The Greenhouse

I dont know if public salaries work for rugby league.

Certainly the information should be transparent for the NRL and clubs, but for the public im not sure causes a bit to much angst if a player is underperforming, I dont think it helps having the public heaping **** on them.

If you are underperforming on 15m or 20m per year you got so much money who gives a **** what the public says.

If you have one contract worth 500k a year and your underperforming flogging your guts out in such a physical sport I dont know.

IMO the NRL are well aware of methods to clean up the cap but truth be told for whatever reason they want melbourne, roosters, broncos, dogs to have the biggest salary cap.

Pigman wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 8:18 pm

hrundi89 wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 4:06 pm There is no doubt still an opportunity for clubs to cheat, but the relative transparency and the existence of the data as it is just adds to the curiosity for the sport and it's fans and after perhaps an initial phase of "you're paying him how much?", I think it would be a positive outcome.

PREACH IT! Sing it from the hilltops until they yield.

www.overthecap.com

**** your privacy. You want to play professional sports, have punters pay their hard earn to pay your wage, have government/tax payers fund your facilities, give your leagues clubs grants to make your club, and your income sustainable, coaches and ceo's want to use your salary as justification for poor performance, YOU, THE ATHLETE, you hide behind wilful ignorance to skate on punishment for salary cap cheating...

Fine. Public salaries and life bans for players who salary doesn't the publicly listed salary. Transparency, accountability, and the end of salary cap cheating over night, for the price of a minor invasion of your privacy, the likes of which every other elite athlete in the world accepts.
And stop pretending like you're the only industry who has this, anyone armed with the google and my job classification can obtain my salary, so **** your privacy. The public and organisational benefits far out weigh you Bull privacy concerns.

The best thing about it for me, is we could finally make clear criticism's of the club when they make dud signings. You can actually hold those in the job accountable publically. Signed a **** player? But he's on minimum, ok who cares. Signed Josh reynolds? and you paid $900k which puts him in the top 5 paid halves in the comp... GTFO of my club.
Secondly, i think players will actually start to look at their choice of club/loyalty when they see how much the Raiders/Knights/Tigers are paying that spud who is clearly nowhere near them as a player.

papabear wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 10:48 pm I dont know if public salaries work for rugby league.

Certainly the information should be transparent for the NRL and clubs, but for the public im not sure causes a bit to much angst if a player is underperforming, I dont think it helps having the public heaping **** on them.

If you are underperforming on 15m or 20m per year you got so much money who gives a **** what the public says.

If you have one contract worth 500k a year and your underperforming flogging your guts out in such a physical sport I dont know.

IMO the NRL are well aware of methods to clean up the cap but truth be told for whatever reason they want melbourne, roosters, broncos, dogs to have the biggest salary cap.

Under performing players get slagged off by fans regardless. Transparency of earnings only impacts the nature of it. Either way they still get paid.

papabear wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 10:48 pm I dont know if public salaries work for rugby league.

Certainly the information should be transparent for the NRL and clubs, but for the public im not sure causes a bit to much angst if a player is underperforming, I dont think it helps having the public heaping **** on them.

If you are underperforming on 15m or 20m per year you got so much money who gives a **** what the public says.

If you have one contract worth 500k a year and your underperforming flogging your guts out in such a physical sport I dont know.

IMO the NRL are well aware of methods to clean up the cap but truth be told for whatever reason they want melbourne, roosters, broncos, dogs to have the biggest salary cap.

The problem is player power is disproportionate in the NRL and the NRL won't stand up to the players. This is either due to a fear to do so due to the Draft and superleague, or maybe just vested interest and politics.

So the NRL don't even attempt to put the measures in which would make the cap more effective. Look at the AFL, NBA, NFL etc and the level of access and control the governing body maintains over the player market. The NRL players have it ridiculously easy.

Beejay wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 7:59 am

Pigman wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 8:18 pm

hrundi89 wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 4:06 pm There is no doubt still an opportunity for clubs to cheat, but the relative transparency and the existence of the data as it is just adds to the curiosity for the sport and it's fans and after perhaps an initial phase of "you're paying him how much?", I think it would be a positive outcome.

PREACH IT! Sing it from the hilltops until they yield.

www.overthecap.com

**** your privacy. You want to play professional sports, have punters pay their hard earn to pay your wage, have government/tax payers fund your facilities, give your leagues clubs grants to make your club, and your income sustainable, coaches and ceo's want to use your salary as justification for poor performance, YOU, THE ATHLETE, you hide behind wilful ignorance to skate on punishment for salary cap cheating...

Fine. Public salaries and life bans for players who salary doesn't the publicly listed salary. Transparency, accountability, and the end of salary cap cheating over night, for the price of a minor invasion of your privacy, the likes of which every other elite athlete in the world accepts.
And stop pretending like you're the only industry who has this, anyone armed with the google and my job classification can obtain my salary, so **** your privacy. The public and organisational benefits far out weigh you Bull privacy concerns.

The best thing about it for me, is we could finally make clear criticism's of the club when they make dud signings. You can actually hold those in the job accountable publically. Signed a **** player? But he's on minimum, ok who cares. Signed Josh reynolds? and you paid $900k which puts him in the top 5 paid halves in the comp... GTFO of my club.
Secondly, i think players will actually start to look at their choice of club/loyalty when they see how much the Raiders/Knights/Tigers are paying that spud who is clearly nowhere near them as a player.

Absolutely.
Also this club is lobbying for public money from ACT GOV to help build new facilities... before i'm comfortable with local Government giving this club public money, i'd like some assurances they know what they're doing with money, and if the club is getting beaten like a drum at the negotiation table by player managers, why would we assume they'll get value for money with tax payer funds?

Also for all the concerns about it creating a more hostile environment for under performing players, it does the reverse. It's gonna be real **** hard for fans to get pissed off at a player who's performing at a level relative to his salary, and it's gonna be real hard for fans to get pissed at a player for moving clubs when their salary is made public and it can be seen the players original club physically couldnt match that deal... the anger for that, will likely rightly be redirected at the club who probably has a ton of bad deals on their books.

The benefits to the code, to the fans, to the public so far outweigh any minor privacy concerns.
The NRL, on their website should list every single players salary year to year, and also any third party arrangements they have registered for each player

Complete and total transparency. And should a player be found receiving money, goods or services for playing outside of those terms, mandatory life ban for the player and manager. Put the onus back on players and managers, and then salary cap cheating disappears forever.

edwahu wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 8:25 am

papabear wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 10:48 pm I dont know if public salaries work for rugby league.

Certainly the information should be transparent for the NRL and clubs, but for the public im not sure causes a bit to much angst if a player is underperforming, I dont think it helps having the public heaping **** on them.

If you are underperforming on 15m or 20m per year you got so much money who gives a **** what the public says.

If you have one contract worth 500k a year and your underperforming flogging your guts out in such a physical sport I dont know.

IMO the NRL are well aware of methods to clean up the cap but truth be told for whatever reason they want melbourne, roosters, broncos, dogs to have the biggest salary cap.

The problem is player power is disproportionate in the NRL and the NRL won't stand up to the players. This is either due to a fear to do so due to the Draft and superleague, or maybe just vested interest and politics.

So the NRL don't even attempt to put the measures in which would make the cap more effective. Look at the AFL, NBA, NFL etc and the level of access and control the governing body maintains over the player market. The NRL players have it ridiculously easy.

I don't even think the players have the most to lose. They will be manipulated into thinking they do though.

Raiders don't want it because it would embarrass them.
Sure as **** Nick Politis doesn't want it, cause then his players outside the elite will see how underpaid they are.
Player managers won't want it, cause it makes it a heap easier to just represent yourself in negotiations. Look at the list for similar players in your position and potential and just say 'pay me that'.

Transparency would be better for the players too. At the moment whenever there is a signing, there are dollar figures thrown around in articles that are treated like gospel (even on the NRL.com site no less)

I would suggest that these figures in the articles would be higher than what they actually are to help raise interest in the article. It's a bigger story when player X signs for $1M per season rather than $750,000 per season.

hrundi89 wrote:

greeneyed wrote: ↑September 4, 2018, 10:12 pm Salaries MUST be made public.

Here's an example from my NHL team:

https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/mapleleafs

Is that an official statement from the NHL?


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dubby wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 1:01 pm

hrundi89 wrote:

greeneyed wrote: ↑September 4, 2018, 10:12 pm Salaries MUST be made public.

Here's an example from my NHL team:

https://www.capfriendly.com/teams/mapleleafs

Is that an official statement from the NHL?


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I think it's actually the players unions that publishes the numbers. This is an interesting video on it and why its good for the players.
https://www.nhlpa.com/news/1-14922/the- ... hl-players

Beejay wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 10:36 am

edwahu wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 8:25 am

papabear wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 10:48 pm I dont know if public salaries work for rugby league.

Certainly the information should be transparent for the NRL and clubs, but for the public im not sure causes a bit to much angst if a player is underperforming, I dont think it helps having the public heaping **** on them.

If you are underperforming on 15m or 20m per year you got so much money who gives a **** what the public says.

If you have one contract worth 500k a year and your underperforming flogging your guts out in such a physical sport I dont know.

IMO the NRL are well aware of methods to clean up the cap but truth be told for whatever reason they want melbourne, roosters, broncos, dogs to have the biggest salary cap.

The problem is player power is disproportionate in the NRL and the NRL won't stand up to the players. This is either due to a fear to do so due to the Draft and superleague, or maybe just vested interest and politics.

So the NRL don't even attempt to put the measures in which would make the cap more effective. Look at the AFL, NBA, NFL etc and the level of access and control the governing body maintains over the player market. The NRL players have it ridiculously easy.

I don't even think the players have the most to lose. They will be manipulated into thinking they do though.

Raiders don't want it because it would embarrass them.
Sure as **** Nick Politis doesn't want it, cause then his players outside the elite will see how underpaid they are.
Player managers won't want it, cause it makes it a heap easier to just represent yourself in negotiations. Look at the list for similar players in your position and potential and just say 'pay me that'.

It's a complete fallacy that players don't know what their teammates earn. Probably a large part of the reason Parramatta are so **** is the players know how much that Moses fraud is being paid.

I don't think salaries (on the cap) are the issue.

It's the third party deals, we need revealed.

It's the complete transparency of every player and what he's earning or being handed.

E.g.

Titans cap years ago. Scott Prince and his free house.

Brown paper bags full of untraceable poker machine money.

Free accommodation for players from a mutual beneficiary

Free cars, boats et al

Jobs for players family

Jobs for players post career (Brett White)

Jobs for players in the meantime (Carney at Atherton pub)

Every single advantage or incentive given to a player to sign with a club needs to be disclosed


All this can only be accomplished if the NRL completely overhauls the cap, and potentially player managers accreditations, and the process of putting every single contract offer a player receives put before a mutual tribunal to ensure best for party and club

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edwahu wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 8:25 am

papabear wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 10:48 pm I dont know if public salaries work for rugby league.

Certainly the information should be transparent for the NRL and clubs, but for the public im not sure causes a bit to much angst if a player is underperforming, I dont think it helps having the public heaping **** on them.

If you are underperforming on 15m or 20m per year you got so much money who gives a **** what the public says.

If you have one contract worth 500k a year and your underperforming flogging your guts out in such a physical sport I dont know.

IMO the NRL are well aware of methods to clean up the cap but truth be told for whatever reason they want melbourne, roosters, broncos, dogs to have the biggest salary cap.

The problem is player power is disproportionate in the NRL and the NRL won't stand up to the players. This is either due to a fear to do so due to the Draft and superleague, or maybe just vested interest and politics.

So the NRL don't even attempt to put the measures in which would make the cap more effective. Look at the AFL, NBA, NFL etc and the level of access and control the governing body maintains over the player market. The NRL players have it ridiculously easy.

The NRL need to take the power back. Don't they re-issue licences to clubs every few years? They just need to change the rules.

dubby wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 1:48 pm I don't think salaries (on the cap) are the issue.

It's the third party deals, we need revealed.

It's the complete transparency of every player and what he's earning or being handed.

E.g.

Titans cap years ago. Scott Prince and his free house.

Brown paper bags full of untraceable poker machine money.

Free accommodation for players from a mutual beneficiary

Free cars, boats et al

Jobs for players family

Jobs for players post career (Brett White)

Jobs for players in the meantime (Carney at Atherton pub)

Every single advantage or incentive given to a player to sign with a club needs to be disclosed


All this can only be accomplished if the NRL completely overhauls the cap, and potentially player managers accreditations, and the process of putting every single contract offer a player receives put before a mutual tribunal to ensure best for party and club

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Don't forget promises of rep jerseys. Rep games = $$$

And dodgy testimonials to make sure Cam Smith and JT keep the skeletons well and truly buried.

hiriser wrote:

dubby wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 1:48 pm I don't think salaries (on the cap) are the issue.

It's the third party deals, we need revealed.

It's the complete transparency of every player and what he's earning or being handed.

E.g.

Titans cap years ago. Scott Prince and his free house.

Brown paper bags full of untraceable poker machine money.

Free accommodation for players from a mutual beneficiary

Free cars, boats et al

Jobs for players family

Jobs for players post career (Brett White)

Jobs for players in the meantime (Carney at Atherton pub)

Every single advantage or incentive given to a player to sign with a club needs to be disclosed


All this can only be accomplished if the NRL completely overhauls the cap, and potentially player managers accreditations, and the process of putting every single contract offer a player receives put before a mutual tribunal to ensure best for party and club

Sent from my SM-G950F using The Greenhouse mobile app powered by Tapatalk

Don't forget promises of rep jerseys. Rep games = $$$

And dodgy testimonials to make sure Cam Smith and JT keep the skeletons well and truly buried.

Rep jerseys? Sure. Wasn’t Gould and the Roosters accused of using Origin camp as a recruitment drive for the roosters......i believe one of the players he tried to persuade in camp was Shaun Timmins (amongst others).



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Rate Matterson. As a back rower. And we don't need back rowers. He isn't a 5/8. He's done nothing at 5/8. If we had a creative ball running halfback it might work. We don't. He's a good solid player but I'd be looking to invest in other positions.

roneel78 wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 5:07 pm

hiriser wrote:

dubby wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 1:48 pm I don't think salaries (on the cap) are the issue.

It's the third party deals, we need revealed.

It's the complete transparency of every player and what he's earning or being handed.

E.g.

Titans cap years ago. Scott Prince and his free house.

Brown paper bags full of untraceable poker machine money.

Free accommodation for players from a mutual beneficiary

Free cars, boats et al

Jobs for players family

Jobs for players post career (Brett White)

Jobs for players in the meantime (Carney at Atherton pub)

Every single advantage or incentive given to a player to sign with a club needs to be disclosed


All this can only be accomplished if the NRL completely overhauls the cap, and potentially player managers accreditations, and the process of putting every single contract offer a player receives put before a mutual tribunal to ensure best for party and club

Sent from my SM-G950F using The Greenhouse mobile app powered by Tapatalk

Don't forget promises of rep jerseys. Rep games = $$$

And dodgy testimonials to make sure Cam Smith and JT keep the skeletons well and truly buried.

Rep jerseys? Sure. Wasn’t Gould and the Roosters accused of using Origin camp as a recruitment drive for the roosters......i believe one of the players he tried to persuade in camp was Shaun Timmins (amongst others).



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bob Fulton at Manly is the best example of using the promise of rep jerseys to sign a player... I imagine his pitch to Dylan Walker was... "If I can get Jamie Buhrer to play off the bench in origin for 7 minutes, I sure as **** can do the same for you!"

Ryan Matterson has just signed with the tigers

the bone wrote:

roneel78 wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 5:07 pm

hiriser wrote:

dubby wrote: ↑September 7, 2018, 1:48 pm I don't think salaries (on the cap) are the issue.

It's the third party deals, we need revealed.

It's the complete transparency of every player and what he's earning or being handed.

E.g.

Titans cap years ago. Scott Prince and his free house.

Brown paper bags full of untraceable poker machine money.

Free accommodation for players from a mutual beneficiary

Free cars, boats et al

Jobs for players family

Jobs for players post career (Brett White)

Jobs for players in the meantime (Carney at Atherton pub)

Every single advantage or incentive given to a player to sign with a club needs to be disclosed


All this can only be accomplished if the NRL completely overhauls the cap, and potentially player managers accreditations, and the process of putting every single contract offer a player receives put before a mutual tribunal to ensure best for party and club

Sent from my SM-G950F using The Greenhouse mobile app powered by Tapatalk

Don't forget promises of rep jerseys. Rep games = $$$

And dodgy testimonials to make sure Cam Smith and JT keep the skeletons well and truly buried.

Rep jerseys? Sure. Wasn’t Gould and the Roosters accused of using Origin camp as a recruitment drive for the roosters......i believe one of the players he tried to persuade in camp was Shaun Timmins (amongst others).



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Bob Fulton at Manly is the best example of using the promise of rep jerseys to sign a player... I imagine his pitch to Dylan Walker was... "If I can get Jamie Buhrer to play off the bench in origin for 7 minutes, I sure as **** can do the same for you!"

Yup Bozo too. Forgot about Buhrer.
He did the same with Jamie Lyon....brought him back from overseas straight into Origin


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papabear wrote: ↑September 6, 2018, 10:48 pm I dont know if public salaries work for rugby league.

Certainly the information should be transparent for the NRL and clubs, but for the public im not sure causes a bit to much angst if a player is underperforming, I dont think it helps having the public heaping **** on them.

If you are underperforming on 15m or 20m per year you got so much money who gives a **** what the public says.

If you have one contract worth 500k a year and your underperforming flogging your guts out in such a physical sport I dont know.

IMO the NRL are well aware of methods to clean up the cap but truth be told for whatever reason they want melbourne, roosters, broncos, dogs to have the biggest salary cap.

I agree publishing base contracts would cause a lot of problems in social media, probably even among the playing group. I would like to see all 3rd party payments be available as this would show that an equal salary cap is not equal and the same old clubs have more to spend.

Hazza wrote: ↑September 11, 2018, 3:52 pm Ryan Matterson has just signed with the tigers

Back on topic please. This thread is about transparency of player salaries.