The Politics Thread 2013

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Green eyed Mick
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Green eyed Mick » December 8, 2013, 7:38 am

No matter what happens next week this was a watershed moment for the Gay Rights movement in Australia. :clap:

http://www.smh.com.au/photogallery/nati ... aggregate=

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Toviii » December 8, 2013, 7:53 am

Green eyed Mick wrote:No matter what happens next week this was a watershed moment for the Gay Rights movement in Australia. :clap:

http://www.smh.com.au/photogallery/nati ... aggregate=
Agreed GEM.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by gangrenous » December 8, 2013, 10:35 am

I think an important difference between this and the referendum on a republic is that for a short period this is the law, people experience it, and we get to hear/see some of the personal stories.

I think that the PR benefit and additional pressure on the Abbott government to stop being tools will be worth it in the end.

I know almost everyone in this thread hopes the challenge in the high court fails and we don't have to wait another 3-4 years for this.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by papabear » December 9, 2013, 1:34 pm

Stuat wrote:
papabear wrote:
Green eyed Mick wrote:
Stuat wrote:Just quietly- this Downer/ASIO/ASIS stuff looks far worse than Obeid. Corrupt as all ****. Downer pretty much got ASIO to tap offices on behalf of Woodside, then retires straight into a job at Woodside, ASIS officer cracks the **** and becomes a whistleblower, Brandis raids the offices of the Timor lawyer and ASIS guy to shut it all down and provide cover for Downer...

Of course there is no real way of getting any of them legally- it's illegal for ASIS officers to talk about anything that they did, internal scrutiny corrupted by secrecy. But Jesus Christ it's some morally corrupt ****. Sort of stuff you expect in Venezuela not Australia.
Anyone who is surprised by this has clearly not been paying attention :doubt:

Some more context around the whole issue.

http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment ... 2yrqm.html
Eddie Obied pretty much ran NSW as a way for him and his family to get rich.

I fail to see how the above is worse.
Obeid did the dodgy on a few mining deals. Downer used the federal intelligence agencies to gather information for Woodside, which was then used by them in negotiations for the Timor sea oil reserves. He then went and got a job there. That is now being covered up by Brandis under the guise of "security". It's gross criminal corruption on an international level. Even the nicest reading of it it's corrupt as ****...

Don't get me wrong, what Obeid did is disgraceful, but this is equally bad. Both Downer and Obeid deserve to spend a lot of time in jail. No matter which side of politics you sit on, this sort of corruption has no place in a democracy and perpetrators need to be held accountable...
The Downer stuff sounds bad and if guilty he should goto jail, dont get me wrong.

but flogging off public assets (mining tenders) under value to yourself and associates, not to mention the CQ leases, is just downright disgusting coupled with his continuing denials and smarmy presence make him so so much worse.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Albi » December 10, 2013, 11:23 am

Here's the latest little gem from the Abbott Government.

They're now 'asking' childcare workers to 'give back' a recent pay rise. For those who don't know, childcare is one of the most poorly paid sectors, with qualified workers only earning about $37,000.

http://m.smh.com.au/federal-politics/po ... z2n1r4ubx8
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Green eyed Mick » December 10, 2013, 11:41 am

Albi wrote:Here's the latest little gem from the Abbott Government.

They're now 'asking' childcare workers to 'give back' a recent pay rise. For those who don't know, childcare is one of the most poorly paid sectors, with qualified workers only earning about $37,000.

http://m.smh.com.au/federal-politics/po ... z2n1r4ubx8
Not surprised. This was flagged before the election.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by papabear » December 10, 2013, 12:56 pm

oddly enough someone on hecs
earning say 80k might get 52 in the pocket

then you have someone earning 37k
probably getting something like 33 in the pocket.

my heart isnt bleeding.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Albi » December 11, 2013, 4:57 pm

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Nick » December 11, 2013, 5:06 pm

again albi, its 3 years away from an election, the polls mean precisely diddly squat right now.
Polls will become relevant again in about 2 and half years
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Green eyed Mick » December 11, 2013, 5:26 pm

:thumbsup

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Toviii » December 11, 2013, 5:30 pm

I imagine what's gone down with Holden hasn't helped things.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Green eyed Mick » December 11, 2013, 5:48 pm

Toviii wrote:I imagine what's gone down with Holden hasn't helped things.
It also doesn't help when the treasurer fronts the media blaming the Carbon tax for Holdens departure right after the chief of holden has given his own press brief to outline the actual reasons for the departure, never once mentioning the stupid Carbon Tax.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Albi » December 11, 2013, 5:48 pm

His popularity is plummeting faster than Rudd's, and we all know what happened there
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Schifty » December 11, 2013, 7:20 pm

Uruguay government legalising marijuana.

They will control the growing and the selling of the product.

I do not use the stuff but it is definitely a move in the right direction as it will cut a lot of funding to the organised criminal groups that try sell it.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by gangrenous » December 11, 2013, 7:38 pm

Is that where Manbush is?

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Green eyed Mick » December 11, 2013, 7:40 pm

Schifty wrote:Uruguay government legalising marijuana.

They will control the growing and the selling of the product.

I do not use the stuff but it is definitely a move in the right direction as it will cut a lot of funding to the organised criminal groups that try sell it.
It is a very intelligent approach. You purchase plant material from pharmacies or seeds and grow your own. The seeds come from known strains where the THC and CBD content as well as the variety is known. Users are aware of exactly what they are buying and can be assured they aren't consuming something that has been chemically enhanced or something that contains dangerous levels of THC.

They have to register so the government can ensure compliance and because anyone who wants it has access to it the black market is pretty much dead.

Colorado's laws take effect in January and some commentators believe the US will have legalised Cannabis at a federal level within a decade. Yet here we are in Australia still pretending Cannabis is a horrible, addictive and destructive drug while every 3rd add on tv during prime time is for alcohol.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Manbush » December 11, 2013, 8:06 pm

Great move and hopefully it's successful so more can follow suit. Controlling the seeds and quality is a good move, keep it higher in CBD and lower in THC and any mental risks are diminished that greatly it couldn't be argued against from a mental health perspective.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Manbush » December 11, 2013, 8:08 pm

gangrenous wrote:Is that where Manbush is?
:lol:
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Green eyed Mick » December 12, 2013, 6:37 am

Manbush wrote:Great move and hopefully it's successful so more can follow suit. Controlling the seeds and quality is a good move, keep it higher in CBD and lower in THC and any mental risks are diminished that greatly it couldn't be argued against from a mental health perspective.
I don't like our chances. Even the Greens are **** scared to touch the issue. Too many powerful interest groups whose profits and power would be significantly impacted by an intelligent and evidence based drug policy.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Manbush » December 12, 2013, 7:55 am

True GEM but the more places that follow suit the better our chances, especially if the reason pot is illegal (USA) get on board eventually. Just takes some deprogramming of the years of propaganda we've been fed.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by The Rickman » December 12, 2013, 10:13 am

Yep, if it becomes legal in the US (or at least decriminalised), then Australia will follow suit.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Jake » December 12, 2013, 10:29 am

I can't believe how far behind Australia are on the Marijuana issue.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Toviii » December 12, 2013, 11:11 am

Very unfortunate news, but not unexpected...

http://www.theage.com.au/act-news/sames ... 2z884.html
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Jake » December 12, 2013, 11:25 am

Another absolutely ridiculous ruling. What the ****?

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Green eyed Mick » December 12, 2013, 12:27 pm

Not unexpected. Marriage is a federal responsibility and the High Court confirmed as much with this ruling. But this had to be done and the ACT government and the couples who were married in the last week have my full support and admiration.

Now the marraige equality debate shifts to Federal parliament where the Greens have put forward a bill that if passed will end marriage discrimination for everyone, in every state and territory.

Some more info:

The decision was unanimous. Six of the seven judges sat on the case. They found that the word “marriage” in the Constitution means the union of any two natural persons.

This will be a major blow to religious groups who would have no doubt challenged any Federal same-sex marriage law. Now they have no grounds to do so.

The case is not what it seems at first. It is in fact a major step forward for marriage equality in Australia.


Read more: http://www.canberratimes.com.au/comment ... z2nE96AKtd

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Nick » December 12, 2013, 1:31 pm

lets hope this has the intended results, and we see marriage equality passed through at a federal level soon.
Im not convinced it will, but i am hopeful that it might be.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Manbush » December 12, 2013, 6:02 pm

Green eyed Mick wrote:
The decision was unanimous. Six of the seven judges sat on the case. They found that the word “marriage” in the Constitution means the union of any two natural persons.
Any two natural persons sounds promising for future attempts though what about people with prosthetics
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Shadow Boxer » December 12, 2013, 6:14 pm

The labor/greens had 7 years to get it done, a bit disingenuous to expect a committed catholic to do it now.

A shame but won't happen this term.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Schifty » December 12, 2013, 6:16 pm

Key bit from the Guardian article on this.

But the high court has done remarkable work. It went out of its way to declare that that there are no historical, religious or constitutional barriers to same-sex marriage in Australia. The way is open so long as the law is national.

Theirs is not the language of equal marriage advocates, but the judges unanimously declared that in 2013 old notions of Christian matrimony don’t decide the meaning of marriage in the Australian constitution.


Politicians may decide, as they did under John Howard in 2004, that marriage in Australia will be allowed only between men and women. But that’s politics, declared the judges, not constitutional law.

http://www.theguardian.com/society/2013 ... l-equality

It's all down to those bunch of **** clowns that make up our parliament...

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Toviii » December 12, 2013, 6:18 pm

Shadow Boxer wrote:The labor/greens had 7 years to get it done, a bit disingenuous to expect a committed catholic to do it now.

A shame but won't happen this term.
Labor's position change on gay marriage only really happened this year (if it can be called that).
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Manbush » December 12, 2013, 6:27 pm

Toviii wrote:
Shadow Boxer wrote:The labor/greens had 7 years to get it done, a bit disingenuous to expect a committed catholic to do it now.

A shame but won't happen this term.
Labor's position change on gay marriage only really happened this year (if it can be called that).
They didn't legalise it though when they had the chance this year, it was all talk to try and win an unwinnable election.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Schifty » December 12, 2013, 6:31 pm

The longer it goes on the more embarrassing it is for Australia.

Anyway can't wait for the stupids to now get vocal and say this decision will stop people marrying their donkey.

The Dutch have had same sex marriage for 10 years now and there is still yet to be one Donkey wedding.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Green eyed Mick » December 12, 2013, 7:39 pm

Schifty wrote:The longer it goes on the more embarrassing it is for Australia.

Anyway can't wait for the stupids to now get vocal and say this decision will stop people marrying their donkey.

The Dutch have had same sex marriage for 10 years now and there is still yet to be one Donkey wedding.
I think the people currently in charge take pride in being a long way behind the rest of the developed world. They sure as hell aren't in much of a hurry to present Australia as a responsible, free, progressive and open country.

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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Nick » December 12, 2013, 7:43 pm

Schifty wrote: The Dutch have had same sex marriage for 10 years now and there is still yet to be one Donkey wedding.
now that's a disgrace.
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Re: The Politics Thread

Post by Schifty » December 12, 2013, 7:51 pm

Ohh look the faster fraudband is going to take longer and cost 12 billion more


http://www.theguardian.com/technology/2 ... ?CMP=fb_gu


Surprise!

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