Coronavirus

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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

Azza wrote:NSW looks to be doing a great job handling the outbreak last month.

Of course WA will keep its borders closed because a mouse farted somewhere near the NSW border.
Hysterical Victorians and Labor fanbois demanding as recently as 4 days ago that they lockdown greater Sydney. NSW don't know what they are doing. They are incompetat! They are sacrificing lives for the economy. They'll kill us all!

I've said it before, I'll say it again. NSW calmly, methodically go about snuffing out another outbreak while the rest of the country gets on with the business of **** -ing it's pants.

Last edited by Dr Zaius on January 22, 2021, 7:32 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: Coronavirus

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Dr Zaius wrote: January 22, 2021, 7:25 pm
greeneyed wrote:The other States and Territories did a good job containing coronavirus too... by constraining the movement of NSW people from outbreak affected regions into their jurisdictions, and requiring them to quarantine if they’ve been in a hot spot.
How many of the people coming from NSW quarantined by those states have subsequently tested positive?
I'm sure you could tell me. But as we've discussed before, the geographic restrictions on movement are a critical thing in stopping the virus spreading. For example, non ACT residents in NSW hotspots could not come to the ACT. We saw how the NSW clusters very quickly spread to other jurisdictions and the geographic restrictions have done a good job in ensuring that was quickly halted. I really don't understand the constant complaining about it... it is a significant reason that Australia's outcomes have been relatively good... both in health and economic terms.
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by gangrenous »

Dr Zaius wrote:
greeneyed wrote:The other States and Territories did a good job containing coronavirus too... by constraining the movement of NSW people from outbreak affected regions into their jurisdictions, and requiring them to quarantine if they’ve been in a hot spot.
How many of the people coming from NSW quarantined by those states have subsequently tested positive?
You’re better than an argument like that.
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Re: Coronavirus

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gangrenous wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote:
greeneyed wrote:The other States and Territories did a good job containing coronavirus too... by constraining the movement of NSW people from outbreak affected regions into their jurisdictions, and requiring them to quarantine if they’ve been in a hot spot.
How many of the people coming from NSW quarantined by those states have subsequently tested positive?
You’re better than an argument like that.
I'm really not Image
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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

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greeneyed wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: January 22, 2021, 7:25 pm
greeneyed wrote:The other States and Territories did a good job containing coronavirus too... by constraining the movement of NSW people from outbreak affected regions into their jurisdictions, and requiring them to quarantine if they’ve been in a hot spot.
How many of the people coming from NSW quarantined by those states have subsequently tested positive?
I'm sure you could tell me. But as we've discussed before, the geographic restrictions on movement are a critical thing in stopping the virus spreading. For example, non ACT residents in NSW hotspots could not come to the ACT. We saw how the NSW clusters very quickly spread to other jurisdictions and the geographic restrictions have done a good job in ensuring that was quickly halted. I really don't understand the constant complaining about it... it is a significant reason that Australia's outcomes have been relatively good... both in health and economic terms.
None that I'm aware of. I've got no issue with sensible border restrictions, and I think that this time around they've been largely sensible. Obvious exceptions being WA and Victoria, though I'll give a pass to Victoria, they are understandably edgy. But I think that it's a false argument and smacks of desperation that when someone gives credit to NSW you have to chime in with, "but everyone else is doing a great job too" . Let's face it, closing a border is easy and politically advantageous.

They are not there yet, but NSW have again done what as far as I can tell, no other jurasdiction in the world has done. They've gone from significant and widespread community transmission, heading to a state of elimination without global and lengthy lockdowns. I'm not sure that simply closing a border is compatible. Why do so many Australians have such difficulty giving credit where it is due?
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by greeneyed »

Dr Zaius wrote: January 22, 2021, 8:09 pm
greeneyed wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: January 22, 2021, 7:25 pm
greeneyed wrote:The other States and Territories did a good job containing coronavirus too... by constraining the movement of NSW people from outbreak affected regions into their jurisdictions, and requiring them to quarantine if they’ve been in a hot spot.
How many of the people coming from NSW quarantined by those states have subsequently tested positive?
I'm sure you could tell me. But as we've discussed before, the geographic restrictions on movement are a critical thing in stopping the virus spreading. For example, non ACT residents in NSW hotspots could not come to the ACT. We saw how the NSW clusters very quickly spread to other jurisdictions and the geographic restrictions have done a good job in ensuring that was quickly halted. I really don't understand the constant complaining about it... it is a significant reason that Australia's outcomes have been relatively good... both in health and economic terms.
None that I'm aware of. I've got no issue with sensible border restrictions, and I think that this time around they've been largely sensible. Obvious exceptions being WA and Victoria, though I'll give a pass to Victoria, they are understandably edgy. But I think that it's a false argument and smacks of desperation that when someone gives credit to NSW you have to chime in with, "but everyone else is doing a great job too" . Let's face it, closing a border is easy and politically advantageous.

They are not there yet, but NSW have again done what as far as I can tell, no other jurasdiction in the world has done. They've gone from significant and widespread community transmission, heading to a state of elimination without global and lengthy lockdowns. I'm not sure that simply closing a border is compatible. Why do so many Australians have such difficulty giving credit where it is due?
I jump in because it seems to be constantly repeated in this thread that NSW = good; other States = bad and border closures; and border closures = bad. I don’t think that’s a fair and reasonable representation of what’s happened (I won’t repeat the more nuanced arguments I’ve put).

Also, If I jumped in every time the above equivalences were drawn, I’d have posted an awful lot more in this thread than I have. And desperation? What’s there to be desperate about?
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by RedRaider »

See Worldometer stats below:

The last death recorded in Australia was on December 28, 2020. The death prior to that was on November 30, 2020. The death prior to that was on October 28, 2020.
This indicates to me, that even when there are some outbreaks the Health Professionals are doing a wonderful job in treating those who contract Covid19 regardless of the strain.

https://www.worldometers.info/coronavir ... australia/
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Dr Zaius
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Re: Coronavirus

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greeneyed wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: January 22, 2021, 8:09 pm
greeneyed wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: January 22, 2021, 7:25 pm
greeneyed wrote:The other States and Territories did a good job containing coronavirus too... by constraining the movement of NSW people from outbreak affected regions into their jurisdictions, and requiring them to quarantine if they’ve been in a hot spot.
How many of the people coming from NSW quarantined by those states have subsequently tested positive?
I'm sure you could tell me. But as we've discussed before, the geographic restrictions on movement are a critical thing in stopping the virus spreading. For example, non ACT residents in NSW hotspots could not come to the ACT. We saw how the NSW clusters very quickly spread to other jurisdictions and the geographic restrictions have done a good job in ensuring that was quickly halted. I really don't understand the constant complaining about it... it is a significant reason that Australia's outcomes have been relatively good... both in health and economic terms.
None that I'm aware of. I've got no issue with sensible border restrictions, and I think that this time around they've been largely sensible. Obvious exceptions being WA and Victoria, though I'll give a pass to Victoria, they are understandably edgy. But I think that it's a false argument and smacks of desperation that when someone gives credit to NSW you have to chime in with, "but everyone else is doing a great job too" . Let's face it, closing a border is easy and politically advantageous.

They are not there yet, but NSW have again done what as far as I can tell, no other jurasdiction in the world has done. They've gone from significant and widespread community transmission, heading to a state of elimination without global and lengthy lockdowns. I'm not sure that simply closing a border is compatible. Why do so many Australians have such difficulty giving credit where it is due?
I jump in because it seems to be constantly repeated in this thread that NSW = good; other States = bad and border closures; and border closures = bad. I don’t think that’s a fair and reasonable representation of what’s happened (I won’t repeat the more nuanced arguments I’ve put).

Also, If I jumped in every time the above equivalences were drawn, I’d have posted an awful lot more in this thread than I have. And desperation? What’s there to be desperate about?
Nonsense. Discussion in this thread has largely been supportive of border closures. There is appropriate criticism of WA border restrictions. And criticism of Queensland's restrictions last year where equally valid. They were clearly political, as evidenced by the fact that post election they have been considerably relaxed.
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Re: Coronavirus

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I disagree that it is nonsense and there has largely been support for border closures. There has been considerable criticism of it, certainly in the media and from some political quarters. There’s a lot of political point scoring about it in the public debate. I’m not interested in that, just what works. I have previously made clear that I think some border closures have not been well handled and have been more restrictive than necessary. But the geographic restrictions have worked.
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Re: Coronavirus

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greeneyed wrote:I disagree that it is nonsense and there has largely been support for border closures. There has been considerable criticism of it, certainly in the media and from some political quarters. There’s a lot of political point scoring about it in the public debate. I’m not interested in that, just what works. I have previously made clear that I think some border closures have not been well handled and have been more restrictive than necessary. But the geographic restrictions have worked.
Certainly in the media and from certain political quarters? Aren't we talking about this thread. I certainly was.

I'd still argue that most of the media criticism this time around is levelled at WA (incredibly disproportionate response) and Victoria (locked residents out of their own state). Both criticisms are reasonable.

As for political commentary, I haven't seen a nsw presser for a while, the last few that I watched (a couple of weeks ago) Gladys was drawn into the commentary, and quotes in media outlets were largely misconstrued. There have been more headlines this week, and while I haven't seen what she has actually said, if she is saying as reported I think she needs to pull her head in. I think that with the exception of WA, and now including Victoria, the states are generally following the hotspot model that they agreed upon. Palaszczuk was absolutely deserved of critism from Gladys last year however, as unnecessary border restrictions impacted significantly on the physical, mental, social and economic health of many NSW residents.

But none of this explains the fact that when someone says something positive about NSW, you bizarrely feel the need to either counter with a negative, or make a false comparison to states that literally did one thing - shut borders.

There have no doubt been mistakes - Ruby Princess and quarantine leaks. Arguably both of these are Federal responsibilities. But in regards to handling the virus once in the community, NSW's response has been nothing short of exceptional.
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Re: Coronavirus

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Dr Zaius wrote: Certainly in the media and from certain political quarters? Aren't we talking about this thread. I certainly was.
Are you? Who is criticising NSW?
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Re: Coronavirus

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Just listening to something on ABC News where there's a whole bunch of international students petitioning to be able to get into the country and resume their studies in-person.

I'm sitting there thinking "you're kidding, right?". Those students are talking about Australia having an obligation to them, many of whom think of Australia as home, while torturously trying their best not to get the public offside if they were to dismiss the fact that there are thousands of Australian citizens stranded overseas.

I daresay that looking after our citizens who are trying to return home should be a much higher priority than pandering to foreigners who are whingeing about having to learn remotely instead of in-person...
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Re: Coronavirus

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gangrenous wrote:
Dr Zaius wrote: Certainly in the media and from certain political quarters? Aren't we talking about this thread. I certainly was.
Are you? Who is criticising NSW?
GE outright at various times, no so subtle backhanders frequently.
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Re: Coronavirus

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Dr Zaius wrote: January 22, 2021, 7:28 pm
Northern Raider wrote:
greeneyed wrote: January 22, 2021, 5:53 pm The reason for the breach in Queensland hotel quarantine really should be explained... the public deserves answers on what went wrong. At least one of the outbreaks in Sydney has also been unexplained... perhaps it’s impossible to find out. But the leaks into the community are all believed to have come from hotel quarantine there too. We should be given some assurance that procedures for hotel quarantine in NSW and Queensland are as safe as they should be.
That's the key. It's been referred to as an incident which implies that something specific occurred that wasn't meant to. Refusing further comment, saying police are investigating and there's no CCTV footage all gives the impression of cover up. Erodes confidence in the process.
There's no cover up, they genuinely don't know. They were split system aircon, so not that. There was no CCTV in the hotel, so can't say for certain people didn't leave their room. They believe that the people in quarantine contracted it on the 2nd but don't know how.
Strange calling it an incident if that's the case.
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Re: Coronavirus

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Sterlk wrote: January 23, 2021, 9:38 am Just listening to something on ABC News where there's a whole bunch of international students petitioning to be able to get into the country and resume their studies in-person.

I'm sitting there thinking "you're kidding, right?". Those students are talking about Australia having an obligation to them, many of whom think of Australia as home, while torturously trying their best not to get the public offside if they were to dismiss the fact that there are thousands of Australian citizens stranded overseas.

I daresay that looking after our citizens who are trying to return home should be a much higher priority than pandering to foreigners who are whingeing about having to learn remotely instead of in-person...
Yeah, it's a fine line here.

Obviously the international students form a significant financial pillar for the universities, as well as the other economic and diplomatic benefits of having them here in person.

In saying that, it's obviously unfortunate that a ton of expats have been trapped overseas for months, often at significant personal expense. You would think they are the national priority, despite not necessarily being the best economic outcome.
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Re: Coronavirus

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Seiffert82 wrote:
Sterlk wrote: January 23, 2021, 9:38 am Just listening to something on ABC News where there's a whole bunch of international students petitioning to be able to get into the country and resume their studies in-person.

I'm sitting there thinking "you're kidding, right?". Those students are talking about Australia having an obligation to them, many of whom think of Australia as home, while torturously trying their best not to get the public offside if they were to dismiss the fact that there are thousands of Australian citizens stranded overseas.

I daresay that looking after our citizens who are trying to return home should be a much higher priority than pandering to foreigners who are whingeing about having to learn remotely instead of in-person...
Yeah, it's a fine line here.

Obviously the international students form a significant financial pillar for the universities, as well as the other economic and diplomatic benefits of having them here in person.

In saying that, it's obviously unfortunate that a ton of expats have been trapped overseas for months, often at significant personal expense. You would think they are the national priority, despite not necessarily being the best economic outcome.
The Uni’s have a huge economic issue at the moment, they can’t stay financially viable without international students and the governments not willing to prop them up.

I can see why the Uni’s want to to let them in.
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Re: Coronavirus

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I'm Bate Man wrote: January 23, 2021, 8:29 pm
Seiffert82 wrote:
Sterlk wrote: January 23, 2021, 9:38 am Just listening to something on ABC News where there's a whole bunch of international students petitioning to be able to get into the country and resume their studies in-person.

I'm sitting there thinking "you're kidding, right?". Those students are talking about Australia having an obligation to them, many of whom think of Australia as home, while torturously trying their best not to get the public offside if they were to dismiss the fact that there are thousands of Australian citizens stranded overseas.

I daresay that looking after our citizens who are trying to return home should be a much higher priority than pandering to foreigners who are whingeing about having to learn remotely instead of in-person...
Yeah, it's a fine line here.

Obviously the international students form a significant financial pillar for the universities, as well as the other economic and diplomatic benefits of having them here in person.

In saying that, it's obviously unfortunate that a ton of expats have been trapped overseas for months, often at significant personal expense. You would think they are the national priority, despite not necessarily being the best economic outcome.
The Uni’s have a huge economic issue at the moment, they can’t stay financially viable without international students and the governments not willing to prop them up.

I can see why the Uni’s want to to let them in.
That's the balancing act you need to play. Keep the virus suppressed while ensuring business can function as best as possible. We need to protect our health and our jobs. No good having one without the other.
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Re: Coronavirus

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There are Aussie's overseas that for one reason or another got stuck there and have been trying to get home for months.

There are also Aussie's who had made a life for themselves overseas and had no intention of ever coming back until this hit, and suddenly Australia is appealing.

They all deserve to be bought home, but I'd have thought that the former deserved priority over the later. The difficulty is how does a bureaucracy distinguish between the two.

Throw overseas students into the mix. The contribute ecomically, are important to keeping universities viable and many of them have shown more commitment to the country than the later group of Aussies trapped overseas.

As with most things in this pandemic nothing is black and white. Shades of grey.
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

My wrap for the week...

Seven straight days of donuts for NSW!
ImageImageImageImageImageImageImage
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Queensland and Victoria keep tucking into those Krispy Kremes as well.
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During the week, Coronacast discussed the data from NSW Health that based on their experience last year, on average it takes them three weeks to snuff out a cluster. (https://tinyurl.com/y6hmg4bo)
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NSW have been dealing with two separate clusters, from two separate sources - the Northern Beaches cluster, and the Berala BWS cluster.
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The first case in the Northern Beaches cluster was reported on the 17th of December. The last reported case was on the 12th of January (26 days in total). There have been no reported cases from the Northern Beaches cluster for 12 days.
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The first reported case in the Berala cluster was the 31st of December. The last reported case was the 17th of January (17 days in total). There have been no reported cases from the Berala cluster for 7 days, and we are now past the 3 week cluster average. Image
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Total community cases in NSW for the week from the 17th to the 23rd were 5, down from 13 the week prior. All cases were reported on last Sunday. There were no unlinked cases (down from 2). Test numbers unfortunately continue to fall, with a 7 day average of around 13,000, down from 18,000.
.
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Queensland Premier Anastasia Palaszczuk is exploring options to move international quarantine from city centres. I'm glad someone in a leadership position is pushing for this. Still, biosecurity has always been a Federal responsibility, however our Federal Government appears reluctant to fulfill their duties.
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Ironic moment of the week goes to Spanish tennis player and World Number 67, Paula Badosa, who with many other tennis players has been complaining of quarantining upon entry into the country for the Australian Open. She has subsequently tested Covid positive. Amongst the other vocal opponents has been anti-vaxxer and Covid super spreader Novak Djokovic. You really need some self reflection when Nick Kyrgios is giving you a serve about your behaviour.ImageImage
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by gangrenous »

How can there be 7 cases for the week with 7 donuts?
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Re: Coronavirus

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gangrenous wrote: January 24, 2021, 11:38 am How can there be 7 cases for the week with 7 donuts? Image
Each new case of COVID gets a free donut
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Re: Coronavirus

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gangrenous wrote:How can there be 7 cases for the week with 7 donuts? Image
Hotel quarantine doesn't count apparently, probably cause it's meant to be a controlled environment

They're only worried about local cases

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Coronavirus

Post by gangrenous »

I was thinking that, but the quote speaks to unlinked cases, testing rates, and close contacts? Doesn’t seem to be talking about hotel quarantine?
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Re: Coronavirus

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Yep my bad. I've been doing weekly updates on Saturday, but was a bit lazy and did it Sunday this week ie today. When I said only 7 cases I meant from the time of my last post ie last Sunday to yesterday. There were cases last Sunday. It was actually only 5 and no unlinked cases, there were two (one being unlinked) last Saturday. I've updated the post. Sorry I've made this more confusing than it needs to be.
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Coronavirus

Post by gangrenous »

All good doc! Appreciate the summaries!
Northern Raider wrote:
gangrenous wrote: January 24, 2021, 11:38 am How can there be 7 cases for the week with 7 donuts? Image
Each new case of COVID gets a free donut
Image missed this before
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Re: Coronavirus

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There has been a community case in NZ. She's been symptomatic since the 15th. Looks like she has been infectious and out and about for at least a week. I suspect Kiwis have been going about life as normal. She may have been QR code checking in, but how many others were? I guess we are going to find out how good the NZ public health units are. They seem to be a little slow realising venue names so far. Hopefully she is one of those people who just doesn't seem to infect others
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Re: Coronavirus

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Dr Zaius wrote: January 24, 2021, 5:23 pm There has been a community case in NZ. She's been symptomatic since the 15th. Looks like she has been infectious and out and about for at least a week. I suspect Kiwis have been going about life as normal. She may have been QR code checking in, but how many others were? I guess we are going to find out how good the NZ public health units are. They seem to be a little slow realising venue names so far. Hopefully she is one of those people who just doesn't seem to infect others Image
Might be their first real test of contact tracing. Up till now it's been about prevention.
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Re: Coronavirus

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I thought they were pretty much locked in? Where'd she get it from?

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Re: Coronavirus

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-TW- wrote:I thought they were pretty much locked in? Where'd she get it from?

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International quarantine
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Coastalraider »

Dr Zaius wrote: January 25, 2021, 5:20 am
-TW- wrote:I thought they were pretty much locked in? Where'd she get it from?

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International quarantine
Just like all of our recent outbreaks then.
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by Dr Zaius »

Fauci on working with the Trump administration. I listened to a few interviews with him last year. He was so restrained. Patience of a saint.

https://www.nytimes.com/2021/01/24/heal ... covid.html
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Re: Coronavirus

Post by RedRaider »

See below from the Washington Post:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics ... es-deaths/

The graphs are very revealing. Winter in America has seen an explosion of Covid cases. On a more positive note, the vaccine injections have now reached about 1% of the USA population and the vaccine injection trajectory is on a steep incline. Here's hoping the reported supply issues with Pfizer ramping up production at new facilities do not put significant brakes on this incline.
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Re: Coronavirus

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J&J expecting to release results from its phase 3 trial “by early next week”. Also, they reconfirmed their commitment to deliver 100 million vaccine doses by end of June.
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Re: Coronavirus

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Comments on a Guardian article today. Overwhelmingly people believe that NSW has large amounts of virus that they are ignoring, that they are fudging numbers or that they were just plain lucky.

Partisanship is well and truly alive in Australia. People who believe that everything that their party does is 100% correct, and anything that the alternate party does is evil. It's ugly and it ends badly.
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Re: Coronavirus

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Dr Zaius wrote: January 27, 2021, 8:29 pm Comments on a Guardian article today. Overwhelmingly people believe that NSW has large amounts of virus that they are ignoring, that they are fudging numbers or that they were just plain lucky.

Partisanship is well and truly alive in Australia. People who believe that everything that their party does is 100% correct, and anything that the alternate party does is evil. It's ugly and it ends badly.
That’s the unfortunate but expected result of having a global crisis managed on a state level by premiers with self interest. Each premier is defining their own local news cycle therefore creating state based belief patterns.
So far in this pandemic I’ve travelled to SA,Qld and the ACT from NSW, and it’s genuinely mind boggling the different mindsets and views on the different states.

It still blows my mind that in the biggest medical emergency of our time, Australia has not enacted a national control approach to this pandemic. The Australian lamb ad this year while obviously satirical was a strangely concerning look to the future.
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