2019 Rd 7 V Sea Eagles: Game Day

[Botman]

I think Guler will figure that out, he looks to me like an awkward bloke who hasnt quite figured out how to use his frame, he goes in too upright. Doesnt understand leverage yet. And he doesnt have the technique in defence that Horsburgh does, that's for sure and certain.

But look, both are really good young players that we should be excited about.

[Ruben Daley]

Yeah, definitely have Guler in front of Collins.

PigRickman - did you find Horsburgh impressive in the first few rounds?

I like him a lot
Very aggressive with ball in hand and loves it lay the wood in defence
He’s had a little youthful exuberance that got knocked out pretty quickly
I don’t think he’s as good with ball in hand as Guler but defensively he’s very stout
Horsburgh to me looks like a guy with a higher floor but lower ceiling, and Guler a higher ceiling but lower floor
If I had to bet on one to play 6-8 seasons of NRL footy I might take Hors, if i was betting on one to be a rep player, I’d take Guler

I guess I just prefer what Horsburgh brings to this squad at this stage. I will say though that I think they have similar ceilings. And because of his defence I think Guler has the lower floor.

Yeah, I’ve got to go the other way to PigRickman on that. I reckon Horsburgh’s ceiling is higher than Guler - though I really like Guler.

I think Horsburgh could be rep level.

[Wiki Special]

Yeah, definitely have Guler in front of Collins.

PigRickman - did you find Horsburgh impressive in the first few rounds?

I like him a lot
Very aggressive with ball in hand and loves it lay the wood in defence
He’s had a little youthful exuberance that got knocked out pretty quickly
I don’t think he’s as good with ball in hand as Guler but defensively he’s very stout
Horsburgh to me looks like a guy with a higher floor but lower ceiling, and Guler a higher ceiling but lower floor
If I had to bet on one to play 6-8 seasons of NRL footy I might take Hors, if i was betting on one to be a rep player, I’d take Guler

I guess I just prefer what Horsburgh brings to this squad at this stage. I will say though that I think they have similar ceilings. And because of his defence I think Guler has the lower floor.

Yeah, I’ve got to go the other way to PigRickman on that. I reckon Horsburgh’s ceiling is higher than Guler - though I really like Guler.

I think Horsburgh could be rep level.

I think Horsburgh has a big chance to play for QLD.

[Lui_Bon]

Not too worried about that loss. We were always going to have some bad days at the office, it's a long season. How we back up next week will count for more IMO.

I'm in full agreement. I'd like to blame refereeing but it was as good as you have any right to expect. And most of those penalties were stupidly self-inflicted. Let's hope that the team has a decent go in the hall of mirrors and gets it together in Wagga.

BTW, is Hodgson actually a bit ill? Without picking on his attacking choices, some of his defence was rubbish...

[LastRaider]

I’m in disagreement with everyone’s thought in “its only one game”. Manly lost their marque player who runs the entire team in Daly Cheery-Evans yet they still won.

Come on guys, when that happens we should really be putting the team away.


Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse

[Botman]

I'd argue we lost our marque player too, and much earlier. Haha.

[scooter]

We lost because...
- we made some poor decisions in attack
- we were ill disciplined
- we couldn't stop Manly offloading at will
- we couldn't get quick play the balls

Everyone knows the blueprint to beat the Raiders is to blunt our attack by denying us any quick play the ball at all cost. The new directive to not award too many penalties in order to 'let the game flow' allows teams to do this 'legally'.

On a different point, there were at least 2 instances where we couldn't take advantage of Manly's defence in disarray. One was when DCE got injured at the other end of field and the ref stopped play. Not much we can do about that. The other was when ref wanted to double check his held-up decision even though no one was claiming a try. The stoppage in play allowed Manly to reset their defence and we had to start from scratch again.

My view has always been if the player with the ball is not claiming a try, then just play on. I thought James Fisher-Harris was harshly penalised for double movement the other night. He wasn't even trying to score.

Also, the Cotric penalty for passing off the ground was harsh too. What's wrong witj telling him to go back and play the ball. Not like we woukd get any advantages out of it. It is now common practice to instruct players to go back and play the ball again on the mark, so why not in this instance!?

[Raider47]

Bit worried about today's results in terms of what it means for the next month and thereafter. Could easily start a 4 game losing streak with our run coming up. Games like that are ones we really need to be winning if we want to be in and around the top 4 this season. I'm still very unconvinced we will be.

Doubly concerning as we were up against a DCE, Trbo-minus Manly.

[Botman]

My view has always been if the player with the ball is not claiming a try, then just play on. I thought James Fisher-Harris was harshly penalised for double movement the other night. He wasn't even trying to score.

Also, the Cotric penalty for passing off the ground was harsh too. What's wrong witj telling him to go back and play the ball. Not like we woukd get any advantages out of it. It is now common practice to instruct players to go back and play the ball again on the mark, so why not in this instance!?

Im big on the first one, if the attacking team is trying to get on with the game, let em do it. They're not trying to claim a try, so let em go. I thought that really disadvantaged us.

No idea what you're on about in the second part. They'll let you go back to the mark for simultaneous call, and they're pretty relaxed on it, anything close will get you a re-do... he just straight up Rugby Union'd it. It wasn't close to simultaneous, he tackled and passed off the ground. It's just a brain snap.

[BJ]

Cotric pass off the ground was the correct call by the referees. Whether Manly was on side was another issue all together.

I’m pretty sure that’s what Cotric was complaining about.

[scooter]

My view has always been if the player with the ball is not claiming a try, then just play on. I thought James Fisher-Harris was harshly penalised for double movement the other night. He wasn't even trying to score.

Also, the Cotric penalty for passing off the ground was harsh too. What's wrong witj telling him to go back and play the ball. Not like we woukd get any advantages out of it. It is now common practice to instruct players to go back and play the ball again on the mark, so why not in this instance!?

Im big on the first one, if the attacking team is trying to get on with the game, let em do it. They're not trying to claim a try, so let em go. I thought that really disadvantaged us.

No idea what you're on about in the second part. They'll let you go back to the mark for simultaneous call, and they're pretty relaxed on it, anything close will get you a re-do... he just straight up Rugby Union'd it. It wasn't close to simultaneous, he tackled and passed off the ground. It's just a brain snap.

Yep, it was pretty obvious to us watching on tv that Cotric passed it off the ground. However i can understand why he thought he was still entitled to offload the ball... he thought he made a half break... and when you are spun around and falling, it is actually hard to know if a defender still has a hand on you.

I guess my point was what happened really wasn't fundamentally too different to when the ball carrier offloads AFTER the ref had called held. It used to be a penalty but the rule was 'relaxed' because players were claiming it was often hard to hear the ref. So in this case, the ref could have just blown the whistle, call the play back and tell the player to play the ball again.

At the end of the day, I agree that Cotric totally rugby unioned it. But i just feel that this is one rule that possibly could be modified to simplify it. At worst, maybe just make it a scrum or straight handover. A penalty is rather harsh. But hey, that's probably a discussion for another day (or season).

[greeneyed]

These days, a pass off the ground or after there is a call of held is very rare indeed. Usually, it is just sent back for the player to restart.

[Roger Kenworthy]

I have seen it penalised in one other instance this year. So they do still penalise it when it's off the ground rather than a simultaneous call of held.

[greeneyed]

They have had a *lot* of penalties. Whether or not they deserve them, they probably do, but it makes it hard to get any rhythm, compounds any tiredness

The one that really changed the tone of the match was the Manly centre running into BJ off the ball and getting a penalty out of it.

Just reading the thread from go to whoa for the first time... and I did LOL at that one!

[greeneyed]

Canberra Raiders hoping Jordan Rapana can heal quickly once more

Canberra coach Ricky Stuart will be sweating on scans for his international winger Jordan Rapana as the Raiders gear up for a difficult month of tough opponents.

"I don’t think it's broken. I think it's cartilage and if it's cartilage he'll be OK," Stuart said.

Read more: https://www.nrl.com/news/2019/04/28/rai ... once-more/

Cherry-Evans injury could jeopardise Origin chances: https://www.nrl.com/news/2019/04/28/che ... n-chances/

[Roger Kenworthy]

They have had a *lot* of penalties. Whether or not they deserve them, they probably do, but it makes it hard to get any rhythm, compounds any tiredness

The one that really changed the tone of the match was the Manly centre running into BJ off the ball and getting a penalty out of it.

Just reading the thread from go to whoa for the first time... and I did LOL at that one!

I stand by it. BJ made a misread but stopped and was stationary when Parker ran into him. You can't penalise him for not disappearing.

[greeneyed]

Oh... I genuinely thought you were joking!

[TongueFTW]

At the game in the stands, and both teams were standing consistently 1-2m in front with plenty of shenanigans in the ruck, we got pinged for it a couple of times but they didn't. They were offside a number of times after line breaks/quick play the balls with no penalties blown. Not a "ref's faulter" - we need to be better than that, and still had chances to win the game - their offloads killed us.

[gangrenous]

Oh... I genuinely thought you were joking!

He’s right, have a look at it.

[Wiki Special]

They have had a *lot* of penalties. Whether or not they deserve them, they probably do, but it makes it hard to get any rhythm, compounds any tiredness

The one that really changed the tone of the match was the Manly centre running into BJ off the ball and getting a penalty out of it.

Just reading the thread from go to whoa for the first time... and I did LOL at that one!

I stand by it. BJ made a misread but stopped and was stationary when Parker ran into him. You can't penalise him for not disappearing.

Yeah, I agree. Earlier I could only think of one penalty that we copped that was a dud but this one was also.

In saying that, by no means did the refs cost us the game. Manly frustrated us into losing our discipline and that is why we lost.

[Billy Walker]

They have had a *lot* of penalties. Whether or not they deserve them, they probably do, but it makes it hard to get any rhythm, compounds any tiredness

The one that really changed the tone of the match was the Manly centre running into BJ off the ball and getting a penalty out of it.

Just reading the thread from go to whoa for the first time... and I did LOL at that one!

EDIT

[Billy Walker]

They have had a *lot* of penalties. Whether or not they deserve them, they probably do, but it makes it hard to get any rhythm, compounds any tiredness

The one that really changed the tone of the match was the Manly centre running into BJ off the ball and getting a penalty out of it.

Just reading the thread from go to whoa for the first time... and I did LOL at that one!

EDIT

Although I see that post has now been replaced with EDIT hahaha

[Roger Kenworthy]

Oh... I genuinely thought you were joking!

He's pretty much moving towards his own goal line when they make contact. Soft.

[Billy Walker]

Oh... I genuinely thought you were joking!

He's pretty much moving towards his own goal line when they make contact. Soft.

I’m comfortable enough that’s a penalty. Also leaves his winger badly unmarked.

[Raiders666]

Can't say i didn't see this performance coming...I feel we didn't respect the Broncos last week and the same goes for Manly yesterday.
We went away from the patience game that worked so well for us the first few weeks and didn't play smart with the ball at all yesterday.
We looked clueless in the red zone and Hodgson really needs to just let the halves have the ball at times.. I think not taking the 2 was the biggest turning point in the game apart from the Rapana injury. It turned out to be an 8 point turnaround.
Just dumb and ill disciplined footy all round from the boys yesterday, I still thought we would be ok especially after DCE went off , but credit to Manly they really played with a great deal of heart considering the team they had on the park...Hopefuly it's the kick up the **** the team needs so they don't get caught up in the hype. We should have been way too strong for them yesterday....I guess it just proves you need to be at your best every week in the NRL

[Raiders666]

Also the outside backs need a lot more early ball...Do we ever let the ball go out the back? It does my bloody head in.
I think Ricky talking up how ugly Manly would play all weak really backfired on us

[yurithe1]

Also the outside backs need a lot more early ball...Do we ever let the ball go out the back? It does my bloody head in.
I think Ricky talking up how ugly Manly would play all weak really backfired on us

We tried to play Manly at their game, the way bottom of the eight teams would, instead of making them play us at our game for the entire game.

When we played our style, Jack got two and we scored one at the end.

Top four sides know they're good and force the opposition to adjust to them. Ricky's been coaching a team knocking at the door of the top 8 for too long.

[Botman]

Oh... I genuinely thought you were joking!

He's pretty much moving towards his own goal line when they make contact. Soft.

This is kind of where Joey's reputation (and one he's well and truly earned) hurts him a lot. I bet if that's Nic Cotric the penalty isn't blown.

[RedRaider]

Oh... I genuinely thought you were joking!

He's pretty much moving towards his own goal line when they make contact. Soft.

Nice tackle around the legs by Sam in conjunction with JB. Given our performance (Couldn't stop offloads/gain an advantage only to cough up the ball immediately - following 40/20 and Guler run from line drop out among others) cost us the match I don't think pointing the finger at Refs is going to do us any good. I hope the players and coaches use the result as a wake up call for the tough matches ahead.

[papabear]

Imo our problem isn’t so much no decoy runners it’s that our guys pass it to the decoys all the time so they ain’t decoys anymore.

Should make our decoys more effective when we do eventually go wide.

[pickles]

Without using it as an excuse the lopsided penalty count was uncharacteristic of other games that round and also across the season. Prior to yesterdays game we were averaging about 6 penalties conceded per game so we were almost double that at 13. There were 2 other games that had high penalty counts Tigers v Titans at 10-10 and Knights v Eels at 8-8. It was the biggest disparity between any 2 teams by a good margin.

Based on this I would have to agree with Stuart that it was just our turn rather than anything else.

Our tackle effectiveness was rubbish. Just over 80% when it has been well over 90% for most of the season. We also missed about 25% of our total missed tackles for the year yesterday. Our wins have come on the back of our defence and that is what really let us down yesterday.

[greeneyed]

I'd strongly recommend people have a look at the Annesley media briefing from today:

https://www.nrl.com/news/2019/04/29/gra ... --round-7/

He shows statistics on the number of play the balls that take longer than four seconds as a percentage of the total by team from the weekend. It shows why the referees have the Raiders in their sights on slow play the balls...

[Roger Kenworthy]

Oh... I genuinely thought you were joking!

He's pretty much moving towards his own goal line when they make contact. Soft.

This is kind of where Joey's reputation (and one he's well and truly earned) hurts him a lot. I bet if that's Nic Cotric the penalty isn't blown.

Agree. It's incidental contact if you look at the way their centre falls (and does his best Mark McLinden and stays down), but Joey was being a bit loose early on which probably had him on notice.

[greeneyed]

NRL.com power rankings

4. Canberra Raiders (4)
The Raiders have been excellent to start the year and don't lose much with the loss to Manly. I'm curious to see how they bounce back against the Panthers and even more curious to see if they're truly up to overcoming some heavy hitters like the Roosters and Rabbitohs. Those games will come and we'll see if they withstand the pressure, but they showed on the road that they can be had.

Read more: https://www.nrl.com/news/2019/04/29/res ... ea-eagles/

Raiders.com.au competition: Man of the Match vote: Raiders v Sea Eagles: https://www.raiders.com.au/news/2019/04 ... ea-eagles/

Match Gallery: Raiders v Sea Eagles: https://www.raiders.com.au/news/2019/04 ... ea-eagles/

Round 7 Moment of the week: Wighton's second try: https://www.raiders.com.au/news/2019/04 ... econd-try/

[The Nickman]

Oh... I genuinely thought you were joking!

He's pretty much moving towards his own goal line when they make contact. Soft.

This is kind of where Joey's reputation (and one he's well and truly earned) hurts him a lot. I bet if that's Nic Cotric the penalty isn't blown.

I'm obviously watching a completely different clip to you blokes, because I've watched it at least a dozen times now and it looks to me like Joey just comes straight in and shoulder charges the guy!

That's a penalty every day of the year.