Canberra Raiders sign Wigan Warriors half George Williams on three year deal

[Botman]

Neil Henry said he wouldnt attempt the change Sezer's mind specifically because he and the Titans club as a whole were in the media every day complaining (rightly) about how it's ridiculous that the rules allowed DCE to sign a contract and use it as leverage to negotiate with another club.
They specifically said they werent interested in doing to us what Manly had done to them (also i think Sezer had made it clear he wasnt going to backflip anyways, because he was eager to move closer to home)

As for the stats, it's very hard to shine as a play maker, statistically when your team, and specifically the outside backs were as disgusting as most of those titans team. The titans were a poorly coached, poorly run and talent deficient line up. There is about 5 players in recent history capable of dragging that bunch to success and they're guys like Hayne, Thurston, Jones

If you seriously believe that the Titans didn't try and get him to stay out of pure kindness, and to not upset one the clubs they literally compete with.. well then, I have a halfback who's best years are in front of him to sell you.

Plus Ashley Taylor went on to double Sezer's output the following year - at the same club, in an arguably worse team. I mean, i just dont even know where to begin with it, if this is the starting point.

There no kindness about it. It was a stand about DCE. Not Sezer.

[gerg]

Is this the new Sezer v Williams thread?

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[The Nickman]

Neil Henry said he wouldnt attempt the change Sezer's mind specifically because he and the Titans club as a whole were in the media every day complaining (rightly) about how it's ridiculous that the rules allowed DCE to sign a contract and use it as leverage to negotiate with another club.
They specifically said they werent interested in doing to us what Manly had done to them (also i think Sezer had made it clear he wasnt going to backflip anyways, because he was eager to move closer to home)

As for the stats, it's very hard to shine as a play maker, statistically when your team, and specifically the outside backs were as disgusting as most of those titans team. The titans were a poorly coached, poorly run and talent deficient line up. There is about 5 players in recent history capable of dragging that bunch to success and they're guys like Hayne, Thurston, Jones

Pretty keen for someone to tell me the stats of the Cowboys playing finals football since Thurston went there

[Beejay]

Hey Rickman,
I just looked them up and they improved.

[edwahu]

8/14 from what I can see. I thought it would be better tbh but he didn't start to regularly make it for 6 years.

[The Nickman]

8/14 from what I can see. I thought it would be better tbh but he didn't start to regularly make it for 6 years.

What?? But... but the cowboys had Thurston!!

Surely they made the finals every single year they had Thurston!

[Beejay]

Compare that to say Mitchell Moses.

Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 --4 --10 -- 5 ---- 6
2017 --4 --10 -- 6 ---- 15
2016 --6 --18 -- 15 -- 13
2015 --3 --12 -- 4 --- 12

Or someone else you **** all over Sezer's stats when he was at the titans- Chad Townsend
Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 -- 4 -- 12 -- 3 -- 9
2017 -- 5 -- 7 - -- 5 -- 3
2016 -- 6 -- 12 -- 5 -- 11
2015 -- 2 -- 9 --- 7 -- 8
2014 -- 3 -- 10 -- 5 -- 10

Can we just touch for a second on how pointless Mitch Moses past stats are until we have numbers on phoning it in, lack of effort and optional tackling. **** Christ.

Also, just ftr. Those Sezer ‘15 stats look very similar to the Townsend ‘16 ones. Surely having near identical stats to the premiership winning team’s halfback when your team is busted indicates you’re playing pretty well?

So Sezer’s best year in the NRL looks similar Chad Townsend’s output?
You know who else was in the halves next to Townsend.. James Maloney, a half that actually improves his team and takes them to a premiership.
Unlike Sezer who has only ever plodded along achieving nothing. Even in 2016 our most successful year he was barely sighted.

[Beejay]

8/14 from what I can see. I thought it would be better tbh but he didn't start to regularly make it for 6 years.

What?? But... but the cowboys had Thurston!!

Surely they made the finals every single year they had Thurston!

Hey Rickman,
You’re not going to believe this story, but first year Thurston arrives they make their first ever grand final!
And then since then, when he played 18 or more games in a season they made the finals every year except 2009 and last year.
And spoiler alert; the years he missed large chunks through injury, they missed the finals pretty much every time.

Incredible I know.

[Botman]

Basically Thurston took the Cowboys from absolute irrelevant to finals contenders every year and sometimes dragged them to be premiership contenders

also they were on the rough end of 3 consecutive years of very bad officiating in elimination games. The guy completed changed that franchise. I know a proud QLDer like Rickman wouldnt question JT's greatness, so a hearty Fairgo itall is owed here.

[Cranky Old Man]

It is pointless comparing the statistics of a Thurston, Cronk and a regulation half such as Sezer. The first two are once in a generation players who miraculously both turned up in the same generation, much like Stuart ans Langer. By definition those players are not readily available in normal circumstances. Sezer is one of a dozen or so halfbacks of the last five years who fit the description of FAQ, not "very good" like DCE currently or even "pretty good" with "flashes of brilliance" such as Johnston, Reynolds and a couple of others, but very serviceable in a good team. In my lifetime teams have made grand finals with worse players in key positions, and the Raiders could easily do so this year with Sezer, but having a Thurston clone would probably make it more probable!
But you go with what you have got. Form and injuries are imponderables to add to the excitement of a journey to the finals, on which journey we are currently embarking.

[RedRaider]

Agreed Cranky. The fact Thurston, Cronk, Slater and Smith were all born in the same year in the same State is a freakish occurrence.

The key to having a great season though is to have most of the top 17 in form at the business end. The Sharks win in 2016 for me showed what everyone on the same page footy was all about. Even though the Sharks were up against the 'been there done that' Smith and Cronk, the Sharks had enough in them to win the Grand Final 14-12 on the day. Dogged defence, turning up play after play, keeps sides in the hunt no matter the opposition. I know attack gets all the headlines (and Dally M points), but for me it is always about the teams commitment in defence. We are seeing it in the Raiders squad this year.

We are not in the top one or two in attack this year but our ladder position is so much better. That's why I think we are a chance this year. I'm really not to concerned about the squad in 2020 at this point. I think there is a lot to cheer for in 2019.

[hobbsy]

Compare that to say Mitchell Moses.

Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 --4 --10 -- 5 ---- 6
2017 --4 --10 -- 6 ---- 15
2016 --6 --18 -- 15 -- 13
2015 --3 --12 -- 4 --- 12

Or someone else you **** all over Sezer's stats when he was at the titans- Chad Townsend
Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 -- 4 -- 12 -- 3 -- 9
2017 -- 5 -- 7 - -- 5 -- 3
2016 -- 6 -- 12 -- 5 -- 11
2015 -- 2 -- 9 --- 7 -- 8
2014 -- 3 -- 10 -- 5 -- 10

Can we just touch for a second on how pointless Mitch Moses past stats are until we have numbers on phoning it in, lack of effort and optional tackling. **** Christ.

Also, just ftr. Those Sezer ‘15 stats look very similar to the Townsend ‘16 ones. Surely having near identical stats to the premiership winning team’s halfback when your team is busted indicates you’re playing pretty well?

So Sezer’s best year in the NRL looks similar Chad Townsend’s output?
You know who else was in the halves next to Townsend.. James Maloney, a half that actually improves his team and takes them to a premiership.
Unlike Sezer who has only ever plodded along achieving nothing. Even in 2016 our most successful year he was barely sighted.

Is Sezer supposed to be our Maloney or Townsend here? Because yeah, he does improve teams and if we had him in the halves next to Sezer instead of Blake Austin over the past couple years I have no doubt we would have been improved as well. I mean we are a top 4 team again already after ditching Austin this year. It's amazing to me how many people can't see who the real problem half was for us the last few years.

[julian87]

Compare that to say Mitchell Moses.

Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 --4 --10 -- 5 ---- 6
2017 --4 --10 -- 6 ---- 15
2016 --6 --18 -- 15 -- 13
2015 --3 --12 -- 4 --- 12

Or someone else you **** all over Sezer's stats when he was at the titans- Chad Townsend
Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 -- 4 -- 12 -- 3 -- 9
2017 -- 5 -- 7 - -- 5 -- 3
2016 -- 6 -- 12 -- 5 -- 11
2015 -- 2 -- 9 --- 7 -- 8
2014 -- 3 -- 10 -- 5 -- 10

Can we just touch for a second on how pointless Mitch Moses past stats are until we have numbers on phoning it in, lack of effort and optional tackling. **** Christ.

Also, just ftr. Those Sezer ‘15 stats look very similar to the Townsend ‘16 ones. Surely having near identical stats to the premiership winning team’s halfback when your team is busted indicates you’re playing pretty well?

So Sezer’s best year in the NRL looks similar Chad Townsend’s output?
You know who else was in the halves next to Townsend.. James Maloney, a half that actually improves his team and takes them to a premiership.
Unlike Sezer who has only ever plodded along achieving nothing. Even in 2016 our most successful year he was barely sighted.

If that’s what you take out of it there’s no point even discussing it because you’re cherry picking stats and not putting anything into any context whatsoever.

[Beejay]

Compare that to say Mitchell Moses.

Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 --4 --10 -- 5 ---- 6
2017 --4 --10 -- 6 ---- 15
2016 --6 --18 -- 15 -- 13
2015 --3 --12 -- 4 --- 12

Or someone else you **** all over Sezer's stats when he was at the titans- Chad Townsend
Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 -- 4 -- 12 -- 3 -- 9
2017 -- 5 -- 7 - -- 5 -- 3
2016 -- 6 -- 12 -- 5 -- 11
2015 -- 2 -- 9 --- 7 -- 8
2014 -- 3 -- 10 -- 5 -- 10

Can we just touch for a second on how pointless Mitch Moses past stats are until we have numbers on phoning it in, lack of effort and optional tackling. **** Christ.

Also, just ftr. Those Sezer ‘15 stats look very similar to the Townsend ‘16 ones. Surely having near identical stats to the premiership winning team’s halfback when your team is busted indicates you’re playing pretty well?

So Sezer’s best year in the NRL looks similar Chad Townsend’s output?
You know who else was in the halves next to Townsend.. James Maloney, a half that actually improves his team and takes them to a premiership.
Unlike Sezer who has only ever plodded along achieving nothing. Even in 2016 our most successful year he was barely sighted.

If that’s what you take out of it there’s no point even discussing it because you’re cherry picking stats and not putting anything into any context whatsoever.

The context is that Townsend has been able to hold nerve and help steer his team around while putting in adequate 5th tackle options to give his team a chance. Sezer has not at the Raiders , and how could you say he did that at the Titans when they came 14th.

[julian87]

Compare that to say Mitchell Moses.

Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 --4 --10 -- 5 ---- 6
2017 --4 --10 -- 6 ---- 15
2016 --6 --18 -- 15 -- 13
2015 --3 --12 -- 4 --- 12

Or someone else you **** all over Sezer's stats when he was at the titans- Chad Townsend
Year -- T -- TA -- LB -- LBA
2018 -- 4 -- 12 -- 3 -- 9
2017 -- 5 -- 7 - -- 5 -- 3
2016 -- 6 -- 12 -- 5 -- 11
2015 -- 2 -- 9 --- 7 -- 8
2014 -- 3 -- 10 -- 5 -- 10

Can we just touch for a second on how pointless Mitch Moses past stats are until we have numbers on phoning it in, lack of effort and optional tackling. **** Christ.

Also, just ftr. Those Sezer ‘15 stats look very similar to the Townsend ‘16 ones. Surely having near identical stats to the premiership winning team’s halfback when your team is busted indicates you’re playing pretty well?

So Sezer’s best year in the NRL looks similar Chad Townsend’s output?
You know who else was in the halves next to Townsend.. James Maloney, a half that actually improves his team and takes them to a premiership.
Unlike Sezer who has only ever plodded along achieving nothing. Even in 2016 our most successful year he was barely sighted.

If that’s what you take out of it there’s no point even discussing it because you’re cherry picking stats and not putting anything into any context whatsoever.

The context is that Townsend has been able to hold nerve and help steer his team around while putting in adequate 5th tackle options to give his team a chance. Sezer has not at the Raiders , and how could you say he did that at the Titans when they came 14th.

The Titans came 14th because they sucked. Good players play in bad teams sometimes.

The context is that you said Sezer was ordinary at the Titans. I said his ‘15 looks similar to Townsend’s ‘16 by stats. If a halfback from a team coming 3rd last has similar stats to one in a team winning the comp then odds are he’s not playing that poorly imo. That was all I picked out and posted about. I’m not talking about his time at Canberra. And that was both of their best years, not best vs average.

[simo]

Why are we hating on sezer in this thread now? Concentrate on something else in the game if you dont like him. Its just sad and old

[Coastalraider]

Can we just touch for a second on how pointless Mitch Moses past stats are until we have numbers on phoning it in, lack of effort and optional tackling. **** Christ.

Also, just ftr. Those Sezer ‘15 stats look very similar to the Townsend ‘16 ones. Surely having near identical stats to the premiership winning team’s halfback when your team is busted indicates you’re playing pretty well?

So Sezer’s best year in the NRL looks similar Chad Townsend’s output?
You know who else was in the halves next to Townsend.. James Maloney, a half that actually improves his team and takes them to a premiership.
Unlike Sezer who has only ever plodded along achieving nothing. Even in 2016 our most successful year he was barely sighted.

If that’s what you take out of it there’s no point even discussing it because you’re cherry picking stats and not putting anything into any context whatsoever.

The context is that Townsend has been able to hold nerve and help steer his team around while putting in adequate 5th tackle options to give his team a chance. Sezer has not at the Raiders , and how could you say he did that at the Titans when they came 14th.

The Titans came 14th because they sucked. Good players play in bad teams sometimes.

The context is that you said Sezer was ordinary at the Titans. I said his ‘15 looks similar to Townsend’s ‘16 by stats. If a halfback from a team coming 3rd last has similar stats to one in a team winning the comp then odds are he’s not playing that poorly imo. That was all I picked out and posted about. I’m not talking about his time at Canberra. And that was both of their best years, not best vs average.

Watching the last half of Sezers last year with the Titans, he looked like a playmaker that was making all the right moves, but was let down by the people around him. At the same time - the Raiders looked like a team made up of people who needed a link man, which was exactly Sezers role at the Titans. I was very very excited by his signing, as it looked form the outside that the 2 parts would complement each other exceptionally well. At the Titans, he had no option but to run everything. At the Raiders, he seems to have too many options, good middles, good edges, a good hooker and he cant seem to get his head around it.

In reality, I think his biggest struggle is trying to figure out what his role actually is. At the Titans, he was the man, it all came off him. Coming to the Raiders, a huge part of his role is to feed ball to the talent we have on the edges. For me, he has always looked lost. He always looks like his first instinct is to think about what to do - nothing is coming naturally for him. Playing off the back of Hodgo means he has never been 'the man' here. Austin over calling him has thrown him out of balance. And now for Jack to step in and exceed everyones expectation has again led him to not really know what piece of the puzzle he is supposed to play.

Watching someone like Maloney in Origin in the last couple of weeks shows what a play maker should be - he walked into that camp and said 'this is my team, listen to me, follow me.' He was the loudest voice in the dressing rooms at halftime.

Sezer seems to be lost in the background in similar situations, he doesn't command respect, doesn't demand the ball, doesn't insist of running the sets.

I think he looked so much better at the Titans because he was the only 'Alfa'. Here, he is lost and cannot figure out how to get the best from himself.

[Cranky Old Man]

As an addendum to my post above, and back on topic, I'm looking forward to whatever G Williams brings to the club whenever he arrives. Another reason to move my weary bones out to GIO Stadium for another season of mysteries unfolding. Will he be another Bateman/Hodgson/Whitehead/Sutton or will he be a Turner?
It won't really matter to me, it just adds interest to a game which is always interesting to the maximum degree. If it was only the score that mattered it would be as boring as reading the stock market moves, as vital as that info can be.
I could never get involved in the McCrone, Buttris, Austin etc etc personal denigration that was and still is common here because I saw them and all the others as actors on a huge stage there to entertain us, and doing so to the best of their abilities however limited. That is what RL is about to my mind, not fodder to a hate fest.

[Johno]

As an addendum to my post above, and back on topic, I'm looking forward to whatever G Williams brings to the club whenever he arrives. Another reason to move my weary bones out to GIO Stadium for another season of mysteries unfolding. Will he be another Bateman/Hodgson/Whitehead/Sutton or will he be a Turner?
It won't really matter to me, it just adds interest to a game which is always interesting to the maximum degree. If it was only the score that mattered it would be as boring as reading the stock market moves, as vital as that info can be.
I could never get involved in the McCrone, Buttris, Austin etc etc personal denigration that was and still is common here because I saw them and all the others as actors on a huge stage there to entertain us, and doing so to the best of their abilities however limited. That is what RL is about to my mind, not fodder to a hate fest.

Great post, enjoyed reading that COM..kudos!

[BadnMean]

As an addendum to my post above, and back on topic, I'm looking forward to whatever G Williams brings to the club whenever he arrives. Another reason to move my weary bones out to GIO Stadium for another season of mysteries unfolding. Will he be another Bateman/Hodgson/Whitehead/Sutton or will he be a Turner?
It won't really matter to me, it just adds interest to a game which is always interesting to the maximum degree. If it was only the score that mattered it would be as boring as reading the stock market moves, as vital as that info can be.
I could never get involved in the McCrone, Buttris, Austin etc etc personal denigration that was and still is common here because I saw them and all the others as actors on a huge stage there to entertain us, and doing so to the best of their abilities however limited. That is what RL is about to my mind, not fodder to a hate fest.

Great post, enjoyed reading that COM..kudos!

Rubbish. He's not one of the great posters and will never take this forum beyond mediocre. Here is a list of all the superior posters and a list of their top posts per category for comparison...

[Ruben Daley]

Just re-joined this thread after a few weeks off. Read nothing about George Williams but I did enjoy the last few posts from Coastal (agree with all that about Sezer - I think the couple of plays against the Tigers were the first time in a long time that we’ve seen him play by instinct), Cranky - bravo, I loved that post, and a nice humorous finish there by BadnMean.

I’d be happy to retire this thread on that high note until something actually happens regarding George Williams.

[FROG]

As an addendum to my post above, and back on topic, I'm looking forward to whatever G Williams brings to the club whenever he arrives. Another reason to move my weary bones out to GIO Stadium for another season of mysteries unfolding. Will he be another Bateman/Hodgson/Whitehead/Sutton or will he be a Turner?
It won't really matter to me, it just adds interest to a game which is always interesting to the maximum degree. If it was only the score that mattered it would be as boring as reading the stock market moves, as vital as that info can be.
I could never get involved in the McCrone, Buttris, Austin etc etc personal denigration that was and still is common here because I saw them and all the others as actors on a huge stage there to entertain us, and doing so to the best of their abilities however limited. That is what RL is about to my mind, not fodder to a hate fest.

Might be time to change your name.. sensible old man perhaps?

[-TW-]

The GM podcast posted a highlights video of Williams playing for Wigan, he looks like a more polished Wighton with a good running game, picks the pass well and runs well

I'm worried we'll end up with 2 6s and no playmaker.. unless the idea is to run everything through Hodgson

[MrPosh]

The GM podcast posted a highlights video of Williams playing for Wigan, he looks like a more polished Wighton with a good running game, picks the pass well and runs well

I'm worried we'll end up with 2 6s and no playmaker.. unless the idea is to run everything through Hodgson

I'm assuming the idea was for Williams to replace Wighton and to obtain another half.

Wighton was in the last chance saloon with his move to six. The fact that he grabbed that opportunity with two hands and more has probably scuppered the plan and now it's planning on next year on the hoof.

[gerg]

The GM podcast posted a highlights video of Williams playing for Wigan, he looks like a more polished Wighton with a good running game, picks the pass well and runs well

I'm worried we'll end up with 2 6s and no playmaker.. unless the idea is to run everything through Hodgson

I'm assuming the idea was for Williams to replace Wighton and to obtain another half.

Wighton was in the last chance saloon with his move to six. The fact that he grabbed that opportunity with two hands and more has probably scuppered the plan and now it's planning on next year on the hoof.

I can't agree with that Mr Beckham. I don't think Wighton was or is going anywhere (not if the club has anything to do with it)

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[MrPosh]

The GM podcast posted a highlights video of Williams playing for Wigan, he looks like a more polished Wighton with a good running game, picks the pass well and runs well

I'm worried we'll end up with 2 6s and no playmaker.. unless the idea is to run everything through Hodgson

I'm assuming the idea was for Williams to replace Wighton and to obtain another half.

Wighton was in the last chance saloon with his move to six. The fact that he grabbed that opportunity with two hands and more has probably scuppered the plan and now it's planning on next year on the hoof.

I can't agree with that Mr Beckham. I don't think Wighton was or is going anywhere (not if the club has anything to do with it)

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He's obviously not, now, but with the discipline issue as it was I wouldn't say that was unlikely. He had to play better to repay the club.

I can't believe the club even dared to hope that his move to 5/8th could go so we'll - mostly because of who filled in for him at full back.

[Botman]

I dont think the club had any thoughts on getting Williams to replace Wighton.

[dubby]

No, i think it was to replace Sezer..

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[The Nickman]

I dont think the club had any thoughts on getting Williams to replace Wighton.

Absolutely zero.

[BadnMean]

There may have been some bet hedging in that we're in the market for a quality half no matter what and this year could easily have been...

a) a fail for Jack at 5/8 and moved back to FB
b) decent but not amazing for Jack at 5/8 (and the new FB) and suddenly we have a new half coming and best for team if Jack goes back to #1
c) Jack getting himself in trouble again

The fact that Jack AND the new FB have both been excellent is a double bonus win that really no-one fully predicted and that in fact, no diligent club CEO in his right mind would place all his bets on that double hail mary paying off so handsomely. It'd be remiss to have just sat looking at that scenario and just assumed "she'll be right"- so you do what we all say, improve our squad when we can.

As it turns out we have a genuine 5/8 in Jack and G Williams can come in and offer more than Sezer or Williams in attack/direction (that's not actually that diificult, Sezer has been competent at his best and seems not to have the trust of Hodgo) and hold his end u defensively.

It'll be easy enough for Williams to offer the same or more in attack as our current half options, he'll likely be better in D than Sam and I'll be impressed if he's near as good in contact as Sezer. He's not small at all for a half so I'm optimistic he'll handle it. Then it comes down to direction. He seems to have a good head on him and is very experienced in SL and Tests. He'll have some trust and rapport with Hodgo. He may not be a controlling half but if Hodgo trusts him and allows him to call it when he wants it or actively calls him onto the play instead of being all Jack all the time then we are already ahead.

I'm not quite going to judge how he'll play until he gets here and into our set up. When Whitehead arrived we were told we were getting an attacking/offloading/blockbusting second rower. Turns out he's become a defensive mainstay who adds to attack with skill, hands and guile rather than a powerful style.

[Botman]

Williams was purchased, rightly or wrongly, (and i have no thoughts on that because i have no idea what G.Williams is) to partner Wighton in the halves. We'll see if that's the right move.

Im hopeful about what he can bring here based on what others who have watched George have said.

[robtheraider]

From the video look exclusively left side....there is barely no attack at all down the right edge.

How having 2 exclusively left side players will help in team balance has me scratching my head.

[The Nickman]

From the video look exclusively left side....there is barely no attack at all down the right edge.

How having 2 exclusively left side players will help in team balance has me scratching my head.

Yeah, but that's because he plays on the left at Wigan, Rob. For us he's probably going to play on the right, and I'm sure he'll be able to adjust.

It's not like he's just going to camp over on the left with Jack.

[Sid]

hahah I can just imagine seeing him running the same left channel as Jack all game with both calling for the ball while not having any halves on the right hand side

[The Nickman]

hahah I can just imagine seeing him running the same left channel as Jack all game with both calling for the ball while not having any halves on the right hand side

Haha I'm pretty sure that's how Rob is picturing it in his head too.