Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing drugs

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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Shano » August 24, 2012, 11:30 pm

LP Raider wrote:I have been told by a local league player that he was offered performance drug's, IF Lance has been getting away with it for so many years at an international level how can we trust the players we chear on week after week are clean after the Storm scandal.
Did the storm take performance enhancing drugs?

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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad » September 4, 2012, 3:25 pm

Tyler Hamilton claims in memoirs that Lance Armstrong was 'two years ahead' of everyone else
The Australian September 04, 2012 12:15PM

Lance Armstrong was a doping pioneer "two years ahead of what everybody else was doing", according to Tyler Hamilton's explosive memoir to be released this week.

The book sets out in unprecedented detail the extent of Armstrong's cheating and how the Texan and his US Postal Service teammates managed to evade the testers for so long.

The Secret Race is an extraordinary 268-page confessional which, as one American reviewer commented, "isn't just a game-changer for the Armstrong myth -- it's the game-ender".

Cycling's doping culture is laid bare as Armstrong's former friend and teammate describes a world in which EPO, steroids, testosterone, Actovegin, human-growth hormones and blood transfusions became commonplace and vital for success. Hamilton traces how more drugs were made available the higher he climbed in the US Postal team, until he was initiated to the inner circle of Armstrong's mountain domestiques who boosted their hematocrit levels with EPO.

For the Tour de France in 1999, US Postal hired Armstrong's gardener, nicknamed Motoman, to follow the Tour on a motorbike, carrying a Thermos flask full of EPO vials and a prepaid cell phone. "When we needed 'Edgar (Allan Poe, the nickname for EPO)," writes Hamilton, "Phillipe would zip through the Tour's traffic and make a drop-off."

Used syringes were put into a Coke can which was crushed and given to the team doctor, who carried it away in his knapsack unnoticed through the crowds.

EPO usage became such an everyday chore that Hamilton "got to where I could estimate my hematocrit level by the colour of my blood".

Blood doping was added to the armoury in 2000. Hamilton writes that Armstrong and the team director, Johan Bruyneel, instituted a sophisticated program in which riders' blood was withdrawn, stored and reinjected to boost the red blood cells and increase endurance. He describes flying from France to Spain in 2000 with Armstrong and another teammate, Kevin Livingstone, to have their blood drawn. "With the other stuff, you swallow a pill or put on a patch or get a tiny injection," Hamilton writes. "But here you're watching a big clear plastic bag slowly fill up with your warm dark red blood. You never forget it."

Hamilton says that during the Tour de France in 2000, the riders entered their hotel room to find their blood bags taped to a wall above their beds, ready for reinjection.

He describes getting goosebumps as his blood, still cold from its refrigeration, re-entered his system. The retired rider admits to sustained doping, and many more blood transfusions, when he left US Postal for CSC and Phonak.

Armstrong has always protested that he never tested positive, a hollow claim according to Hamilton.

"If you were careful and paid attention, you could dope and be 99 per cent certain that you would not get caught," Hamilton writes.

Riders would tip each other off on mobile phones if a tester arrived in Girona, Spain, where they were based, so they could take evasive action if they were still in their "glowtime" (the period when drugs in the system are still detectable).

Michele Ferrari, the Italian doctor who ran Armstrong's training regime and was recently banned for life by the United States Anti-Doping Agency, taught US Postal riders to "microdose", using smaller amounts of EPO and injecting the drug into the vein so it left the system quicker.

As well as naming teammates, management and doctors, the book throws serious allegations against the UCI, cycling's international governing body.

Hamilton and other US Postal riders have testified that Armstrong admitted to testing positive for EPO at the Tour of Switzerland in 2001 -- a fact confirmed by Martial Saugy, director of the Lausanne anti-doping laboratory, in USADA's investigation.

Hamilton writes that Armstrong told him: "No worries, dude. We're gonna have a meeting with them. It's all taken care of."

"Some time after that, I remember Lance phoning Hein Verbruggen. I was struck by the casual tone of the conversation. Lance was talking to the president of the UCI. But he may as well have been talking to a business partner, a friend," Hamilton writes.

Verbruggen and the UCI have denied any improper action in relation to Armstrong.

Daniel Coyle, the book's author, has spoken to Hamilton's former teammates to corroborate his story, which he told under oath to a US federal grand jury and to USADA.

Armstrong continues to protest his innocence, despite being banned for life by USADA.

THE TIMES

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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Schifty » September 4, 2012, 5:18 pm

Really don't know what to think of all this Armstrong thing.

All the people giving evidence are blokes that have been caught cheating so you really have to question their credibility.

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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad » September 6, 2012, 9:47 am

Schifty wrote:Really don't know what to think of all this Armstrong thing.

All the people giving evidence are blokes that have been caught cheating so you really have to question their credibility.
It's true. I don't know what to think in this case. Are these people fessing up just trying to knock over the biggest name in cycling? To add to that, even if he did use, I feel like I can't hate the guy when you think of all the work he's done for Cancer charities.

Here's a thought: If you were in his position, and were asked to dope up, but in return, your actions will see in excess of $500 million raised for cancer research, would you do it?

Considering also he competed in an era where doping was rife in the sport, so he did what a lot of people were already doing, and in return he inspired millions of cancer sufferers around the world not to give up and to keep fighting.

I'm not mad at him
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Shadow Boxer » September 6, 2012, 10:00 am

Fuifui Bradbrad wrote:
Schifty wrote:Really don't know what to think of all this Armstrong thing.

All the people giving evidence are blokes that have been caught cheating so you really have to question their credibility.
It's true. I don't know what to think in this case. Are these people fessing up just trying to knock over the biggest name in cycling? To add to that, even if he did use, I feel like I can't hate the guy when you think of all the work he's done for Cancer charities.

Here's a thought: If you were in his position, and were asked to dope up, but in return, your actions will see in excess of $500 million raised for cancer research, would you do it?

Considering also he competed in an era where doping was rife in the sport, so he did what a lot of people were already doing, and in return he inspired millions of cancer sufferers around the world not to give up and to keep fighting.

I'm not mad at him
They did a piece on it on Gruen planet last night, apparently the Arnmstrong strategy is to make it seem like if you hate him you like cancer. Might just be working.

How anybody could seriously believe he didn't take drugs is just mind boggling, then again people believe in sky fairies so I am constantly amazed.

Bring me some Edgar.....
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad » September 6, 2012, 10:03 am

Shadow Boxer wrote:They did a piece on it on Gruen planet last night, apparently the Arnmstrong strategy is to make it seem like if you hate him you like cancer. Might just be working.

How anybody could seriously believe he didn't take drugs is just mind boggling, then again people believe in sky fairies so I am constantly amazed.

Bring me some Edgar.....
It's true. I remember one year in the 90's something like 10-20 odd people were kicked out after day 1
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by SubLime Green » September 6, 2012, 11:17 am

I hate the fact that he is basically using Cancer Research as an advertising tool in order to save his reputation.

I'm glad the money was raised for Cancer Research, but I certainly don't agree with the means it was achieved. I don't think encouraging dishonest and illegal activity as long as it raises money in some way for Cancer Research is the right thing to do.

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Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Stuat » September 6, 2012, 11:45 am

It's a funny one. I highly suspect Lance was doped up to the eyeballs. If that's proven it needs to be acknowledged. On the flip side, the problem in taking away his titles is that who the hell do you give them to. Pretty much all the top ten riders in those tours, especially the early ones have similar asterixes next to their names and have been embroiled in some sort of doping controversy. To find winners that were likely clean you have to go back to riders finishing 8, 9th, 12th, 14th...

Taking Lances tours and giving them to another riders who was also likely doped up doesn't achieve anything... Having the greatest cyclist of his generation hypothetically with 3-4 tour wins all from finishes outside the top 10 is a bit silly. Like the Storm, Lance will still be viewed as the "winner" of those tours whether it's official or not. I can't see a clean rider who finished outside the top 10 and more than a decade later being awarded the "win" getting much out of it, either in standing historically or monetarily. They will simply become a bit of an historical footnote from a dark time in cyclings history... I'm a bit conflicted about what's "best"...

In terms of history, Lance will always be tainted. That will stay with him throughout history. A bit like all the track records from the 70's and 80's a majority of which were likely set by athletes drugging it up. Those records are viewed by many accordingly- they stand but with a big addendum next to them. Maybe that's the best option here- asterix those tours but let the official record remain unchanged... The damage to how those are viewed and legacy of the riders has already been done and will follow those tours forevermore... Maybe that's enough pubishment...

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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Michael » September 6, 2012, 11:59 am

I suspect people might be more willing to forgive Lance's doping if he wasn't in the habit of employing Gestapo tactics against his enemies, and using his cancer battle as some form of magical cloaking device that repels all criticism of his drug cheating. "HOW CAN YOU SAY THAT ABOUT LANCE? HE BEAT CANCER!"
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by gergreg » September 10, 2012, 6:21 pm

And now Contador wins the 'tour of Spain'. What happened to the days when if you got caught cheating that was the end of your career?
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Shadow Boxer » October 27, 2012, 6:12 am

http://www.google.com/hostednews/afp/ar ... daa831.101

:roflmao You couldn't make this **** up if you tried
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Shezza » October 27, 2012, 10:37 am

That is gold SB
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by SubLime Green » October 27, 2012, 3:44 pm

:lol:

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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by -PJ- » October 28, 2012, 5:15 am

the UCI have announced there will be no official winner of the Tour de France in the records between 1999 and 2005. the whole sport should be canned. or let them all juice up and may the best horse win.....
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by 86 invader » November 4, 2012, 8:42 pm

i can't really add much to this discussion that hasn't been said... however, eddie merckx and miguel indurain (2 of the guys tied for most tour de france titles) have been very cautious in condemning armstrong... if they can't even pretend to be disgusted or horrified about this, then that further underlines how long doping has been going on and how deep it was embedded in the sport...

on one hand it's a great deterrent to think that people can be shamed years after they have stopped competing but i also wonder if this money and energy that's gone into this anti-armstrong campaign couldn't have been put to better use...

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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad » November 5, 2012, 11:01 am

Tour De France has been dodgy since day dot. I've read stories of people catching rides in trucks in the areas where there were no spectators, and people coming in halfway through the race.

People will always find a way to beat the system.
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by -GD- » January 15, 2013, 10:39 am

ABC Grandstand


BREAKING: Report: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing drugs in interview with Oprah Winfrey (via Associated Press).

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Schifty » January 15, 2013, 10:52 am

Did the audience all get free EPO?

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad » January 15, 2013, 11:04 am

Schifty wrote:Did the audience all get free EPO?
:lol:
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Re: Lance Armstrong charged with doping

Post by The Nickman » January 15, 2013, 11:08 am

-GD- wrote:ABC Grandstand


BREAKING: Report: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing drugs in interview with Oprah Winfrey (via Associated Press).
Somebody in the Gambling Thread bet on this!!
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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by -PJ- » January 15, 2013, 1:50 pm

I've added Lance to the list of people I don't care for.
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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by -GD- » January 16, 2013, 8:06 am

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by -PJ- » January 16, 2013, 5:58 pm

for those of you with foxtel you can watch the drug cheat with Oprah Winfrey on discovery channel on Friday afternoon at 1pm.
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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by LP Raider » January 16, 2013, 6:04 pm

When is the international sporting community going to say enough is enough with the constant drug scandals regarding US athletes and I use the term athlete loosely.

The US has time and time again brought scandal to sport as a whole.

Hopefully with the downfall of its economy, which is a similar paradox...the international community will be less reluctant in their involvement.

As a golf fan there have been similar whispers of Tiger Woods using performance enhancers as there were of Armstrong...it would not surprise me the slightest.

This country realy is the vial of the sporting world, perhaps they should be kicked out of the Olympics and they could host their own claiming every winner world **** champion... muppets.

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by gergreg » January 16, 2013, 6:57 pm

The fact that he denied it for ten years, even suing several publications for even suggesting he was a drug cheat should see him end up behind bars. I heard on the news that his estimated wealth is close to or over $100 million - all gained by cheating. It's an absolute disgrace.

Totally agreed LP - the worst one I think is Carl Lewis. He has the nerve to accuse Usain Bolt of being a drug cheat (which I actually believe) when he got busted himself, yet his offence was virtually swept under the carpet.
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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Begbie » January 17, 2013, 5:23 am

Gerg wrote: Totally agreed LP - the worst one I think is Carl Lewis. He has the nerve to accuse Usain Bolt of being a drug cheat (which I actually believe) when he got busted himself, yet his offence was virtually swept under the carpet.
Interesting, why do you believe?

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Dr Zaius » January 17, 2013, 10:43 am

Not something I've considered before LP. But you are right, most of the big names busted in recent years are American. Pretty hypocritical given their carry on about countries like east Germany
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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by gergreg » January 17, 2013, 5:25 pm

Begbie wrote:
Gerg wrote: Totally agreed LP - the worst one I think is Carl Lewis. He has the nerve to accuse Usain Bolt of being a drug cheat (which I actually believe) when he got busted himself, yet his offence was virtually swept under the carpet.
Interesting, why do you believe?

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Professor » January 17, 2013, 7:56 pm

Schifty wrote:Did the audience all get free EPO?
:lol:

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Schifty » January 17, 2013, 8:43 pm

Here is a drinking game to play when you get a chance to watch the interview.

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Begbie » January 17, 2013, 9:20 pm

Gerg wrote:
Begbie wrote:
Gerg wrote: Totally agreed LP - the worst one I think is Carl Lewis. He has the nerve to accuse Usain Bolt of being a drug cheat (which I actually believe) when he got busted himself, yet his offence was virtually swept under the carpet.
Interesting, why do you believe?

http://chicago.cbslocal.com/2012/08/12/ ... u-know-it/
Yes mate, this article has been doing the rounds and copped a ribbing from 99% of society.

Dan Berstein is a bitter and twisted American with absolutley no idea.You are accusing Usain Bolt as being a drug cheat without any evidence or proof. Why are you so sure?

It's a typical response to the the yanks being beat. Did we get another another similar article for Micahel Phelps phenominal effort it the pool and questioning his performance in the pool. .
Last edited by Begbie on January 18, 2013, 8:46 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Schifty » January 17, 2013, 9:39 pm

MIchael Phelps didn't win all those Gold Medals in Bejing.

Lost the final of the 100m butterfly to the Serbian bloke, but that wouldn't make a good story so shock horror he won by the smallest marging possible.

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Begbie » January 17, 2013, 9:43 pm

Exactly! the serb was robbed.

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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by -PJ- » January 18, 2013, 12:48 pm

just watching the LA interview and hey Lance has come clean. the only thing he hasn't done is drop any names which I totally understand. to Lance, I'm disappointed in you and in my eyes have lost any credibility. you are a cheat. I respect you for what you have told the world today. you're name is mud. millions of people around the world now look at you in a different light. you have let so many people down, shame on you...
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Re: Lance Armstrong admits to using performance-enhancing dr

Post by Shadow Boxer » January 18, 2013, 1:49 pm

green94 wrote:just watching the LA interview and hey Lance has come clean. the only thing he hasn't done is drop any names which I totally understand. to Lance, I'm disappointed in you and in my eyes have lost any credibility. you are a cheat. I respect you for what you have told the world today. you're name is mud. millions of people around the world now look at you in a different light. you have let so many people down, shame on you...
Well he has zero respect from me, he's still lying to protect his partners in crime, only confessed because he got caught and needs to crawl into a gutter somewhere and rot.
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