The Politics Thread 2009

Discuss all the events of the day

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yeh raiders
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by yeh raiders » November 27, 2009, 10:26 pm

Northern Raider wrote:
yeh raiders wrote:Pretty sure it a system by which the amount of GEE a company can emit, is based on permits. These permits can be sold/traded from company to company allowing for differing amounts of carbon to be produced. How the heck can you measure the amount of carbon produced from company to company :?
It's guaranteed to cost jobs, for little (if any :doubt: ) positive impact on climate.
Glorified tax IMO. Companies that produce carbon emissions have to pay a fee based on the volume they produce. I fail to see how that is going to affect global warming.
Complete Rubbish Tax and the support against man-made Global Warming is building and its sensational ! Now Even Al Gore (Mr Inconvenient Truth) doesnt blame most "Global Warming" on Carbon Dioxide.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Manbush » November 27, 2009, 11:21 pm

Northern Raider wrote:
yeh raiders wrote:Pretty sure it a system by which the amount of GEE a company can emit, is based on permits. These permits can be sold/traded from company to company allowing for differing amounts of carbon to be produced. How the heck can you measure the amount of carbon produced from company to company :?
It's guaranteed to cost jobs, for little (if any :doubt: ) positive impact on climate.
Glorified tax IMO. Companies that produce carbon emissions have to pay a fee based on the volume they produce. I fail to see how that is going to affect global warming.
Then they pass it on to consumers meaning the companies wont be much worse off just the taxpayers
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Dr. Alex » December 1, 2009, 10:27 am

Abbott new Lib Leader.

Might of Voted for Hockey or Turnbull - but there is no way in hell I will be ever voting for Abbott.

Don't really want to vote for Rudd either.

:?

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by thickos » December 1, 2009, 10:36 am

This is a very difficult day for progressive-minded supporters of the Liberal Party such as myself. I don't really have anything else to say - we will be obliterated next year, whenever the election will be.

Dark days

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Question » December 1, 2009, 10:44 am

The bloke has a good size set of nuts and will be swinging punches from the get go,He will reveal all labor's flaws very very quickly all goes well for gaining numbers again...

Excellent to see abloke lead a party that does not know the meaning of Pussy Foot.

Oh and he is a left footer as well. :thumbsup

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Sasha » December 1, 2009, 10:59 am

:lol: @ Abbott

:lol: :lol: @ someone voting informally and the margin being 1 vote.

Bob Brown to be the leader of the second biggest political party 12 months :lol:

Seriously I didn't mind Turnbull because he wasn't a conservative dinosaur, but had too much of a grasp on reality in social issues and that pissed off the far right wing nut jobs..

Tony Abbott is so backwards he apposes Stem cell research, something which has potential to improve the lives of a substantial number of people :thumbsdown
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by papabear » December 1, 2009, 11:05 am

I dont like abbott, but atleast he had the balls to stick up against the ETS and left wing nutjobs who favour another nuffy tax.

Anyway the hard left are going to vote green anyways so I dont see it as a big loss for the libs.

Albeit I hope he changes his stance on stem cell research as opposing it is a bit sad.

As for turnbull :-

"I am friends with my Rubbish collector"

"I had to live in a two bedroom apartment once"" (I think that apartment was in vaucluse)

either way I dont think he had a touch on the social pulse of the worker.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Sasha » December 1, 2009, 11:18 am

Great article

Liberals outfox themselves with Boxer Abbott
TONY WRIGHT

The air of disbelief that has enveloped Federal Parliament over the past week became a roar of gobsmacked silence when it was announced that the Liberal Party had elected Tony Abbott the new leader by precisely one vote.

Even Abbott's supporters were astounded. Joe Hockey had been eliminated in the first round, leaving Abbott in the contest against Turnbull.

The Liberals had outfoxed themselves.

It was supposed to be a final race between Abbott and Hockey. But the soft-hearted Hockey supporters apparently felt that they couldn't humiliate poor Malcolm. So without consulting each other and locking in numbers, a few too many of them gave their first-round vote to Turnbull, imagining that he was about to be defeated anyway, and trying to give him a soft landing.

That left Hockey stranded. He found himself with only 23 votes, while Turnbull got 26 and Abbott - whose supporters weren't at all soft-hearted - topped the vote with 35.

That left Abbott and Turnbull head to head, and Big Joe - who anyway, had placed himself firmly astride a barbed-wire fence, trying to please everyone by offering a free vote on the emissions trading scheme, putting a number of noses out of joint - got his original wish. He wouldn't have to challenge Turnbull directly.

And then, if you still needed proof that this party was split asunder, the final vote went down to the wire. Abbott got 42 votes, Turnbull received 41.

But hang on! That means there were 84 votes counted in the first round, and only 83 in the second. Seems someone opted for the donkey vote, and wrote an inscrutable "No" on their ballot paper. Whoever it was appears to have been a Hockey supporter who couldn't stomach either Turnbull or Abbott.

Victorian Fran Bailey wasn't there at all. She has been ill and wanted to cast a proxy vote. But there was no system in place for such a thing. Bailey might be counted as a Turnbull number in a face-off with Abbott. Thus, the split could have been irrevocable: 42-42.


Turnbull gave one of his classy media appearances soon after.

He wasn't about to resign, he would go to the backbench and he and his wife Lucy would discuss the future before deciding whether to contest the next election.

Would he change anything that he had done?

"No," he responded.

Tony Abbott told the press gallery he believed the job of the opposition is to be an opposition, not an echo of the government.

And he promised to rip into the Rudd government's emissions trading scheme in the style of Paul Keating who tore apart John Hewson's hopes by a full-frontal attack on the GST in the early 1990s.

He even quoted Keating from those days: "'If you don't understand it, don't vote for it. If you do understand it, you'd never vote for it."

"As leader I am not afraid of an election. And I am not afraid of an election on this issue (the emissions trading scheme he has promised his party will now defeat). I am not."

He wouldn't speculate about the outcome of the 2010 election, and the old boxer promised a "good, fair fight".

"It's been a big day, a tough day for some of my colleagues," he said.

"I feel humbled and daunted by what's ahead.

"Obviously some wounds that have to be healed. I will do my best to be a consultative and collegial leader."

And he had generous words for the man he had just vanquished.

"I particularly want to pay tribute to Malcolm Turnbull. We have sometimes be sparring partners, but mostly we've been friends."

www.smh.com.au

And, umm, who is Abbott's deputy? That would be Julie Bishop, deputy to Brendan Nelson and Malcolm Turnbull. Still standing. Amazing.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Northern Raider » December 1, 2009, 12:00 pm

Let Abbott be the sacrificial lamb at the next election. Save Hockey for when they have a decent shot at winning. My only concern is that Labour will now get a double dissolution and subsequently a mandate to pass this ridiculous ETS. It would only be a viable method of reducing carbon emissions if the funds raised were directly channelled into creating alternative power sources. Alas this is not the case and the revenue is to be diverted back to compensation to the consumers for increased energy cost. Its just a recurring cycle of money with no real reduction in emissions. Its all about the politics and nothing to do arresting climate change.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by beetlejuice » December 1, 2009, 2:32 pm

The Labor party is very very happy right now :thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup :thumbsup
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Manbush » December 1, 2009, 2:57 pm

The ETS to me is just another tax grab, if they want to improve the environment they need to look at deforestisation, plant more trees and stop relying on them for their fibres etc, they take way too long to grow for what they produce, hemp on the other hand will produce the same in 6 months as trees do in 20yrs plus it improves soil quality and he fibres are actually stronger. Until a government looks into the hemp industry i will never take them seriously on environmental issues, they have the perfect cure yet refuse to look at it
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Woodgers » December 1, 2009, 4:44 pm

Damn...not a good day for the Libs.

I'm no politics guru at all but the biggest news of the day for most Aussies I reckon is the interest rate rise. How convienient for the ALP that the opposition leadership seems to have overshadowed this major issue. I'm not angry because my rate went up, I fixed mine in for 5 years so it means sweet FA to me. What I do think though is what type of Govt puts rates up for a record 3rd month straight coming into Christmas? Surely they could have held off till January and let the average Joe have a decent festive season buying presents for their kids and loved ones? Surely the Govt would have got the .25 back in GST anyway? I dunno, as I say i'm definitely no politics or economics expert so maybe consumer spending needed to be halted immediately. However that seems odd to me, wouldn't you want retail booming at Christmas time?

The role of the Federal Government is to make people's lives better. I cannot for the life of me see how not showing any compasion at Christmas time follows that ideal. The wife and I always chuck what we can under giving trees at Christmas and this year when we do i'm definitely going to feel that we haven't done nearly enough. It's going to be a tough year for a lot of families. I hope they remember why.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Nick » December 1, 2009, 5:00 pm

i have never even considered voting ALP before, but even as a staunch liberal, the only thing worst than ALP, is the strong christian right... Abbott will not have my vote.
Absolutely appauling decision by the Libs.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Woodgers » December 1, 2009, 5:21 pm

Raider_69 wrote:i have never even considered voting ALP before, but even as a staunch liberal, the only thing worst than ALP, is the strong christian right... Abbott will not have my vote.
Absolutely appauling decision by the Libs.
Dunno much about all that mate so as per my philosophy in life or on this forum, I don't have a comment about it.
We continue to **** about with blokes that are part of some fraternity. It's infuriating.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Nick » December 1, 2009, 5:48 pm

FTR, i has nothing to do with christianity in itself
i just dont believe religion has any place in the world of politics, the christian right, at least the heavy right, in potical sense have very little social conscience. They are unbelievably stubborn and will not listen to the poeple on any issue. Which is very off putting for the voters.

There is a very strong right wing christian faction amongst the Liberal party, and i worry where they will take the party. Abbott is pretty much a lackey of that strong right faction. It is indeed very troubling times. The christian voters will lap it up, but people like me, and there are a lot of them that are Lib voters, have always had concerns about the extreme right gaining control of the Libs, its why i liked Turnbull, he was strong in all the areas Libs are usually strong but had a social conscience which appealed to some swing ALP voters... Abbott appeals to the staunches of staunch LIB voters and freightens the **** out of the rest of us. If its not in the bibble, you can pretty much expect Abbott and co to oppose it.

Conversely, i would hate to see the day Rudd keels over and that **** unionist troll Gillard takes over. Gillard is the Abbott of the left. And neither should EVER be allowed to maintain any power.
Far left, far right, it doesnt matter, its bad. At the very least Johnny and Rudd are in that middle ground where they arent completely **** bonkers.

Abbott is the WORST possible leader of an opposition.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by beetlejuice » December 1, 2009, 5:50 pm

Woodgers wrote:Damn...not a good day for the Libs.

I'm no politics guru at all but the biggest news of the day for most Aussies I reckon is the interest rate rise. How convienient for the ALP that the opposition leadership seems to have overshadowed this major issue. I'm not angry because my rate went up, I fixed mine in for 5 years so it means sweet FA to me. What I do think though is what type of Govt puts rates up for a record 3rd month straight coming into Christmas? Surely they could have held off till January and let the average Joe have a decent festive season buying presents for their kids and loved ones? Surely the Govt would have got the .25 back in GST anyway? I dunno, as I say i'm definitely no politics or economics expert so maybe consumer spending needed to be halted immediately. However that seems odd to me, wouldn't you want retail booming at Christmas time?

The role of the Federal Government is to make people's lives better. I cannot for the life of me see how not showing any compasion at Christmas time follows that ideal. The wife and I always chuck what we can under giving trees at Christmas and this year when we do i'm definitely going to feel that we haven't done nearly enough. It's going to be a tough year for a lot of families. I hope they remember why.
woodgers, the federal government actually has no direct control over the interest rates. the reserve bank, which by law has to be a seperate entity, goes on several factors before deciding on interest rates. One very simple fact is that due to the G.F.C, the reserve bank placed rates at emergency lows to stop a recession. This worked, we avoided one. they are now ajusting them to suit the growth of the economy.

The reserve bank wont meet again till febuary so thats why the couldnt be raised in january.
Raider_69 wrote:i have never even considered voting ALP before, but even as a staunch liberal, the only thing worst than ALP, is the strong christian right... Abbott will not have my vote.
Absolutely appauling decision by the Libs.
the libs have made a terrible mistake. but Hockey's no dummy. He knows he'll have a better chance after the next election cause Abbott has got next to ZERO chance of becoming PM........unless their is a mass suicide pact amongst the Labor MP's and belinda Neal finds herself leader (which see's me move up a few notches in the party :thumbsup ). Hockey will be able to have a proper mandate over the party and will do good things for them.

Abbott won by a single vote, dont be surprised if he actually dont last out till the election if the polls go south......thats if there isnt one called in feb.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by beetlejuice » December 1, 2009, 5:53 pm

Raider_69 wrote:FTR, i has nothing to do with christianity in itself
i just dont believe religion has any place in the world of politics, the christian right, at least the heavy right, in potical sense have very little social conscience. They are unbelievably stubborn and will not listen to the poeple on any issue. Which is very off putting for the voters.

There is a very strong right wing christian faction amongst the Liberal party, and i worry where they will take the party. Abbott is pretty much a lackey of that strong right faction. It is indeed very troubling times. The christian voters will lap it up, but people like me, and there are a lot of them that are Lib voters, have always had concerns about the extreme right gaining control of the Libs, its why i liked Turnbull, he was strong in all the areas Libs are usually strong but had a social conscience which appealed to some swing ALP voters... Abbott appeals to the staunches of staunch LIB voters and freightens the **** out of the rest of us. If its not in the bibble, you can pretty much expect Abbott and co to oppose it.

Conversely, i would hate to see the day Rudd keels over and that **** unionist troll Gillard takes over. Gillard is the Abbott of the left. And neither should EVER be allowed to maintain any power.
Far left, far right, it doesnt matter, its bad. At the very least Johnny and Rudd are in that middle ground where they arent completely **** bonkers.

Abbott is the WORST possible leader of an opposition.
have to say mate, top post! being in the labor right faction, i not a huge fan of seeing gillard becoming PM either. ill admit i actually liked turnbull his social views fitted well with mine and he's what we call a small l liberal. the nation would have done ok with him as PM
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Nick » December 1, 2009, 5:57 pm

beetlejuice wrote:
Woodgers wrote:Damn...not a good day for the Libs.

I'm no politics guru at all but the biggest news of the day for most Aussies I reckon is the interest rate rise. How convienient for the ALP that the opposition leadership seems to have overshadowed this major issue. I'm not angry because my rate went up, I fixed mine in for 5 years so it means sweet FA to me. What I do think though is what type of Govt puts rates up for a record 3rd month straight coming into Christmas? Surely they could have held off till January and let the average Joe have a decent festive season buying presents for their kids and loved ones? Surely the Govt would have got the .25 back in GST anyway? I dunno, as I say i'm definitely no politics or economics expert so maybe consumer spending needed to be halted immediately. However that seems odd to me, wouldn't you want retail booming at Christmas time?

The role of the Federal Government is to make people's lives better. I cannot for the life of me see how not showing any compasion at Christmas time follows that ideal. The wife and I always chuck what we can under giving trees at Christmas and this year when we do i'm definitely going to feel that we haven't done nearly enough. It's going to be a tough year for a lot of families. I hope they remember why.
woodgers, the federal government actually has no direct control over the interest rates. the reserve bank, which by law has to be a seperate entity, goes on several factors before deciding on interest rates. One very simple fact is that due to the G.F.C, the reserve bank placed rates at emergency lows to stop a recession. This worked, we avoided one. they are now ajusting them to suit the growth of the economy.

The reserve bank wont meet again till febuary so thats why the couldnt be raised in january.
Raider_69 wrote:i have never even considered voting ALP before, but even as a staunch liberal, the only thing worst than ALP, is the strong christian right... Abbott will not have my vote.
Absolutely appauling decision by the Libs.
the libs have made a terrible mistake. but Hockey's no dummy. He knows he'll have a better chance after the next election cause Abbott has got next to ZERO chance of becoming PM........unless their is a mass suicide pact amongst the Labor MP's and belinda Neal finds herself leader (which see's me move up a few notches in the party :thumbsup ). Hockey will be able to have a proper mandate over the party and will do good things for them.

Abbott won by a single vote, dont be surprised if he actually dont last out till the election if the polls go south......thats if there isnt one called in feb.
I hope he goes to the next election and i hope he gets **** canned so heavily they wont even let him in his kids school politics club for fear of voter back lash. The sooner the prick drifts off into obscruity the better.

Smokin Joe is the man, but i agree its too early and he's better off waiting till after the next election. Which tbh is what i wanted Turnbull to do. I wouldnt be shocked if Abbott was voted out on another spill before the next election, as you say, it was hardly a decisive win. I just hope the party has the balls to stand up and ensure under Abbott, some sembelence of centred policy is maintained, and we dont become Fred Nile's wet dream

BTW... wasnt it K.Rudd's vote buyin... err i mean Stimulas Package that staved off the full effects of a recession, i mean thats what him and his wench Gillard keep telling us, despite everyone, including yourself knowing deep down, it was a glorified vote buying stunt, which sadly will work on a population where the middle class swing voters who cashed in big time and arent all that politically minded, are the majority.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Woodgers » December 1, 2009, 6:04 pm

woodgers, the federal government actually has no direct control over the interest rates. the reserve bank, which by law has to be a seperate entity, goes on several factors before deciding on interest rates. One very simple fact is that due to the G.F.C, the reserve bank placed rates at emergency lows to stop a recession. This worked, we avoided one. they are now ajusting them to suit the growth of the economy.

The reserve bank wont meet again till febuary so thats why the couldnt be raised in january.
Are you 100% sure on all this? Why is it that every time there is a rate rise the Treasurer and Federal Govt is under the pump then? Also, is this 'they are completely irrelevant' or is it another Greg Bird case where they are the power, someone got injured.....but they were just standing in the corner counting sheep? I find it hard to believe.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Question » December 1, 2009, 6:06 pm

Babbott knows he is not going to win the next election ****,he has been sent in to unravel and reveal and will cause a few frowns amongst the libs but mainly the commies along the way..A cat amongst pigeons setting up the libs for the next in a landslide.


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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by beetlejuice » December 1, 2009, 6:10 pm

what impressed me about joe was his solution to the ETS crisis. free vote. vote they way your electorate or your views allow you to choose.

showed great decision making and respect for his fellow collegues beliefs.

also the conspiracy is that several Abbott voters supported turnbull in the first ballot the knock out Hockey, knowing they would beat Turnbull.......have to admit very smart politics.

woodgers

the reason why the treasurer and the PM are under the pump is that their policies are usually questioned whenever people have to fork out money. they are the public face of the economy. remember there were seveal rate rises in 2007 while the economy is strong. they are usually used to keep inflation in check (high rates) or to boost consumer spending (lower rates).

a proper analogy would be, they are the bastard cop arresting your drunken mate. sure they are being pricks over it, but its the best situation they see to solve the problem.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by beetlejuice » December 1, 2009, 6:15 pm

Raider_69 wrote:BTW... wasnt it K.Rudd's vote buyin... err i mean Stimulas Package that staved off the full effects of a recession, i mean thats what him and his wench Gillard keep telling us, despite everyone, including yourself knowing deep down, it was a glorified vote buying stunt, which sadly will work on a population where the middle class swing voters who cashed in big time and arent all that politically minded, are the majority.
id like to think it was done in their views to keep the economy from going under (which its short term effects have had results), but you might be right, it could have be done to win votes. Thats a very real possibility.

Im having a little faith (i shouldnt ive been bitten hard by the party before) that they did it for the good.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by papabear » December 1, 2009, 6:51 pm

Woodgers wrote:
woodgers, the federal government actually has no direct control over the interest rates. the reserve bank, which by law has to be a seperate entity, goes on several factors before deciding on interest rates. One very simple fact is that due to the G.F.C, the reserve bank placed rates at emergency lows to stop a recession. This worked, we avoided one. they are now ajusting them to suit the growth of the economy.

The reserve bank wont meet again till febuary so thats why the couldnt be raised in january.
Are you 100% sure on all this? Why is it that every time there is a rate rise the Treasurer and Federal Govt is under the pump then? Also, is this 'they are completely irrelevant' or is it another Greg Bird case where they are the power, someone got injured.....but they were just standing in the corner counting sheep? I find it hard to believe.
The Govt has no control over the decision to raise or decrease interest rates.

But the govt can influence the rbas decisions indirectly.
The RBA will make there decision on interest rates to
keep economic growth as high as possible whilst trying to keep inflation between 2-3% (why it isnt aimed for 0% is beyond me but they are the magic figures that were chosen).

Thus if the govt are spending like theres no tomorrow putting inflationary pressures on the economy the RBA are going to raise interest rates to combat the inflationary pressures.

Conversely if govt actually spent wisely/prudently only on areas which helped foster economic growth and that did not put inflationary pressure on the economy the RBA would lower interest rates. The RBA arent evil dictators they just push interest rates whereever they need to be to maintain this stability.

Thus any govt which says it has no control over interest rates is technically telling the truth but in reality it selling you a technicality and really by most peoples standards a lie.

Howard could have saved/spent better to keep interest rates down during his last term he didnt, he got booted.

If variable interest rates get over 8% again and krudd is going to the electorate on a double dissolution solely on the carbon tax then he will struggle to beat suddam hussien let alone fred niles good buddy tony abbott.

Interestingly people dont want religion in politics - I am EXACTLY the same it has no place in politics. but i dont think that should be what determines your vote as voting on the issue of religion imo is just as defeating as having religion in politics in the first place. OK if two parties policies are the exactly the same and one person is some raging religous right nut or some raging loony vote for the other guy as the safe bet, but I would implore all people like me not tied to a party to vote from there pocket.

Also i think it was manbush who spoke about hemp - i gets to full sucking in CO2 capacity in 6 mths compared to what takes a tree 20yrs (i might be wrong but thats what i gathered) then i thoroughly agree with you on that general idea. Now let me first preface that i am not sold on man made climate change -i dont really care but only enter into the debate because its a bit of a flavour of the month topic atm.

But imo the responsible way for a govt to fix it would be to spend the money on land/hemp farms and other things that breathe in carbon dramatically as opposed to just slugging polluters with a tax that will ultimately be paid by us the consumer. Before you say raise taxes more spending we did a whole bunch of wasteful spending on school buildings to handouts that could have just as easily gone on buying up masses and masses of land and planting whatever trees are best for C02 reduction.

The govt did not, they were more excited in keeping the overinflated construction industry (albeit we should thank for there support to the raiders through the CFMEU) and other overinflated indirectly govt protected industries then doing something a bit more economically efficient.

However fair is fair Krudd only midway through his term im still hoping he can do some good to my life and the life of us fellow australians before the next election comes up, or atleast expand the opportunities available to us.

sorry about any grammatical errors and typos, i got on a rant had no time to check the little things.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by -LG- » December 1, 2009, 6:57 pm

A terrible day for Australian politics. We need a strong opposition and I worry this move to the far right is going to sideline the Libs for a while.

Abbott is personable enough, and principled, and I expect that he will surprise some people. But the Liberal Party needs to sort out what exactly it is and who it thinks it represents, if it's ever going to be a force again.

By electing someone from the far right all they've done is guaranteed the support of the rusted on conservatives - who weren't going anywhere anyway. They will lose the moderate middle ground, the swinging voters that swung across to Rudd last time.

I'm a bit on the fence re: climate change. I think it's definitely occurring and worsening quickly (as cooling and heating phases have occurred quickly in the past), but I also think it's a natural event that we're simply contributing to rather than directly causing.

But Australians are on the frontline of climate change, Canberra just had it's hottest November ever (5 degrees above average according to an ABC article I read yesterday), so the Libs won't have anywhere to hide if things continue to worsen.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Riaan » December 1, 2009, 7:43 pm

Lime Green wrote:A terrible day for Australian politics. We need a strong opposition and I worry this move to the far right is going to sideline the Libs for a while.

Abbott is personable enough, and principled, and I expect that he will surprise some people. But the Liberal Party needs to sort out what exactly it is and who it thinks it represents, if it's ever going to be a force again.

By electing someone from the far right all they've done is guaranteed the support of the rusted on conservatives - who weren't going anywhere anyway. They will lose the moderate middle ground, the swinging voters that swung across to Rudd last time.

I'm a bit on the fence re: climate change. I think it's definitely occurring and worsening quickly (as cooling and heating phases have occurred quickly in the past), but I also think it's a natural event that we're simply contributing to rather than directly causing.

But Australians are on the frontline of climate change, Canberra just had it's hottest November ever (5 degrees above average according to an ABC article I read yesterday), so the Libs won't have anywhere to hide if things continue to worsen.
Your right the Lib right wing has just made sure it will lose the next election. Turnbull was on the right track supporting the ETS and at least trying to sore up some support from the moderate middle ground. Labor will lose the next election in a land slide and unless things change probably the next one as well.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by -TW- » December 1, 2009, 7:50 pm

I hope he goes to the next election and i hope he gets **** canned so heavily they wont even let him in his kids school politics club for fear of voter back lash. The sooner the prick drifts off into obscruity the better.
i heard... (emphasize heard) that after the vote was taken a spill was called for abbott... doesnt sound like it got up though

sad times if you in the job 2 mins and want to be chucked out already

but i love this...

Abbott can win election, says Howard (ABC)

Abbott doomed to failure: Hawke (SMH)

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Uncensored » December 2, 2009, 4:52 am

I think I am going to have to vote for big Kev's mob again to keep the right-wing, wack-job extremists where they belong. The prospect of Abbott as PM is just unacceptable.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by beetlejuice » December 2, 2009, 8:42 am

Uncensored wrote:I think I am going to have to vote for big Kev's mob again to keep the right-wing, wack-job extremists where they belong. The prospect of Abbott as PM is just unacceptable.
LOVE THE SIG! :clap: :clap: :clap:
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Northern Raider » December 2, 2009, 9:33 am

The most terrible part of this whole episode is that its diverting discussion away from the real issue i.e. what a terrible piece of legislation this ETS is and how it will have ZERO effect on climate change.
* The author assumes no responsibility for the topicality, correctness, completeness or quality of information provided.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by mick63 » December 2, 2009, 7:25 pm

Northern Raider wrote:The most terrible part of this whole episode is that its diverting discussion away from the real issue i.e. what a terrible piece of legislation this ETS is and how it will have ZERO effect on climate change.
Sadly its another example of an unquestioning media focusing on the headline and not the fine print.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by mick63 » December 2, 2009, 7:34 pm

thickos wrote:This is a very difficult day for progressive-minded supporters of the Liberal Party such as myself. I don't really have anything else to say - we will be obliterated next year, whenever the election will be.

Dark days
Dark days indeed.

The ascension of Abbott reminds me of Jim Hackers,sadly this is real.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Northern Raider » December 3, 2009, 9:54 am

mick63 wrote:
Northern Raider wrote:The most terrible part of this whole episode is that its diverting discussion away from the real issue i.e. what a terrible piece of legislation this ETS is and how it will have ZERO effect on climate change.
Sadly its another example of an unquestioning media focusing on the headline and not the fine print.
Which, even more sadly wouldn't happen if the general population didn't react to this method of journalism. There is plenty written about the actual ETS itself but its hidden away in the less general news channels.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by The Naked Zombie » December 3, 2009, 10:22 am

I'm very happy with appointment of Abbott as Liberal Party leader and look forward to him winning the next election and starting the long, arduous job of cleaning up the mess left by PM Gillard and her merry band of retards :)
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Question » December 3, 2009, 10:26 am

The Naked Zombie wrote:Gillard
A massive Twilight fan imo.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by The Naked Zombie » December 3, 2009, 10:40 am

I don't care what it likes, just chuck a bag on it immediately. IMMEDIATELY.
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