Croker's kicking

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Manbush
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Manbush »

If Sezer was in the team there could be an argument for it but even out of form I’d trust Croker to kick ahead of anyone else in the 17.
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Croker's kicking

Post by LastRaider »

Manbush wrote:If Sezer was in the team there could be an argument for it but even out of form I’d trust Croker to kick ahead of anyone else in the 17.
Yep that’s it. There is no one else at the moment.

I can forgive misses at away games but when at home on the ground he practices on once a week he should be converting more than he is.

But I’m more concerned with Wighton at 5/8, I don’t think it is working...



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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by RedRaider »

There are areas for improvement in the Raiders in lots of parts of the game. Goal kicking for me at this point is just a matter of time before it comes good. JC's 'gidley flick' yesterday for the Nic Cotric TRY was fabulous. For much of this season so has been JCs one on one defence. If Sticky is concerned by it, he has Sam Williams to turn too, as he kicked very well at the back end of 2018.

Of larger concern was the lack of defensive shape to gift the Fifita and Bird tries to the Broncos. That will have been noted by every NRL coach.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Northern Raider »

Coastalraider wrote: April 22, 2019, 6:13 am
Seiffert82 wrote: April 22, 2019, 2:05 am Something is wrong with his form this season. Not sure if it's the kneecap thing, but he's stabbing at the ball and his follow-through sucks.

I hope the club has arranged for Halligan to come back in and do a few sessions with him. It's certainly not 100% right.
I agree mate, he looks amazingly tense when he is at the tee.

If he kicks at 80%, we lead the comp for the first time since 2005. I really wanted that yesterday.
A lot of unnecessary focus on being top of the ladder. Does anybody remember in any given year who leads the comp in mid April?
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by -PJ- »

Northern Raider wrote: April 22, 2019, 9:06 am
Coastalraider wrote: April 22, 2019, 6:13 am
Seiffert82 wrote: April 22, 2019, 2:05 am Something is wrong with his form this season. Not sure if it's the kneecap thing, but he's stabbing at the ball and his follow-through sucks.

I hope the club has arranged for Halligan to come back in and do a few sessions with him. It's certainly not 100% right.
I agree mate, he looks amazingly tense when he is at the tee.

If he kicks at 80%, we lead the comp for the first time since 2005. I really wanted that yesterday.
A lot of unnecessary focus on being top of the ladder. Does anybody remember in any given year who leads the comp in mid April?
StGeorge were on top of the NSWRL ladder in April 62.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Botman »

Northern Raider wrote: April 22, 2019, 9:06 am
Coastalraider wrote: April 22, 2019, 6:13 am
Seiffert82 wrote: April 22, 2019, 2:05 am Something is wrong with his form this season. Not sure if it's the kneecap thing, but he's stabbing at the ball and his follow-through sucks.

I hope the club has arranged for Halligan to come back in and do a few sessions with him. It's certainly not 100% right.
I agree mate, he looks amazingly tense when he is at the tee.

If he kicks at 80%, we lead the comp for the first time since 2005. I really wanted that yesterday.
A lot of unnecessary focus on being top of the ladder. Does anybody remember in any given year who leads the comp in mid April?
Not me, because it’s never been us!
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by reptar »

Northern Raider wrote:
Coastalraider wrote: April 22, 2019, 6:13 am
Seiffert82 wrote: April 22, 2019, 2:05 am Something is wrong with his form this season. Not sure if it's the kneecap thing, but he's stabbing at the ball and his follow-through sucks.

I hope the club has arranged for Halligan to come back in and do a few sessions with him. It's certainly not 100% right.
I agree mate, he looks amazingly tense when he is at the tee.

If he kicks at 80%, we lead the comp for the first time since 2005. I really wanted that yesterday.
A lot of unnecessary focus on being top of the ladder. Does anybody remember in any given year who leads the comp in mid April?
Most likely the Dragons.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by cat »

I am certainly not saying to drop him as kicker but i am surprised he hasn't passed on the gig mid game when he has missed a few

Sammy can kick and i think jack too

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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by FROG »

Sam Williams is statistically the best kicker at the club. Not saying I'd take it off toots but to say there is no alternative is not a true statement.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by raiderskater »

cat wrote: April 22, 2019, 9:49 am I am certainly not saying to drop him as kicker but i am surprised he hasn't passed on the gig mid game when he has missed a few
Because he's not going to get better as a kicker if he's not kicking!

I'm re-watching the game now and the first kick his axis is definitely twisted, it's not the smooth clean line we're used to. It's a confidence thing, I'm sure. Give him another couple of weeks, he'll come good. He's too good not to.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by BadnMean »

I'd just monitor at this stage. It would be odd if he couldn't get back to his usual 80%.

I don't like his kick offs though. I liked it when Rapana or someone who can roost high or hit weird floaters kicks off. Croker just kicks nice low straight conversion type kicks for them to catch.

Letting Jack do it would be a wild ride.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by julian87 »

BadnMean wrote: April 22, 2019, 10:27 am I'd just monitor at this stage. It would be odd if he couldn't get back to his usual 80%.

I don't like his kick offs though. I liked it when Rapana or someone who can roost high or hit weird floaters kicks off. Croker just kicks nice low straight conversion type kicks for them to catch.

Letting Jack do it would be a wild ride.
Agree on this. The kicks offs are ordinary. Flat and easy to catch for their back about 10 out every time.
well, I guess you could say that I'm buy curious.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Northern Raider »

julian87 wrote: April 22, 2019, 10:31 am
BadnMean wrote: April 22, 2019, 10:27 am I'd just monitor at this stage. It would be odd if he couldn't get back to his usual 80%.

I don't like his kick offs though. I liked it when Rapana or someone who can roost high or hit weird floaters kicks off. Croker just kicks nice low straight conversion type kicks for them to catch.

Letting Jack do it would be a wild ride.
Agree on this. The kicks offs are ordinary. Flat and easy to catch for their back about 10 out every time.
I'd recruit Kyle Feldt just for his kick offs.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Begbie »

No one is laying the boot in, just highlighting a concern and this forum is the place to do it. Croker would be the first to put his hand up to admit his goal kicking is not up to scratch at the moment. He's earnt the right to kick himself back into form, but if he can't then other options need to be explored.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by SeeBee101 »

I was actually thinking about this yesterday too. He is playing well but I have concerns that his injury he messed with his kicking action...


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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Brew »

Sam Williams was nailing them in the trial against Parra including a cracker from the sideline.
I guess we wait until it costs us a win


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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by woppadingo »

Yeh it has not cost us a game yet but it might have added a bit of pressure yesterday.
He's gotta be man enough to hand over the duties if his kicking doesn't come back.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by raidersmalt »

Waiting till it costs us a game is foolish.

If we genuinely want to have a crack this year we need every point we can get.

I would continue to monitor at this atge, but I'd be lining up alternatives and wouldn't hesitate to switch him out mid game if called for.

As for Williams being our best (statistically), that's true....but from memory that statistic is possibly misleading due to Williams only kicking about 5 or 6 in first grade games.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by edwahu »

Unless there is an injury you back a 10 season 80%+ kicker who is kicking at 65% to revert to the mean.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by FROG »

raidersmalt wrote: April 22, 2019, 10:47 pm Waiting till it costs us a game is foolish.

If we genuinely want to have a crack this year we need every point we can get.

I would continue to monitor at this atge, but I'd be lining up alternatives and wouldn't hesitate to switch him out mid game if called for.

As for Williams being our best (statistically), that's true....but from memory that statistic is possibly misleading due to Williams only kicking about 5 or 6 in first grade games.
Mate, Williams has kicked 25 goals for the raiders. When you include his goals that he kicked while in the UK, he has kicked over 70 goals and is statistically a better kicker than both sezer and croker
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by FROG »

edwahu wrote: April 22, 2019, 11:34 pm Unless there is an injury you back a 10 season 80%+ kicker who is kicking at 65% to revert to the mean.
I agree Ed
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Coastalraider »

FROG wrote: April 23, 2019, 2:11 am
edwahu wrote: April 22, 2019, 11:34 pm Unless there is an injury you back a 10 season 80%+ kicker who is kicking at 65% to revert to the mean.
I agree Ed
Agree, but that doesn’t mean you just leave it alone and hope it improves - extra sessions, sports psych and a Halligan Masterclass would all be possible moves to support him. Tell him you support him 100%, and as proof, give him access to every tool in the shed to help him out.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by raidersmalt »

FROG wrote: April 23, 2019, 2:11 am
raidersmalt wrote: April 22, 2019, 10:47 pm Waiting till it costs us a game is foolish.

If we genuinely want to have a crack this year we need every point we can get.

I would continue to monitor at this atge, but I'd be lining up alternatives and wouldn't hesitate to switch him out mid game if called for.

As for Williams being our best (statistically), that's true....but from memory that statistic is possibly misleading due to Williams only kicking about 5 or 6 in first grade games.
Mate, Williams has kicked 25 goals for the raiders. When you include his goals that he kicked while in the UK, he has kicked over 70 goals and is statistically a better kicker than both sezer and croker
So I just looked it up, 25/30. Not bad, but not as significant a sample as Crokers >800. I'm not saying it's wrong, it's just that it's a small sample size which may be misleading.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Matt »

I have 3 thoughts on this, 2 might explain a reason for his slump and the 3rd is stats based:
1. He kicked his best when we had Halligan on the staff working with our kickers. To the best of my knowledge he isnt ATM
2. He has had a couple of knee injuries. Whether he likes it or not, the muscle memory and body feel is different. You never quite go back to 'normal'. So slight differences in his body's bio-mechanics can make all the difference between kicking them and not, or hitting the post or not.
3. 80% career goal kickers don't turn to rubbish overnight. Its a slump, he will bounce back. Still on track to break the NRL scoring records
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by BadnMean »

But if it IS a little bio-mechanical difference that has crept in, what if he just goes back to being a 70%/75% kicker as he adjusts but never fully able to rectify...
That would be tricky...
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Postman Pat »

He’s hit some great pressure kicks over the years, he’ll be back.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by Botman »

BadnMean wrote: April 23, 2019, 7:47 pm But if it IS a little bio-mechanical difference that has crept in, what if he just goes back to being a 70%/75% kicker as he adjusts but never fully able to rectify...
That would be tricky...
If it's biomechanical issues, and tbh i think it is right now because he's stabbing at the ball at bit IMO, i'd chalk that up to the knee situation and as he gets more comfortable and confident he'll get back into his groove

Im not turfing the greatest pointer scorer the game has ever seen for a guy with 30 FG kicks to him name only 5 weeks into a rough spell.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by RedRaider »

I would stick with JC as the goal kicker. However, I think if we can arrange for Halligan to spend a day looking at his current technique, then I think it would be money well spent. Hopefully continuous improvement is part of the new culture at the Raiders. To me he is just a tweak away from 80% again. He was formerly comfortable with Halligan. Let's go back to the well.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by afgtnk »

Having watched Williams kick quite a bit in reserve grade as well, he is a suprisingly good goal kicker despite not having the greatest technique.

I suspect Croker may be having a few issues inside the head, to go with a minor technical flaw or two. To my knowledge kickers only get coached every so often, so hoping that Halligan or whoever is coaching them at the moment has been brought in to go over things.

He's got a great technique so you would think he will always bounce back given the foundations and experience he has.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by irvste »

BadnMean wrote:But if it IS a little bio-mechanical difference that has crept in, what if he just goes back to being a 70%/75% kicker as he adjusts but never fully able to rectify...
That would be tricky...
Storm should have sacked smith as kicker years ago then he only kicks at 74% Image its a concern but he'll come good

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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by BadnMean »

irvste wrote: April 23, 2019, 11:27 pm
BadnMean wrote:But if it IS a little bio-mechanical difference that has crept in, what if he just goes back to being a 70%/75% kicker as he adjusts but never fully able to rectify...
That would be tricky...
Storm should have sacked smith as kicker years ago then he only kicks at 74% Image its a concern but he'll come good

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If they have someone else who reliably kicks better then sure, they should have changed.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by The Nickman »

This thread is absolute garbage. Somebody want to do the stats on how many of our kicks have been from the sideline this year, because it seems like a lot, more than usual


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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by BadnMean »

Calm down. He's missed a few more than normal and a couple he might not normally miss. People are just speculating why or wondering what might fix it.

No-one is really calling for him not to kick- at most people are saying it's worth monitoring for another month or so.

Or wondering who else can kick if ever. No-one is trashing him. It's just a little sideline to the season so far.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by raiderskater »

Is this the new version of the Croker's captaincy thread, now that those jerks got what they wanted and we have co-captains?

I can't help but wonder if that's contributed to a lot of things I've noticed this year. Croker said in an interview he understands it's not a demotion but the heart isn't logical. It would fit with his new, seemingly desperate/aggressive defense AND a low-confidence approach to his kicking.
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Re: Croker's kicking

Post by zim »

afgtnk wrote: April 23, 2019, 8:30 pm Having watched Williams kick quite a bit in reserve grade as well, he is a suprisingly good goal kicker despite not having the greatest technique.

I suspect Croker may be having a few issues inside the head, to go with a minor technical flaw or two. To my knowledge kickers only get coached every so often, so hoping that Halligan or whoever is coaching them at the moment has been brought in to go over things.

He's got a great technique so you would think he will always bounce back given the foundations and experience he has.
Agree on Williams. Just looks uncomfortable. It never looks pretty but it's surprisingly effective. It's like he's had to teach himself how to kick goals and by the time he's gotten to a proper kicking coach its the old "sure if that's working for you keep it up."
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