Israel Folau

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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad » June 21, 2019, 11:57 am

What is ******** me up the wall is the defence that “He’s quoting the bible. Why should he be punished for quoting the bible?”

To anyone who TRULY believes that, tell me the passage that Insta post is quoting.

I’ll wait here


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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 21, 2019, 12:33 pm

1 Corinthians 6:9-10

Or do you not know that the unrighteous2 will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived: xneither the sexually immoral, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor men who practice homosexuality,3 10 nor thieves, nor the greedy, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers will inherit the kingdom of God.

English Standard Version


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Re: Israel Folau

Post by raiderskater » June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm

Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Northern Raider » June 21, 2019, 2:19 pm

raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm
Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
You didn't see it? :?
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by raiderskater » June 21, 2019, 2:25 pm

Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:19 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm
Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
You didn't see it? :?
I see it now that dubby has completely changed what he posted originally.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Northern Raider » June 21, 2019, 2:46 pm

raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:25 pm
Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:19 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm
Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
You didn't see it? :?
I see it now that dubby has completely changed what he posted originally.
Fair enough. I googled the passage and its in there. Depends on which translation you read as to whether it specifically says "homosexuals" but the meaning is the same. In reading it though it appears to only reference male homosexuality. Means the lesbian community is in the clear. :lol:
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Northern Raider » June 21, 2019, 2:49 pm

Wow, all this public outrage has been a massive boon for Izzy. Its up over $300k now. :shock:
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by raiderskater » June 21, 2019, 3:59 pm

Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:46 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:25 pm
Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:19 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm
Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
You didn't see it? :?
I see it now that dubby has completely changed what he posted originally.
Fair enough. I googled the passage and its in there. Depends on which translation you read as to whether it specifically says "homosexuals" but the meaning is the same. In reading it though it appears to only reference male homosexuality. Means the lesbian community is in the clear. :lol:
The lesbian community is considered fetish fuel for men, so I'm not quite sure that counts as "in the clear".
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Northern Raider » June 21, 2019, 4:12 pm

raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 3:59 pm
Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:46 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:25 pm
Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:19 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm
Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
You didn't see it? :?
I see it now that dubby has completely changed what he posted originally.
Fair enough. I googled the passage and its in there. Depends on which translation you read as to whether it specifically says "homosexuals" but the meaning is the same. In reading it though it appears to only reference male homosexuality. Means the lesbian community is in the clear. :lol:
The lesbian community is considered fetish fuel for men, so I'm not quite sure that counts as "in the clear".
You've been following Manbush's posts too much.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Manbush » June 21, 2019, 5:58 pm

I’m seeing his gofundme being reported a lot for breaching their terms and conditions, if it gets shutdown wonder if he’ll sue them as well for persecuting him for his religious beliefs.

“campaigns we deem, at our sole discretion, to be in support of, or for the legal defence of alleged crimes associated with hate, violence, harassment, bullying, discrimination, terrorism or intolerance of any kind relating to race, ethnicity, national origin, religious affiliation, sexual orientation, sex, gender or gender identity or serious disabilities or diseases;”
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 21, 2019, 6:00 pm

raiderskater wrote:
Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:19 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm
Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
You didn't see it? :?
I see it now that dubby has completely changed what he posted originally.
I went from king james version to the more modern and highly regarded English standard version.

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Re: Israel Folau

Post by The Rickman » June 21, 2019, 6:10 pm

The whole thing is a **** joke, you should expect to be called out for quoting hate speech no matter where it’s written
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Botman » June 21, 2019, 7:05 pm

dubby wrote:
June 21, 2019, 6:00 pm
raiderskater wrote:
Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:19 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm
Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
You didn't see it? :?
I see it now that dubby has completely changed what he posted originally.
I went from king james version to the more modern and highly regarded English standard version.

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that's great and all, but i dont really see what LeBron has to do with any of this.
CREATE PROCEDURE BotMan_Post AS
SELECT * FROM Previous_Post
EXEC quote_post
WHERE UserName = 'Aknalkfgnaa' OR 'Yeah Raiders' OR 'Billy B'
EXEC RAND(good_grief; cheak_notes; uh82cit;)

GO;

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Re: Israel Folau

Post by raiderskater » June 21, 2019, 9:20 pm

dubby wrote:
June 21, 2019, 6:00 pm
raiderskater wrote:
Northern Raider wrote:
June 21, 2019, 2:19 pm
raiderskater wrote:
June 21, 2019, 12:37 pm
Uh...great. Where's the homosexuals? Since that was one of the groups Folau has particularly targeted. I don't see them listed there. So that blows his "quoting the bible" defence out the window.
You didn't see it? :?
I see it now that dubby has completely changed what he posted originally.
I went from king james version to the more modern and highly regarded English standard version.

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You mean, you went from an older version that did not at all support your argument to a modern "new translation" that mysteriously added in something that wasn't there before.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 21, 2019, 9:38 pm

Fine, here's the kjv.

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind, 

10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor extortioners, shall inherit the kingdom of God. 





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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 21, 2019, 9:39 pm

Here's the nasb

do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals,
10 nor thieves, nor the covetous, nor drunkards, nor revilers, nor swindlers, will inherit the kingdom of God.


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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 21, 2019, 9:42 pm

And the Geneva Study Bible from 1599

Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor wantons, nor buggerers,
10 Nor thieves, nor covetous, nor drunkards, nor railers, nor extortioners shall inherit the kingdom of God.



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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 21, 2019, 9:47 pm

And just to be fair, to balance out the literal translations to a dynamic equivalent, here's the NLT.

Don’t you realize that those who do wrong will not inherit the Kingdom of God? Don’t fool yourselves. Those who indulge in sexual sin, or who worship idols, or commit adultery, or are male prostitutes, or practice homosexuality, 10 or are thieves, or greedy people, or drunkards, or are abusive, or cheat people—none of these will inherit the Kingdom of God.

(Just to appease skater, as she's so adamant I was plucking the one type of translation to suit a agenda.)



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Israel Folau

Post by greeneyed » June 22, 2019, 12:32 am

It doesn’t matter what translation is used. This stuff was written by uneducated, awful people many, many centuries ago. There’s no reason to believe this rubbish. It has no relevance in today’s world. It’s horrible. It is hateful. In my view, it’s not what loving Christians should accept as kind, human behaviour in the 21st century. And I’m glad the large majority of people reject it, wholeheartedly today.

People should treat others well, as they would wish to be treated by others. That’s decent human behaviour. That’s pretty much all we need to remember.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by The Rickman » June 22, 2019, 5:48 am

greeneyed wrote:It doesn’t matter what translation is used. This stuff was written by uneducated, awful people many, many centuries ago. There’s no reason to believe this rubbish. It has no relevance in today’s world. It’s horrible. It is hateful. In my view, it’s not what loving Christians should accept as kind, human behaviour in the 21st century. And I’m glad the large majority of people reject it, wholeheartedly today.

People should treat others well, as they would wish to be treated by others. That’s decent human behaviour. That’s pretty much all we need to remember.
Hear hear. No matter what the translation is, it’s absolute awful garbage that has no place in today’s society

Again, the fact that anybody believes they have the right to treat other humans like this based on two thousand year old hateful garbage is just mind blowing to me
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Manbush » June 22, 2019, 7:21 am

It’s not that easy though, if you’ve been raised to believe the Bible is the literal word of god you’ve got to take all of it as true including the abhorrent bits, it’s why for example in America you have a pastor/sheriff saying gays should be executed, why a couple of Republicans want to create a 51st state based on biblical law where over 60% of Australians would be executed for simply supporting marriage equality or a woman’s right to choose.

It’s great that the majority of Christians abandon Christian morality and adapt secular morality as their Christian values but for the hardcore believers like Izzy the indoctrination is too ingrained.

They need a Bible 2.0 along the lines of Jefferson’s Bible where they cut out all the old Leviticus type laws and just have Jesus’s teachings (dump the odd bad ones of his as well). Or better yet just have the golden rule which Jesus taught and existed in society back to at least Confucius.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by greeneyed » June 22, 2019, 9:45 am

As you allude to, that’s the New Testament. Many of its teachings are good and provide a fundamental basis for civil societies today. Love your fellow man, do unto others as you would have them do unto you, forgiveness of others, charity, turn the other cheek, empathy, compassion, tolerance, inclusion of the poor, the sick, the weak. Christianity has been a great force for good in the world.

Sadly, some turn to parts of the Bible that are inconsistent with that and are grasped onto by right wing “fundamentalists” who want to spread hatefulness.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 22, 2019, 10:36 am

GE, the Old Testament is largely Jewish law, history and prophecies about the returning of the messiah. Sadly, when he turned up they didn't recognize him!

I'm absolutely positive that if Jesus was walking around today, he'd go straight to the people who were hurting, in pain, the starving and the unlovely.

He'd teach, heal, sing, laugh and probably fart too. He came to the sick, because they need a doctor.

Then, he'd turn to the religious and confront them. He'd be furious with certain groups and how they've allowed pride, dogma and religious extremism to ruin his church.

Jesus is the reason I'm a Christian. He loves all of us. He died for us, then rose again. That's pretty cool.

Just lately I've been really confronted by my own lack of involvement, my idleness, my lack of commitment to Him. I've disappointed Him.

My wife and I have both realized that we need to just get totally serious about doing exactly what Jesus would want us to do.

Serve others. Love, serve and be a help to those who can't give anything to us. Just be on their level, acting in total love and faith, no more sitting idle, lazy and lukewarm.

There's a lot of people out there who could use that, i think .

This is probably one of those things that would be better said in a conversation, not a post. It's too deep and can be easily misunderstood this way.

There are a lot of indecent Christian behavior. Of that, I'm guilty.

I really want to turn this around.

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Israel Folau

Post by The Rickman » June 22, 2019, 10:57 am

dubby wrote:GE, the Old Testament is largely Jewish law, history and prophecies about the returning of the messiah. Sadly, when he turned up they didn't recognize him!

I'm absolutely positive that if Jesus was walking around today, he'd go straight to the people who were hurting, in pain, the starving and the unlovely.

He'd teach, heal, sing, laugh and probably fart too. He came to the sick, because they need a doctor.

Then, he'd turn to the religious and confront them. He'd be furious with certain groups and how they've allowed pride, dogma and religious extremism to ruin his church.

Jesus is the reason I'm a Christian. He loves all of us. He died for us, then rose again. That's pretty cool.

Just lately I've been really confronted by my own lack of involvement, my idleness, my lack of commitment to Him. I've disappointed Him.

My wife and I have both realized that we need to just get totally serious about doing exactly what Jesus would want us to do.

Serve others. Love, serve and be a help to those who can't give anything to us. Just be on their level, acting in total love and faith, no more sitting idle, lazy and lukewarm.

There's a lot of people out there who could use that, i think .

This is probably one of those things that would be better said in a conversation, not a post. It's too deep and can be easily misunderstood this way.

There are a lot of indecent Christian behavior. Of that, I'm guilty.

I really want to turn this around.

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To be fair dubs, I’ve had the same recent self-reflection recently and realise I need to do all of the same things to be a better Buddhist, I’ve been getting sloppy with my love and respect for other people

Actually no, scratch that, I need to do all of those things better to be a better human being full stop. It has nothing to do with which religion/philosophy I choose to identify with

Good luck with your goal of being a better person to everyone equally for the good of all mankind, no matter the banner you choose to do it under
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Manbush » June 22, 2019, 11:08 am

greeneyed wrote:
June 22, 2019, 9:45 am
As you allude to, that’s the New Testament. Many of its teachings are good and provide a fundamental basis for civil societies today. Love your fellow man, do unto others as you would have them do unto you, forgiveness of others, charity, turn the other cheek, empathy, compassion, tolerance, inclusion of the poor, the sick, the weak. Christianity has been a great force for good in the world.

Sadly, some turn to parts of the Bible that are inconsistent with that and are grasped onto by right wing “fundamentalists” who want to spread hatefulness.
Nah it’s not quite the New Testament as that still has some bad teachings within it and it still contains and condones the abhorrent stuff from the Old Testament.

You can say that Christianity has been a great force for good in this world but by equal measure it’s also been a great force for bad in this world, slavery, genocides, witch hunts, oppression of women, homophobia etc.

As for some turning to the parts that are inconsistent with the good stuff the whole book is inconsistent, you could use it to endorse any behavior as it contains good and bad messages.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by greeneyed » June 22, 2019, 11:32 am

Of course there have been a lot of bad things done in the name of Christianity. As I said, sadly some people grab the bad things to push their agenda of hate. But the positive things I've mentioned have helped form the basis of civil societies today. It's embodied in our laws and systems of ethics. That should be acknowledged.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Manbush » June 22, 2019, 11:49 am

The Bible is both good and bad though in its teachings GE. That’s the problem with basing your life around a book which is open to interpretation, some will take the good messages and some will take the bad, both are as equally valid. The fundamentalists are just following the teachings more literally.

The bad I mentioned also helped shape our societies, our laws and ethics hence slavery being around for so long, inequality of races and gender, homophobia, you can’t just acknowledge the good and ignore the bad when it’s both.

You’re also more aware of the Age of Enlightenment and it’s influence on modern society than most, that is a large part of where our modern ethics and values like equality came from.

I just want to touch on one of your good elements like charity, the Christian version throughout history hasn’t been that good, it’s been responsible for erasing cultures through missionaries, the charity comes at the price of proselytizing if you don’t convert you don’t receive it, it discriminates, then there’s the whole Catholic charity to Africa is recent history which cost a lot of lives with the condition of charity not using condoms and telling them condoms are worse than aids, it’s been done to increase their numbers not to actually help.
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 22, 2019, 12:14 pm

The Rickman wrote:
dubby wrote:GE, the Old Testament is largely Jewish law, history and prophecies about the returning of the messiah. Sadly, when he turned up they didn't recognize him!

I'm absolutely positive that if Jesus was walking around today, he'd go straight to the people who were hurting, in pain, the starving and the unlovely.

He'd teach, heal, sing, laugh and probably fart too. He came to the sick, because they need a doctor.

Then, he'd turn to the religious and confront them. He'd be furious with certain groups and how they've allowed pride, dogma and religious extremism to ruin his church.

Jesus is the reason I'm a Christian. He loves all of us. He died for us, then rose again. That's pretty cool.

Just lately I've been really confronted by my own lack of involvement, my idleness, my lack of commitment to Him. I've disappointed Him.

My wife and I have both realized that we need to just get totally serious about doing exactly what Jesus would want us to do.

Serve others. Love, serve and be a help to those who can't give anything to us. Just be on their level, acting in total love and faith, no more sitting idle, lazy and lukewarm.

There's a lot of people out there who could use that, i think .

This is probably one of those things that would be better said in a conversation, not a post. It's too deep and can be easily misunderstood this way.

There are a lot of indecent Christian behavior. Of that, I'm guilty.

I really want to turn this around.

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To be fair dubs, I’ve had the same recent self-reflection recently and realise I need to do all of the same things to be a better Buddhist, I’ve been getting sloppy with my love and respect for other people

Actually no, scratch that, I need to do all of those things better to be a better human being full stop. It has nothing to do with which religion/philosophy I choose to identify with

Good luck with your goal of being a better person to everyone equally for the good of all mankind, no matter the banner you choose to do it under
Thanks Enrique, I think we're on the same page. Both of us want to be a better human so we can love and help other humans. We hold different world views, but if love is the goal, what difference does it make which view we hold?

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Manbush
Mal Meninga
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Manbush » June 22, 2019, 1:41 pm

Depends Dubby, if those beliefs lead to discrimination like against marriage equality, euthanasia etc that’s not helping or loving others, that’s prioritizing the beliefs.

The loving and helping others should be the priority and the realization that the right to ones beliefs end where others are affected by said beliefs.
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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Manbush
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Manbush » June 22, 2019, 1:48 pm

Just on the doing what Jesus would want you to do, where do you think he’d sit on the political spectrum, would he be for helping the wealthy or for helping the less fortunate? I’d say he’d be far more liberal than conservative policy wise going by how Christians talk of him.
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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Northern Raider
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Northern Raider » June 22, 2019, 2:46 pm

Izzy GFM is now $535k. This is mainly thanks to all the media uproar. If people had simply ignored it he'd be lucky to scratch out $10k. Any publicity is good publicity.
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The Rickman
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by The Rickman » June 22, 2019, 3:21 pm

Northern Raider wrote:Izzy GFM is now $535k. This is mainly thanks to all the media uproar. If people had simply ignored it he'd be lucky to scratch out $10k. Any publicity is good publicity.
Not really, he’s not going to get a cent of it
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dubby
Don Furner
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 22, 2019, 4:47 pm

Manbush wrote:Just on the doing what Jesus would want you to do, where do you think he’d sit on the political spectrum, would he be for helping the wealthy or for helping the less fortunate? I’d say he’d be far more liberal than conservative policy wise going by how Christians talk of him.
You're asking me to assume the actions of God incarnate, of my savior.

Hard to do, old mate

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Manbush
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by Manbush » June 22, 2019, 4:48 pm

Just looked at the page some of the $5 donors are taking the piss with names like “IsraelChangedReligions ToSuitHisBankAccount” and “Israelisa Massive####”.
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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dubby
Don Furner
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Re: Israel Folau

Post by dubby » June 22, 2019, 4:49 pm

Bushy, you're an old adversary, a kind hearted but stoic opponent.

Jesus loves you man. I would give anything to see you and him have a chat. Anything. His love, wisdom and kindness would just be incredible for you. I wish i knew how to respond to you man. Anything to get you to see that He loves you more than you know

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