Canberra Raiders defend high ticket prices

Dr Zaius · Post by **Dr Zaius** » April 25, 2013, 9:49 pm

That's one of the issues that I have with the "popular" teams getting the lion's share of Fta games. Eventually it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

Shano · Post by **Shano** » April 25, 2013, 9:53 pm

Greenbits wrote:That's one of the issues that I have with the "popular" teams getting the lion's share of Fta games. Eventually it becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

Particularly when the local team makes it so hard for the kids to go and grow into their team, that they have no choice but to watch the popular teams on teli

Bard · Post by **Bard** » April 25, 2013, 9:54 pm

And as for dynamic ticketing, dont think it will work in this market. Not enough games or demand (eg we hardly ever sell out the stadium) to vary the prices enough for it to work.

cat · Post by **cat** » April 25, 2013, 9:58 pm

the problem with the cost per game is for non die hard fans your not getting a lot for your money.

movies go for around 2hrs and you can get in for around $15. For that you see "the stars of the screen" and sit in a comfy indoor seat

You can tickets for bands pretty cheap too and that's indoors and interactive with the crowd

Raiders game most people get there for the main game which goes for around 2hrs. You sit in a cold seat and because the raiders are never on free to air the general fan doesn't know "our stars",

other entertainment is normally seeing the young kids play (lovely for mum and dad to watch but there is only so much I want to see) , cheerleaders doing a little dance and that's about it.

The best bit of the super league era was the off field entertainment IMO

I'm sure the league as a whole can do better with what is offered game day.

Chickas shoe · Post by **Chickas shoe** » April 25, 2013, 10:21 pm

I'm not screaming for off-field entertainment but the hour wait between the two games on offer is another way we're getting screwed by broadcasters. The u20s is hugely entertaining as a rule and I love to catch it but rarely do, as it starts too early for me. I'm always rushed when visiting from the Bush. A 15 minute wait and I'd be there with bells on.

Channel Nein's intransigence and the League's pathetic non-response in regards to equity in this area is the biggest impediment we face as a club. As suggested, it is a self fulfilling prophecy that creates seemingly permanent haves and have nots.

Post by **greeneyed** » April 25, 2013, 10:23 pm

The gap between games is an absolute disgrace for spectators.

Lui_Bon · Post by **Lui_Bon** » April 25, 2013, 10:35 pm

Going right back to the OP, (I think) one of the points the raiders are making is how much they have to make from a game to cover the costs they owe to the ACT govt for use of the stadium. It could just be me but they make it look like their emphasis is on breaking even every time rather than doing anything to promote the code and their games.

I can hear people saying "yeah well fair enough too." And I'd agree more if I hadn't heard Simon Hawkins going on about their soon-to-be 8 million bucks a year revenue stream. As someone above said, on that basis if it was a choice of buying another office block or running a football team, you'd buy the building every time. Remember that old board game Squatter? The one where it was better to sell all your sheep and then buy better pasture so you could win the game? I'm a bit concerned the Raiders board are playing squatter rather than rugby league... pun fully intended.

They justify their stance by saying that if you're a member of some sort, you'll save that money. Well you can stick that. Personally I could pay GA for every game, but the experience is a waste of time compared to staying at home in comfort. I've sat through my share of downpours, eating cold hotdogs and drinking warm vbs. I ended up eating my own sangas and alternating warm beer with a flask; no benefit for the club there.

I think it's time the club tried a proper professional evaluation of their fan base and gave some decent consideration to what it is they're trying to achieve.... and if all it is is a break even on the costs of using the stadium, than I'd say they can get stuffed: they ain't no professionals.

Seiffert82 · Post by **Seiffert82** » April 25, 2013, 10:41 pm

I agree. Hiking up ticket prices to simply break even on stadium expenses and in so doing screwing over the current hard core fans is such a short sighted approach.

I'm not saying that the club should just drop prices to crazy low levels just to put more bums on seats, but the price they charge under 15's is doing nothing but destroying the future fanbase of the club.

The ARLC should step in and dictate all concession ticket prices can't exceed $10 - and probably should be half that ala the AFL.

roneel78 · Post by **roneel78** » April 25, 2013, 10:47 pm

greeneyed wrote:Isn't that because they had to install electricity at Leichhardt first and then bring in temporary lighting?

No. They were complaining about the cost of electricity. This was after that. That was when electricity prices were cheaper in NSW then what they are now too

freddo · Post by **freddo** » April 25, 2013, 10:56 pm

We should ask Trump, Gates or our friends at Huawei to buy us a Staduim

cat · Post by **cat** » April 25, 2013, 11:41 pm

greeneyed wrote:The gap between games is an absolute disgrace for spectators.

The NRL's excuse for the gap is always because of the coverage from fox between under 20s and doing the preview for the main game.

But that never makes sense to me as not all games have under 20s on fox.

I know the ceos whinge about it every year at their big meeting. Maybe they need to stand up to the tv people and the NRL and just say there will be a lesser gap.

The grounds/clubs would make more money cause more people would come for under 20s and spend more on beer and food

RedRaider · Post by **RedRaider** » April 26, 2013, 7:11 am

Seiffert82 wrote:I agree. Hiking up ticket prices to simply break even on stadium expenses and in so doing screwing over the current hard core fans is such a short sighted approach.

I'm not saying that the club should just drop prices to crazy low levels just to put more bums on seats, but the price they charge under 15's is doing nothing but destroying the future fanbase of the club.

The ARLC should step in and dictate all concession ticket prices can't exceed $10 - and probably should be half that ala the AFL.

Agree S82. Looked up the Hoyts prices and it is around $10 for a matinee session. I am a season ticket holder and will continue to be as it supports the Club. But for parents wanting to take their kids to watch football it is a fair chunk of the family budget. I know what the arguments in favour of high pricing will be. ACT has lower unemployment than the National Average and higher average income levels. But your point about the future fan base is a good one. Lets get the youngsters involved and watching the Raiders.

On a 'pricing' side note, interesting that people can see a Test Match for $25 in Canberra, but the City/Country ticket prices were reported at $60 in Coffs Harbour.

Post by **Matt** » April 26, 2013, 9:09 am

Tickets are too expensive and food is poor (although I still hang out for my hotdog and chips, only to pay for it the next day). No surprise our crowds are terrible. It also doesnt help that the Canberra crowds tend to favor winners. If the team is losing, the crowds go down.

christoraider · Post by **christoraider** » April 26, 2013, 9:37 am

I really struggle when people say they want more entertainment at football games.i don't care seeing anything but the league.
U6 footy is only really for the kids and their parents,boring
Any game/promotion ain't too bad for about 2 minutes and perving on the raiderettes is a bit wrong.

I miss the lower grades of old ,we used to go and watch half of 21's/20's then reggies,made a day of it.
At least get rid of the hour between firsts and 20's

cat · Post by **cat** » April 26, 2013, 10:44 am

christoraider wrote:I really struggle when people say they want more entertainment at football games.i don't care seeing anything but the league.
U6 footy is only really for the kids and their parents,boring
Any game/promotion ain't too bad for about 2 minutes and perving on the raiderettes is a bit wrong.

I miss the lower grades of old ,we used to go and watch half of 21's/20's then reggies,made a day of it.
At least get rid of the hour between firsts and 20's

But you are a league fan and not a little kid at the footy with dad.

Those of us who love watching our team are more then happy watching the under 20s. I love seeing the younger players develop and being able to sit there in a few years time and say I saw them play before they were super stars.

But kids who can have a pretty low attention span need things to do/see. And those adults who don't know the game well need something else to.

And when your paying $30+ for a ticket you want to see more then what we have at times.

I reckon cut the gap between the games down to around 30min. Have a band/singer someone perform while the players are warming up and have crowd competitions for half time. Like the big ball they had years ago,

Shadow Boxer · Post by **Shadow Boxer** » April 26, 2013, 10:49 am

It's a fantastic model, McDonalds should raise the price of a big mac to $10, then only those that really want one will go, they save on costs, revenue stays the same.

there must be a flaw in that argument somewhere, oh yeh it's unsustainable and eventually everyone will go to Burger King.

papabear · Post by **papabear** » April 26, 2013, 10:58 am

Watching our club defend those prices makes me shake my head in sadness

Post by **-GD-** » April 26, 2013, 10:59 am

Just looked at the Brumbies cheapest ticket prices. You would think that the ACT Gov. would charge the same rent

General Admission

Adult - $24.00

Junior 5-18 Years - $11.00

Concession (Pen, Snr and Full Time Stud) - $19

papabear · Post by **papabear** » April 26, 2013, 11:07 am

Honestly is there an organization as disconnected to its fan base / market as the raiders are??

Maybe penrith but u can blame that on Gould.

FuiFui BradBrad · Post by **FuiFui BradBrad** » April 26, 2013, 12:35 pm

I was saying this to a mate the other day, people complain about this gap between 20s and 1sts, I'm surprised clubs haven't gone "Right, we have an hour to kill, what can we do?"

If it was up to me, I'd pitch something like a talent show/concert. Do a call out to all unsigned artists to come and ply their trade, then have a play off between 2 bands at each home game, with a finale at the last home game. Winner gets a prize.

It'd give the crowd something to watch in the break, plug some up and coming artists and promote the sport to a new audience and maybe even boost attendances a little more.

Toviii · Post by **Toviii** » April 26, 2013, 12:40 pm

Fuifui Bradbrad wrote:I was saying this to a mate the other day, people complain about this gap between 20s and 1sts, I'm surprised clubs haven't gone "Right, we have an hour to kill, what can we do?"

If it was up to me, I'd pitch something like a talent show/concert. Do a call out to all unsigned artists to come and ply their trade, then have a play off between 2 bands at each home game, with a finale at the last home game. Winner gets a prize.

It'd give the crowd something to watch in the break, plug some up and coming artists and promote the sport to a new audience and maybe even boost attendances a little more.

Sounds amazing! Would really make the price worthwhile

Seiffert82 · Post by **Seiffert82** » April 26, 2013, 12:48 pm

RedRaider wrote:
Seiffert82 wrote:I agree. Hiking up ticket prices to simply break even on stadium expenses and in so doing screwing over the current hard core fans is such a short sighted approach.

I'm not saying that the club should just drop prices to crazy low levels just to put more bums on seats, but the price they charge under 15's is doing nothing but destroying the future fanbase of the club.

The ARLC should step in and dictate all concession ticket prices can't exceed $10 - and probably should be half that ala the AFL.
Agree S82. Looked up the Hoyts prices and it is around $10 for a matinee session. I am a season ticket holder and will continue to be as it supports the Club. But for parents wanting to take their kids to watch football it is a fair chunk of the family budget. I know what the arguments in favour of high pricing will be. ACT has lower unemployment than the National Average and higher average income levels. But your point about the future fan base is a good one. Lets get the youngsters involved and watching the Raiders.

On a 'pricing' side note, interesting that people can see a Test Match for $25 in Canberra, but the City/Country ticket prices were reported at $60 in Coffs Harbour.

Not only that, I seem to recall the ticket price for the finals game vs Cronulla last season as being similar to, if not cheaper than, our regular game ticket prices. The prices for finals tickets are dictated by the NRL.

Like you, I'm a season ticket holder as it supports the club, but blind freddy can see there is a correlation between dwindling crowd numbers and stupidly high "at gate" ticket prices.

FuiFui BradBrad · Post by **FuiFui BradBrad** » April 26, 2013, 12:50 pm

I think so, then they can justify the price by saying its 2 games and a concert.

Announce the winner of the playoff at half time. This would encourage the bands/their fans to hang around and gives an extra something to do at half time

Seiffert82 · Post by **Seiffert82** » April 26, 2013, 1:12 pm

Toviii wrote:
Fuifui Bradbrad wrote:I was saying this to a mate the other day, people complain about this gap between 20s and 1sts, I'm surprised clubs haven't gone "Right, we have an hour to kill, what can we do?"

If it was up to me, I'd pitch something like a talent show/concert. Do a call out to all unsigned artists to come and ply their trade, then have a play off between 2 bands at each home game, with a finale at the last home game. Winner gets a prize.

It'd give the crowd something to watch in the break, plug some up and coming artists and promote the sport to a new audience and maybe even boost attendances a little more.
Sounds amazing! Would really make the price worthwhile

For a while there they actually did have some local muso's come in a play a song or two between the games. Not sure why they canned the idea.

FTR it's complete bollocks that TV sheduling requires such a long break between the games. I think you'd get significantly more turn up for the 20's if there was only a 15-20 minute gap. I understand they need to cater for injury time in the 20's and warm ups for first grade, but 40-45 minutes between games is ridiculous.

Post by **greeneyed** » April 26, 2013, 1:17 pm

People aren't going to pay more for a ticket to the game because of incidental entertainment in my estimation. They may feel better about the experience overall, but it's not the draw card. The football is. The bottom line is, the tickets for entry to the football are way too expensive compared to other forms of entertainment.

Frankly, I'd be willing to pay more NOT to have a gap between games which they have to fill with rubbish.

Given the clubs seem unwilling to do anything bout the gap between games, by all means put something on (rather than the nothing that happens now) and a talent contest is as good an idea as I've heard. But I'd really just not have the gap, just stop wasting my life, and give me the footy which is why I go.

ak47 · Post by **ak47** » April 26, 2013, 2:04 pm

**** E-squared or any stupid attempt to get people to the games and stop making things complicated

the cost determines the demand more than anything else - no **** jumping castle or rock band is gonna change this

i am hear to watch footy, nothing else - i would like to eat, but its also poor quality for the price

its a disgrace all of our sports have more than doubled in price in 10 years - 10 **** years and i swear its doubled in cricket TESTS and GA footy tix....i remember if i bought a sunday at Maccas i got a free entry to the SFS behind the sticks pre olympics

If they halved the price - would they get double the people and would they sell double the food and beers and merchandise?

its a workin class game - the NRL cant have it both ways, and claim working class game and charge rediculous prices like we are all lawyers and bankers.

The sterotype i think is rubbish, but the purists will always drive into our heads that rugby league is working class - therefore how about treating its fan as workin clas, and offer $15 GA and tix and $2 meat pies and free entry for kids.

Get the masses into the gates - get as many people into the gates as possible and offer them a variety of things to buy - the more into the gates, the more things inside are bought.

It also looks amazing - a sold out leichardt looks betteer than a 10k crowd @ Bruce. when people see stadiums full, they wanna be there, when people see them empty, they dont.

Toviii · Post by **Toviii** » April 26, 2013, 2:27 pm

I don't mean to be a negative Nelly, but are people of the belief that if we dropped ticket prices we would get a significant improvement in crowd numbers? Apart from the faithful, I'm not sure if the interest in the Raiders is actually there to begin with? It seems the people of Canberra get behind the Brumbies moreso than they do the Raiders. Whilst I was living there it would be a lot more likely for someone to ask you 'Hey are you going to the Brumbies this weekend?' rather than 'Hey did you want to go to the Raiders game tonight?' Reducing the ticket prices would help, but the Raiders need to do more in terms promotion and marketing for the city to get behind them. The NRL could also help out with more free to air exposure but that's another story.

The Green Hornet · Post by **The Green Hornet** » April 26, 2013, 2:49 pm

Toviii wrote:I don't mean to be a negative Nelly, but are people of the belief that if we dropped ticket prices we would get a significant improvement in crowd numbers? Apart from the faithful, I'm not sure if the interest in the Raiders is actually there to begin with? It seems the people of Canberra get behind the Brumbies moreso than they do the Raiders. Whilst I was living there it would be a lot more likely for someone to ask you 'Hey are you going to the Brumbies this weekend?' rather than 'Hey did you want to go to the Raiders game tonight?' Reducing the ticket prices would help, but the Raiders need to do more in terms promotion and marketing for the city to get behind them. The NRL could also help out with more free to air exposure but that's another story.

I really do think we would get significantly more people to the game if prices were lower. I for one cant afford the prices they charge atm, and lots of mates with young families are in the same boat. Simply cant justify spending the cash for a family of 4. Drop the prices, guarantee you a lot more people will go, not just individuals, but families also.

In terms of promotion, i think its a self fulfilling prophecy. All the promotion in the world still wont make people go to the game (regularly) with the current prices. So you're left with an interested market at first, who cant be involved because of pricing, so they will soon find other areas to spend their time and money, and the Raiders have lost the opportunity of adding to memberships.

Out of interest, does anyone know the stats of membership numbers for 2013 compared to years past?

Dibbers · Post by **Dibbers** » April 26, 2013, 2:59 pm

I don't think the NRL gives a rats about crowd figures to be honest... Considering all the money is in the broadcast rights and advertising, they'll get more money if people stay at home and watch it on TV then they'll make from selling out stadiums.

Think about it, It costs $60,000 to pay for gameday. So at current prices the Raiders need 9,600 to attend (off the top of my head, can't remember the exact amounts mentioned in the thread). So in order to make a PROFIT they need over 9,600 to attend (which doesn't happen very often). When you can sell a game to broadcasters, and gurantee Holden ads at halftime, or Hungry Jacks ads scrolling at the bottom of the screen, those companies will pay you the $60k for the pleasure... and that's each... so you make a 100% return on your investment just from 2 companies having ads on during a game purely because there are "x" amount of people watching it on TV.

It's the easier way of making money. Why spend thousands in marketing trying to get people to games, when you'd prefer them to watch it at home, save the money from marketing and just sell a couple of ads? More people at games means less people watching on TV, which means less money from advertising.

It sucks but that's the way of the game these days.

jedski · Post by **jedski** » April 26, 2013, 3:04 pm

Timbo wrote:Someone made a comment about Roosters prices, a friend of mine has been a member for years. I was told that the prices went through the floor when the SFS became Allianz stadium and it offset the costs.

Did the Roosters actually sell the sponsorship to Allianz, or was it sold by the stadium management?

raidersforme · Post by **raidersforme** » April 26, 2013, 3:55 pm

The price is way to high, and to think other clubs can do this.

To celebrate 25 years since the 1988 Grand Final between the Bulldogs and the Tigers which the Bulldogs charged to victory 24-12 in front of 40,000 fans the Bulldogs will be offering 1988 General Admission ticket prices for an exclusive time of 1988 minutes.

The prices for General Admission tickets in 1988 and for the 1988 minutes are as follows:

Adult $10
Concession
$7.50
Family
$20
Junior $5

This exclusive offer will be available from Tuesday, 23 April at 11.00am through until Wednesday, 24 April at 8.08pm.

ANZ Stadium are also getting involved by bringing back some famous items that many fans would have enjoyed back in 1988. Both the famous Chicko Roll and hotdog will be available for just $2.50 from all food outlets inside the venue prior to the kick-off of the NRL match.

Be sure to guarantee your seat and take advantage of this special offer which celebrates such a great moment in Bulldogs history.

Shadow Boxer · Post by **Shadow Boxer** » April 26, 2013, 4:01 pm

From memory the act gov actually pay the raiders and brumbies to play there. Otherwise they would have an empty stadium,

Ie the raiders are guaranteed a certain gate

I'm not sure how it works but the season ticket thing is a scam to exploit the situation.

Seiffert82 · Post by **Seiffert82** » April 26, 2013, 4:26 pm

Toviii wrote:I don't mean to be a negative Nelly, but are people of the belief that if we dropped ticket prices we would get a significant improvement in crowd numbers? Apart from the faithful, I'm not sure if the interest in the Raiders is actually there to begin with? It seems the people of Canberra get behind the Brumbies moreso than they do the Raiders. Whilst I was living there it would be a lot more likely for someone to ask you 'Hey are you going to the Brumbies this weekend?' rather than 'Hey did you want to go to the Raiders game tonight?' Reducing the ticket prices would help, but the Raiders need to do more in terms promotion and marketing for the city to get behind them. The NRL could also help out with more free to air exposure but that's another story.

Did you see the sea of green at our Cronulla finals match? There are plenty of 'closet' fans out there as well as people who simply can't afford to take their entire family to the footy for $100 plus food.

I reckon if you drop the GA kids ticket prices to $5 and adults to around $20 you'll get a lot more people deciding to go on the day.

cat · Post by **cat** » April 26, 2013, 4:30 pm

Dibbers wrote:I don't think the NRL gives a rats about crowd figures to be honest... Considering all the money is in the broadcast rights and advertising, they'll get more money if people stay at home and watch it on TV then they'll make from selling out stadiums.

Think about it, It costs $60,000 to pay for gameday. So at current prices the Raiders need 9,600 to attend (off the top of my head, can't remember the exact amounts mentioned in the thread). So in order to make a PROFIT they need over 9,600 to attend (which doesn't happen very often). When you can sell a game to broadcasters, and gurantee Holden ads at halftime, or Hungry Jacks ads scrolling at the bottom of the screen, those companies will pay you the $60k for the pleasure... and that's each... so you make a 100% return on your investment just from 2 companies having ads on during a game purely because there are "x" amount of people watching it on TV.

It's the easier way of making money. Why spend thousands in marketing trying to get people to games, when you'd prefer them to watch it at home, save the money from marketing and just sell a couple of ads? More people at games means less people watching on TV, which means less money from advertising.

your argument is great and true but I don't think the clubs get any money from the ads during the game on tv and in relation to the raiders we only get one free tv game this year. Fox sports don't do ads during the game that I know of

Seiffert82 · Post by **Seiffert82** » April 26, 2013, 4:38 pm

Funnily enough I recorded the Footy Show on Thursday as I saw Phil Gould was interviewing David Smith (surprisingly they talked about the footy more than usual as well and it was good to see Erin Molan distance herself from all the other crap they carry on about).

Anyway, among other things, Smith made the point that he wants to see crowd numbers increase and to make it more of an 'entire package' for the spectator.

Now, as much as I don't give a crap about the peripheral entertainment around the games, I did find it heartening that he does have a focus on increasing spectator numbers and the fan base as a whole (although they all say that, so actions will speak louder than words).

With that in mind, I might actually write to him about our ticket prices. It really is a rort and if he even vaguely looks at the AFL model where they have massive member numbers and also low prices for families to rock up to a game it's hard to argue that the model that the Raiders have implemented is a sensible one.