The Politics Thread 2017

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Manbush
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The Politics Thread 2017

Post by Manbush » January 9, 2017, 6:00 pm

The definitive Joker reading a Trump tweet, Hamil should do all of Trumps tweets, the character is perfect for it :lol:
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Green eyed Mick » January 11, 2017, 1:54 pm


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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by hiriser » January 11, 2017, 4:02 pm


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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Manbush » January 11, 2017, 6:05 pm

Ah 4chan at it again, first pizzagate now this, showing jus how easy it is to troll both the left and the right :lol:
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Green eyed Mick » January 11, 2017, 6:13 pm

When Obama was elected Trump was one of the loudest voices peddling bald faced lies to discredit him. As a result millions of people still believe Obama was illegitimate. It was inevitable that some of Trumps most strident opponents would resort to similar tactics to attack Trump.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Manbush » January 11, 2017, 6:59 pm

Actually from what I've heard from someone who goes to 4chan regularly it was a bunch of Trump supporters who did it to play with the media.

Could you imagine being Trump, copping it from all sides then suddenly this comes out :lol:
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Green eyed Mick » January 12, 2017, 7:08 am

There is literally nothing that could happen to Trump that he wouldn't richly deserve.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Manbush » January 12, 2017, 7:22 am

That's rubbish GEM I can think of one thing immediately, the presidency :woot:
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Green eyed Mick » January 12, 2017, 7:24 am


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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Toviii » January 12, 2017, 9:12 am

Manbush wrote:Actually from what I've heard from someone who goes to 4chan regularly it was a bunch of Trump supporters who did it to play with the media.

Could you imagine being Trump, copping it from all sides then suddenly this comes out :lol:
I thought the posts on 4Chan were different to what was leaked by buzzfeed
'I've got 17 blokes in that dressing room that are hurting'

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Green eyed Mick » January 16, 2017, 4:54 pm

54-46 and a 15 seat margin to Labor in the latest polls. The only thing keeping Turnbull in the job is the lack of talent around him.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Manbush » January 17, 2017, 8:40 am

Which is why I've been saying he's got nothing to lose by allowing marriage equality, he's already a dead man walking, he may as well go down swinging.

Lovely, Daniel Nalliahs ministry has lost its charity status due to politicizing.

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... ffiliation
"My own opinion is enough for me and I claim the right to have it defended against any consensus, any majority, anywhere, any place, any time, and anyone who disagrees with this can pick a number, get in line and kiss my ass" Christopher Hitchens

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Northern Raider » January 17, 2017, 2:03 pm

Green eyed Mick wrote:54-46 and a 15 seat margin to Labor in the latest polls. The only thing keeping Turnbull in the job is the lack of talent around him.
Since when did talent stop a party from shafting a sitting PM?

It's time the party room (on both sides) stopped kneejerk reactions to opinion polls.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 17, 2017, 8:12 pm

Agreed.

It's also time the government did something useful and not **** it up.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Ginga » January 17, 2017, 9:40 pm

Green eyed Mick wrote:54-46 and a 15 seat margin to Labor in the latest polls. The only thing keeping Turnbull in the job is the lack of talent around him.
Oh no you don't, I'm not falling for "The polls" this year after that whole BREXIT and Trump thingy last year

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Green eyed Mick » January 19, 2017, 11:47 am

Meet our new Health Minister.

"The next expansion in private health coverage is, I believe, through employer incentives for the inclusion of health care in workplace arrangements - perhaps through creative ways of excluding employer health care from the fringe benefits tax regime," he said.

He argued that adopting more of a US-style healthcare system - in which employers, rather than the government, take responsibility for healthcare - would free up money for governments to spend on aged care and other priorities.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 19, 2017, 4:42 pm

Get ****.

Seems completely at odds with the way the worlds heading. We're moving towards a mass unemployed/underemployed workforce in the future, makes no sense to sit this with employers. Especially when it doesn't work in the states to begin with.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by greeneyed » January 19, 2017, 4:44 pm

Why would we be moving to a mass unemployment/underemployment workforce?


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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Green eyed Mick » January 19, 2017, 5:40 pm

The manufacturing and mining sectors are shrinking and the service industry is becoming more and more automated. Plus the population is growing.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by greeneyed » January 19, 2017, 6:02 pm

Green eyed Mick wrote:The manufacturing and mining sectors are shrinking and the service industry is becoming more and more automated. Plus the population is growing.
None of which means we are headed to mass unemployment/underemployment.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 19, 2017, 8:32 pm


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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by greeneyed » January 19, 2017, 8:49 pm

That sort of scare mongering has been going on since the Luddites. Technological advance simply makes us richer, lifts our standards of living, and we humans are amazing... we move on and do things that are more in demand, and more interesting.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 19, 2017, 9:11 pm

Yeah, I disagree. I think this time is different (for the reasons put forward in the video iirc, been a while since I watched it).

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by greeneyed » January 19, 2017, 9:44 pm

The people who sprout this sort of stuff see the threats and can't imagine there will be opportunities. It resonates because psychological studies show humans place much more value on losses than gains... even when they're tangible. In this case they're intangible, because the new things are still to emerge. But history shows they always emerge. People aren't developing photos from film... instead they're running stores where people can print their digital images or building and selling devices to screen them on.

Each generation says change is faster and more significant than ever before. But the world forgets how significant change was in the past.

I'm an optimist that we will keep dealing with change and technological advance... bring it on, because it will raise our standard of living.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by -TW- » January 19, 2017, 9:52 pm

There's only so much more advance that can happen, it's not infinite

I remember seeing something about the Silicon chip nearing it's maximum capacity and only creating a DNA chip would exceed it

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 20, 2017, 5:39 am

greeneyed wrote: Each generation says change is faster and more significant than ever before. But the world forgets how significant change was in the past.

I'm an optimist that we will keep dealing with change and technological advance... bring it on, because it will raise our standard of living.
I'd say that is a fairly solid argument... change is faster and more significant in each successive generation over the last 100 years.

I'm not saying humans won't keep dealing with change. I'm suggesting that we'll end up in a world where a large number of people don't have jobs because technology becomes superior to humans across such a wide range of tasks.

It's part of the drive behind trialling ideas like the universal income around the world at the moment.

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The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 20, 2017, 5:45 am

-TW- wrote:There's only so much more advance that can happen, it's not infinite

I remember seeing something about the Silicon chip nearing it's maximum capacity and only creating a DNA chip would exceed it
There's a whole lot more scope for advancement yet. Many advancements come from appropriately utilising hardware that already exists.

The silicon chip is reaching the limit of how many atoms wide the gate is in transistors. But DNA chips are not the only way forward. You have 3D stacking, cloud computing, quantum computing, optical computing. Wait and see what wins for the next leg!

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by greeneyed » January 20, 2017, 6:47 am

gangrenous wrote:
greeneyed wrote: Each generation says change is faster and more significant than ever before. But the world forgets how significant change was in the past.

I'm an optimist that we will keep dealing with change and technological advance... bring it on, because it will raise our standard of living.
I'd say that is a fairly solid argument... change is faster and more significant in each successive generation over the last 100 years.

I'm not saying humans won't keep dealing with change. I'm suggesting that we'll end up in a world where a large number of people don't have jobs because technology becomes superior to humans across such a wide range of tasks.

It's part of the drive behind trialling ideas like the universal income around the world at the moment.
I think that's been tried before... and was a massive failure.

People tried to destroy agricultural equipment and factory equipment for the same reasons at the beginning of the 1800s. There's not going to be mass unemployment, because humans always find new things to do - and they're higher value and more interesting.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 20, 2017, 6:58 am

If you have a robot with greater intelligence and ability than you, what do you move on to that a robot wouldn't be chosen for?

There's a fundamental difference between what is coming and what has been. That is that humans have always been significantly better at a wide range of tasks. That number is shrinking, and will continue to shrink.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Ginga » January 20, 2017, 7:36 am

gangrenous wrote:If you have a robot with greater intelligence and ability than you, what do you move on to that a robot wouldn't be chosen for?

There's a fundamental difference between what is coming and what has been. That is that humans have always been significantly better at a wide range of tasks. That number is shrinking, and will continue to shrink.
I'm generally pessimistic by nature but I'd have to tip my hat to you as I pail in comparison, no hope for a meaningful existence cause robots will usurp us all... just out of curiosity if robots have replaced the majority in the job market who/what will be driving the demand for the product or service they now provide?

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 20, 2017, 7:38 am

That's not what I said at all.

Note people can consume without having a job also.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by greeneyed » January 20, 2017, 7:50 am

I'm not in the slightest bit worried about a world of mass unemployment - not as a result of technological change, anyway. Economies change and develop, and the things that emerge for human capital to move into when displaced by technology have generally never been able to be imagined in advance. But it happens. It's simply the process of economic development.

I'm clearly not going to convince anyone, so I'll stop now.
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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by Ginga » January 20, 2017, 7:55 am

gangrenous wrote:That's not what I said at all.

Note people can consume without having a job also.
Only if that consumption is provided for them

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by papabear » January 20, 2017, 8:04 am

Whilst I am also an optimist and look forward to the opportunities that will come with technological advance and prepare for the inevitable losses.

I think the average truck driver on the street would feel a few things:-

1 - A sideways glance at reading a "be happy everything is going to be awesome" from an individual (not naming anyone in particular or personally) who had a job where he effectively couldn't get moved on (by technology (or any other means?) and still got paid a good clip.
2 - Nervous about the potential downtime in income and lifestyle while potentially having to retrain into a position that doesn't give him the same freedom and enjoyment he got from his past role.
3 - Completely not trusting of a government who tried to knock over small operators at the expense of bigger players and unions.

Eitherway, to me there is an obvious disconnect between canberra and the rest of the nation especially regional / outer suburban areas in a way that is seen in other western nations which will see sitting governments punished imo until someone atleast pays people who are in difficult spots some notice.

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Re: The Politics Thread 2016

Post by gangrenous » January 20, 2017, 11:19 am

greeneyed wrote:I'm not in the slightest bit worried about a world of mass unemployment - not as a result of technological change, anyway. Economies change and develop, and the things that emerge for human capital to move into when displaced by technology have generally never been able to be imagined in advance. But it happens. It's simply the process of economic development.

I'm clearly not going to convince anyone, so I'll stop now.
I'm not worried about it. I think a post-work world is a good thing. But I think the transition will be a bitch.

Governments should be thinking about how we transition our economies and welfare as more people are unemployable.

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