Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Botman » February 14, 2019, 7:53 am

Woodgers wrote:
February 13, 2019, 7:16 pm
NRL players generally play in ZERO atmosphere. Nothing. So what do we do? We come up with something that adds atmosphere. BUT....the crowd does it when the opposition players are out there in the middle of the noise and our guys get none of it and are walking down a tunnel. How can people not understand that by doing it the way we do it it actually works in the opposition's favour and gets them pumped for kick off because they're the ones actually subject to the noise and the build up on the ground and ours aren't? It's madness. Having been involved in supporters groups including running one for the Raiders, and having been interested in crowd participation my entire life I strongly believe we actually could not be doing it in a more backward manner for our team/club to get anything out of it.
Except the players consciously know the act is directed toward their opposition. They are acutely aware that the noise in a demonstration of the crowd support against them.
I would guess like most of this stuff, there is no correlation between this and teams performing better or worse, or us performing better or worse.

If this kind of thing has an impact, i'd say it would be isolated to individuals, some negative, some positive. I dont think there is a collective material difference in favour of either them or us... Some players thrive in combative environments, others shrink. Some players thrive when the atmosphere is behind them, others freeze under the pressure.

so to me this just comes down what works best for the crowd and the optics, and from that perspective, pre game and for games where... y'know we're not staring at a 7k crowd and trying to call it 12k

Has to be at least 15k of bodies in the crowd before they should bring it out.
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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by greeneyed » February 14, 2019, 8:13 am

Pigman wrote:
February 14, 2019, 7:53 am
Has to be at least 15k of bodies in the crowd before they should bring it out.
You can’t do that really... you have people who come from inter state once a year... or young kids who turn up who love to take part... and you say... sorry, only 14,000 are here. No Viking Clap for you!
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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by zim » February 14, 2019, 8:17 am

It'd be a nice change if at the start of each game the commentators talked about how there aren't enough people there instead of how much they like the clap.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Botman » February 14, 2019, 8:23 am

greeneyed wrote:
February 14, 2019, 8:13 am
Pigman wrote:
February 14, 2019, 7:53 am
Has to be at least 15k of bodies in the crowd before they should bring it out.
You can’t do that really... you have people who come from inter state once a year... or young kids who turn up who love to take part... and you say... sorry, only 14,000 are here. No Viking Clap for you!
If the alternative is we're doing the VC with 5500 people there?
Then yep, "Sorry guys, no VC today" seems like a preferable situation.
CREATE PROCEDURE BotMan_Post AS
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EXEC RAND(good_grief; cheak_notes; uh82cit;)

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by gergreg » February 14, 2019, 9:13 am

If we want to develop some pre game atmosphere what better way than having GE at the West entrance with a 'head count' clicker and Woodgers at the East entrance, also with a clicker. 5 minutes before kick-off the crowd waits in anticipation for the two clicker guys to signal that the clap can take place.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad » February 14, 2019, 9:32 am

Side note: Broncos have signed Matty Johns to mentor their playmakers


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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by LimeGreenMachine » February 14, 2019, 9:46 am

Matty Johns is working with their halves. They fly down to Sydney for it

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Coastalraider » February 14, 2019, 1:58 pm

LimeGreenMachine wrote:
February 14, 2019, 9:46 am
Matty Johns is working with their halves. They fly down to Sydney for it
Seibold had him working with the bunnies halves last year - he is a smart cookie is Seibs.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by nemesis » February 14, 2019, 2:10 pm

greeneyed wrote:
February 14, 2019, 8:13 am
Pigman wrote:
February 14, 2019, 7:53 am
Has to be at least 15k of bodies in the crowd before they should bring it out.
You can’t do that really... you have people who come from inter state once a year... or young kids who turn up who love to take part... and you say... sorry, only 14,000 are here. No Viking Clap for you!
exactly, the clap is here to stay, just get used to it.

amazes me that people want it gone or think we don't deserve it ha ha
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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Rickmando » February 14, 2019, 2:43 pm

The Viking clap is hokey and unoriginal. Like all good things, you have too much of it... then it jumps the shark.

Would compromise and roll it out for player milestone games and finals matches. But I’m with others who suggest that 6000 people doing it on a Saturday afternoon vs the Titans is straight up Nuff City

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by zim » February 14, 2019, 2:48 pm

Is 11,000 people ok?

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by luke » February 14, 2019, 3:30 pm

would support a ban on the Mexican wave during home finals (should we ever have another one)

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by greeneyed » February 14, 2019, 4:26 pm

By the way, there have only twice been crowds of 6,000 or less at Canberra Stadium: http://www.rugbyleagueproject.org/match ... 0tLS0tLS0=

The last was over two decades ago, 1992 against the Gold Coast (5,788) and 1996 against the Panthers (5,935).

At Seiffert Oval, there were 15: http://www.rugbyleagueproject.org/match ... 0tLS0tLS0t

The lowest ever crowd at Seiffert was 3,197 against the Steelers in 1987.
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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by zim » February 14, 2019, 5:06 pm

Pretty sure you have to apply the raiders tax GE. That 6000k to the titans game that people are referencing was reported as over 11000.
I think you'll find the crowd at Seiffert was actually only 17.81 people.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Lui_Bon » February 14, 2019, 7:11 pm

I still like the terrible green towel. After all, you might need it after a horn and the clap.
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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Botman » February 14, 2019, 8:35 pm

zim wrote:
February 14, 2019, 5:06 pm
Pretty sure you have to apply the raiders tax GE. That 6000k to the titans game that people are referencing was reported as over 11000.
I think you'll find the crowd at Seiffert was actually only 17.81 people.
TELL HIM WHAT HE'S WON JOHNNY!

I think you need the stadium at least half full, so given a SMALL raiders tax.... if the crowd is 15k, you'd hope there is at least 10k, and hopefully 12.5

That's probably OK enough to get by.
Anything less than that.... nope. that aint it, chief.

It's real easy when at the ground... the stadium holds 25k there abouts.... so to have 7k you need 1 in 4 seats full... i've been at many a game that's had an official figure of 10k which no rational person could say 1/4 of the stadium was full. It gets worse the higher it gets. 15k crowds means over HALF the stadium is full... yeah, hard pass.
CREATE PROCEDURE BotMan_Post AS
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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by greeneyed » February 14, 2019, 8:41 pm

Pigman wrote:
zim wrote:
February 14, 2019, 5:06 pm
Pretty sure you have to apply the raiders tax GE. That 6000k to the titans game that people are referencing was reported as over 11000.
I think you'll find the crowd at Seiffert was actually only 17.81 people.
TELL HIM WHAT HE'S WON JOHNNY!

I think you need the stadium at least half full, so given a SMALL raiders tax.... if the crowd is 15k, you'd hope there is at least 10k, and hopefully 12.5

That's probably OK enough to get by.
Anything less than that.... nope. that aint it, chief.

It's real easy when at the ground... the stadium holds 25k there abouts.... so to have 7k you need 1 in 4 seats full... i've been at many a game that's had an official figure of 10k which no rational person could say 1/4 of the stadium was full. It gets worse the higher it gets. 15k crowds means over HALF the stadium is full... yeah, hard pass.
They are official crowd figures. It’s in the newspaper the next day, whether that agrees with your own head count or not. The tries you said are no tries are still worth four points if the ref says so. You can pretend they’re not the figures... but they’re the figures.


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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by gergreg » February 14, 2019, 8:47 pm

greeneyed wrote:
Pigman wrote:
zim wrote:
February 14, 2019, 5:06 pm
Pretty sure you have to apply the raiders tax GE. That 6000k to the titans game that people are referencing was reported as over 11000.
I think you'll find the crowd at Seiffert was actually only 17.81 people.
TELL HIM WHAT HE'S WON JOHNNY!

I think you need the stadium at least half full, so given a SMALL raiders tax.... if the crowd is 15k, you'd hope there is at least 10k, and hopefully 12.5

That's probably OK enough to get by.
Anything less than that.... nope. that aint it, chief.

It's real easy when at the ground... the stadium holds 25k there abouts.... so to have 7k you need 1 in 4 seats full... i've been at many a game that's had an official figure of 10k which no rational person could say 1/4 of the stadium was full. It gets worse the higher it gets. 15k crowds means over HALF the stadium is full... yeah, hard pass.
They are official crowd figures. It’s in the newspaper the next day, whether that agrees with your own head count or not. The tries you said are no tries are still worth four points if the ref says so. You can pretend they’re not the figures... but they’re the figures.


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Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Keghead » February 14, 2019, 9:06 pm

Anyone happen to see the last winner in the Rockhampton gallops today “Siege of Ennis started at 200/1 and won. Unbelievable Image


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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by EJ » February 14, 2019, 9:59 pm

luke wrote:would support a ban on the Mexican wave during home finals (should we ever have another one)
+1

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by PhilY » February 14, 2019, 10:06 pm

Woodgers wrote:
February 13, 2019, 7:16 pm
PhilY wrote:
February 13, 2019, 5:58 pm
Definitely not Australian or for that matter NZ psyche. Move the Haka to post game wins????

The Clap has given the Raiders huge media attention. One day the Club will get back to the winners circle and when that happens, with a full stadium, it’ll seriously pump our players and get into the heads of the opposition.
Sometimes games just need a 1% edge. Post game, with the opposition already in the changing room the clap won’t give anyone anything.
I reckon you're completely wrong and i've brought this up a few times.

NRL players generally play in ZERO atmosphere. Nothing. So what do we do? We come up with something that adds atmosphere. BUT....the crowd does it when the opposition players are out there in the middle of the noise and our guys get none of it and are walking down a tunnel. How can people not understand that by doing it the way we do it it actually works in the opposition's favour and gets them pumped for kick off because they're the ones actually subject to the noise and the build up on the ground and ours aren't? It's madness. Having been involved in supporters groups including running one for the Raiders, and having been interested in crowd participation my entire life I strongly believe we actually could not be doing it in a more backward manner for our team/club to get anything out of it.

My thoughts on the Viking Clap is the Raiders have found something that can work but they want to treat it like an awesome song they've heard and wear the thing out within the first month. Use it appropriately before the novelty is completely gone. The crowd is most pumped after a win and that is why I think that would be the best time, when energy is high and the players are out there to enjoy it together and it doubles as a thank you to the fans for turning up. Before kick off is quite 'meh' because in my experience in Canberra most the crowd turns up right on or around kick off and if people aren't finding their seats they're holding a pie or a drink or something and you see heaps of people around not getting involved because of that or simply that they're not in game mode yet.

The Haka is nothing like this, it's a war dance for players to strike intimidation to the opposition. That comparison is completely apples and oranges.
So if I read you correctly, all that hoofing, clapping and horn blowing isn’t meant to be imposing or at all threatening (apple to orange of the Haka), more along the lines of a group of blokes asking the rival Viking Chieftan, very politely, if it would be OK to take his only daughter out on an escorted date? No, not quite convinced on that one.
For the record, I played both League and Union. I played up front and hard. I have a busted nose, a permanently crippled hand and have had 4 knee reconstructions. I’d trade 2 more knee reconstructions for the opportunity to walk up that tunnel, just once, with thousands of fans chanting like that. Talk about white line fever, they’d have to pump me full of sedatives to stop me ripping heads off.
Sorry mate, its supposed to be a full on in your face don’t F with me war chant, and thats the way the crowd should work it, because thats how the players hear it and feel it.
So instead of complaining, how about getting stuck in and pump the players to the max. Thats what supporters do.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by BadnMean » February 15, 2019, 12:12 am

That post should earn you the right to blow the horn first home game philvy 👌

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Coastalraider » February 15, 2019, 12:48 am

mamando wrote:
February 14, 2019, 2:43 pm
The Viking clap is hokey and unoriginal. Like all good things, you have too much of it... then it jumps the shark.

Would compromise and roll it out for player milestone games and finals matches. But I’m with others who suggest that 6000 people doing it on a Saturday afternoon vs the Titans is straight up Nuff City
I also suggest banning the ‘Raiders - clap,clap,clap’ chant, cheering, and any tormenting of referees unless we have 11,000 people. None of those really have the same effect with a smaller crowd, so let’s not bother with any sort of game day atmosphere.

I will allow a cheer if points are scored by a Canberra player, but it must be restrained.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by gergreg » February 15, 2019, 1:21 am

5 minutes before kick-off the crowd waits in anticipation for the sign from the upper most section of the stadium. Woodgers scurries into position leading 3 lambs. Each lamb representing 1000 people. The crowd audibly gasps and quickly turns as one to the same spot, but at the North end of the stadium. GE's rendezvous point. Where is he, what could be holding him up, something must be wrong?

Wait, wait I can see something. How many baby goats is he leading? Yes, yes. I can see at least 4. GE finally reaches his position, had to take a bathroom break on the way, prostate playing up again it seems.

He looks to the Southern end, towards Woodgers. In tandem they both make a signal to the heavens. Meanwhile a representative from the opposition's team seeing the signal rushes to the changeroom to inform their team that the clap is on.

This grand spectacle reaches an almost uncontrollable climax as the drums start beating with fierce intensity and the fans rise as one for the Viking clap.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Grün Maschine » February 15, 2019, 4:05 am

gergreg wrote:
February 15, 2019, 1:21 am
5 minutes before kick-off the crowd waits in anticipation for the sign from the upper most section of the stadium. Woodgers scurries into position leading 3 lambs. Each lamb representing 1000 people. The crowd audibly gasps and quickly turns as one to the same spot, but at the North end of the stadium. GE's rendezvous point. Where is he, what could be holding him up, something must be wrong?

Wait, wait I can see something. How many baby goats is he leading? Yes, yes. I can see at least 4. GE finally reaches his position, had to take a bathroom break on the way, prostate playing up again it seems.

He looks to the Southern end, towards Woodgers. In tandem they both make a signal to the heavens. Meanwhile a representative from the opposition's team seeing the signal rushes to the changeroom to inform their team that the clap is on.

This grand spectacle reaches an almost uncontrollable climax as the drums start beating with fierce intensity and the fans rise as one for the Viking clap.

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What happens to the goats?

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by Botman » February 15, 2019, 7:20 am

greeneyed wrote:
February 14, 2019, 8:41 pm
Pigman wrote:
zim wrote:
February 14, 2019, 5:06 pm
Pretty sure you have to apply the raiders tax GE. That 6000k to the titans game that people are referencing was reported as over 11000.
I think you'll find the crowd at Seiffert was actually only 17.81 people.
TELL HIM WHAT HE'S WON JOHNNY!

I think you need the stadium at least half full, so given a SMALL raiders tax.... if the crowd is 15k, you'd hope there is at least 10k, and hopefully 12.5

That's probably OK enough to get by.
Anything less than that.... nope. that aint it, chief.

It's real easy when at the ground... the stadium holds 25k there abouts.... so to have 7k you need 1 in 4 seats full... i've been at many a game that's had an official figure of 10k which no rational person could say 1/4 of the stadium was full. It gets worse the higher it gets. 15k crowds means over HALF the stadium is full... yeah, hard pass.
They are official crowd figures. It’s in the newspaper the next day, whether that agrees with your own head count or not. The tries you said are no tries are still worth four points if the ref says so. You can pretend they’re not the figures... but they’re the figures.

I get it man, someone tells you something, and that's it. Shut it down.
Some dudes can go about life just taking everything their told at face value and not question it. That isnt me.

If you tell me we're in a 25,000 seat stadium, and there 15,000 people at the game, and it clear and **** obvious the stadium isnt even half full, let alone 3/5ths full... well im gonna go ahead and say you're fudging figures
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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by simo » February 15, 2019, 7:42 am

Its not just the people in the crowd that make up the attendance numbers we use though. Youre forgetting to count those waiting/working in the carpark, anyone at the ais centre, current traffic on Ginninderra Drive as well as the residents of the immediate Bruce population. x 1.5
Dont delete this GE

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by gergreg » February 15, 2019, 7:51 am

Grün Maschine wrote:
gergreg wrote:
February 15, 2019, 1:21 am
5 minutes before kick-off the crowd waits in anticipation for the sign from the upper most section of the stadium. Woodgers scurries into position leading 3 lambs. Each lamb representing 1000 people. The crowd audibly gasps and quickly turns as one to the same spot, but at the North end of the stadium. GE's rendezvous point. Where is he, what could be holding him up, something must be wrong?

Wait, wait I can see something. How many baby goats is he leading? Yes, yes. I can see at least 4. GE finally reaches his position, had to take a bathroom break on the way, prostate playing up again it seems.

He looks to the Southern end, towards Woodgers. In tandem they both make a signal to the heavens. Meanwhile a representative from the opposition's team seeing the signal rushes to the changeroom to inform their team that the clap is on.

This grand spectacle reaches an almost uncontrollable climax as the drums start beating with fierce intensity and the fans rise as one for the Viking clap.

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What happens to the goats?
Well that depends. We crack the 6k and they're off to the Corporate box with GE for fresh carrots and apples. Now, we don't crack the 6k and GE leads them off to the rear of the 'soul cartel' van, never to be seen again.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by PhilY » February 15, 2019, 8:07 am

BadnMean wrote:
February 15, 2019, 12:12 am
That post should earn you the right to blow the horn first home game philvy 👌
Mate, just to stand in the tunnel with the players and hear the horn blow to start the chant would do me!

I’d love to do a poll to find out how many of the negative folk have actually played the game. Very few I would think, because they are all “whats in it for me” without any thought of the players.

We have something unique. Lets quit all this self centred cry baby whoa is me the world is against us bull crap and focus on how to help the team get back to the glory days.

Bring it on!!!!

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by gergreg » February 15, 2019, 8:12 am

Does nobody look around them at the ground or something? I do and all I see is a bunch of faces like smashed crabs or dropped meat pies. Clearly the majority of the crowd has played before, it's not a Brumbies game.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by sprintman » February 15, 2019, 8:15 am

How about we follow the topic instead of crapping on about clapping?

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by T_R » February 15, 2019, 8:27 am

PhilY wrote:
February 15, 2019, 8:07 am
Lets quit all this self centred cry baby whoa is me the world is against us bull crap and focus on how to help the team get back to the glory days.
So sack the coach?
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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by BJ » February 15, 2019, 11:58 am

I have four words for anyone who says Rugby League accurately records crowds at Bruce Stadium for Rugby League

“Fiji Italy crowd 6733”


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-TW-
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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by -TW- » February 15, 2019, 12:11 pm

BJ wrote:I have four words for anyone who says Rugby League accurately records crowds at Bruce Stadium for Rugby League

“Fiji Italy crowd 6733”
Or the crowds circa 2011-2014

9684... "**** off there's about 30 people here"

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Re: Michael Ennis joins Canberra Raiders as coaching consultant

Post by The Nickman » February 15, 2019, 12:23 pm

-TW- wrote:
February 15, 2019, 12:11 pm
BJ wrote:I have four words for anyone who says Rugby League accurately records crowds at Bruce Stadium for Rugby League

“Fiji Italy crowd 6733”
Or the crowds circa 2011-2014

9684... "**** off there's about 30 people here"
Yeah, I've been in the crowd at Canberra where they've BLATANTLY lied about it and called it 10k, and there's no WAY the ground is even CLOSE to 40% full!
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