2019 Rd 3 V Knights: Game Day

[Johno]

How out of form is Cotric really? He had a bad game last week but from memory was ok in game 1 and again last night imo. The outside backs haven’t really been gifted that much opportunity yet.

That turn of foot and swerve to get him near the try line is what I take out of it. Yeah he might not be as confident as some points last year but I don’t really think he’s in some horrible patch of form.

Thought the chance at the end where he passed he could have slid in for a try, as someone said on another thread, the prop and jink he does at the line takes away his effectiveness.
Im sure he will come good though, its not like hes bombed tries

[luke]

The 12 Visitors print from last night’s game

https://12visitors.com.au/product/home-game-2/

[Billy Walker]

The 12 Visitors print from last night’s game

https://12visitors.com.au/product/home-game-2/

Is the artist selling many of these prints?

[Woodgers]

Excellent post Woodgers.

Yeah really good post except it’s starts of by saying he disagrees with what everyone is saying then nicely makes most the exact points the majority have been saying. It is well put though and agree with everything said including that Cotric is struggling.

Billy, I jumped on and only read the last 2 pages before posting and thought there were a lot of negative comments. In any event, I didn't intend on being condescending. Cheers for the shout. Onwards and upwards hopefully

[Billy Walker]

Excellent post Woodgers.

Yeah really good post except it’s starts of by saying he disagrees with what everyone is saying then nicely makes most the exact points the majority have been saying. It is well put though and agree with everything said including that Cotric is struggling.

Billy, I jumped on and only read the last 2 pages before posting and thought there were a lot of negative comments. In any event, I didn't intend on being condescending. Cheers for the shout. Onwards and upwards hopefully

Sorry - I wasn’t having a go. I think it is a great post. It’s always a good day after the raiders get up. Pretty happy with this start to the season. Don’t need the boys to be world beaters at this stage just keep getting the points and find top gear a few weeks out from finals.

[simo]

Im with dubby, we need to get rid of bj and EDIT

[edwahu]

How out of form is Cotric really? He had a bad game last week but from memory was ok in game 1 and again last night imo. The outside backs haven’t really been gifted that much opportunity yet.

That turn of foot and swerve to get him near the try line is what I take out of it. Yeah he might not be as confident as some points last year but I don’t really think he’s in some horrible patch of form.

He is out of Cotric form, which is still not that bad.

[gerg]

Parker just had a few 'I dug a hole moments' against the Warriors. He broke 2 tackles and setup a try. Immortal in waiting.

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[The Nickman]

Hahahah Cotric is struggling is as big a greenhouse myth as Paul Vaughan has slow play the balls

Also, anyone advocating for us to get rid of Joey is a deadset ****


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[-TW-]

He's still averaging 3 tackle busts and nearly 100m a game so far this season so still good numbers

Some impressive stats CNK averages about 6.6 a game and 172m a game. Rapana has 154 post contact metres in 2 games.

[Raiders666]

Haha now people are bagging Bj... This place ****

[greeneyed]

Round 3 In the sheds: Hudson Young: https://www.raiders.com.au/news/2019/03 ... son-young/

[BJ]

It’s funny but my contact at St George had speeding up his play the balls as a focus for Vaughan in his first season.

[zim]

It’s funny but my contact at St George had speeding up his play the balls as a focus for Vaughan in his first season.

He's a more complete player now. Was good for us but he's fitter now. Coming into his prime.

[Botman]

Hahahah Cotric is struggling is as big a greenhouse myth as Paul Vaughan has slow play the balls

Also, anyone advocating for us to get rid of Joey is a deadset ****


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Haha **** that’s maybe my favourite GH group think
It was absurd then and remains absurd now

Joey is EDIT, no question. But you just have to accept that, and understand what he provides outside of that is hugely valuable

[Botman]

It’s funny but my contact at St George had speeding up his play the balls as a focus for Vaughan in his first season.

He's a more complete player now. Was good for us but he's fitter now. Coming into his prime.

Yeah... na
He was exactly this. Just no one on the national scene noticed.

[Botman]

Don’t they usually release the charges the day after?
Can we assume Joey has no case to answer?

[greeneyed]

Don’t they usually release the charges the day after?
Can we assume Joey has no case to answer?

See the Round 4 thread...

[Botman]

Don’t they usually release the charges the day after?
Can we assume Joey has no case to answer?

See the Round 4 thread...

Thanks chief!
Harsh charge imo but at least he’s free to play

[Woodgers]

Joey Leilua is a brain dead footballer that will cost you games and win you games. I've made peace with it. He's virtually uncoachable. But I like him on our team because as a centre his physicality means his opposite number can barely ever contain him 1 on 1. So inside the opposition 10 he's one of the most dangerous players in the game. Rapana gets a lot of tries because opposition wingers have to jam in to help the centre try contain Joey. He's an X factor player we need, and the more he works on his fitness and gets back to help out our back 3 the more I value his contributions to this team. You will never get the stupid stuff out of his game because he wouldn't be the same player. It is what it is.

[greeneyed]

Joey Leilua was the Dally M Centre of the Year in 2018. He's an essential part of the team. I wish he didn't do things like he did last night. I do believe he was provoked and penalty was sufficient. The MRC should have seen that.

[Woodgers]

I just want to add to my last post, i've brought up this point before and I sincerely don't want people to view it as a racist post, it's just a general observation on sport.

One of my best mates coaches first grade Rugby Union at the best club in Canberra. Talking to him he deals with a lot of islanders. He says that one of his biggest challenges is trying to get islanders to play to any structure, they'll follow the plan for 10 minutes and then just go back to playing park footy because that's why they're there, to play footy. It's their instinct.

I'm a big soccer fan (sorry fellas - English Dad). You look at a nation like Germany and their physical attributes aren't anything special, but as a general rule they're always a good shot at every world cup. Why? They take 22 players to every tournament that follow the plan to the absolute letter and know their role in every scenario. They could come up against Nigeria or Cameroon who put 11 players out on the park who are faster, have more endurance and are physically stronger. Germany shouldn't win the match but they normally do because they don't stray from the structures and follow the instructions. I can't see an African team winning a world cup in my lifetime because the players as a generalisation play the game but don't stick to the plan and base the 90 minutes around the highest percentage football to win the game.

As a professional coach in any sport, and in the NRL as well, the coach needs to understand the strengths and weaknesses of the players he has. He's not teaching them to catch a footy or tackle by that stage, it is man managing their strengths and weaknesses and trying to make it fit into the game plan. Ricky has a job with Leilua to manage instinct with structure. My observation on 3 games this season is that Ricky would be happy with the improvement in Leilua from 2018. I'd guess that Ricky doesn't inhibit his attacking play but really just wants him to make good decisions in defence. And he's been doing that IMO.

Craig Bellamy is the best coach in the game because he understands his players totally, and he provides an environment where he manages to focus them on their role. He flies off the handle when his players don't stick to that structure.

I hated Michael Ennis as a player but i'd bet anything that probably his greatest attribute as a player was he delivered on the coaching instructions and helped the players beside him do the same.

[greeneyed]

Ricky Stuart interview on ABC Canberra Grandstand:

Tough win, those sorts of wins count at the end of the year. I don't worry about the table, where other teams are on the table at this stage of the year. Unlucky we didn't score three or four more tries, three disallowed and Nick Cotric could have scored at the end perhaps.

We had to fix up the line speed, some individual errors in defence, and they were. It was a solid display of character from the boys in tough conditions.

Last year we were told we had no mental toughness, last night we must have had it. Those blokes are mentally tough. We're not going to win every close game, but we need to win the majority of them. Some individual performances stood out, but the whole team played well.

There's been a lot of work put in, not just the off season. Some players are finding some maturity. There were a couple of errors from Jack Wighton, but I'm satisfied with how he's settling in at five eighth. Charnze Nicoll Klokstad really settling in well at fullback. Some of the English players were very good. Ryan Sutton hasn't had the wraps he deserves so far, he was very good starting. John Bateman was outstanding. Runs like a front rower, finds the ball at the right time, some of his runs were the the result of terrific power. He made an enormous contribution to the win.

Sam Williams, very good at managing the team's attack. Very good performance. We've got two players in Aidan Sezer and Joe Tapine injured, we need players who can step in. We haven't had that depth the past couple of years and it is good to have it now.

There's always room for improvement. It is only Rd 3. There are things we'll need to improve for the Cowboys, we're still a new team and building combinations.

You can listen to the audio of the full interview here: https://www.abc.net.au/radio/canberra/p ... d/10933744 (Ricky Stuart interview: 0:00 min mark)

[RedRaider]

I don't normally disagree with you Woodgers but I don't think race has anything to do with following a plan. It gets down to the individual and how willing they are to allow their talent to be harnessed. Does the individual 'buy in' or not. To use your soccer example, Brazil don't seem to have a problem being competitive. Germany did not make the Round of 16 qualifiers at the last World Cup having been beaten at Group level by Mexico and South Korea. Just like the Sharks taking half a century to win an NRL Premiership, one day an African nation will produce a Pele or Mbappe to spearhead a side good enough to beat the Worlds finest.

If you look at our side, both BJ and Sia have Samoan heritage. But they are chalk and cheese as far as discipline goes. I don't think generalisation based on Islander heritage stacks up. It is more the make up of the individual that counts.

[Raider Azz]

Hahahah Cotric is struggling is as big a greenhouse myth as Paul Vaughan has slow play the balls

Also, anyone advocating for us to get rid of Joey is a deadset ****


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Are you surprised? I mean just last week people were saying we should release Tapine, and literally made up statistics about how many games he's missed over the last three years to prove their point.

[Woodgers]

I don't normally disagree with you Woodgers but I don't think race has anything to do with following a plan. It gets down to the individual and how willing they are to allow their talent to be harnessed. Does the individual 'buy in' or not. To use your soccer example, Brazil don't seem to have a problem being competitive. Germany did not make the Round of 16 qualifiers at the last World Cup having been beaten at Group level by Mexico and South Korea. Just like the Sharks taking half a century to win an NRL Premiership, one day an African nation will produce a Pele or Mbappe to spearhead a side good enough to beat the Worlds finest.

If you look at our side, both BJ and Sia have Samoan heritage. But they are chalk and cheese as far as discipline goes. I don't think generalisation based on Islander heritage stacks up. It is more the make up of the individual that counts.

It was an overall generalisation RR and it's an observation. There are exceptions to the rule. I certainly didn't want to come across as pointing the finger at races or anything, in fact I was deliberately trying to be sensitive about that as it isn't my go at all.

I'm envious of the physical attributes of those athletes of the island nations. Naturally they are some of the best athletes, as are our own Indigenous people.

As a generalisation I was trying to make the point that some people are more coachable than others, same as some people are more physically gifted as others. We all have different strengths.

Without getting into a tit for tat, you'll find that Germany performance at the last WC as an anomaly. But let's not flog it. Brazil have failed dismally in the past due to poor coaching, but their biggest strength is they're the most technically gifted players on earth, partly because many of them grow up learning to play with a tennis ball so acquire skills that are the envy of every nation.

Anyhow I made my point and again, I wouldn't have submitted the post if I thought people didn't think I was making a valid point and would take it the wrong way. It was more or less lived experience on how coachable people are and I hope I didn't cause anyone any offence.

[yeh raiders]

I actually think Ricky has done a good job of managing Joey Leilua, knowing that no one with much intelligence or discipline constantly tries to force as many offloads in traffic as he does.

Is this the longest stint he has had at a club without having serious problems?

And as mentioned, he won COTY last year at the Daly M’s and was sublime in 2016.

On the flip side, I think Jack Wighton has been poorly managed. Constantly having smoke blown up him, then thrown into unfamiliar positions on acccount of him being such a naturally gifted footballer.

[greeneyed]

Joey Leilua is fantastic. FULL STOP.

[zim]

It’s funny but my contact at St George had speeding up his play the balls as a focus for Vaughan in his first season.

He's a more complete player now. Was good for us but he's fitter now. Coming into his prime.

Yeah... na
He was exactly this. Just no one on the national scene noticed.

Yeah... Na. If you think he hasn't improved you're really not paying attention. He's a professional now and it shows in his performances.
Even since origin last year he's taken another step forward. He's leaner, his work off the ball is better and his defence was never bad but now he's also proactive and not just reactive.

[The Nickman]

Hahahah Cotric is struggling is as big a greenhouse myth as Paul Vaughan has slow play the balls

Also, anyone advocating for us to get rid of Joey is a deadset ****


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Are you surprised? I mean just last week people were saying we should release Tapine, and literally made up statistics about how many games he's missed over the last three years to prove their point.

Hahaha fair call


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[Billy Walker]

I just want to add to my last post, i've brought up this point before and I sincerely don't want people to view it as a racist post, it's just a general observation on sport.

One of my best mates coaches first grade Rugby Union at the best club in Canberra. Talking to him he deals with a lot of islanders. He says that one of his biggest challenges is trying to get islanders to play to any structure, they'll follow the plan for 10 minutes and then just go back to playing park footy because that's why they're there, to play footy. It's their instinct.

I'm a big soccer fan (sorry fellas - English Dad). You look at a nation like Germany and their physical attributes aren't anything special, but as a general rule they're always a good shot at every world cup. Why? They take 22 players to every tournament that follow the plan to the absolute letter and know their role in every scenario. They could come up against Nigeria or Cameroon who put 11 players out on the park who are faster, have more endurance and are physically stronger. Germany shouldn't win the match but they normally do because they don't stray from the structures and follow the instructions. I can't see an African team winning a world cup in my lifetime because the players as a generalisation play the game but don't stick to the plan and base the 90 minutes around the highest percentage football to win the game.

As a professional coach in any sport, and in the NRL as well, the coach needs to understand the strengths and weaknesses of the players he has. He's not teaching them to catch a footy or tackle by that stage, it is man managing their strengths and weaknesses and trying to make it fit into the game plan. Ricky has a job with Leilua to manage instinct with structure. My observation on 3 games this season is that Ricky would be happy with the improvement in Leilua from 2018. I'd guess that Ricky doesn't inhibit his attacking play but really just wants him to make good decisions in defence. And he's been doing that IMO.

Craig Bellamy is the best coach in the game because he understands his players totally, and he provides an environment where he manages to focus them on their role. He flies off the handle when his players don't stick to that structure.

I hated Michael Ennis as a player but i'd bet anything that probably his greatest attribute as a player was he delivered on the coaching instructions and helped the players beside him do the same.

Maybe ask your coaching friend if he’s heard of a rugby team called the All Blacks. They have a high proportion of Pacific Islanders who seem to be able to stick to a game plan for more than 10 minutes. Perhaps your friend is just a poor coach who makes excuses with not so casual racism?

[Leeroy Jenkins]

I sincerely don't want people to view it as a racist post

This is normally the point you should re-think about posting an obviously racist post.

But hey, you saved it by saying you “appreciate their physical attributes” /s

[T_R]

I just want to add to my last post, i've brought up this point before and I sincerely don't want people to view it as a racist post, it's just a general observation on sport.

One of my best mates coaches first grade Rugby Union at the best club in Canberra. Talking to him he deals with a lot of islanders. He says that one of his biggest challenges is trying to get islanders to play to any structure, they'll follow the plan for 10 minutes and then just go back to playing park footy because that's why they're there, to play footy. It's their instinct.

I'm a big soccer fan (sorry fellas - English Dad). You look at a nation like Germany and their physical attributes aren't anything special, but as a general rule they're always a good shot at every world cup. Why? They take 22 players to every tournament that follow the plan to the absolute letter and know their role in every scenario. They could come up against Nigeria or Cameroon who put 11 players out on the park who are faster, have more endurance and are physically stronger. Germany shouldn't win the match but they normally do because they don't stray from the structures and follow the instructions. I can't see an African team winning a world cup in my lifetime because the players as a generalisation play the game but don't stick to the plan and base the 90 minutes around the highest percentage football to win the game.

As a professional coach in any sport, and in the NRL as well, the coach needs to understand the strengths and weaknesses of the players he has. He's not teaching them to catch a footy or tackle by that stage, it is man managing their strengths and weaknesses and trying to make it fit into the game plan. Ricky has a job with Leilua to manage instinct with structure. My observation on 3 games this season is that Ricky would be happy with the improvement in Leilua from 2018. I'd guess that Ricky doesn't inhibit his attacking play but really just wants him to make good decisions in defence. And he's been doing that IMO.

Craig Bellamy is the best coach in the game because he understands his players totally, and he provides an environment where he manages to focus them on their role. He flies off the handle when his players don't stick to that structure.

I hated Michael Ennis as a player but i'd bet anything that probably his greatest attribute as a player was he delivered on the coaching instructions and helped the players beside him do the same.

Maybe ask your coaching friend if he’s heard of a rugby team called the All Blacks. They have a high proportion of Pacific Islanders who seem to be able to stick to a game plan for more than 10 minutes. Perhaps your friend is just a poor coach who makes excuses with not so casual racism?

Just about any of the NZ union teams.

I'm not buying, either.

[gerg]

Imagine the outcry if Dubby made that post.

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[T_R]

Imagine the outcry if Dubby made that post.

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Imagine the double standards in those who choose to ignore it when it's NOT dubby..