Williams or Sezer?

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Northern Raider
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Northern Raider »

simo wrote: May 20, 2019, 12:53 pm
Northern Raider wrote: May 20, 2019, 12:50 pm An effective kicking game is very difficult to quantify statistically. Their no real way to measure the nuances between a good kick and a bad one. A 20m grubber kick into touch 10m from the oppostion goal line late in a game is fantastic if its a 5th tackle when you're up by 8 points. If its the 3rd tackle and you're down by 8 its an appalling play. Statistically its almost identical.
Similarly, people are crediting williams for a bomb that no chasers could get to that the south winger just dropped cold. Its a lucky outcome for a really average kick
Think of that nothing bomb that gave the Bunnies a 7 tackle set, which lead to their first try. He spills it and Raiders score its a Try Assist.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

Having another look Sezer has 4 kick errors in 2 games. I remember him kicking into opposition players a lot in those 2 games, so it must be charge downs and kicks out on the full.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by BadnMean »

Northern Raider wrote: May 20, 2019, 12:59 pm
simo wrote: May 20, 2019, 12:53 pm
Northern Raider wrote: May 20, 2019, 12:50 pm An effective kicking game is very difficult to quantify statistically. Their no real way to measure the nuances between a good kick and a bad one. A 20m grubber kick into touch 10m from the oppostion goal line late in a game is fantastic if its a 5th tackle when you're up by 8 points. If its the 3rd tackle and you're down by 8 its an appalling play. Statistically its almost identical.
Similarly, people are crediting williams for a bomb that no chasers could get to that the south winger just dropped cold. Its a lucky outcome for a really average kick
Think of that nothing bomb that gave the Bunnies a 7 tackle set, which lead to their first try. He spills it and Raiders score its a Try Assist.
It wasn't the standard easy to catch bomb, he spiralled it, which you do to make it harder to catch and got a result. You do give a kicker credit for choosing the right kind of kick to get just a little edge.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by simo »

They all spiral it. Its a hit and hope. Its not a “good play”
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Northern Raider »

Maybe we need stats on spiral vs rotating bombs.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Botman »

Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 20, 2019, 12:59 pm Having another look Sezer has 4 kick errors in 2 games. I remember him kicking into opposition players a lot in those 2 games, so it must be charge downs and kicks out on the full.
I dont think it's charge downs. I think it's just out on the full. I know Sezer had two in quick succession in general play, and then had that chip to Rapana trying to replicate the week prior and it sailed over on the full too. So Im sure he had 4 go out on the full in those two games.

But as you and Rickman raised, this stat is pretty meaningless if it's not counting a 7th tackle kick or charge down as an error.
edwahu

Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by edwahu »

Hodgo has 8 for the season, so it has to include charge downs or something else entirely that we aren't thinking of. It's just a crap name I think.

7th tackle set is a separate stat (Kicked Dead) so you can always add them together.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by BadnMean »

simo wrote: May 20, 2019, 2:54 pm They all spiral it. Its a hit and hope. Its not a “good play”
No- many backspin for accuracy to target a smaller area closer to the goal line; you spiral when your own kick position (too far out) or game station- praying for that drop so try a different style of kick- require a different technique. Which he was smart enough to do.

Kick of the century? No? But was he thinking like a half and tried a play a few % smarter than the usual backspin (which is his "go to" when trying to line up for our catchers by the way so that they can catch the thing)- yes he did. So just give a little credit when it is due.

Such a nego hater.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by BadnMean »

PigRickman wrote: May 20, 2019, 3:18 pm
Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 20, 2019, 12:59 pm Having another look Sezer has 4 kick errors in 2 games. I remember him kicking into opposition players a lot in those 2 games, so it must be charge downs and kicks out on the full.
I dont think it's charge downs. I think it's just out on the full. I know Sezer had two in quick succession in general play, and then had that chip to Rapana trying to replicate the week prior and it sailed over on the full too. So Im sure he had 4 go out on the full in those two games.

But as you and Rickman raised, this stat is pretty meaningless if it's not counting a 7th tackle kick or charge down as an error.
How does Hodgo get to 8 then? genuinely trying to figure this thing out.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by The Nickman »

BadnMean wrote: May 20, 2019, 5:09 pm
simo wrote: May 20, 2019, 2:54 pm They all spiral it. Its a hit and hope. Its not a “good play”
No- many backspin for accuracy to target a smaller area closer to the goal line; you spiral when your own kick position (too far out) or game station- praying for that drop so try a different style of kick- require a different technique. Which he was smart enough to do.

Kick of the century? No? But was he thinking like a half and tried a play a few % smarter than the usual backspin (which is his "go to" when trying to line up for our catchers by the way so that they can catch the thing)- yes he did. So just give a little credit when it is due.

Such a nego hater.
The correct term is *checks notes* "coward"
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Botman »

BadnMean wrote: May 20, 2019, 5:10 pm
PigRickman wrote: May 20, 2019, 3:18 pm
Roger Kenworthy wrote: May 20, 2019, 12:59 pm Having another look Sezer has 4 kick errors in 2 games. I remember him kicking into opposition players a lot in those 2 games, so it must be charge downs and kicks out on the full.
I dont think it's charge downs. I think it's just out on the full. I know Sezer had two in quick succession in general play, and then had that chip to Rapana trying to replicate the week prior and it sailed over on the full too. So Im sure he had 4 go out on the full in those two games.

But as you and Rickman raised, this stat is pretty meaningless if it's not counting a 7th tackle kick or charge down as an error.
How does Hodgo get to 8 then? genuinely trying to figure this thing out.
Hmm, thats weird haha

I dont know then. Just no **** idea haha
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Botman »

The Rickman wrote: May 20, 2019, 5:22 pm
BadnMean wrote: May 20, 2019, 5:09 pm
simo wrote: May 20, 2019, 2:54 pm They all spiral it. Its a hit and hope. Its not a “good play”
No- many backspin for accuracy to target a smaller area closer to the goal line; you spiral when your own kick position (too far out) or game station- praying for that drop so try a different style of kick- require a different technique. Which he was smart enough to do.

Kick of the century? No? But was he thinking like a half and tried a play a few % smarter than the usual backspin (which is his "go to" when trying to line up for our catchers by the way so that they can catch the thing)- yes he did. So just give a little credit when it is due.

Such a nego hater.
The correct term is *checks notes* "coward"
:roflmao
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Seiffert82 »

Yeah, that spiral bomb towards the end of the game was a really good kick. The fullback was under a lot of pressure to get into a decent position to field it.

The kick that gave them the 7 tackle set that they scored off was a terrible kick. We couldn't even properly contest the ball. It was the most critical error of the match.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Ronny P »

Tell me Jackson Hastings isnt coming to Raiders......... no no no no no!


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edwahu

Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by edwahu »

Surely not with Williams on the way. I'm guessing Titans/Warriors or maybe Cowboys an outsider.

Here's the source for others:
https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/exile- ... 399ad5c006
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Coastalraider »

Im guessing the Knights.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Northern Raider »

Ronny P wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:21 pm Tell me Jackson Hastings isnt coming to Raiders......... no no no no no!


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Where did this news come from?
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Coastalraider »

Northern Raider wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:37 pm
Ronny P wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:21 pm Tell me Jackson Hastings isnt coming to Raiders......... no no no no no!


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Where did this news come from?
Mention of him going to an 'out of town' club.

https://www.sportingnews.com/au/league/ ... 0nml0f679v
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Northern Raider »

Coastalraider wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:46 pm
Northern Raider wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:37 pm
Ronny P wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:21 pm Tell me Jackson Hastings isnt coming to Raiders......... no no no no no!


Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
Where did this news come from?
Mention of him going to an 'out of town' club.

https://www.sportingnews.com/au/league/ ... 0nml0f679v
Out of which town? :?
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Roger Kenworthy »

The Rickman wrote: May 20, 2019, 5:22 pm
BadnMean wrote: May 20, 2019, 5:09 pm
simo wrote: May 20, 2019, 2:54 pm They all spiral it. Its a hit and hope. Its not a “good play”
No- many backspin for accuracy to target a smaller area closer to the goal line; you spiral when your own kick position (too far out) or game station- praying for that drop so try a different style of kick- require a different technique. Which he was smart enough to do.

Kick of the century? No? But was he thinking like a half and tried a play a few % smarter than the usual backspin (which is his "go to" when trying to line up for our catchers by the way so that they can catch the thing)- yes he did. So just give a little credit when it is due.

Such a nego hater.
The correct term is *checks notes* "coward"
I'm working on a screenplay - The Character Assassination of Sam Williams by the Coward Rickman.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by -PJ- »

Coastalraider wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:46 pm
Northern Raider wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:37 pm
Ronny P wrote: May 21, 2019, 2:21 pm Tell me Jackson Hastings isnt coming to Raiders......... no no no no no!


Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse
Where did this news come from?
Mention of him going to an 'out of town' club.

https://www.sportingnews.com/au/league/ ... 0nml0f679v
Wilcannia is out of town..
3rd Battalion Royal Australian Regiment..Old Faithful
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Ilanraiders »

After that drop!! Sezer back in!!!
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by AUSTEZER »

Yep Absolutely get Aidan back
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by BadnMean »

Winning this and turning that performance around will go a long way to Sammy keeping his spot.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Canberra Milk »

That could be all she wrote for Williams after that performance. I think Stick might give him one more chance but I'm not sure
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Raider Azz »

Wonder what the high IQ posters suggesting we release Sezer a few weeks back think now

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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by AUSTEZER »

He doesn't Deserve another shot after Today we've had one Half since round 3 if we are to Salvage our Season a Change has to be made next week
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Danaman137 »

Will be very keen to see how Sezer goes in Mounties tomorrow. Only needs to put in a half decent performance and he takes Sammy’s spot I say. That was awful from Williams.


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edwahu

Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by edwahu »

Danaman137 wrote: May 25, 2019, 4:55 pm Will be very keen to see how Sezer goes in Mounties tomorrow. Only needs to put in a half decent performance and he takes Sammy’s spot I say. That was awful from Williams.


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Hingano would be a chance.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by rayden83 »

Never in my life thought I would say this, but I think we need to recall Sezer. Do I need help? :?
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by Danaman137 »

edwahu wrote:
Danaman137 wrote: May 25, 2019, 4:55 pm Will be very keen to see how Sezer goes in Mounties tomorrow. Only needs to put in a half decent performance and he takes Sammy’s spot I say. That was awful from Williams.


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Hingano would be a chance.
I wouldn’t be against it. We know what Sezer and Williams offer. Give hingano a game or 2, if he plods it up, bring Sezer in.

Alternatively if I’m Ricky I’m on the phone to Bateman convincing him to stuff George Williams into his luggage on the way home.


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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by afgtnk »

As mentioned in the game day thread, the answer to dropping Williams isn't to bring Sezer back. You don't replace **** with something even more ****. And as the last couple of years have clearly shown us, Aidan Sezer is complete ****. His form at Mounties hasn't been up to scratch either.

If we're dropping, Ata deserves a run and I'd be really interested to see how he goes given how he's played this year.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by BadnMean »

No. That was his chance- if I'm coach Ricky he gave him a good long run, the benefit of two close losses vs good teams- I am now looking elsewhere. He had every chance in the world there to do something. He showed nothing. I am officially off team Sam.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by LP Raider »

Raider Azz wrote: May 25, 2019, 4:53 pm Wonder what the high IQ posters suggesting we release Sezer a few weeks back think now

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Its about managing your cap, your not going to get anything significantly better with Sezer coming in next week.

In a couple of weeks everyone will want Williams back in. The hole debate is rather boring, if reports are correct and Hingano is playing well for Mounties your ceiling is going to be higher having him in the side.

You know what your getting with Williams and Sezer and its just average plodder performances, both of them couldn't find their way out of corn flakes box.

So yes if can offload Sezer now you do it because he is wasted cap space next year and there's no way in hell any other club is going to want him.
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Re: Williams or Sezer?

Post by simo »

afgtnk wrote: May 25, 2019, 5:02 pm As mentioned in the game day thread, the answer to dropping Williams isn't to bring Sezer back. You don't replace **** with something even more ****. And as the last couple of years have clearly shown us, Aidan Sezer is complete ****. His form at Mounties hasn't been up to scratch either.

If we're dropping, Ata deserves a run and I'd be really interested to see how he goes given how he's played this year.
This is one of the worst double dows ive seen. Youre wrong as were all others who backed williams. Pack it up and move it on.
Dont delete this GE
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