The Greenhouse

And here I am in phase 2b paying virtually no attention to the rollout. It's going to be months before us 'balance of adult population' folk are deemed worthy.

Great to hear qld is opening up again.

Doc, are these 3 day lockdowns purely to allow the health services time to catch up on contact tracing? Have qld still not got a centralised location sign in tracing system?

That’s 2 lockdowns now with essentially no spread, are they spooked, sensible or just have a **** software system?

Coastalraider wrote:Great to hear qld is opening up again.

Doc, are these 3 day lockdowns purely to allow the health services time to catch up on contact tracing? Have qld still not got a centralised location sign in tracing system?

That’s 2 lockdowns now with essentially no spread, are they spooked, sensible or just have a **** software system?

It serves no purpose in snuffing out transmission. Its stalls transmission allowing contact tracers to play catch up. To snuff it out you need at least a couple of weeks locked down. I've no idea why they felt the need to do it. They are well resourced and should be able to contact trace those numbers. Although I do hear that the software they use is rather antiquated. It does play out well politically, as people seem to think that it snuffs out the cluster, and point to no further cases in Adelaide and Perth after their lockdown as proof.

I just hope no more cases pop up in NSW!!

Just seems unnecessary panic

The only lockdowns that have been justified imo was the first one to build the stockpile and the Melbourne one, albeit it was excessive

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So at this rate I might get my vaccine sometime in 2022.

Least it might be Pfizer

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Gotta admit, as much as I'm pro-vaccine, was feeling a bit sketchy on AstraZenica before they pulled it for under-50s.

The odds are absurdly low, but if that vaccine is going to kill 1 per 750,000, you can't help but think "what if I'm that one? The odds of somebody my age getting killed by COVID in Australia are far less than that".

If AstraZenica was all the world had, then sure, but there are a good number of effective vaccines that don't have this problem. I want one that doesn't come with a known chance of inflicting the dead-sies.

Sterlk wrote:Gotta admit, as much as I'm pro-vaccine, was feeling a bit sketchy on AstraZenica before they pulled it for under-50s.

The odds are absurdly low, but if that vaccine is going to kill 1 per 750,000, you can't help but think "what if I'm that one? The odds of somebody my age getting killed by COVID in Australia are far less than that".

If AstraZenica was all the world had, then sure, but there are a good number of effective vaccines that don't have this problem. I want one that doesn't come with a known chance of inflicting the dead-sies.

Completely agree.

There are safer options. We are not in a state of urgency. We have also purchased Novovax who hopefully are releasing Phase 3 data soon.

Dr Zaius wrote: ↑April 9, 2021, 8:48 am

Sterlk wrote:Gotta admit, as much as I'm pro-vaccine, was feeling a bit sketchy on AstraZenica before they pulled it for under-50s.

The odds are absurdly low, but if that vaccine is going to kill 1 per 750,000, you can't help but think "what if I'm that one? The odds of somebody my age getting killed by COVID in Australia are far less than that".

If AstraZenica was all the world had, then sure, but there are a good number of effective vaccines that don't have this problem. I want one that doesn't come with a known chance of inflicting the dead-sies.

Completely agree.

There are safer options. We are not in a state of urgency. We have also purchased Novovax who hopefully are releasing Phase 3 data soon.

Which vaccine did you have?

I'm not about to deny the possibility that the AZ vax can trigger these blood clots. However I'm not going to assume any connection either given all evidence to date is purely anecdotal and no clinical link has been identified. Looking at the raw numbers being published from the UK. There were 22 cases of Cerebral Venous Sinus Thrombosis (CVST) recorded from people who had received the AZ vax. Of those 7 lost their lives. According to medical sites CVST affects 5 in every 1 million people each year. The cases in the UK were recorded after 18 million people had received the AZ vax over the last 3 months. Statistically 90 people out of 18 million will suffer CVST this year vax or no vax. To have 22 in the first quarter is pretty much on par. Case of correlation does not necessarily mean causation.

Authorities are doing the right thing in taking the cautious approach. It will be wise to rule out any connection before pressing on.

The Nickman wrote: ↑April 9, 2021, 9:46 am

Dr Zaius wrote: ↑April 9, 2021, 8:48 am

Sterlk wrote:Gotta admit, as much as I'm pro-vaccine, was feeling a bit sketchy on AstraZenica before they pulled it for under-50s.

The odds are absurdly low, but if that vaccine is going to kill 1 per 750,000, you can't help but think "what if I'm that one? The odds of somebody my age getting killed by COVID in Australia are far less than that".

If AstraZenica was all the world had, then sure, but there are a good number of effective vaccines that don't have this problem. I want one that doesn't come with a known chance of inflicting the dead-sies.

Completely agree.

There are safer options. We are not in a state of urgency. We have also purchased Novovax who hopefully are releasing Phase 3 data soon.

Which vaccine did you have?

5G

Northern Raider wrote:

The Nickman wrote: ↑April 9, 2021, 9:46 am

Dr Zaius wrote: ↑April 9, 2021, 8:48 am

Sterlk wrote:Gotta admit, as much as I'm pro-vaccine, was feeling a bit sketchy on AstraZenica before they pulled it for under-50s.

The odds are absurdly low, but if that vaccine is going to kill 1 per 750,000, you can't help but think "what if I'm that one? The odds of somebody my age getting killed by COVID in Australia are far less than that".

If AstraZenica was all the world had, then sure, but there are a good number of effective vaccines that don't have this problem. I want one that doesn't come with a known chance of inflicting the dead-sies.

Completely agree.

There are safer options. We are not in a state of urgency. We have also purchased Novovax who hopefully are releasing Phase 3 data soon.

Which vaccine did you have?

5G

Hope it was Telstra, wouldn't want to hit a Vodafone blackspot

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Got my first shot last night.
I got the pfizer one, which im quite thankful for given 30 minutes after i got home from the shot they were announcing on the news AZ was being pulled for U50's

The Nickman wrote:

Dr Zaius wrote: ↑April 9, 2021, 8:48 am

Sterlk wrote:Gotta admit, as much as I'm pro-vaccine, was feeling a bit sketchy on AstraZenica before they pulled it for under-50s.

The odds are absurdly low, but if that vaccine is going to kill 1 per 750,000, you can't help but think "what if I'm that one? The odds of somebody my age getting killed by COVID in Australia are far less than that".

If AstraZenica was all the world had, then sure, but there are a good number of effective vaccines that don't have this problem. I want one that doesn't come with a known chance of inflicting the dead-sies.

Completely agree.

There are safer options. We are not in a state of urgency. We have also purchased Novovax who hopefully are releasing Phase 3 data soon.

Which vaccine did you have?

Pfizer

Northern Raider wrote:I'm not about to deny the possibility that the AZ vax can trigger these blood clots. However I'm not going to assume any connection either given all evidence to date is purely anecdotal and no clinical link has been identified. Looking at the raw numbers being published from the UK. There were 22 cases of Cerebral Venous Sinus Thrombosis (CVST) recorded from people who had received the AZ vax. Of those 7 lost their lives. According to medical sites CVST affects 5 in every 1 million people each year. The cases in the UK were recorded after 18 million people had received the AZ vax over the last 3 months. Statistically 90 people out of 18 million will suffer CVST this year vax or no vax. To have 22 in the first quarter is pretty much on par. Case of correlation does not necessarily mean causation.

Authorities are doing the right thing in taking the cautious approach. It will be wise to rule out any connection before pressing on.

There's more than anecdote, but less than causative evidence. Much of the pathology of covid is related to vasculopathy and thrombosis, so the suggestion that a vaccine with those antigens might cause something like that is not a stretch. The question is are the people that this occurs in the same cohort that have catastrophic thrombosis from covid.

This is a demonstration of the ongoing scrutiny that vaccination programs undergo after roll out and not a victory that antivaxxers might believe it to be. It's a testament to the safety of the childhood vaccination program, many of which the vaccines are 30 or more years old.

We have the time and option to switch to less concerning options, and I trust that they have made the right decision.

I don't see this as a slight against the federal government. Vaccine selection was always a gamble and they hedged their bets across three platforms - mRNA, viral vector and traditional protein with adjuvant (Novovax). Their performance on actual roll out however deserves criticism.

That makes total sense. My comments were more based on media reporting and reactions by the general population that the vaccine causes blood clots. It's drawing conclusions from anecdotes before any clinical link has been established. Particularly when statistically there is little difference in the number of cases to what is normally experienced. Precautions are now being taken until a link is either establish or eliminated. As you said, there's alternative routes that can be taken.

I think there’s more to it than you make out NR.

You can’t just look at the rates, you have to consider the segments and typical causes. If those clots are generally seen in older patients after surgery for example, that’s a very different kettle of fish to a sudden high propensity in younger people with no other causal contributors.

Not saying that’s the case, I haven’t done any research on that. But you do need to be careful just looking at frequency.

Botman wrote:Got my first shot last night.
I got the pfizer one, which im quite thankful for given 30 minutes after i got home from the shot they were announcing on the news AZ was being pulled for U50's

Who did you sleep with to get Pfizer?

gangrenous wrote: ↑April 10, 2021, 10:12 am

Botman wrote:Got my first shot last night.
I got the pfizer one, which im quite thankful for given 30 minutes after i got home from the shot they were announcing on the news AZ was being pulled for U50's

Who did you sleep with to get Pfizer?

My best guess on that is my wife? She's a doctor dealing with some very at risk people...

Honestly i dont know why i got the vaccine so early, my employer sent me an email saying i'd been idenitfied as critical/high risk and eligable for phase 1b... i dont really agree with that assessment but im pretty keen to get the vaccine so not going to argue with them
As for Pfizer over AZ? Pot luck i think

gangrenous wrote: ↑April 10, 2021, 10:11 am I think there’s more to it than you make out NR.

You can’t just look at the rates, you have to consider the segments and typical causes. If those clots are generally seen in older patients after surgery for example, that’s a very different kettle of fish to a sudden high propensity in younger people with no other causal contributors.

Not saying that’s the case, I haven’t done any research on that. But you do need to be careful just looking at frequency.

I'm not saying there isn't more to it. I've made that caveat in previous posts. What I'm saying is conclusions shouldn't be drawn purely from the anecdotes reported in the media because case numbers are on par with normal situations. It definitely needs deeper investigation and precautions take for the interim. Assumptions cannot be made one way or the other.

Botman wrote: ↑April 10, 2021, 10:17 am

gangrenous wrote: ↑April 10, 2021, 10:12 am

Botman wrote:Got my first shot last night.
I got the pfizer one, which im quite thankful for given 30 minutes after i got home from the shot they were announcing on the news AZ was being pulled for U50's

Who did you sleep with to get Pfizer?

My best guess on that is my wife? She's a doctor dealing with some very at risk people...

Honestly i dont know why i got the vaccine so early, my employer sent me an email saying i'd been idenitfied as critical/high risk and eligable for phase 1b... i dont really agree with that assessment but im pretty keen to get the vaccine so not going to argue with them
As for Pfizer over AZ? Pot luck i think

Maybe due to your wife's status. Would make sense to vaccinate partners of those dealing with high risk patients.

Either that or Bill Gates has identified you as a high value asset for his mind control drugs.

I for one welcome our tech giant overlord, and i'd like to remind him as a well respected and insanely popular member of an online community, I can be helpful in rounding up others to toil in his manufactoring sweat shops

Well that question has been answered.

gangrenous wrote:I think there’s more to it than you make out NR.

You can’t just look at the rates, you have to consider the segments and typical causes. If those clots are generally seen in older patients after surgery for example, that’s a very different kettle of fish to a sudden high propensity in younger people with no other causal contributors.

Not saying that’s the case, I haven’t done any research on that. But you do need to be careful just looking at frequency.

The type of clot, central venous thrombosis is unusual. I've probably only seen it a couple of times in my career. Definitely once that I can remember, possibly twice if I vaguely recall. I can't say what the triggers are in adults, but in kids it's usually a middle ear infection gone bad.

A quick search, Australia has a contract for 51 million doses of the Novovax vaccine. It uses a traditional protein antigen and adjutant platform. Initial reports from Phase 3 are 96% efficacy. Phase 3 reports expected to be released this month, and emergency authorisation in the US next month.

Professor Allen Cheng explains the Australian Technical Advisory Group on Immunisations recommendation on the Astra Zeneca vaccine and young adults.
https://www.smh.com.au/national/why-we- ... 57hrv.html

So how did we get through an entire WA snap lockdown without one comment in here?!!

Coastalraider wrote: ↑April 27, 2021, 12:16 pm So how did we get through an entire WA snap lockdown without one comment in here?!!

Because these snap lockdowns are completely pointless, and I think we all know that by now.

Coastalraider wrote: ↑April 27, 2021, 12:16 pm So how did we get through an entire WA snap lockdown without one comment in here?!!

Western Australia may as well be their own country.

Got my second jab today
awaiting to see if i get knocked around by it.

Got tomorrow off work anyways so not going to be the end of the world if it does

Botman wrote: ↑April 29, 2021, 12:53 pm Got my second jab today
awaiting to see if i get knocked around by it.

Got tomorrow off work anyways so not going to be the end of the world if it does

I'm certainly keeping my fingers crossed, old friend.

Botman wrote: ↑April 29, 2021, 12:53 pm Got my second jab today
awaiting to see if i get knocked around by it.

Got tomorrow off work anyways so not going to be the end of the world if it does

Friend who had it said they had some bouts of fatigue for a few days after the first jab. Then went away. Did you have that?

I'm phase 2A so will be able to get mine in the next couple of weeks. I had my flu jab a week ago in prep.

Northern Raider wrote: ↑April 29, 2021, 1:13 pm

Botman wrote: ↑April 29, 2021, 12:53 pm Got my second jab today
awaiting to see if i get knocked around by it.

Got tomorrow off work anyways so not going to be the end of the world if it does

Friend who had it said they had some bouts of fatigue for a few days after the first jab. Then went away. Did you have that?

I'm phase 2A so will be able to get mine in the next couple of weeks. I had my flu jab a week ago in prep.

You better be all jabbed up before my Buck's Weekend!

The Nickman wrote: ↑April 29, 2021, 1:21 pm

Northern Raider wrote: ↑April 29, 2021, 1:13 pm

Botman wrote: ↑April 29, 2021, 12:53 pm Got my second jab today
awaiting to see if i get knocked around by it.

Got tomorrow off work anyways so not going to be the end of the world if it does

Friend who had it said they had some bouts of fatigue for a few days after the first jab. Then went away. Did you have that?

I'm phase 2A so will be able to get mine in the next couple of weeks. I had my flu jab a week ago in prep.

You better be all jabbed up before my Buck's Weekend!

I plan on turning up coughing and spluttering everywhere.