The Cricket Thread

[Northern Raider]

Burns has a pretty useful Test career - avg 40 (4x 100 and 4x 50 in 28 innings >>> he failed in series vs India (in Aus), NZ (in Aus), Sri Lanka (in SL) and Sth Africa, and prospered vs WI, NZ (in NZ) Sri Lanka (in Aus). His State form was good last yr. He is coming off a big hundred last summer.
For Aust A - 133 vs Sussex.

You need a lot of work on your statistical analysis in cricket. Burns "failed" against India by scoring 2 x 50s in his 4 innings. Thats the same number of 50s that Harris has in his 11 total test innings, which you believe is "OK".

His "failure" against New Zealand included scores of 126, 70 and 40.

He had a tough time in Sri Lanka but we got flogged 3-0 in that series. He was dropped for the 3rd test and SMarsh was promoted to opener.

He was recalled for the Hobart test against South Africa where EVERYBODY failed. He was again dropped (along with Callum Ferguson in his only test appearance). His next match was flown over to SA for the last test following Sandpapergate. Top scored in the 2nd innings with 42 when the side was 119 all out.

His test career has hardly been delivered on a silver platter. To call him a flat track bully is ridiculous. The only time he's really "failed" is in Sri Lanka and he had a few friends there.

You are correct. Serves me right for reading stats on my phone over lunch. My apologies.

I still think he is a flat track bully. I've always had that feeling about him. As I said, he is more credentialed than the other 2.

Just looked up those 50s vs India, we made 570 in the 1st dig, then came out swinging in the 2nd innings, the strike rates are all very high, bar SMarsh who made 1 from 4 in the 2nd dig. He was at 6.

It's 129 not 126 vs NZ. He made 71 in the 1st dig too. Team made 550 in the 1st innings. Warner twin tons. This was back when NZ still sucked. They were still sucky when he toured NZ too.

As for calling Harris ok, an avg of 30 is ok. In other countries that's acceptable. Not India or Australia though. Hence my suggestion of Uzi opening, where he avgs more than anywhere else at Test level.

So a guy averaging 40 is a flat track bully and a guy averaging 30 is OK. Good grief.

[Matt]

Bancroft 52*
Handscomb out for 13.
92/4. Require 64 more to win.

[Matt]

Burns has a pretty useful Test career - avg 40 (4x 100 and 4x 50 in 28 innings >>> he failed in series vs India (in Aus), NZ (in Aus), Sri Lanka (in SL) and Sth Africa, and prospered vs WI, NZ (in NZ) Sri Lanka (in Aus). His State form was good last yr. He is coming off a big hundred last summer.
For Aust A - 133 vs Sussex.

You need a lot of work on your statistical analysis in cricket. Burns "failed" against India by scoring 2 x 50s in his 4 innings. Thats the same number of 50s that Harris has in his 11 total test innings, which you believe is "OK".

His "failure" against New Zealand included scores of 126, 70 and 40.

He had a tough time in Sri Lanka but we got flogged 3-0 in that series. He was dropped for the 3rd test and SMarsh was promoted to opener.

He was recalled for the Hobart test against South Africa where EVERYBODY failed. He was again dropped (along with Callum Ferguson in his only test appearance). His next match was flown over to SA for the last test following Sandpapergate. Top scored in the 2nd innings with 42 when the side was 119 all out.

His test career has hardly been delivered on a silver platter. To call him a flat track bully is ridiculous. The only time he's really "failed" is in Sri Lanka and he had a few friends there.

You are correct. Serves me right for reading stats on my phone over lunch. My apologies.

I still think he is a flat track bully. I've always had that feeling about him. As I said, he is more credentialed than the other 2.

Just looked up those 50s vs India, we made 570 in the 1st dig, then came out swinging in the 2nd innings, the strike rates are all very high, bar SMarsh who made 1 from 4 in the 2nd dig. He was at 6.

It's 129 not 126 vs NZ. He made 71 in the 1st dig too. Team made 550 in the 1st innings. Warner twin tons. This was back when NZ still sucked. They were still sucky when he toured NZ too.

As for calling Harris ok, an avg of 30 is ok. In other countries that's acceptable. Not India or Australia though. Hence my suggestion of Uzi opening, where he avgs more than anywhere else at Test level.

So a guy averaging 40 is a flat track bully and a guy averaging 30 is OK. Good grief.

As I said, avg of 30 as an Aussie is considered not good enough. However, people more knowing than us are backing Harris. Hence ok.

Flat track bully is my opinion. You are welcome to disagree. However, it's worth reading the countries he played against, and the attacks he faced. That Sth African side was good. SL are very good at home. The India he faced was different to Kohlis side now. NZ only came good recently. WIs have been awful for a long long time.

If he is picked and prospers in this Ashes, you may rub it in my face.

BTW, I don't see Bancroft or Harris prospering in the Ashes.

[Northern Raider]

Burns out performed Harris against the same opposition. Maybe Harris needs a bit of flat track bully in him to improve his record.

[Matt]

Burns out performed Harris against the same opposition. Maybe Harris needs a bit of flat track bully in him to improve his record.

Maybe.

Looks like Bancroft has just put his hand up with a match winning 93*. Making the opener selection no clearer.

[Northern Raider]

Burns out performed Harris against the same opposition. Maybe Harris needs a bit of flat track bully in him to improve his record.

Maybe.

Looks like Bancroft has just put his hand up with a match winning 93*. Making the opener selection no clearer.

Yep, Bancroft scoring runs clouds it even more. He was an outside chance at best but now right in the mix. Selectors have to make a call and hope it works. At least they have alternatives if their first choice fails.

[Matt]

Burns out performed Harris against the same opposition. Maybe Harris needs a bit of flat track bully in him to improve his record.

Maybe.

Looks like Bancroft has just put his hand up with a match winning 93*. Making the opener selection no clearer.

Yep, Bancroft scoring runs clouds it even more. He was an outside chance at best but now right in the mix. Selectors have to make a call and hope it works. At least they have alternatives if their first choice fails.

Ill be honest, I reckon that innings will get him a run in the 1st Test. Which of course means the Barmy Army are going to have some serious fun

[Northern Raider]

Burns out performed Harris against the same opposition. Maybe Harris needs a bit of flat track bully in him to improve his record.

Maybe.

Looks like Bancroft has just put his hand up with a match winning 93*. Making the opener selection no clearer.

Yep, Bancroft scoring runs clouds it even more. He was an outside chance at best but now right in the mix. Selectors have to make a call and hope it works. At least they have alternatives if their first choice fails.

Ill be honest, I reckon that innings will get him a run in the 1st Test. Which of course means the Barmy Army are going to have some serious fun

All 3 suspendees returning to test cricket in the same match. Will make it harder for them to target an individual.

[Matt]

Burns out performed Harris against the same opposition. Maybe Harris needs a bit of flat track bully in him to improve his record.

Maybe.

Looks like Bancroft has just put his hand up with a match winning 93*. Making the opener selection no clearer.

Yep, Bancroft scoring runs clouds it even more. He was an outside chance at best but now right in the mix. Selectors have to make a call and hope it works. At least they have alternatives if their first choice fails.

Ill be honest, I reckon that innings will get him a run in the 1st Test. Which of course means the Barmy Army are going to have some serious fun

All 3 suspendees returning to test cricket in the same match. Will make it harder for them to target an individual.

Yes, but it gives the Barmy Army 3 players to sing at, which means more not less

[Matt]

Ok, the warm up/ selection game is over, who do you think Langer will pick? Not your opinion, get into Alf's thoughts. Who plays the 1st Test?

Warner - LOCK
Bancroft - I think we all knew this spot was up for grabs, and when it mattered, it was Bancroft who took the game by the horns
Khawaja - If fit - If not, I think they pick Marsh or Labu, as I think Wade will be at 6. I lean to Marsh coz I think they are tempted by the extra seam bowler, obviously everyone slides up 1 in the order.
Smith - LOCK
Head - little lock. If Wade isnt at 6, Head is under the pump.
Wade - I think there will be great temptation to pick Marsh, but I think they will be confident in their 4 man attack.
Paine - LOCK
Cummins - LOCK
Starc - LOCK
Lyon - LOCK
Hazelwood - LOCK

Pattinson - 12th - I've said it before, but I would be shocked to see our bowlers split for the 1st Test. I do see Pattinson playing this series somewhere though. Id also love to know Langer's thoughts of 5 genuine bowlers, knowing Cummins, Pattinson and Starc can all bat.

Marsh 13th
Siddle/ Bird/ Neser 14th - Paper, Scissors, Rock situation for the extra bowler. I think Langer goes for experience, and I've ordered it that way on purpose. Though, like you'll see below, Country cricketers might be dropped knowing they are still in the country.
Burns 15th - Harris is playing Country Cricket, which picking Burns keeps him in the country.
Patterson/ Labu 16th - If not selected for the 1st Test, because Labu is already in the country, he goes back to county cricket.

Carey, Pucovski, Tremain, Handscomb, Holland, the 2 extra quicks, Labu* and Harris* all left out.

[Northern Raider]

Hi Matt, without going into player by player analysis you might be pretty close to right on the starting team. I also don't like the idea. It means 2 guys coming off centuries in the last test are being dropped for 2 players averaging under 30 in test cricket. I'm referring to Burns and Patterson being replaced by Bancroft and Wade. It also means the only batsman retained from a fairly dominant series win over Sri Lanka will be Travis Head. We should be showing more loyalty to the incumbents who have been scoring runs. There's been enough disruption the last couple of years without rocking the boat even more.

If Khawaja is ruled out then I think Labushagne is the logical pick to replace him. He can bat at no3 and is also easy to replace when Usi returns. He's an expendable fill in. Bringing in Marsh might give them another seamer but it also messes with the batting order. Better to have some stability with an eye on the whole series.

Bowlers really should pick themselves. We would be mad to leave out Starc. He's easily the most dangerous bowler in our attack. If he faulters then look at bringing in Pattinson. At least give Starc the opportunity to fail first. If he's on he could easily be our top wicket taker for the series.

[Matt]

Hi Matt, without going into player by player analysis you might be pretty close to right on the starting team. I also don't like the idea. It means 2 guys coming off centuries in the last test are being dropped for 2 players averaging under 30 in test cricket. I'm referring to Burns and Patterson being replaced by Bancroft and Wade. It also means the only batsman retained from a fairly dominant series win over Sri Lanka will be Travis Head. We should be showing more loyalty to the incumbents who have been scoring runs. There's been enough disruption the last couple of years without rocking the boat even more.

If Khawaja is ruled out then I think Labushagne is the logical pick to replace him. He can bat at no3 and is also easy to replace when Usi returns. He's an expendable fill in. Bringing in Marsh might give them another seamer but it also messes with the batting order. Better to have some stability with an eye on the whole series.

Bowlers really should pick themselves. We would be mad to leave out Starc. He's easily the most dangerous bowler in our attack. If he faulters then look at bringing in Pattinson. At least give Starc the opportunity to fail first. If he's on he could easily be our top wicket taker for the series.

Incumbency should only take you so far. Esp when your spot isn't nailed down and/or players pushing for your spot.

Openers:
Harris and Burns got cracks because of Sandpaper gate, Renshaw failing to regain form/HIA fitness and Finch being an LBW gimme.

Given Bancroft is avaliable, there is argument to him being the incumbent in the same vane as Warner - very different form/ability situation though, esp as Bancroft was only just holding onto his spot. Both the other 2 are incumbents too. So you have to punt 2.

On this tour, all 3 openers have had 1 significant innings, and mostly garbage outside that. Burns has had medical issues since SL Test series. Harris avgs 47-48 In country cricket, and Bancroft 57(?). All have claim.

#6
I like Patterson, he is the most consistent state middle order bat for yrs. 100 in the last game. As I said, hard to leave him out, buuuut...

Wade has avged like 60 since the summer. Hard to leave him out.

[Northern Raider]

Total mixed messages there. Incumbency argument for some but not others. No matter how you spin it the situation is simple. 2 guys coming off test centuries and have good test averages are potentially being dropped for 2 guys who have played tests for 15 months or more that have ordinary averages.

Just stick with the guys who did the job for you also time.

[Matt]

https://www.foxsports.com.au/cricket/au ... 6a060f1f61

Wade in, and likely to have bat in the 1st Test.
Bancroft in.
Neser in.

16 man squad is now 17.

Suggestion of Labu in, but the country cricket proximity thing might be in play, or he is #17.

No Carey.
No Holland.

[Matt]

Total mixed messages there. Incumbency argument for some but not others. No matter how you spin it the situation is simple. 2 guys coming off test centuries and have good test averages are potentially being dropped for 2 guys who have played tests for 15 months or more that have ordinary averages.

Just stick with the guys who did the job for you also time.

Yep.
2 are unlucky missing out for Smith and Warner.

2 of 3 lose out to partner Warner.

Looks like Patterson loses out to Wade, having beaten him to a baggy green at home vs SL.

[Northern Raider]

Patterson beat Wade to the test cap in Aus. Scores a century. Gets dropped for Wade.

Go figure

[-PJ-]

I love myself a bit of test cricket.

What ungodly hour do I need to be out of bed to watch a session a day before needing sleep to function at work ?

[Dusty]

I can’t wait


Sent from my iPhone using The Greenhouse

[Matt]

Ashes squad:
Australia Squad: Tim Paine (c), Travis Head (VC), Patrick Cummins (VC), Cameron Bancroft, Marcus Harris, Josh Hazlewood, Usman Khawaja, Marnus Labuschagne, Nathan Lyon, Mitchell Marsh, Michael Neser, James Pattinson, Peter Siddle, Steven Smith, Mitchell Starc, Matthew Wade, David Warner.

https://wwos.nine.com.au/cricket/austra ... ocial-WWOS

Looking at that, if say my XII is pretty right

[-PJ-]

Q. When are the ENG women's side gunna have a go ?

Boris won't be happy...

[reptar]

Q. When are the ENG women's side gunna have a go ?

Boris won't be happy...

If they have a go, do they get a go?

[Matt]

England Test squad for first Ashes Test: Joe Root (c), Moeen Ali, Jimmy Anderson, Jofra Archer, Jonny Bairstow, Stuart Broad, Rory Burns, Jos Buttler, Sam Curran, Joe Denly, Jason Roy, Ben Stokes (vc), Olly Stone, Chris Woakes.

https://www.cricket.com.au/news/england ... 2019-07-27

I'll guess the team...

Burns
Roy
Denly
Root
Buttler
Stokes
Bairstow
Ali
Woakes/ Archer/ Curran
Broad
Anderson

[Northern Raider]

A lot of fire power with their seamers. Still lack a quality spinner. Expect to see wickets prepared to suit. That shouldn't hurt Lyon too much. For a spinner he goes OK on the decks with some grass cover. He's like to rip it through the seam which gets a bit more purchase on the grass. Very much in his comfort zone with both turn and bounce.

[Matt]

A lot of fire power with their seamers. Still lack a quality spinner. Expect to see wickets prepared to suit. That shouldn't hurt Lyon too much. For a spinner he goes OK on the decks with some grass cover. He's like to rip it through the seam which gets a bit more purchase on the grass. Very much in his comfort zone with both turn and bounce.

Lyon prefers pace and bounce. That way he can vary arm speed.

Both pace attacks have good variety.

They look deeper batting

[-TW-]

Based on the squad

Warner
Harris
Khawaja
Smith
Head
Wade
Paine
Cummins
Pattinson
Starc
Lyon

Hazelwood

I'm torn on Bancroft, as he was the only one to hit one off the square in the trial game, and he's been in semi decent form in his county stint. But the fact is he almost got dropped for stinking it up in South Africa before being a cheat.

Pattinson over Hazelwood, early doors I want raw pace at them. They stink at facing out and out pace and if they pick Denly, Roy and that other spud I can't think of as their top 3 they could be 3 for bugger all. Hazelwood and Neser will get game time through this rotation policy that apparently they'll employ.

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[Matt]

Based on the squad

Warner
Harris
Khawaja
Smith
Head
Wade
Paine
Cummins
Pattinson
Starc
Lyon

Hazelwood

I'm torn on Bancroft, as he was the only one to hit one off the square in the trial game, and he's been in semi decent form in his county stint. But the fact is he almost got dropped for stinking it up in South Africa before being a cheat.

Pattinson over Hazelwood, early doors I want raw pace at them. They stink at facing out and out pace and if they pick Denly, Roy and that other spud I can't think of as their top 3 they could be 3 for bugger all. Hazelwood and Neser will get game time through this rotation policy that apparently they'll employ.

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Burns is the other spud (yes, the Poms have a Burns too). Their top 3 looks fragile, but they bat deep with Ali and Woakes at 7 and 8.

[Matt]

https://www.foxsports.com.au/cricket/au ... tEjuTao4Lw

This feels to me like Harris will be left out if Khawaja does get selected, which also looks likely.

[Northern Raider]

I'm all in favour of rewarding domestic form with test selection and Wade has been fantastic this past season. What I don't like is dropping a guy who has performed to accommodate him. Patterson was given a shot and took it (30 and 114*). He does not deserve to be dropped.

[Matt]

I'm all in favour of rewarding domestic form with test selection and Wade has been fantastic this past season. What I don't like is dropping a guy who has performed to accommodate him. Patterson was given a shot and took it (30 and 114*). He does not deserve to be dropped.

The kicker in this instance is that Patterson kept Wade out of the team 7 months ago.

[Northern Raider]

I'm all in favour of rewarding domestic form with test selection and Wade has been fantastic this past season. What I don't like is dropping a guy who has performed to accommodate him. Patterson was given a shot and took it (30 and 114*). He does not deserve to be dropped.

The kicker in this instance is that Patterson kept Wade out of the team 7 months ago.

Yep, selectors preferred him then and he did the job. What's changed now?

[Matt]

I'm all in favour of rewarding domestic form with test selection and Wade has been fantastic this past season. What I don't like is dropping a guy who has performed to accommodate him. Patterson was given a shot and took it (30 and 114*). He does not deserve to be dropped.

The kicker in this instance is that Patterson kept Wade out of the team 7 months ago.

Yep, selectors preferred him then and he did the job. What's changed now?

Wade banged so hard, he got through the door?!?

[-TW-]

Australia A form would have played a part

Wade carved up, Patterson made a couple of 30s

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[Matt]

Australia A form would have played a part

Wade carved up, Patterson made a couple of 30s

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Yep, thats why Burns vs Harris vs Bancroft became a shootout. The 1st two scored 100s vs Sussex. When the game was on the line in the inter-international match Bancroft batted them to a win. 93* vs an international quality attack beats 133 and 109(?) vs a County attack.

[Northern Raider]

I'm all in favour of rewarding domestic form with test selection and Wade has been fantastic this past season. What I don't like is dropping a guy who has performed to accommodate him. Patterson was given a shot and took it (30 and 114*). He does not deserve to be dropped.

The kicker in this instance is that Patterson kept Wade out of the team 7 months ago.

Yep, selectors preferred him then and he did the job. What's changed now?

Wade banged so hard, he got through the door?!?

Hodgo style

[Northern Raider]

Australia A form would have played a part

Wade carved up, Patterson made a couple of 30s

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Patterson hardly batted during the Australia A tour. He had 2 x Not Outs and 2 x DNBs in 5 innings. Realistically his position in the test team should not be up for grabs. He should at least hold his spot to start the series. If he doesn't measure up then Wade if 1st in line to take his spot.