Rabbits were in a shocking spot, they didn't just turn up last night and magically flick a switch, they built into form with a couple wins (against the Warriors last week no less) and were able to play to their abilities again. The Roosters lost but they didn't go out with a reserve grade side either, their major players played together in a good hard game against their biggest rivals, not really the same thing as our situation this weekend.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by GreenMachine » September 6, 2019, 7:07 am

hobbsy wrote:
September 6, 2019, 6:57 am
GreenMachine wrote:
September 6, 2019, 6:21 am
hobbsy wrote:
September 5, 2019, 9:26 pm
If you can't see the importance of continuing winning in this competition you haven't been paying attention.
Please explain it to me.
Roosters lost last night. Should we put a red line through them now?
I've already posted explaining it, but again, momentum is massive. There are so many teams in this competition who can beat anyone if they are in form. We've seen it happen numerous times this year. Last night's game is actually a great example. A few weeks ago the Rabbits were in a shocking spot, they didn't just turn up last night and magically flick a switch, they built into form with a couple wins (against the Warriors last week no less) and were able to play to their abilities again. The Roosters lost but they didn't go out with a reserve grade side either, their major players played together in a good hard game against their biggest rivals, not really the same thing as our situation this weekend.
We’ve spent the last month playing ‘good hard games’ against our top 4 rivals with our best team.
Fatigue, and fatigue related injuries are real. Take a look at Manly now.
On top of that, I don’t think anyone is saying ‘lose the game’ and stall momentum.

The only debate, as I see it, is whether more players are rested or not, due to the fact that we won’t drop out of the top 4.

A separate debate about possibly losing the match (due to running an inexperienced team) equating to losing momentum is also being discussed.

I tend to agree with those who have said if our mental focus and preparation is so poor, that should we drop against the Warriors, our season would be derailed. Then we were never contenders to begin with.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Coastalraider » September 6, 2019, 7:26 am

Im fine with the 4 boys not named getting a rest, they all look like they need it.

But Im torn on resting any others - I totally understand the cotton wool approach to our superstars, but have a read of the Bellamy piece earlier this week in regards to resting players before the finals. i would hate for us to loose one of our most influential players this week.

But on the other hand, momentum is exceptionally important, and Im look ing further than next week.

Let use this example - we rest Hodgo, Jack, Papa etc this week. Great, they will be fresh for next week. Now lets say off the back of that rest we win week 1 of the finals. Thats awesome, we have earned a week off and get a straight shot at the Prelims.

Then we go into the prelims with the core of our talent only having played 2 games in a month.

Bellyache has already used that exact example of how they missed the GF de to lack of momentum hurting their side.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by hobbsy » September 6, 2019, 7:30 am

GreenMachine wrote:
September 6, 2019, 7:07 am
hobbsy wrote:
September 6, 2019, 6:57 am
GreenMachine wrote:
September 6, 2019, 6:21 am
hobbsy wrote:
September 5, 2019, 9:26 pm
If you can't see the importance of continuing winning in this competition you haven't been paying attention.
Please explain it to me.
Roosters lost last night. Should we put a red line through them now?
I've already posted explaining it, but again, momentum is massive. There are so many teams in this competition who can beat anyone if they are in form. We've seen it happen numerous times this year. Last night's game is actually a great example. A few weeks ago the Rabbits were in a shocking spot, they didn't just turn up last night and magically flick a switch, they built into form with a couple wins (against the Warriors last week no less) and were able to play to their abilities again. The Roosters lost but they didn't go out with a reserve grade side either, their major players played together in a good hard game against their biggest rivals, not really the same thing as our situation this weekend.
We’ve spent the last month playing ‘good hard games’ against our top 4 rivals with our best team.
Fatigue, and fatigue related injuries are real. Take a look at Manly now.
On top of that, I don’t think anyone is saying ‘lose the game’ and stall momentum.

The only debate, as I see it, is whether more players are rested or not, due to the fact that we won’t drop out of the top 4.

A separate debate about possibly losing the match (due to running an inexperienced team) equating to losing momentum is also being discussed.

I tend to agree with those who have said if our mental focus and preparation is so poor, that should we drop against the Warriors, our season would be derailed. Then we were never contenders to begin with.
I completely understand the concern regarding the potential for injuries, and Ive got no problem with managing players who are carrying a niggle or are fatigued to the point they cant put in 100%. I guess it comes down to what you consider more important, the risk of injury or keeping momentum.

For mine, as others have said, injuries can happen at any time, even on the training paddock. Those games also showed us that starting a bit flat against those teams can put you in a position you won't want to be in during the finals. Personally I'd rather run the risk we run every day and ensure that the players are playing together consistently and playing well in the lead up to the big games.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Dusty » September 6, 2019, 7:38 am

I hope we get 3rd for a few reasons...

1. It’s in Sydney and I’ll be able to travel down to the match.

2. I think they are a little vulnerable after last night (a couple of injuries and possible suspensions).


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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Neeeegz » September 6, 2019, 7:52 am

Finchy wrote:
Neeeegz wrote:
September 5, 2019, 7:47 pm
Finchy wrote:
Neeeegz wrote:
September 3, 2019, 9:45 pm
Matt wrote: I'd take Sutton over Liu TBH
Why ? May I ask ?

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Because Sutton plays for us, Liu plays for the Roosters.
Sorry, missed the spelling, I wasn't talking about any other teams players.
I'll type slower next time.

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2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by gangrenous » September 6, 2019, 7:52 am

Coastalraider wrote: Bellyache has already used that exact example of how they missed the GF de to lack of momentum hurting their side.
But the flip side of that is putting yourself in the best position to win next week. There’s no point worrying about only playing 2 games in a month if you’re so stuffed you lose the first round anyway. Look how wonderfully the strategy of peaking for the finals worked in 2017! That’s what happens when you worry about consequences of winning important games before it happens.

Our side has been smashed the last month and the only way to fix that, and our best shot at winning week 1 of the finals imo, is to rest up a bit.

If we do end up winning we can try to address that by playing an opposed game in the week between perhaps. It’s not the best, but it’s something. If we play everyone without rest and lose, how do you recuperate that in between?!

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Mickey_Raider » September 6, 2019, 8:21 am

We really couldn’t have asked for a better outcome last night. Bruising game and roosters came out of it with MRC and injury concerns.
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Ruben Daley » September 6, 2019, 8:51 am

Woodgers wrote:
September 4, 2019, 1:06 pm
Ruben Daley wrote:
September 4, 2019, 12:05 pm
No way Ricky is taking this game lightly. It's just not his style.

Resting guys with niggles just shows he thinks we are a legitimate chance of going the whole way and is planning for another month of footy.

And I don't see how resting those guys means the rest of the team will phone it in. Most of the guys coming in will be playing their guts out to show Ricky they're the man if there's a sniff of an opportunity during the finals.

The majority of the team is unchanged and they will be totally focused on executing the game plan they've fallen away from at times over the last few weeks. I reckon Ricky will have told Hodgo and the halves to ensure every set ends with a decent option.
Yeah I agree with this 100% and the point I was going to make is the same one you've made, putting the onus on the regular bench and fringe players to come in and see the regular season out on behalf of their mates can't be underestimated. To Ricky's credit this is a club, not a 1st grade team and they look like a group playing for each other. It's beneficial that we get more run in the legs of guys like Havili, Horse, Lui and even Sam Williams who could be called upon for a bigger role in the finals. Personally I wouldn't be playing Papa, Hodgson or Wighton either and I still think the replacements could come in and do a job against the Warriors, and that isn't taking the Warriors lightly and throwing away 2 points, I genuinely think we can get what we want out of the game with minimal risk to the overall goal. I also think it would be beneficial especially after the events of last week to give Sezer the keys and let him run the show, I don't think that is breaking any combos but moreso preparing him for the next month and getting his hands on the ball more.

As has been mentioned multiple times, these chances are few and far between and i'm still not completely over being there in the outer ground in 1993 hearing Sticky screaming in pain in that final match against Parra. Personally I think minimising any of those big risks are worth it, even if we drop the game. I think the recent Storm and Sharks games have given us enough confidence and momentum to go all the way even if a few guys are wrapped in cotton wool for a week.

Assuming we play the Roosters week 1, it is fair to predict they are going to be in a heck of a game on Thursday against their arch rivals that have more to play for. Going in fresh against them in week 1 is potentially the key to the entire finals series, we win that game next week and we are in with the biggest shout in over 2 decades, even moreso than 2016 with a home prelim on the horizon. This could be one of the few exception to the age old cliche of taking it a week at a time.
Your prediction about last night's game was spot-on. Not only did the Roosters lose, it was a bloodbath. They'll have a longer turnaround but there'll still be a few of them carrying niggles. I particularly noted Cronk looking dusty right at the end.

The brutality of last night just confirmed how easy it is to lose players to injury and suspension. Every second guy went down with an HIA. I don't normally go for conservative tactics but this is the exception. Like you, I actually worry a bit about the big guns we still have playing. But I'm comfortable with the balance Ricky has gone for.

I remember that 1993 game too. It was one of the greatest shifts from party atmosphere at the million tries we scored to absolute horror at seeing Ricky writhing on the ground. I have no doubt we would have won the premiership that year had Ricky been fit.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Woodgers » September 6, 2019, 9:44 am

RedRaider wrote:
September 6, 2019, 1:57 am
Can't agree Woodgers. In 1993 the game had been well won long before Sticky was injured. He should have been replaced. Imo that should have been first Raiders try after half time.

If we are in a similar position on Saturday I think Sticky will give longer minutes to the bench players. But we have to get to that position first. I don't think the Warriors should be dismissed as easy beats. If a side doesn't show respect for the opposition then they are one step towards defeat. The focus has to be on getting the job done and having key players on the park is essential for that outcome. We have rested 4 injured players and have BJ suspended and Tapine injured. We are nowhere near full strength. We shouldn't be fearful of what hasn't happened ie possible injury. Even at training the players are a chance of injury, but we can't have them not training for fear of injury.
I'm not going to die on this hill, for me it isn't the end of the world if we do or don't rest more players but I do want to reiterate that I don't think Ricky or the players or myself in this instance are dismissing Warriors as easybeats, my position is I think we can get what we want out of the game anyhow with the mix of regular first graders and fringe players. I don't think resting players doesn't show the Warriors respect, the side of the fence i'm on is i'm respecting the players in the squad to get the job done for their mates.

The point on Sticky being replaced in 1993 is a sliding doors thing. Yes he should have been replaced earlier but hypothetically he could have done the injury in the first minute. We're using hindsight saying he should have been replaced but Sheens could have mitigated that risk before the game. And while I do also agree players can get injured at training or other recreational activities, it's fair to say that you're more risk of getting a serious injury in an NRL match than in other parts of your life.
We continue to **** about with blokes that are part of some fraternity. It's infuriating.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by The Rickman » September 6, 2019, 9:53 am

GreenMachine wrote:
September 6, 2019, 6:30 am
gangrenous wrote:
September 6, 2019, 6:26 am
The Rickman wrote: I agree more with the second line and believe all those advocating for us losing are also muppets.
Who is doing that? Or is this typical StrawNickman?
It amazes me that comprehension levels are sill so low in Australia.
I can’t recall one person saying we need to lose the game.
Hahaha the ***by levels are absolutely through the roof on these two posts. Sensational stuff for a Friday morning.
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by GreenMachine » September 6, 2019, 10:25 am

Dusty wrote:
September 6, 2019, 7:38 am
I hope we get 3rd for a few reasons...

1. It’s in Sydney and I’ll be able to travel down to the match.

2. I think they are a little vulnerable after last night (a couple of injuries and possible suspensions).


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Agree.
Great opportunity, notwithstanding the fact the Roosters will want to bounce back.
I think most people wanted us to take on the Roosters irrespective of what occurred this weekend.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by dubby » September 6, 2019, 10:26 am

The team will be focused in defeating the warriors tomorrow.

They'll be up for it.

No matter who we play in the finals it will be tough. We need to be at full strength for that.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by -PJ- » September 6, 2019, 10:48 am

Finishing 3rd is way better than finishing 4th.

No one remembers who ran 4th.

Home ground, healthy crowd, family friendly time slot, plenty to play for..

AND..Guttriss on the horn..beautiful !!
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by woppadingo » September 6, 2019, 10:53 am

Three of the four players being rested look like they need it. Soliola is old and is important to our finals campaign so I have no issue with him being rested aswell.
No others are being rested so I dont see the reason for all the arguing over whether they should be. If we are well ahead and in control during the Warriors game I have no issue with one or two other critical players being given a spell as well.
I think Ricky has the balance right.
Definitely think playing the Rooters in week 1 is the preferred option. We have a better chance against them with their injuries and possible suspensions. That could change if the Storm lose Cam Smith but that is unlikely and out of our control. Play what is in front of us and it will take care of itself.
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Azza » September 6, 2019, 10:56 am

Agreed. Storm in a teacup.

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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by Billy Walker » September 6, 2019, 11:48 am

Of course we want to win. I think momentum is very important, but I’m sure if you go back through time you will find plenty of examples of everything - teams that prevailed following “the loss we had to have”, teams that fell off the rails after a momentum busting loss. Teams that benefited from a week off and others that thrived on getting to the GF the hard way. All teams are different and there’s no magic formula to it all but I don’t think any Raiders fan would complain if we just won every game between now and pre-season 2020!

TongueFTW
Simon Woolford
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by TongueFTW » September 6, 2019, 2:35 pm

Given Stuart has kept Starling and Rapana on the extended bench, you would have to think they are some chance of coming in for Hodgson and Kris. Might be:

1. Bailey Simonsson
2. Michael Oldfield
3. Jarrod Croker (C)
4. Nick Cotric
20. Jordan Rapana
6. Jack Wighton
7. Aidan Sezer
8. Josh Papalii
14. Siliva Havili
10. Dunamis Lui
11. Hudson Young
12. Elliott Whitehead
13. Ryan Sutton

21. Tom Starling
15. Emre Guler
16. Corey Horsburgh
17. JJ Collins

Would still be a handy side that should beat the Warriors. I am concerned a little by Simonsson under the high ball, but I guess he can move Oldfield there if there are issues defensively.

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greeneyed
Don Furner
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by greeneyed » September 6, 2019, 2:42 pm

TongueFTW wrote:Given Stuart has kept Starling and Rapana on the extended bench, you would have to think they are some chance of coming in for Hodgson and Kris. Might be:

1. Bailey Simonsson
2. Michael Oldfield
3. Jarrod Croker (C)
4. Nick Cotric
20. Jordan Rapana
6. Jack Wighton
7. Aidan Sezer
8. Josh Papalii
14. Siliva Havili
10. Dunamis Lui
11. Hudson Young
12. Elliott Whitehead
13. Ryan Sutton

21. Tom Starling
15. Emre Guler
16. Corey Horsburgh
17. JJ Collins

Would still be a handy side that should beat the Warriors. I am concerned a little by Simonsson under the high ball, but I guess he can move Oldfield there if there are issues defensively.
I don’t think Rapana is any chance of coming in. He’s been playing injured for half the season.


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-PJ-
Laurie Daley
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Re: 2019 Rd 25 V Warriors: Teams and Previews *Teams p1*

Post by -PJ- » September 6, 2019, 2:48 pm

I can't see Rapa playing either Fergus.
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