Climate change

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The Nickman
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Re: Climate change

Post by The Nickman »

gergreg wrote: August 26, 2020, 3:39 pm We aren't contributing to emissions at all if we aren't selling our coal?

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Now you're being deliberately obtuse.
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greeneyed
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Re: Climate change

Post by greeneyed »

It would be very inefficient for Australia to simply decide not to sell our coal. The countries that use the coal, create the carbon emissions, not Australia. The efficient policy solution is to have international carbon emissions reduction targets, for every country, and market based systems to achieve the reductions. The world's energy requirements are such that coal use will continue, even with carbon emission reduction targets that adequately deal with climate change. And as pointed out, because Australia's coal is high quality, it is a better choice than low grade coal... and the market based systems for carbon emission reductions will mean that there is continued demand for Australian coal... the low grade coal prices out first.
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papabear
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Re: Climate change

Post by papabear »

gergreg wrote: August 26, 2020, 3:39 pm We aren't contributing to emissions at all if we aren't selling our coal?

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I do not know if you are trolling right now.

The earth is made up of many countries. Global Warming / Climate Change whatever you want to call is a result of the cumulative effect of everything happening on the planet.

If we stop selling coal, indonesia or brazil will dig out some MORE dirty coal, which will do more damage then had we just continued digging out our clean coal.

To be abundantly clear, to reduce / fix / assist in climate change the entirety of the global population has to work together for the solution if one small country stops digging out clean coal resulting in another small country digging out more dirty coal, this equals worse climate change.

If your issue is with coal, the better argument is arguing for cleaner power sources both here and more importantly abroad. But whilst people are operating coal power stations someone is going to dig out coal and supply it to them.
The Nickman
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Re: Climate change

Post by The Nickman »

greeneyed wrote: August 26, 2020, 4:38 pm It would be very inefficient for Australia to simply decide not to sell our coal. The countries that use the coal, create the carbon emissions, not Australia. The efficient policy solution is to have international carbon emissions reduction targets, for every country, and market based systems to achieve the reductions. The world's energy requirements are such that coal use will continue, even with carbon emission reduction targets that adequately deal with climate change. And as pointed out, because Australia's coal is high quality, it is a better choice than low grade coal... and the market based systems for carbon emission reductions will mean that there is continued demand for Australian coal... the low grade coal prices out first.
You see, that makes sense. This is where rational, informed debate is important, rather than solutions that are uninformed and actually counterproductive to the problem at hand.
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gergreg
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Re: Climate change

Post by gergreg »

Context is important. My comment is directly in response to people like Red who point at other countries as being bigger emitters as an excuse for Australia to not pull our weight.

Edit - I've done a quick scan back in this thread and according to Red Australia exports 1% of China's coal consumption. Does that mean the other 99% is dirtier coal?
Last edited by gergreg on August 26, 2020, 5:26 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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gangrenous
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Re: Climate change

Post by gangrenous »

I’m pretty sure RedRaider named coal co-captain in the team line-up this week.
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gergreg
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Re: Climate change

Post by gergreg »

gangrenous wrote:I’m pretty sure RedRaider named coal co-captain in the team line-up this week.
That's a bit harsh. Next you'll be claiming Nickman has a vested interest in the mining industry.

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RedRaider
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Re: Climate change

Post by RedRaider »

gergreg wrote: August 26, 2020, 5:26 pm Context is important. My comment is directly in response to people like Red who point at other countries as being bigger emitters as an excuse for Australia to not pull our weight.

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Except that's not what I have said at all. Show me a comment where I have said Australia should not reduce emissions. I have supported Australia meeting the Paris Agreement reductions several times. Further I have said that every nation should be on board - for the slow witted that includes Australia. You don't need to make stuff up gergreg. Just state your point of view.
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gergreg
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Re: Climate change

Post by gergreg »

I have and you have and we disagree.

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RedRaider
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Re: Climate change

Post by RedRaider »

So I have said we (Australia and the rest of the World) should reduce emissions and you disagree - righto then.
The Nickman
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Climate change

Post by The Nickman »

gergreg wrote:
gangrenous wrote:I’m pretty sure RedRaider named coal co-captain in the team line-up this week.
That's a bit harsh. Next you'll be claiming Nickman has a vested interest in the mining industry.

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You could say I’m one of the leading experts in coal quality in the world (probably top 10 people)... I mean, I would never say that, but you certainly could, gerg

But that doesn’t mean I blindly defend thermal coal or deny climate change or science. The world needs to move to cleaner energy sources, and the world needs to eliminate petrol cars, and it needs to do it soon, but while there’s coal being burned for power generating, Australian coal should be burned. That’s not having a vested interest, that’s knowing the facts and the science behind coal quality and the differences between the different coal grades (or rank, as we like to call it).

And further to that, people always think I’d be without a job when the world moves to renewables... they obviously have never heard of steel or know how it’s generated. Thermal coal is the cheaper coal, it’s not worth anything in comparison to the “good stuff”. So much more of my job and my income relies upon coking coal.
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gergreg
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Re: Climate change

Post by gergreg »

I had you at 12th TBH. But seriously I'm okay to be corrected by knowledgeable posters.

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Northern Raider
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Re: Climate change

Post by Northern Raider »

gergreg wrote: August 27, 2020, 7:51 am I had you at 12th TBH. But seriously I'm okay to be corrected by knowledgeable posters.
He used to be top 10 but has slipped well down into low teens after too many benders.

What he's saying about coal quality in a simple metaphor - Somebody is needs a car for regular work commute. We're providing them a Tesla while the competition is offering a Landcruiser.
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papabear
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Re: Climate change

Post by papabear »

gergreg wrote: August 27, 2020, 7:51 am I had you at 12th TBH. But seriously I'm okay to be corrected by knowledgeable posters.

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Note to self, to persuade people ask EDIT.
RedRaider
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Re: Climate change

Post by RedRaider »

The Nickman wrote: August 27, 2020, 7:06 am But that doesn’t mean I blindly defend thermal coal or deny climate change or science. The world needs to move to cleaner energy sources, and the world needs to eliminate petrol cars, and it needs to do it soon, but while there’s coal being burned for power generating, Australian coal should be burned. That’s not having a vested interest, that’s knowing the facts and the science behind coal quality and the differences between the different coal grades (or rank, as we like to call it).

And further to that, people always think I’d be without a job when the world moves to renewables... they obviously have never heard of steel or know how it’s generated. Thermal coal is the cheaper coal, it’s not worth anything in comparison to the “good stuff”. So much more of my job and my income relies upon coking coal.
There is a possible announcement coming on 22 September from Elon Musk. (See link below). If the announcement is about a viable 'million mile battery' then that is an absolute game changer in the electric vehicle (EV) market and many other applications such as home energy storage. As mentioned in previous posts, the possibility then is for one battery to be the power source for a series of replacement vehicles. It is likely to be initially expensive as all new technologies are, but over time, the price will come down as competitor production ramps up. The link points to another EV start up company in China. I hope Australia can get in on this.
https://finance.yahoo.com/news/we-are-w ... 31166.html

A bit more info on million mile batteries below:
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-auto ... ort%20said.
The Nickman
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Climate change

Post by The Nickman »

Elon Musk is an absolute joker and a clown. I’ll believe the hype around him as soon as he actually delivers something... anything.
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Fuifui Bradbrad
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Re: Climate change

Post by Fuifui Bradbrad »

The Nickman wrote: September 1, 2020, 7:22 pm Elon Musk is an absolute joker and a clown. I’ll believe the hype around him as soon as he actually delivers something... anything.
Something's not quite right about him. I cant put my finger on it. I could easily see him going all Hank Scorpio on the world
Feel free to call me RickyRicky StickStick if you like. I will also accept Super Fui, King Brad, Kid Dynamite, Chocolate-Thunda... or Brad.
The Nickman
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Re: Climate change

Post by The Nickman »

Fuifui Bradbrad wrote: September 2, 2020, 9:02 am
The Nickman wrote: September 1, 2020, 7:22 pm Elon Musk is an absolute joker and a clown. I’ll believe the hype around him as soon as he actually delivers something... anything.
Something's not quite right about him. I cant put my finger on it. I could easily see him going all Hank Scorpio on the world
Yeah, except I doubt his flamethrower would be much more than a bunch of hot air
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Northern Raider
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Re: Climate change

Post by Northern Raider »

The Nickman wrote: September 2, 2020, 12:12 pm
Fuifui Bradbrad wrote: September 2, 2020, 9:02 am
The Nickman wrote: September 1, 2020, 7:22 pm Elon Musk is an absolute joker and a clown. I’ll believe the hype around him as soon as he actually delivers something... anything.
Something's not quite right about him. I cant put my finger on it. I could easily see him going all Hank Scorpio on the world
Yeah, except I doubt his flamethrower would be much more than a bunch of hot air
Fairly sure Elon Musk is behind COVID-19 while cunningly diverting blame onto Bill Gates.
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RedRaider
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Re: Climate change

Post by RedRaider »

I thought I would put out there some information on an Australian start up company which plans to produce Hydrogen Fuel Cell vehicles by 2022. Here's hoping they can make it to market. The issue with Hydrogen fuel cell vehicles is the lack of infrastructure for people to gain access to Hydrogen. The advantages are obvious. The fuel cell produces electricity which powers an electric motor to drive the vehicle. The range on a Hydrogen vehicle is longer than a current electric vehicle (EV). It only takes a few minutes to re-fuel, much like petrol and diesel now, which is a disadvantage for an EV. When the hydrogen is burned it produces - water. Initial small production runs will likely mean that the cost of these vehicles is higher than mass produced vehicles. But this is a possible local glimpse into the future.
https://www.h2x.earth/
https://reneweconomy.com.au/h2x-hopes-t ... suv-95181/

In the USA there is a company called Nikola which has a similar market capitalization to Ford. Some information on them below. Watch for a possible new entrant into the Australian market with hydrogen fuel cell and EVs.
https://thedriven.io/2020/06/10/nikola- ... rogen-ute/
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Re: Climate change

Post by RedRaider »

Elon Musk announcement was underwhelming on 22 September. Not much new announced and delays.
https://www.theverge.com/2020/9/22/2145 ... highlights
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zim
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Re: Climate change

Post by zim »

You need to broaden your horizons.
https://arstechnica.com/cars/2020/09/he ... batteries/

How do you equate new battery chemistry and price reductions to bring it down to ICE with underwhelming?
New battery chemistry alone is a huge deal.
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Re: Climate change

Post by RedRaider »

Zim, I appreciate your input with technology links. Lots of things happening in the future but also lots of 'if's' about Telsla which even the writer of the article acknowledges with references to: " it wouldn’t be a Tesla announcement without vague timelines, and it was a little unclear which improvements are ready to go now—and which ones they’re just expecting to succeed in the next couple of years." I hope the $25,000 Tesla becomes a reality so that more people will be priced into the market. Henry Ford had a 19 year production run with the Model T. Interesting that it was called the Ford Model T as it followed the previous Ford Model S. Tesla also has a Model S. I wonder what Elon Musk will look to call the Tesla $25,000 model should it eventuate.

For EV technology which is going to happen:
https://www.cnet.com/roadshow/news/most ... olkswagen/
Some impressive looking Electric Vehicles in that lot.

I got to open the latest Electric Vehicle fast charger the company I work for installed in Scone last week. Local State Member, Mayor and some media there. We have put more than 30 in place. The last few in conjunction with Transport NSW. More to come with all major highways to have an EV fast charger within about 150km of each other to assist in overcoming the range anxiety of people considering owning an EV. "If you build it they will come". It is about assisting tourism into Regional NSW.
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Re: Climate change

Post by RedRaider »

For those considering purchasing an Electric Vehicle and wondering where all the Electric Vehicle chargers are, there is an app called 'Plugshare' which shows where all of them are. This is regardless of which organisation put them in place. The EV charger network is broad and expanding.
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Re: Climate change

Post by RedRaider »

See below a study on which areas of improvement are needed to make Electric Vehicles mainstream.

https://www.castrol.com/en_gb/united-ki ... ption.html
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