Retain or release?

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greeneyed
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Retain or release?

Post by greeneyed » August 29, 2019, 1:07 pm


According to Big League, we so far have one gain (George Williams),no losses and these players off contract. Who should be retained or released?

Luke Bateman
Royce Hunt
Sebastian Kris
Andre Niko
Brendan O’Hagan
Kyle Patterson
Reuben Porter
Jordan Rapana
Harley Smith Shields
Sam Williams


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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Matt » August 29, 2019, 1:17 pm

Hasnt the club said the are interested or stated talks with Rapana, Bateman and Williams?

Anyway, my 2 cents:
Bateman - 100% cap based. IMO he would need to be a 23-30 type guy, as in bottom quarter of the 30 man squad cap wise. If so, retain, if not release.
Hunt - never cracked the grade, and doesn't fit Ricky's new forwards template, release.
Kris - got a taste this yr, Id retain as depth.
Niko - Has been good at Mounties. Retain probably.
O'Hagan - Ive heard he has regressed/ not improved this yr. I think this is yr 2 at the club. Tempted to release, but halves are tricky.
Patterson - Havent heard enough to know TBH.
Porter - Was upgraded to top 30. Jr rep player. I think you retain.
Rapana - Depends if you are going to retain BJ IMO. They are better together than apart. Id retain though.
Shields - Massive wraps. Id keep.
Williams - Depends on Sezer. I suspect we let Sezer move on, so we keep Sammy. But if he is happy to play reserve grade, let Sammy can walk.

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Retain or release?

Post by greeneyed » August 29, 2019, 1:18 pm

Matt wrote:Hasnt the club said the are interested or started talks with Rapana, Bateman and Williams?
Yes.



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Re: Retain or release?

Post by -TW- » August 29, 2019, 1:23 pm


greeneyed wrote:According to Big League, we so far have one gain (George Williams),no losses and these players off contract. Who should be retained or released?

Luke Bateman - no deal
Royce Hunt - no deal, would keep at Mounties if he can't find another deal
Sebastian Kris - retain
Andre Niko - retain
Brendan O’Hagan - no deal
Kyle Patterson - not sure
Reuben Porter - not sure
Jordan Rapana - obvious retain
Harley Smith Shields - retain
Sam Williams - retain


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Re: Retain or release?

Post by zim » August 29, 2019, 1:36 pm

Luke Bateman - Retain on min wage.
Royce Hunt - Release. Time to try someone else. Hetherington is coming and Hunt looks like he could do with a push by moving to another club.
Sebastian Kris - Retain on min wage.
Andre Niko - Release unless you need to fill the squad then he's been fine.
Brendan O’Hagan - Release. Too many defensive issues and we need to see what Wescott can do. If we need a back up half to complement Sammy I'd rather sign Dean Matterson on min wage.
Kyle Patterson - Retain. Looks like a mini hodgo in 20s.
Reuben Porter - Retain.
Jordan Rapana - Retain.
Harley Smith Shields - Retain. Looks like Cotric in 20s. Give him Kris' spot if you need to.
Sam Williams - Retain. Don't expect Sezer to be here.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by PigRickman » August 29, 2019, 1:37 pm

In a vacuum if i ignore everything else except do i want these guys part of my top 30 squad?
i'd keep Bateman, Kris, Rapana, Sheilds (seems really highly rated by some here) and Williams.

I dont know enough on Porter, O'Hagan and Niko to say.

But if Kris gets a solid offer elsewhere you let him walk. If Bateman wont sign a league minimum deal, then you let him walk and maybe that deal gets slid to Hunt if the club likes him as a 6th middle?
You keep Rapana at 400k but probably let him walk at 500k. You keep Sam Williams on 200k and let him walk for anything over.

It's tough to say what to do with some of these players without knowing what the money is.
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Re: Retain or release?

Post by The Rickman » August 29, 2019, 2:22 pm

Jordy Raps you extend on up to about 500k, but I have to say his stocks appear to be rapidly declining... I wouldn't be keeping him at the expense of Simonsson, for example.

The rest of those guys would need to be pretty close to minimum wage for me to keep them, otherwise I'm swapping them out for minimum wage guys. We're going to need every dollar for upgrading the bigger names over the next few seasons.
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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Ronny P » August 29, 2019, 2:44 pm

Great thread!

Luke Bateman (Release)
Royce Hunt (Release)
Sebastian Kris (Release and replace with Niko who has thrived on a year with Mounties)
Andre Niko (push up to top 30 over Kris)
Brendan O’Hagan(Replace him with Westcott who deserves his chance at Cup. Ohagan has had his turn)
Kyle Patterson (Gun but who stays and who goes, him or Starling. My opinion is Patterson is a better player but interesting club decision)
Reuben Porter (Release)
Jordan Rapana (Release)
Harley Smith Shields(straight into top 30 for Abbey)
Sam Williams (isnt he going??)
Cant wait for this weekend to sledge Gallen regardless!


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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Northern Raider » August 29, 2019, 3:56 pm

With the exception of Rapana these are all reserve grade players. If we let them go we need to replace them with other reserve grade players. Unless somebody is detremental to the harmony of the squad (i.e. a bit of the ****) I'm not that fussed whether they are retained or released.
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Retain or release?

Post by greeneyed » August 29, 2019, 4:12 pm

Here’s my take...

Luke Bateman - retain on minimum deal only
Royce Hunt - Ricky Stuart has clearly decided he won’t play him in firsts, but he’s great for Mounties, encourage Mounties to sign him.
Sebastian Kris - retain
Andre Niko - currently a development player, hope he’s retained, perhaps another development contract
Brendan O’Hagan - again a development player, happy for another development contract if possible, but not showing enough for top 30
Kyle Patterson - development player, promote to top 30 if there’s space
Reuben Porter - encourage Mounties to sign him
Jordan Rapana - retain, but not at any price
Harley Smith Shields - development player, promote to top 30 if there’s space
Sam Williams - happy to keep Sam as the best back up in the business, Sezer may need to be released early though

Smith Shields and Patterson the stand out juniors to retain.



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Re: Retain or release?

Post by dubby » August 29, 2019, 5:08 pm

Jordy is a shadow of his former self.

Based on current form I'd release him. But I think injury has interfered with his form at present.

The rest I don't know enough about, and tend to think whatever.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Northern Raider » August 29, 2019, 5:45 pm

It does look like injury has limited Rapana this year. Up until that point he's been fantastic for us. I'm not about to cast him adrift only on his latest form.
His market value may have dropped and if so it should make his retention much easier.

In short, we now have a top 4 squad and I wouldn't be letting anybody go just to chase a shiny new play thing.
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Re: Retain or release?

Post by edwahu » August 29, 2019, 6:07 pm

I think Rapa gets a bit of a bum rap. He has lost a yard of pace but he still makes a lot of meters and his overall contribution last weekend was way ahead of Cotric for example. If his pace is gone forever then one thing I reckon may be worth trying is Simo to start and Rapa off the bench.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Ruben Daley » August 29, 2019, 6:36 pm

dubby wrote:
August 29, 2019, 5:08 pm
Jordy is a shadow of his former self.

Based on current form I'd release him. But I think injury has interfered with his form at present.

The rest I don't know enough about, and tend to think whatever.

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I definitely think it’s injury but also having four centres partners over the season, only one of whom can create for him really hurts. Additionally, the left is the main side for attack with Jack in the halves now, so the quantity and quality of ball going right has been low.

This combination of factors has made Rapa’s season really disjointed, so it’s no wonder he’s not at the standard we’ve come to expect.

He did make a huge bust out of nothing on the weekend when we really needed it and, had the play been allowed to continue after he got tackled following his quick tap, we probably would have scored.

Keep for sure.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Cranky Old Man » August 29, 2019, 6:48 pm

Rapana last year and beyond was the best winger in the NRL by a fair margin. Since then he has had injuries which have caused some drop in form and effectiveness, but he is still a top class NRL winger. But time, the enemy of all physical players, is not on his side. He probably only has three seasons at most left to him at the top level. He may never get back to the player he was, and a small improvement on this seasons form might be his ceiling from this point on.
The alternative player already in contention is obviously Simonnson, an exceptionally good athlete who seems to have ingested all the best attributes of Rapana this season and has obviously not wasted an opportunity to educate himself on the finer points of wing play from Rapana, Oldfield or even Cotric. He seems to have a great work ethic and a very professional outlook. He must be on the recruitment radar of just about every NRL club.
Those facts mark out the retention factors facing the club, and some difficult decisions need to be confronted. A "value adder" in Rapanas favour is his combination with Lealuia, which seems to be a real bonus at the moment, but that doesn't have an endless shelf life, Smith - Shields looms on the horizon, a generational player according to some close to the club and elsewhere.
I would be terribly sad to farewell Rapana, a player who has given me tremendous pleasure since his arrival, but it will happen soon. He may have a discounted value if he wishes to extend his stay.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by sprintman » August 29, 2019, 7:02 pm

Rapana release. Losing Simonsson would be criminal.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Ruben Daley » August 29, 2019, 7:19 pm

Cranky Old Man wrote:
August 29, 2019, 6:48 pm
Rapana last year and beyond was the best winger in the NRL by a fair margin. Since then he has had injuries which have caused some drop in form and effectiveness, but he is still a top class NRL winger. But time, the enemy of all physical players, is not on his side. He probably only has three seasons at most left to him at the top level. He may never get back to the player he was, and a small improvement on this seasons form might be his ceiling from this point on.
The alternative player already in contention is obviously Simonnson, an exceptionally good athlete who seems to have ingested all the best attributes of Rapana this season and has obviously not wasted an opportunity to educate himself on the finer points of wing play from Rapana, Oldfield or even Cotric. He seems to have a great work ethic and a very professional outlook. He must be on the recruitment radar of just about every NRL club.
Those facts mark out the retention factors facing the club, and some difficult decisions need to be confronted. A "value adder" in Rapanas favour is his combination with Lealuia, which seems to be a real bonus at the moment, but that doesn't have an endless shelf life, Smith - Shields looms on the horizon, a generational player according to some close to the club and elsewhere.
I would be terribly sad to farewell Rapana, a player who has given me tremendous pleasure since his arrival, but it will happen soon. He may have a discounted value if he wishes to extend his stay.
I'm a big Simonsson fan and he's got a huge ceiling. But he's still got a long way to go in terms of positioning, both in defence and attack, and he's not as natural a finisher as Rapa. I'm confident he'll get there but he's a natural athlete who's going to need to learn some fundamentals rather than a natural footballer. A good example of this is how he's yet to get himself in any sort of space to use his incredible speed.

So I think the club needs Rapa for next year while Simonsson continues to learn. Simonsson has already played 70%+ of games this season with all the same guys contending for spots, so he'll no doubt be getting a lot game time next year too.

After that, maybe the roles switch and Rapa becomes our back-up man.

I'd like to hear more about Smith-Shields, if anyone can expand.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by PigRickman » August 29, 2019, 7:30 pm

edwahu wrote:
August 29, 2019, 6:07 pm
I think Rapa gets a bit of a bum rap. He has lost a yard of pace but he still makes a lot of meters and his overall contribution last weekend was way ahead of Cotric for example. If his pace is gone forever then one thing I reckon may be worth trying is Simo to start and Rapa off the bench.
He used to be a player who could something out of nothing where as now he seems to just be a very good winger who'll finish everything he should and a few he shouldnt but perhaps his game breaking, create something out of nothing days are behind him now with age and injuries.
At the right price you could keep him for another 2 years imo, but how does that work from squad building with Simo, and then the next gen? I dont know. Some tough decisions to be made on Raps and Beej.
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Re: Retain or release?

Post by yeh raiders » August 29, 2019, 8:06 pm

More than happy to see us keep Rapana on good coin at least for next year.

Still think he has plenty to give, he hasn’t had a great run with injuries this year, looks like he needs an offseason to get the body right.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Billy Walker » August 29, 2019, 8:13 pm

dubby wrote:
August 29, 2019, 5:08 pm
Jordy is a shadow of his former self.

Based on current form I'd release him. But I think injury has interfered with his form at present.

The rest I don't know enough about, and tend to think whatever.

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X 2

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by julian87 » August 30, 2019, 6:43 am

Luke Bateman - Pretty simple. Retain if he’ll take min wage, move on if not.
Royce Hunt - Gone.
Sebastian Kris - Probably an unpopular opinion, but if we re-sign Rapana Kris is gone for mine. Centre is the least important position in rugby league atm and we’d already have Leilua, Croker, Cotric, Oldfield, Smith Shields and utilities to cover. Being a rigid specialist centre probably hurts Kris in this regard.
Andre Niko - If there’s a #30 spot for a back he’d be retained in top squad on min coin imo. If not you’d try to keep him as development.
Brendan O’Hagan - Gone
Kyle Patterson - Don’t know enough about him.
Reuben Porter - Probably retain one year.
Jordan Rapana - Retain. Given his price tag has probably plummeted we could really strike gold if he really comes good again.
Harley Smith Shields - Retain and promote to top squad in place of Abbey or Kris.
Sam Williams - Retain on low coin if Sezer is gone. If he won’t stay for 200k or so or lower you get someone else in who will.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by The Rickman » August 30, 2019, 6:44 am

Billy Walker wrote:
dubby wrote:
August 29, 2019, 5:08 pm
Jordy is a shadow of his former self.

Based on current form I'd release him. But I think injury has interfered with his form at present.

The rest I don't know enough about, and tend to think whatever.

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X 2
EDIT

If it were up to you we would’ve sacked Croker and Leilua this year, and now we’re adding Rapana to the list? What’s with you and our outside backs?

I’m starting to think you might be Michael Oldbeard’s mum
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Re: Retain or release?

Post by -PJ- » August 30, 2019, 7:19 am

dubby wrote:
August 29, 2019, 5:08 pm
Jordy is a shadow of his former self.

Based on current form I'd release him. But I think injury has interfered with his form at present.

The rest I don't know enough about, and tend to think whatever.

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Raps has been a little down on previous years..but the bar is set very high.

I think we're all waiting for him to flick the switch..

And he will..

Must keep imo.
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Re: Retain or release?

Post by dubby » August 30, 2019, 7:43 am

Yeah I've had a think, and realize that a good off season and time to heal will do him the world of wonders.

I'd love to see him stay another year or two

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by schnitzel » August 30, 2019, 8:01 am

Id be very interested to see how Rapana goes in the right centre position now that he has lost a yard of pace. I think he has the skills to create for his winger. Of course this relates to moving on Leilua

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by The Rickman » August 30, 2019, 9:07 am

dubby wrote:
August 30, 2019, 7:43 am
Yeah I've had a think, and realize that a good off season and time to heal will do him the world of wonders.

I'd love to see him stay another year or two

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That settles it, it's time to move him on!!

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by dubby » August 30, 2019, 9:28 am

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by GreenMachine » August 30, 2019, 10:53 am

sprintman wrote:
August 29, 2019, 7:02 pm
Rapana release. Losing Simonsson would be criminal.
I said this a few months back and nothing has changed my mind.
I would let Rapana go and continue to develop Simonsson.

The money saved could help upgrade CNK or be used to supplement a strong middle forward who could cushion the impact when Papalii is interchanged off.

I also note that Sezer should be allowed to leave and I'd be talent scouting the next 'good thing' in young halfback / play maker.

I would retain Williams on a minimum - break glass in case of emergency type role.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Billy Walker » August 30, 2019, 11:16 am

The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 9:07 am
dubby wrote:
August 30, 2019, 7:43 am
Yeah I've had a think, and realize that a good off season and time to heal will do him the world of wonders.

I'd love to see him stay another year or two

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That settles it, it's time to move him on!!

Sign me up for the gang, Billy Walker!
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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Billy Walker » August 30, 2019, 11:19 am

GreenMachine wrote:
August 30, 2019, 10:53 am
sprintman wrote:
August 29, 2019, 7:02 pm
Rapana release. Losing Simonsson would be criminal.
I said this a few months back and nothing has changed my mind.
I would let Rapana go and continue to develop Simonsson.

The money saved could help upgrade CNK or be used to supplement a strong middle forward who could cushion the impact when Papalii is interchanged off.

I also note that Sezer should be allowed to leave and I'd be talent scouting the next 'good thing' in young halfback / play maker.

I would retain Williams on a minimum - break glass in case of emergency type role.
I like this thinking GreenMachine.

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Re: Retain or release?

Post by The Rickman » August 30, 2019, 12:00 pm

Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 11:16 am
The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 9:07 am
dubby wrote:
August 30, 2019, 7:43 am
Yeah I've had a think, and realize that a good off season and time to heal will do him the world of wonders.

I'd love to see him stay another year or two

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That settles it, it's time to move him on!!

Sign me up for the gang, Billy Walker!
Can you ride a horse and fire a six shooter?

I only accept toughened folks in the gang that are driven to see green machine success and won’t by sidetracked by sentiment or affection.

The type of ruthless folk that wouldn’t blink about cutting Papa and Bateman if they strung together 2 bad games.

🤠
Can I ride a horse?? Sure I can!!

"Yippy whippy, whippy!"
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Re: Retain or release?

Post by Billy Walker » August 30, 2019, 1:03 pm

The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 12:00 pm
Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 11:16 am
The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 9:07 am
dubby wrote:
August 30, 2019, 7:43 am
Yeah I've had a think, and realize that a good off season and time to heal will do him the world of wonders.

I'd love to see him stay another year or two

Sent from my SM-G960F using The Greenhouse mobile app powered by Tapatalk
That settles it, it's time to move him on!!

Sign me up for the gang, Billy Walker!
Can you ride a horse and fire a six shooter?

I only accept toughened folks in the gang that are driven to see green machine success and won’t by sidetracked by sentiment or affection.

The type of ruthless folk that wouldn’t blink about cutting Papa and Bateman if they strung together 2 bad games.

🤠
Can I ride a horse?? Sure I can!!

"Yippy whippy, whippy!"
You’re in! Keep a keen eye out for underperformance and fire at will 😉

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Location: Greener pastures

Re: Retain or release?

Post by Northern Raider » August 30, 2019, 1:48 pm

Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 1:03 pm
The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 12:00 pm
Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 11:16 am
The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 9:07 am
dubby wrote:
August 30, 2019, 7:43 am
Yeah I've had a think, and realize that a good off season and time to heal will do him the world of wonders.

I'd love to see him stay another year or two

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That settles it, it's time to move him on!!

Sign me up for the gang, Billy Walker!
Can you ride a horse and fire a six shooter?

I only accept toughened folks in the gang that are driven to see green machine success and won’t by sidetracked by sentiment or affection.

The type of ruthless folk that wouldn’t blink about cutting Papa and Bateman if they strung together 2 bad games.

🤠
Can I ride a horse?? Sure I can!!

"Yippy whippy, whippy!"
You’re in! Keep a keen eye out for underperformance and fire at will 😉
He might need a crash course in blame laying and scapegoating.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.

Billy Walker
John Ferguson
Posts: 2778
Joined: April 29, 2017, 7:22 pm
Favourite Player: Ashley Gilbert

Re: Retain or release?

Post by Billy Walker » August 30, 2019, 2:19 pm

Northern Raider wrote:
August 30, 2019, 1:48 pm
Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 1:03 pm
The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 12:00 pm
Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 11:16 am
The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 9:07 am

That settles it, it's time to move him on!!

Sign me up for the gang, Billy Walker!
Can you ride a horse and fire a six shooter?

I only accept toughened folks in the gang that are driven to see green machine success and won’t by sidetracked by sentiment or affection.

The type of ruthless folk that wouldn’t blink about cutting Papa and Bateman if they strung together 2 bad games.

🤠
Can I ride a horse?? Sure I can!!

"Yippy whippy, whippy!"
You’re in! Keep a keen eye out for underperformance and fire at will 😉
He might need a crash course in blame laying and scapegoating.
Maybe - although I heard he’s pretty good at blame scaping and goat laying! 😂

User avatar
Northern Raider
Mal Meninga
Posts: 23078
Joined: June 19, 2007, 8:17 am
Favourite Player: Dean Lance
Location: Greener pastures

Re: Retain or release?

Post by Northern Raider » August 30, 2019, 2:55 pm

Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 2:19 pm
Northern Raider wrote:
August 30, 2019, 1:48 pm
Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 1:03 pm
The Rickman wrote:
August 30, 2019, 12:00 pm
Billy Walker wrote:
August 30, 2019, 11:16 am


Can you ride a horse and fire a six shooter?

I only accept toughened folks in the gang that are driven to see green machine success and won’t by sidetracked by sentiment or affection.

The type of ruthless folk that wouldn’t blink about cutting Papa and Bateman if they strung together 2 bad games.

🤠
Can I ride a horse?? Sure I can!!

"Yippy whippy, whippy!"
You’re in! Keep a keen eye out for underperformance and fire at will 😉
He might need a crash course in blame laying and scapegoating.
Maybe - although I heard he’s pretty good at blame scaping and goat laying! 😂
Regarding the latter, I'm fairly sure those charges were dropped due to a technicality.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.

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