PPL and child care

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Professor
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Professor » December 9, 2014, 5:00 pm

Manchild wrote:
Lucy wrote:
T_R wrote:
Pigman wrote:
Manbush wrote:Well Nick tell me then how much its costing you, there's enough reports on the price of raising kids in Australia, knowledge of mates situations and seeing poor families raising kids to have a "faintest idea", otherwise enlighten me.
It cost $100 minimum a day in day care alone
That's $1k a fortnight if you have two working parents

It's added $70 a week to our grocery bill, around $300 a quarter to our utilities. We are forever buying clothes because he grows out of them or ruins them, and no not ruins as in stains, ruins as in holes and rips in the garments, he's ruined a number of our own clothes with vomit, **** and piss stains, you've got cots, prams, you need portable options to take when you have to go visit family, you've got to have spare everything just about, it's not enough to buy on set of sheets, one grow bag, one change table mat, you need 2-3 because if **** happens, literal **** in this case, you need back ups to get by whilst you wash others. He adds massive amounts to our healthcare premiums, We also put money aside to pay for his future education. Car child seats, we had to buy a car to replace my wife's car which was not big enough to fit a child seat, pram and accessories in, we had to buy a bigger house because the 2 bedroom shoe box apartment wasn't big enough for a child to grow up in.

I mean I could go on, and on and **** on.
Let alone if you add a 2nd child.
If it's any consolation, it get much, much more expensive from here.
And from there it's all downhill.

I have 16 year old twins, a 13 year old and a 7 month old.
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Raidersrawesome » December 9, 2014, 5:12 pm

Lucy wrote:
T_R wrote:
Pigman wrote:
Manbush wrote:Well Nick tell me then how much its costing you, there's enough reports on the price of raising kids in Australia, knowledge of mates situations and seeing poor families raising kids to have a "faintest idea", otherwise enlighten me.
It cost $100 minimum a day in day care alone
That's $1k a fortnight if you have two working parents

It's added $70 a week to our grocery bill, around $300 a quarter to our utilities. We are forever buying clothes because he grows out of them or ruins them, and no not ruins as in stains, ruins as in holes and rips in the garments, he's ruined a number of our own clothes with vomit, **** and piss stains, you've got cots, prams, you need portable options to take when you have to go visit family, you've got to have spare everything just about, it's not enough to buy on set of sheets, one grow bag, one change table mat, you need 2-3 because if **** happens, literal **** in this case, you need back ups to get by whilst you wash others. He adds massive amounts to our healthcare premiums, We also put money aside to pay for his future education. Car child seats, we had to buy a car to replace my wife's car which was not big enough to fit a child seat, pram and accessories in, we had to buy a bigger house because the 2 bedroom shoe box apartment wasn't big enough for a child to grow up in.

I mean I could go on, and on and **** on.
Let alone if you add a 2nd child.
If it's any consolation, it get much, much more expensive from here.
And from there it's all downhill.

I have 16 year old twins, a 13 year old and a 7 month old.
I have 4 as well

19,17, 8 and 5

On one income all the way through
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Lucy
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Lucy » December 9, 2014, 5:17 pm

Sometimes I wonder why we do it to ourselves and then they make me laugh or smile or give me a hug and you realise no matter how much you spend and how much they waste you'd never change it for a second.
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Raidersrawesome » December 9, 2014, 5:18 pm

No , not even having to drive to the valley at 2 in the morning to pick up your pissed son
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Lucy » December 9, 2014, 5:21 pm

I'm not quite there yet. Well, that they admit to at least. I like to think I know better ha!
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Raidersrawesome » December 9, 2014, 5:22 pm

Id rather he call me TBH
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by reptar » December 9, 2014, 6:19 pm

Manchild wrote:If you take away PPL I would say many people would seriously consider having children.
Is that a bad thing?
Gina Riley: Oh, come on, John. That’s a bit old hat, the corrupt IOC delegate.
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by gangrenous » December 9, 2014, 6:37 pm

T_R wrote:
gangrenous wrote:
T_R wrote:
gangrenous wrote:Am I wrong T_R?
In my experience in this thread, almost entirely and almost always.
Of course T_R! Attack me again. Not what I say at all. You're awesome.
:roflmao :roflmao :roflmao :roflmao :roflmao

You asked the **** question. If you take yourself that seriously, this is probably not the place for you.

Any thread where Manbush's views are read and discussed simply cannot be a serious place.
The mistake was indeed mine. Usually in my experience when people claim I'm wrong they justify themselves. I always fall in the trap of forgetting you don't roll like that.

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by T_R » December 9, 2014, 7:01 pm

gangrenous wrote:
T_R wrote:
gangrenous wrote:
T_R wrote:
gangrenous wrote:Am I wrong T_R?
In my experience in this thread, almost entirely and almost always.
Of course T_R! Attack me again. Not what I say at all. You're awesome.
:roflmao :roflmao :roflmao :roflmao :roflmao

You asked the **** question. If you take yourself that seriously, this is probably not the place for you.

Any thread where Manbush's views are read and discussed simply cannot be a serious place.
The mistake was indeed mine. Usually in my experience when people claim I'm wrong they justify themselves. I always fall in the trap of forgetting you don't roll like that.
So you were wrong again? How depressing :(
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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by papabear » December 9, 2014, 7:18 pm

From a biological perspective, I thought the human race reproducing and raising their young in a manner to continue to reproduce and thrive on this planet and eventually the universe was the single most important thing we could do.

Thus, imo, government policy should be promoting and assisting with the above.

From an economic perspective (aside from the obvious benefits through extra taxes raised on double income families) in terms of a getting things done perspective.

Say you have two families with two kids each.

You could have 1 carer looking after four kids and three other people doing three other jobs to full capacity, lets say one person digging iron ore out of the ground, one person flogging the iron ore to the world and another person being a doctor, all four of those paying taxes on income earnt, the carer picking up the extra cash caring for the child of the family who has two outside childcare employment opportunities.

Or you could have 2 carers then obviously only 2 of 3 of the above jobs are being done.

It simply is a no brainer.

Then the "welfare" argument.
People who do not have children, one day are going to be on a pension or super, not working using the goods and services provided by other younger people all offspring that they have not raised or spent a cent on.
People who have had children, who have bought up the workforce that will support them in their aging years will get no benefit/financial recompense for the money they have invested in the future workforce. They will get the same benefit as those who have spent their money on whatever their own heart desires and have not raised children into productive adults.

Thus from the above perspective, if anybody is doing better out of the system or getting "welfare" from the system it certainly is not those who have chosen to raise children.

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Manbush » December 9, 2014, 8:03 pm

Environmentally it's bad though ;)

Should there be a cap on how many children you can claim it for?

#Warning ridiculous extreme example#

I went to school with one of Andrew Gee's cousins, there were 18 kids in total in his family. Now obviously pumping all those out the mum had no time (or desire) to work anywhere other than their farm. What sort of benefits should they get being self employed pumping so many out? (No idea if they were getting any assistance except a good discount from the catholic school we went to).
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by T_R » December 9, 2014, 8:06 pm

Wow, this thread has drifted into some strange places :lol:

This is known as the 'Manbush Effect'.
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Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Botman » December 9, 2014, 8:13 pm

Sort it out, Manbush. Sort it out.
CREATE PROCEDURE BotMan_Post AS
SELECT * FROM Previous_Post
EXEC quote_post
WHERE UserName = 'Aknalkfgnaa' OR 'Yeah Raiders' OR 'Billy B'
EXEC RAND(good_grief; cheak_notes; uh82cit;)

GO;

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Manbush » December 9, 2014, 8:13 pm

At least I gave a bolded warning this time :lol:
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by gangrenous » December 9, 2014, 8:17 pm

T_R wrote:So you were wrong again? How depressing :(
No, just the once :)

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by gangrenous » December 9, 2014, 8:23 pm

papabear wrote: People who do not have children, one day are going to be on a pension or super, not working using the goods and services provided by other younger people all offspring that they have not raised or spent a cent on.
Depending on the situation, you could surely argue that these people paid their taxes into the system to support others and are now having that reciprocated?

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Manbush » December 9, 2014, 8:29 pm

With the way the age of retirement is going I don't think my pension will be an issue :P
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by T_R » December 9, 2014, 9:23 pm

gangrenous wrote:
papabear wrote: People who do not have children, one day are going to be on a pension or super, not working using the goods and services provided by other younger people all offspring that they have not raised or spent a cent on.
Depending on the situation, you could surely argue that these people paid their taxes into the system to support others and are now having that reciprocated?
No, Australia does not carry a surplus. We consume immediately the tax we pay, and more.
Image

Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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PPL and child care

Post by gangrenous » December 10, 2014, 5:31 am

T_R wrote: No, Australia does not carry a surplus. We consume immediately the tax we pay, and more.
At present, we're talking over a lifetime. And that doesn't rule out individuals having net positive effect. Not to mention that in immediately using the tax we pay, you're paying the pensions of those currently contributing nothing. You don't need a surplus to earn your cover.

If you do rule out individuals having a net positive effect, then having children and more net draws on the economy doesn't seem like the ideal solution there.

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by papabear » December 10, 2014, 8:17 am

Yes an individual might have a net positive effect financially, but without another generation there would be no one for him to purchase whatever he needs in retirement from.

Added to that, there is TR's point that despite some individuals having a net positive effect, the tax savings doesn't just sit there to be used in ones retirement we need the next generation to keep paying taxes etc.

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Manbush » December 10, 2014, 8:52 am

Also have to take into the equation that on average people with children live longer so they drain more in that regard.
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by T_R » December 10, 2014, 9:20 am

Manbush wrote:Also have to take into the equation that on average people with children live longer so they drain more in that regard.
Oh, come on Image

This is just getting dumb.
Image

Son, we live in a world that has forums, and those forums have to be guarded by Mods. Who's gonna do it? You? You, Nickman? I have a greater responsibility than you can possibly fathom. You weep for Lucy, and you curse GE. You have that luxury. You have the luxury of not knowing what I know -- that GE’s moderation, while tragic, probably saved lives; and my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, keeps threads on track and under the appropriately sized, highlighted green headings.
You want moderation because deep down in places you don't talk about at parties, you want me on that forum -- you need me on that forum. We use words like "stay on topic," "use the appropriate forum," "please delete." We use these words as the backbone of a life spent defending something. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the blanket of the very moderation that I provide and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather that you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise, I suggest you get a green handle and edit a post. Either way, I don't give a DAMN what you think about moderation.

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by The Rickman » December 10, 2014, 9:42 am

Manbush wrote:Environmentally it's bad though ;)

Should there be a cap on how many children you can claim it for?

#Warning ridiculous extreme example#

I went to school with one of Andrew Gee's cousins, there were 18 kids in total in his family. Now obviously pumping all those out the mum had no time (or desire) to work anywhere other than their farm. What sort of benefits should they get being self employed pumping so many out? (No idea if they were getting any assistance except a good discount from the catholic school we went to).
You see?? This is why we can't have nice things around here.
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Professor » December 10, 2014, 9:54 am

The Nickman wrote:
Manbush wrote:Environmentally it's bad though ;)

Should there be a cap on how many children you can claim it for?

#Warning ridiculous extreme example#

I went to school with one of Andrew Gee's cousins, there were 18 kids in total in his family. Now obviously pumping all those out the mum had no time (or desire) to work anywhere other than their farm. What sort of benefits should they get being self employed pumping so many out? (No idea if they were getting any assistance except a good discount from the catholic school we went to).
You see?? This is why we can't have nice things around here.
:lol:

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Shadow Boxer » December 10, 2014, 10:27 am

Lucy wrote:
T_R wrote:
Pigman wrote:
Manbush wrote:Well Nick tell me then how much its costing you, there's enough reports on the price of raising kids in Australia, knowledge of mates situations and seeing poor families raising kids to have a "faintest idea", otherwise enlighten me.
It cost $100 minimum a day in day care alone
That's $1k a fortnight if you have two working parents

It's added $70 a week to our grocery bill, around $300 a quarter to our utilities. We are forever buying clothes because he grows out of them or ruins them, and no not ruins as in stains, ruins as in holes and rips in the garments, he's ruined a number of our own clothes with vomit, **** and piss stains, you've got cots, prams, you need portable options to take when you have to go visit family, you've got to have spare everything just about, it's not enough to buy on set of sheets, one grow bag, one change table mat, you need 2-3 because if **** happens, literal **** in this case, you need back ups to get by whilst you wash others. He adds massive amounts to our healthcare premiums, We also put money aside to pay for his future education. Car child seats, we had to buy a car to replace my wife's car which was not big enough to fit a child seat, pram and accessories in, we had to buy a bigger house because the 2 bedroom shoe box apartment wasn't big enough for a child to grow up in.

I mean I could go on, and on and **** on.
Let alone if you add a 2nd child.
If it's any consolation, it get much, much more expensive from here.
And from there it's all downhill.

I have 16 year old twins, a 13 year old and a 7 month old.
ahhh, now I understand
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Lucy » December 10, 2014, 10:28 am

Shadow Boxer wrote:
Lucy wrote:
T_R wrote:
Pigman wrote:
It cost $100 minimum a day in day care alone
That's $1k a fortnight if you have two working parents

It's added $70 a week to our grocery bill, around $300 a quarter to our utilities. We are forever buying clothes because he grows out of them or ruins them, and no not ruins as in stains, ruins as in holes and rips in the garments, he's ruined a number of our own clothes with vomit, **** and piss stains, you've got cots, prams, you need portable options to take when you have to go visit family, you've got to have spare everything just about, it's not enough to buy on set of sheets, one grow bag, one change table mat, you need 2-3 because if **** happens, literal **** in this case, you need back ups to get by whilst you wash others. He adds massive amounts to our healthcare premiums, We also put money aside to pay for his future education. Car child seats, we had to buy a car to replace my wife's car which was not big enough to fit a child seat, pram and accessories in, we had to buy a bigger house because the 2 bedroom shoe box apartment wasn't big enough for a child to grow up in.

I mean I could go on, and on and **** on.
Let alone if you add a 2nd child.
If it's any consolation, it get much, much more expensive from here.
And from there it's all downhill.

I have 16 year old twins, a 13 year old and a 7 month old.
ahhh, now I understand
Yeah, it explains a lot.
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Shadow Boxer » December 11, 2014, 7:52 am

At least we can share that common bond and knowing look that only the parents of twins will ever understand ;)
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by The Rickman » December 11, 2014, 1:15 pm

Shadow Boxer wrote:At least we can share that common bond and knowing look that only the parents of twins will ever understand ;)
Except your twins are old enough to be Lucy's twins grandparents, AMIRITE??
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Botman » December 11, 2014, 2:04 pm

SB's twins names are Mavis and Mildred
Lucy's twins names are Neveah and Laquisha
CREATE PROCEDURE BotMan_Post AS
SELECT * FROM Previous_Post
EXEC quote_post
WHERE UserName = 'Aknalkfgnaa' OR 'Yeah Raiders' OR 'Billy B'
EXEC RAND(good_grief; cheak_notes; uh82cit;)

GO;

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Re: PPL and child care

Post by The Rickman » December 11, 2014, 2:10 pm

:lol:
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Re: PPL and child care

Post by Lucy » December 11, 2014, 2:40 pm

Don't forget Moisha my 13 year old.
Avatar Bet - bleedgreen99 - Raiders to make (BG99)/miss(Lucy) the 8. Avatar from last round of regular season 2015 until GF 2016.
Signature Bet - Raider85 - Raiders to get(Lucy)/miss(R85) the wooden spoon. Signature for entire offseason.
Bottle of something to the value of $70 - Matthew Borewood to not see (Lucy)/to see (Piggles) a first grade game in 2015 for the Warriors.
The Name Change Bet - Regarding the three bets above;
I win all three I keep my name.
I win one I become "the Punish"
I lose all I become "Chicken Little"

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Botman
Mal Meninga
Posts: 25912
Joined: June 18, 2013, 4:31 pm
Favourite Player: Nick Cotric

Re: PPL and child care

Post by Botman » December 11, 2014, 2:47 pm

And you're new one, Treyden.
CREATE PROCEDURE BotMan_Post AS
SELECT * FROM Previous_Post
EXEC quote_post
WHERE UserName = 'Aknalkfgnaa' OR 'Yeah Raiders' OR 'Billy B'
EXEC RAND(good_grief; cheak_notes; uh82cit;)

GO;

Shadow Boxer
Ricky Stuart
Posts: 9176
Joined: May 20, 2008, 2:50 pm

Re: PPL and child care

Post by Shadow Boxer » December 11, 2014, 2:55 pm

lol, My twins are 12, you middle aged white men will never understand the bond Lucy and I share.

I went to a year ten formal after party last night, if you want to feel old go to one of those for a while.
Image

User avatar
The Rickman
Mal Meninga
Posts: 44079
Joined: June 25, 2012, 9:53 am
Favourite Player: Hodgo
Location: Rockhampton, Central Queensland

Re: PPL and child care

Post by The Rickman » December 11, 2014, 2:56 pm

I was sure at least one of them was hyphenated, Luce.
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2012 Golden Boogs Newbie of the Year
2013 'Nella Awards Best Punter
2013 Boogs Thread of the Year ~ The Betting Thread
2014 Boogs Matthew Elliott Award Winner
2014 Boogs some award with Hanbush

User avatar
The Rickman
Mal Meninga
Posts: 44079
Joined: June 25, 2012, 9:53 am
Favourite Player: Hodgo
Location: Rockhampton, Central Queensland

Re: PPL and child care

Post by The Rickman » December 11, 2014, 3:01 pm

Shadow Boxer wrote:lol, My twins are 12, you middle aged white men will never understand the bond Lucy and I share.

I went to a year ten formal after party last night, if you want to feel old go to one of those for a while.
A year ten formal after party?? Who do you think you are, Manbush??
Image
2012 Golden Boogs Newbie of the Year
2013 'Nella Awards Best Punter
2013 Boogs Thread of the Year ~ The Betting Thread
2014 Boogs Matthew Elliott Award Winner
2014 Boogs some award with Hanbush

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